Think Fast Talk Smart: Communication Techniques

Why mastering unspoken workplace communication is essential to long-term career success.

Succeeding at work doesn’t just depend on how hard you work or how smart you are. According to Erin McGoff, it often comes down to whether you understand the “secret language” everyone else seems to be speaking.

McGoff is a career creator, Forbes 30 Under 30 honoree, and author of The Secret Language of Work: Hyper Helpful Scripts for Every Situation. Known for her wildly popular AdviceWithErin platform, she helps millions of professionals phrase things more effectively — without sounding stiff or robotic. “It’s this hidden curriculum to the workforce,” she explains, describing the unwritten rules of interviews, negotiations, and professional etiquette. “It’s not written down anywhere. It’s not equally distributed.” Her mission is to make those invisible rules visible — and usable.

In this episode of Think Fast, Talk Smart, McGoff and host Matt Abrahams explore how to communicate with confidence, advocate for yourself strategically, and build a professional brand with intention. Confidence, she says, isn’t fixed: “Confidence isn’t binary. Confidence is a spectrum.” It starts internally, with how we speak to ourselves, and strengthens when we “get really good at what you do.”

Episode Reference Links:
Connect:

Chapters:

  • (00:00) - Introduction
  • (04:53) - The Secret Language of Work
  • (06:29) - Building Confidence
  • (08:36) - Creating Your Professional Brand
  • (09:57) - Setting Expectations at Work
  • (12:28) - Advocate Strategically
  • (14:31) - Mastering First Impressions
  • (15:47) - Professional vs. Personal
  • (18:16) - Interview Before, During, After
  • (25:10) - Nonverbal Presence
  • (25:34) - The Final Three Questions
  • (29:33) - Conclusion

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Creators and Guests

Host
Matt Abrahams
Lecturer Stanford University Graduate School of Business | Think Fast Talk Smart podcast host
Guest
Erin McGoff
Content Creator | Author | Director | Founder of AdviceWithErin

What is Think Fast Talk Smart: Communication Techniques?

One of the most essential ingredients to success in business and life is effective communication.

Join Matt Abrahams, best-selling author and Strategic Communication lecturer at Stanford Graduate School of Business, as he interviews experts to provide actionable insights that help you communicate with clarity, confidence, and impact. From handling impromptu questions to crafting compelling messages, Matt explores practical strategies for real-world communication challenges.

Whether you’re navigating a high-stakes presentation, perfecting your email tone, or speaking off the cuff, Think Fast, Talk Smart equips you with the tools, techniques, and best practices to express yourself effectively in any situation. Enhance your communication skills to elevate your career and build stronger professional relationships.

Tune in every Tuesday for new episodes. Subscribe now to unlock your potential as a thoughtful, impactful communicator. Learn more and sign up for our eNewsletter at fastersmarter.io.

Matt Abrahams: Success in life
and in work is not just about

showing up and communicating.

It's about making sure you understand
what's needed in the moment.

My name's Matt Abrahams and I
teach Strategic Communication at

Stanford Graduate School of Business.

Welcome to Think Fast.

Talk Smart, the podcast.

Today, I look forward to
speaking with Erin McGoff.

Erin is a very successful creator, widely
known for her popular AdviceWithErin,

where she reaches millions with
practical career and life advice.

Erin specializes in making
complex professional topics

accessible and actionable.

She recently was named
to Forbes 30 under 30.

Her new book is called The Secret
Language of Work: Hyper Helpful

Scripts for Every Situation.

Welcome, Erin.

Over the past several months, I've
really enjoyed getting to know you,

and I really appreciate the helpful,
actionable advice you provide.

Thanks for being here.

Erin McGoff: Thanks Matt for having me.

I'm really excited about this.

Matt Abrahams: Excellent.

Shall we get started?

Erin McGoff: Yeah, let's go for it.

Matt Abrahams: So I'd like to
start with the title of your new

book, The Secret Language of Work.

You argue that there's a secret language
in the workplace and that cracking

that code is critical to success.

Can you share more about this and what
are some specific translations that you

found really unlock success for people?

Erin McGoff: So I was motivated to
write this book based off of my content.

You know, I make short form video
content teaching people how to phrase

things more professionally, but not in
a corporate or robotic way, but rather

strike that balance between sounding
professional, but also sounding like

yourself and sounding authentic.

When I was coming up in my career,
I just noticed that there was

just this language, there was this
etiquette that you had to learn.

Some people were taught it when
they were growing up, like their

parents would teach them, or maybe
they're even lucky enough to learn

it in school, which is really rare.

And it's this hidden curriculum to
the workforce, and it's all these

secret rules that show that you're
capable and competent and that you

know how to be professional, like
shaking hands on a job interview.

It's not written down anywhere.

It's not equally distributed.

So I was motivated to write the book
because I wanted to write down the

hidden etiquette of job interviews and
how to negotiate without being rude

and professionally quit your job so
that people could have this handbook.

And while a book is about strategic
communication in the workforce, it

really is a book that's designed
to make people feel more confident.

I wrote it in a way that's similar to
how I'm speaking right now, just like

really warm and nonjudgmental, and it's
designed to help people, it's a self-help

book, but it's also to help you feel
really good at yourself and confident

because you can only communicate as
successfully as you believe what you're

saying and your confidence level.

Matt Abrahams: Absolutely.

So how you feel translates directly into
how you present yourself and communicate.

What are one or two of the
things that you advise people to

begin to build that confidence?

Erin McGoff: Yeah, a lot of people
really struggle with confidence.

I always say that confidence isn't binary.

Confidence is a spectrum and it's
something that goes up and down.

Working on your confidence is
about raising that threshold.

You're gonna go up and down every
day, but the more you work on your

confidence, the more you can raise your
threshold so it won't go down so much.

The person that you speak to
the most is actually yourself.

We talk to ourselves all day,
every day, in our minds, and we

can be really mean to ourselves.

Really judgmental and critical.

And the first step, and really the
most important step to becoming

confident is to be your own best friend.

Turn that voice, don't try to shut
it off 'cause that's impossible,

but try to turn it into something
that's a bit more constructive.

And to tell yourself, you didn't bomb that
interview, you stumbled over your words

on one of the questions, and it was fine.

You're human.

You know, just to kind of reframe those
cognitive distortions that we have.

Surround yourself with people who make
you feel good about yourself, but surround

yourself with a great support group.

And then another thing that I don't
think enough people talk about is

to get really good at what you do.

That is a great natural way
to foster true confidence.

What you'll see a lot is the
thinly veiled insecurity that

people think is confidence.

True confidence is actually really relaxed
and calm and even funny and humble.

Once you feel really good about
yourself and you like who you

are, you don't really care as much
about other people think of you.

Matt Abrahams: Thank you for that.

There's so much richness in what you said.

So first and foremost, it starts
internally, the conversations we

have with ourself, and then it's the
confidence we have in what we do.

So get really good at it.

And then surround yourself
with people who reinforce that.

And realize that being kind to yourself,
having a supportive network, can really

change where you are in that trajectory.

And you're right,
confidence is not binary.

It varies.

And so I really like the advice,
and it does start with that

looking internally and having
that confidence in yourself first.

Thank you.

You've done a really great job of
sharing information with the world,

creating short form content, really
setting up a brand for yourself.

I'd love for you to share some advice
and best practices that you use in terms

of how you present yourself externally.

Having a brand that comes
with you into work is helpful.

Having a presence that's
beyond just the physical you.

What are some best practices
you recommend for engaging

people and establishing a brand?

Erin McGoff: The number one piece
of advice I always give is do great

work and be great to work with.

Because a lot of people are great
at their jobs and they're jerks, and

eventually it catches up with them and
nobody wants to work with them because

they're so difficult to work with.

And while they might get away
with that for 5 to 10 years, it

does eventually catch up with you.

And that's why I always say, don't
burn bridges if you don't have to.

Give people the benefit of the doubt.

Try to get along with everyone and be
friendly because that reputation is

really important and trust is important
too, and it takes so long to build

trust that you can break it in a second.

So it's really important that you
actually teach people how to treat you.

Tell people, this is who
I am as a professional.

Here's what I'm here to do and
here's what I'm like to work with.

You have a professional brand whether
you like it or not, and it's up to you to

decide if you're in control of that or if
you're gonna let other people steer that.

Matt Abrahams: So reflecting on what
that brand is, what you want it to

be, and then I want to dive a little
deeper into the advice you gave about

asserting who you want to be at work
and how people should work with you.

It's easy to understand that
intellectually, but how do I go to

my boss, my colleagues, and say,
hey, here's who I want to be at work,

and here's how best to work with me.

Advice and guidance on how to do that?

Erin McGoff: Yeah, so you have to
teach other people how to treat you

and what they can expect from you.

And actually a lot of this happens
within the first 24 hours of a new job.

It's really important right up front
to tell people what they can expect

from you and to be proactive and to
say, well, that's not something that

I do, however, I can help with this.

And that is also known
as boundary setting.

Another thing is just
proactive communication,

just getting ahead of things.

I remember when I was first starting
out, I was on a film set, and the

director gave me a great piece of advice.

She said, ask people how
they want to be directed.

I was like, that is a
great piece of advice.

Why don't we ask people how
they want to be managed?

Different people have
different working styles.

Some people are external processors,
like me, and they like to talk through

things, and other people like to
figure it out first and then come to a

meeting and present you with solutions.

They're equally fine, but it's about
figuring out what is their communication

style, what is their preferred
workflow and then getting into that.

And, and that leads me to my third
point, which is setting expectations.

And understanding the difference between
expectations, which are something

specific that you envision the other
person and expecting them to do for

you, and standards, which is a standard
that you have for yourself that when

other people don't meet that then you
will choose to disengage with them.

And at work, it's really important to
have standards and also set expectations.

That means don't overpromise.

You want to actually underpromise
and overdeliver, and that's typically

a really great way to set yourself
up for success, teach people how to

treat you and what to expect from
you while also being respected.

It's a great way to building
that professional brand at work.

Matt Abrahams: I really like
several things you said there.

One is all about anchoring, setting
expectations, and you have to think

about what those expectations are.

It's important to establish boundaries
and let people know what's appropriate

not, and I really like what you said is,
if you're going to say, no, I can't, or

don't feel comfortable doing one thing,
do share what you are comfortable doing.

Some people are just so excited to have
the new job or to be part of the new

community, that they don't really think
about what their immediate behavior,

as you said, that first 24 hours
does in terms of setting expectations

for the whole time you're there.

And I really like how you talk about
we have to do that introspection first.

So thank you for that.

Where do most people go wrong when
advocating for themselves during

things like performance reviews,
promotions, or salary conversations?

What can we do to get it right?

Erin McGoff: Whenever you are trying
to advocate for yourself or negotiate

or trying to get anyone else to get
on board with you, the last thing

you wanna do is talk about yourself.

At the end of the day, the company isn't
going to give you a raise because your

student loans are getting more expensive.

They're just not, because it's
not their problem, and it's

just not a compelling argument.

So whenever you're going into a situation
where you need to convince someone else

to get on board with that idea, you
need to put yourself on the back burner.

Put your ego in a little
box, put it to the side, and

think about them as a person.

When it comes to advocating for
yourself, you have to find reasons

that what you want is something
that they would want as well.

So you have to think about
what their goals are, what the

company's goals are, and how you
can align those goals together.

For example, if you don't really
like working on a client project

anymore, instead of going in and
saying, I don't like working on this

client project, it's really boring.

I don't wanna do it anymore, their
boss is just gonna say, tough luck.

Instead, if you went in and said,
hey, I think my skillset would

be much better used over here.

You know, I'm not really
being utilized right here.

I think Kevin can handle
this a lot better.

Then your manager is hearing, oh,
these clients are gonna be happier.

You want them to walk away thinking,
I need to do this for their sake.

Matt Abrahams: The point about
perspective taking is so important.

It's not about what you want, it's about
what they need and really understanding

that and making that mental shift.

I like how you say put your ego
and your needs on the back burner.

It's not that they aren't important,
but the way you position the message

about what value it has for them.

And the final piece you mentioned
there, also super important, which is

demonstrate that in your asking, you're
not just asking for what you want,

but you're also showing how you think.

If you say, I would be better at this
role and maybe this other person could

do this stuff, you are demonstrating
your value because you can think

about how the group, the company,
the organization, can do better.

I appreciate that.

I'd like to talk about first impressions.

You and I both know
they're super important.

What advice do you have for
how we can maximize the first

impression people have of us?

Erin McGoff: So first
impressions are so important.

I will say also, I love what Chris
Voss says, your last impression

is your lasting impression.

I think people should also think
about their last impressions.

You get one chance to make a first
impression, and I think the best thing

you can do when you meet somebody new
is listen and be curious about them.

People are really interesting.

Everyone has their own little world
and their own little life, and they

have interesting things about them.

You just have to be curious about it.

And most people go into it
thinking, how can I look good?

How can I have them understand me?

So the best thing that you can do
is go in, be really warm, smile.

And just ask them some specific
questions and be curious about them.

Matt Abrahams: Yeah.

The point about being interested
and less focused on being

interesting is really powerful.

If you're present, you're listening,
you are trying to draw other people

out, can really make a difference.

I like to share that my mother-in-law
was so good at making first impressions

and her secret was to listen and
then say something very simple.

She'd just say, tell me more.

And in that moment would
really connect with people.

It really helps.

One of the big signature bits
of advice you give related to

these first impressions, and all
impressions, actually, is how do

you come off as professional without
being seen as a corporate robot?

How do you suggest people
strike that balance between

professionalism and authenticity?

It's a fine line to walk, right?

Erin McGoff: It can be tough.

Professional relationships are different
than personal relationships because

in your personal life, if you're
not getting along with somebody, you

can just stop hanging out with them.

But in a professional sense, you
100% are going to have to work with

people that you don't personally like.

You're not going to get along
with everybody you work with

on a personal level, but you
have to get along with them.

So that's why the case for professional
speaking and learning how to speak,

you know, with that etiquette and
choosing when you want to or when

you don't, is so important because
it keeps things within a box.

And I always tell people that learning
how to speak professionally benefits you.

When you are speaking professionally,
you are putting yourself in a persona

that is a professional version of you,
and it actually makes it a lot easier

to negotiate a raise, to set boundaries,
to communicate directly, when you're

within that kind of like lexicon.

When it comes to balancing your true
personality with your professionalism

I always recommend that you just
remember your desired outcome.

That's what I talk about in my
book is whenever you go into a

conversation, just remember, what
do you actually want to happen.

With personal relationships, you go into
it and they're usually very emotional.

You know, I wanna fix this, I
wanna be loved or worthy, but with

professional it's usually just, I
wanna get this client project done.

And so it's always important
to keep things professional

and not necessarily personal.

And again, that's to your benefit,
and not necessarily just for everybody

else, but it's actually to benefit
and protect you in the workspace.

Matt Abrahams: So again, it
comes down to self-reflection and

understanding that you need to be
different in different circumstances.

The way you are with your friends,
your family, is different than

the way you need to be at work.

The words we use, the language we use,
helps define who we are and helps us be

connected, and we have to find the right
level of language use to be appropriate.

It might be right for this organization
to use a lot of acronyms or it

might not be the right thing.

So being observant and adjusting, that
power of language is so important.

And one key indicator, as you just
mentioned, is the context, right?

So we have to consider the context
and make a decision, which persona,

or how do we want to show up based on
the context and how we want to appear.

So another really important point, I
often teach my students, the people I

coach communication is context dependent,
and you have to make those adjustments.

Let's talk about something that's
really hard for lots of people, and

that's interviewing, especially in
today's super competitive environment.

What's one tip or technique you
suggest that people can do before,

during, and after an interview
to really help them stand out?

So actually I'm asking for
three techniques, but at

three different time points.

Before they go in, in
the interview and after.

Do you have some suggestions there?

Erin McGoff: You know, interviews
are weird because we act like, oh,

it's just an interview, but it's not.

You're walking into a room and you're
gonna be judged every millisecond

you are in that room, and a lot of
recruiters make up their mind in

the first 10 seconds of meeting you.

It's scary to sit there and be
judged, especially when you're early

in your career and you feel like
you don't bring a lot to the table.

The more you understand your story, the
more practice you get, the easier it gets.

So the hardest it'll be is in
the beginning of your career.

When I was early on in my career, I
definitely had physical anxiety, so I

mentally felt pretty confident going
in and I was like, yeah, I can crush

this internship, but physically I
would just get really red and hot and

I felt like my body was betraying me.

So for that, for example, I would
actually recommend physically exerting

yourself that morning of the interview,
going on a run, going to yoga.

What happens before we do something scary,
like an interview, is that our fight or

flight is getting ignited and we have
this adrenaline running through our body.

So the best thing you can do
is actually go let it out.

And then for the mental side, you
gotta get amped up and different

people get amped up in different ways.

Some people like to listen to music
that makes 'em feel powerful and strong.

For me, I love a good pep talk, so
I would call one of my friends and

be like, can you just gas me up real
quick, like make me feel so good?

Or even nowadays, I recommend people
just go to ChatGPT and be like,

hey, here's a job description.

Here's my resume.

Can you convince me of why
I'm so good for this job?

I think it's about having other
people remind you of why you're so

great, and remembering that they
wouldn't be interviewing you if they

didn't think you were a good fit.

So before the interview,
physically get it out.

And then to mentally really get
excited and confident about yourself.

And while you're in the interview,
remember that the person

interviewing you is a person.

They are a human being.

Their job is to find
quality candidates to hire.

So the only thing you need to do is go
in and don't focus so much about talking

about yourself and what you've done
and your experience and your skills.

Take the job description and say, I
am the answer to all your problems.

I've done this before.

I can do it again.

I'm a culture fit.

Have a great attitude, smile, use
positive language, keep it forward

facing, solution oriented, so you
wanna have that unique offering.

It's like when you're buying a
pair of jeans and you have three

in front of you, what's going to
make you go for that one pair?

That's just the right color.

They have that extra pocket in the back.

You wanna have that little extra something
that makes them really wanna advocate

for you because then they get to close
their laptop and go home for the day.

Then after the interview, the most
important thing after an interview is to

send that thank you email, which again
is part of the secret language of work.

It's something that a lot of
people don't know to do unless

somebody told you to do it.

It's not intuitive to send somebody a
thank you email after a job interview.

You just wanna send
something really simple.

Hey Kate, thanks so much
for your interview today.

I really enjoyed learning
more about the role.

I'm even more excited to
be in the running now.

Here again are three reasons why I think
I would be a great fit for this position.

1, 2, 3, keep it really short,
and then I really look forward

to hearing back from you herein.

Matt Abrahams: Excellent.

Manage that anxiety.

Do something for the physical
part of it and the mental part.

Make sure that you understand
the job and target your responses

to their job description.

Be the best pair of jeans you can be.

I love that analogy.

And then taking the time to show that
you're really passionate and sending

that thank you note, there's an added
benefit to sending a thank you note.

If there's anything you want to clarify
or correct or add, you can do it there.

I think managing anxiety, tailoring
the message to the job, making sure

you'd say something that's memorable.

Finally sending that thank
you note, really good advice.

Everything we've talked about so
far, which has been things you

do verbally, things you think.

Do you have one bit of advice
for what you do with your body?

Do you have one suggestion
for our non-verbal presence?

Erin McGoff: Keep open body language.

Definitely don't cross your arms.

That's a defensive position and I
think it's okay to cross your legs.

Keep your hands visible
on the table if you can.

Humans subconsciously don't like hidden
hands, so you wanna keep visible hands.

Matt Abrahams: Great advice, open,
visible hands, forward leaning, signals

interest and intent, which is really good.

Thank you for providing advice that you
can do both in person and virtually.

Everything you described can
be done via video as well.

Before we end, I'd like to
ask you three questions.

One I create just for you, and the
other two are similar across everybody.

You ready for that?

Erin McGoff: I'm ready.

Matt Abrahams: So you, for a
living, give people advice.

I'm curious, what's the best
advice you've ever received?

Erin McGoff: My dad is great at giving
these little short snippets and he

always says, from when I was younger,
to be intentional and persist variously.

So be intentional about where you
wanna go and what you wanna do in life.

Be specific about it, and
then persist variously.

So don't let any obstacle get in your
way and every day be intentional and

persist variously, what can we do today?

Matt Abrahams: Yeah, fast and the furious.

I think that's great.

Have intention and act
tenaciously towards it.

Thank you.

Question number two, who is a
communicator that you admire and why?

Erin McGoff: Some of the best
communicators I've seen are in my family.

My parents communicate different ways.

My mom is a very authentic and
intentional communicator, and my dad

is a very straightforward and intense
communicator, and I think having those

two, I got to see different sides of it.

So I have to say both my parents.

Matt Abrahams: It's really interesting
how people answer this question.

Some take people that are very close
and near and dear to them and others

pick people who are in the public
eye, and you can learn from both.

Alright, the final question.

What are the first three ingredients that
go into a successful communication recipe?

Erin McGoff: Number one
is to know your audience.

Not all audiences are created equal,
so if you're going into a meeting

with a HR rep in a huge corporation,
that's different than going into a

meeting with a CEO of a small company.

So you need to know your audience
and know who you're talking to

and know what their goals are.

The second thing is to know you and to
know your goals and your desired outcome.

What do you want out of this conversation?

So first, thinking about what they
want out of the conversation and

put yourself in their shoes first.

And then think about what you want
out of the conversation and then you

can think about how those two align.

And my third thing I would
have to say is just smile.

So many people when they get into
sticky conversations or difficult

conversations that they get so serious,
they get a little defensive, just smile.

The solution is out there and
you're gonna find it together.

So I think it's really important to always
keep that collaborative spirit alive.

Matt Abrahams: So know your audience,
know yourself, be collaborative, and

show up with a smile on your face.

I think those are three important
ingredients that would lead

to a very successful outcome.

Erin, I can see why you are
so good at giving advice.

It's practical, it's
tactical, it's relatable.

Thank you so much for your time, for
your advice, and I wish you the best

of luck on The Secret Language of Work.

Erin McGoff: Thank you so much, Matt.

This was great.

Matt Abrahams: Thank you for
joining us for another episode of

Think Fast Talk Smart, the podcast.

To learn more about workplace
best practices, please listen

to Lorraine Lee in episode 202.

This episode was produced by Katherine
Reed, Ryan Campos, and me, Matt Abraham.

Our music is from Floyd Wonder.

With thanks to the Podium Podcast Company.

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