Medication Mistake Killed My Dog + $80K Kitchen Horror Story (Worcester, MA)

This podcast’s goal is to educate homeowners through submitted “homeowner horror stories.” Mikki shares a personal warning after her English mastiff, Optimus Prime, died from a drug interaction: carprofen and progesterone were prescribed together, leading to a catastrophic GI bleed, and she urges viewers to verify medication interactions and pursue accountability through reporting and complaints. 

The episode then covers a Massachusetts kitchen remodel disaster: a homeowner hired a contractor from a mailbox flyer, paid half up front without a written contract, faced unlicensed electrical work that failed inspection, erratic scheduling, long disappearances, and ballooning costs, ultimately spending about $80,000 after hiring a licensed company to finish properly and learning to verify licensing, get everything in writing, and protect themselves contractually.

00:00 Welcome and New Setup
00:31 What the Podcast Does
02:22 A Personal Story Begins
03:05 Optimus Prime and Mastiffs
07:35 The Medication Mix-Up
13:18 Aftermath and Accountability
20:28 Transition to Horror Stories
20:57 Worcester and Budget Reality
25:49 COVID Prices and Greed
28:29 Red Flags With the Contractor
29:58 Demo Fast Then Stalls
31:06 Permits Licensing and Chaos
32:33 Wicked Stressed Realization
32:54 Calling the Inspector
33:55 Electrical Work Fails
34:27 Costs Spiral and Disappear
34:58 Contractor Vanishes Six Weeks
35:30 Feeling Lost and Ashamed
36:00 Why Homeowners Don't Know
40:50 Consumer Affairs Game Plan
43:17 Firing the Contractor
43:54 Airbnb Side Quest Chaos
46:51 Hiring a Licensed Remodeler
48:17 Final Bill and Lessons
49:26 How to Vet Contractors
50:52 Facebook Recs Ask for Photos
53:27 Contracts Protect Homeowners
54:42 Wrap Up and Where to Find Us

Creators and Guests

Host

Jessica Abreu

As a social media expert, Jessica has a knack for identifying what makes each business unique and translating that into powerful, engaging content that resonates with clients and customers. From crafting tailored strategies and managing accounts to recording on-site content and boosting engagement, Jessica and her team handle it all so their clients can focus on what they do best.

Host

Mikki Paradis

President & CEO at PDI Drywall Inc. Mikki founded her first construction company, PDI Drywall Inc, in 2005 while she was still a student at NC State. After growing PDI into a multimillion dollar company, she has become an accomplished entrepreneur, speaker, and advocate for innovation in business and leadership. With a passion for empowering others, she has built a reputation as a forward-thinking professional dedicated to driving growth and fostering meaningful connections. Known for her dynamic energy and ability to inspire, Mikki is deeply committed to creating positive change in her industry and beyond. Whether through her entrepreneurial ventures or speaking engagements, she consistently challenges the status quo and encourages others to reach their full potential.

What is Chicks in Construction?

You plan your renovation with excitement, trust your contractor, and hope for the best...until things start going sideways. That’s when most homeowners realize they didn’t know what they didn’t know.

From permits that were never pulled to “contractors” who ghost after demo day, the construction world can feel like a maze of hidden costs and shady shortcuts. Too many homeowners end up confused, overwhelmed, and out of a lot of money.

The Chicks in Construction Podcast is here to change that. Hosted by Mikki Paradis, a licensed general contractor with 20+ years of experience, and Jess Abreu, a homeowner turned construction content creator, this show breaks down real renovation horror stories and teaches you how to protect your time, money, and home.

After building a multimillion-dollar drywall business and helping countless homeowners recover from construction nightmares, Mikki is on a mission to make sure you go into your next project informed, not blindsided. And Jess brings the perspective of someone who’s been in your shoes and now knows exactly what questions to ask.

Submit Your Construction Horror Story: https://chicksinconstruction.com/

[00:00:03] Mikki: Well, hello, and welcome back to another episode of Chicks in Construction. I'm your host, Miki Paradise, and this is my amazing co-host.

[00:00:11] Jess: Hi, I'm Jessica Abreu.

[00:00:12] Mikki: I'm pretty much loving our setup. I don't know if you guys have been clocking that we have a different setup, but please, please observe our new signage.

Okay, mm-hmm. It's kind of a big deal.

[00:00:25] Jess: Learning

[00:00:25] Mikki: my Q-R way. Joe worked really hard on this, okay? Joe, the studio god, worked really hard on this. Um, listen, what does this podcast exist for? It's for you. It's for you, homeowner. It's for you, future homeowner. It's for you, person who just loves a little bit of gossip, a little bit of tea, if you will.

If you're a crime show enthusiast- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm ... this show is for you. 'Cause this is con- this is, like, true crime construction edition. What we do here is I'm an expert in construction. I've been in construction for 21 years. Some of y'all, some of y'all on TikTok, you need to know about that, 'cause I'm tired.

I'm tired of hearing- ... about the comments where, "She doesn't... What does she know about construction?" She knows a lot about construction.

[00:01:11] Jess: I don't.

[00:01:12] Mikki: Jess is a homeowner. I'm a construction expert. Jess is- I'm learning ... a homeowner expert. She's great at owning a home. Mm-hmm. And together, we come to- we join forces to help you, other homeowners, other contractors, to understand a little bit about, one, how construction works, and two, how the homeowner experience works- Mm-hmm

so that ideally, in a perfect world, we can help people have better experiences. So, kinda the premise of the show is people write in- Yes ... and they share their stories, we call them homeowner horror stories, on how, like, you know, what construction experience they had. If it went bad, how did it go bad? Kinda walking us through their experience.

And then we break it down- Mm-hmm ... and we pull out the pieces where it's like, ah, that's where things kinda started to go wrong, and we help you know what to do so that that stuff doesn't happen to you if you, the viewer, are going to have- do a renovation, or build a house, or d- replace your roof. Anything.

Whatever it is, we wanna educate you on what is normal and what is not, and a lot of trends that we're seeing. Because our whole motto is that learning the hard way is overrated. Overrated. So, I'm gonna tell you guys a story right now that, um, I'm not sure I'm gonna be able to tell without crying, so I'm just, like, tr- warning you now- Mm-hmm

it might get uncomfortable. So just be prepared for that. And it's not exactly construction-related, but it is one of those moments of, if I had only known, my life would be drastically different right now. And since we ask the homeowners to write in and share their uncomfortable stories with me, I felt like it would be at least, like, a little hypocritical to not talk to you, the audience, about this so that- that you could learn from the experience that I had.

We talk on the show all the time about my dogs. I don't have kids. Jess is the mom. Mm-hmm. I'm the dog mom. I have four dogs, and my, um, my oldest dog, his name was Optimus Prime, and he was an English mastiff. Now, I've had English mastiffs, um, since I graduated from college. I, I adopted my first English mastiff kind of just, just after I graduated, and I've

I just fell in love with the breed. I fell in love with the attitude of the breed. I fell in love with just everything about them. And so after, his name was Bubba. After Bubba passed away, we rescued another English mastiff, and after, his name, his na- that was the first Otis. After Otis passed away, we rescued another English mastiff, and the things about, the thing about English mastiffs is they don't live long.

And so that's kinda one of those things that, like, as a pet owner you kinda have to weigh-

[00:03:55] Jess: Mm-hmm ...

[00:03:55] Mikki: is smaller dogs live, can, can live... I mean, I, I have a friend who has a, um, a Jack Russell that just turned 19 years old.

[00:04:04] Jess: Yeah. Their bodies are just littler. All the organs- Right ... work

[00:04:07] Mikki: better. Like, it just- Yeah

they just last longer. Mm-hmm. And so that's one of the things, like, when you make a decision to own English mastiffs, like, you know that the time is limited. But for me, w- owning, like, you know, take, like, I don't know what the, how you say it, but, but adopting English mastiffs that had already been treated badly, and had not been taken care of, and had not been given proper vet care- Mm-hmm

it reduced that, their lifespan even more dramatically than just being big. So, like, English mastiffs are kinda like related to, like, a BMW. You can't drive a BMW 400,000 miles and not change the oil. Like- Right ... English mastiffs are not pit bulls. You gotta take them to the vet. Like, you've gotta, like, we started crying.

They require

[00:04:56] Jess: a lot

[00:04:57] Mikki: of care. They require a lot of care. And, and if you don't take those steps and those procedures, it j- it costs them more time off, off of their life. So after rescuing four English mastiffs and having a really brief amount of time with them, I had a, a friend that I worked with in the rescue that also bred English mastiffs reach out to me and let me know that she had a litter of puppies.

And I had absolutely no intention of getting a dog. Like we, we had dogs. Mm-hmm. It was, it was like, we had Daisy, the English mastiff, at the time, and it was like, oh, well, I kind of have this thing. I don't know. You probably can't relate to this 'cause you're not a pet person.

[00:05:39] Jess: I don't have, I don't own a single pet.

[00:05:40] Mikki: But when When a dog finds me or an opportunity with a dog finds me, I always take notice of that-

[00:05:52] Jess: Mm ...

[00:05:52] Mikki: more than me ever going out and looking for an animal. Like, I kind of- Mm-hmm ... feel like my animals find me.

[00:05:59] Jess: Yeah. Well, like- I don't- ... your last one did.

[00:06:01] Mikki: Yeah, like we found Frankie on the side of the road.

Mm-hmm. Like, so we kinda have that mentality of, like, when an opportunity presents itself, like, it might be, I don't know, the universe being like, "Hey, this one's for you." So that's kind of the origin of, of Optimus Prime, and I was really excited about having an English mastiff from the beginning so that I could take care of them in a way that, um, they deserve to be taken care of.

Kind of in honor of all the English mastiffs that we had rescued that were treated so horribly until they came to us, and really all we could do was do our best to try to heal the things that other people had broken. And I was excited about the opportunity of having this dog as a puppy and knowing what his entire life was and knowing what his entire experience was and making sure that I was taking care of everything about him.

And I mean, Optimus Prime really lived a spared at no expense life. He went to the chiropractor. He was in physical therapy. Little therapy. Like, he- Yeah. It, there was- He had it

[00:07:05] Jess: made.

[00:07:05] Mikki: There was never anything that that dog needed that I did not provide for him, no matter what the cost was. Like, he was on special diet that cost, the food itself cost $400 a month.

His medication for, like... 'cause he started to get arthritis as he got older, was about $500 a month. Like, I did not care what it cost to take care of him. I, just him having a happy and healthy life was the most important thing to me. So what I wanted to share with you, the viewers, the thing that I want you to know that I didn't know, um, is there are drug interactions that I was unaware of.

So Optimus Prime was on a drug called Carprofen, which is a really commonly prescribed arthritis medication, and is really common. Big dogs are often on some sort of an arthritis medication. We went in on the, I think it was the 2nd of July for his yearly exam. He was completely and totally healthy.

His heart, everything, every, all systems were operating at optimal levels. We go to El Salvador, we come back, he had a hotspot. We took him to the vet, but we didn't see. We went to the, our regular vet, but they, we saw, like, not the regular vet, 'cause they have a ton of different vets.

[00:08:31] Jess: Right. Mm-hmm.

[00:08:33] Mikki: And they prescribed him progesterone, um, f- to treat the hotspot.

Turns out progesterone and carprofen should never, ever be mixed 14 days after we started prescribe y- y- you know, giving him that medication last Sunday, we came home from being out with family, and he couldn't stand. When we left the house a couple hours earlier, he was fine. When he came home, he couldn't get up.

So I immediately started calling. Of course, it was a Sunday, and of course it was, you know, after hours. So we immediately cart- started calling emergency vets and, um, found one that could take him. We brought him in, and they worked on him for an hour, which is unusual. Like, normally they kinda come in and they update you.

They worked on him for an hour before they came in and they told us that he was likely... There, there was essentially no blood in his system. His heart was beating and his system was working overtime. Like, his, his heart rate was so elevated and he, his, his his temperature was, like, 104.

[00:09:45] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:09:46] Mikki: And his body was working so hard to pump blood because there was almost none in his system because it was all bleeding into his gut.

Mm. So the mix of carprofen and progesterone almost always leads to a gi- a GI bleed, a gastrointestinal bleed. And in Prime's case, he had a full-blown ul- ulcer and was completely just bleeding into his stomach, um, to the point where he had almost no blood volume. And He was almost septic And there was nothing that they could do.

They called NC State, and NC State basically said... 'Cause w- here in North Carolina, we, NC State has a really, um, prestigious, I'm gonna say in air quotes, I'm actually not a fan of NC State Vet Hospital, and I honestly encourage you to never take your animal there under really any circumstance. But that's where all the local vets will try to send you if there's a case that is beyond, like, what they're able to do.

Mm-hmm. So they called NC State just to, like, see what was on the table, and they quoted us 8 to $12,000 just to, um, just to see him. Like, that wasn't, like, guaranteeing any outcome or any, like, with the surgery- Mm-hmm ... or, it was just, like, just to diagnose what the problem was, it was gonna be 8 to $12,000. And, um, the vet was like, "I, I'm gonna be honest with you," like, "I don't think there's anything that they can do."

And if, he's, he was in extreme amounts of pain and duress. And so we had to put him down. We had a necropsy done, which is like a animal version of an autopsy, and it came back two days ago that he was perfectly healthy. So there was absolutely nothing wrong with him. There was no underlying issue. He was perfectly healthy.

Um, but the mixing of those medications caused that ulcer which ended up taking his life So I now have to live for the rest of my life knowing that even though I'm not a vet, and even though it's not my job to know that two prescriptions should never be mixed, I fed my first puppy, the first puppy I ever had, the dog love of my life, prescription medication that poisoned him and eventually killed him.

Like, I have to live with that for the rest of my life. And, um, I'm not sure exactly how I'm gonna do that, but if I could, as a... Somebody who has what, I think we're at like 55,000 followers. If we have that many people subscribing, and if I can find one person that watches this and, and pays attention to the prescription drugs that their vet puts them on, and one dog doesn't have to die the way Prime did, then I'm gonna try to do that.

So not a super fun way to start the podcast, but I really wanted to share that with you guys, um, I don't know, to potentially help you not have that experience, um, if you do have a dog that is on any kind of arthritis medication. So that happened, guys. And-

[00:13:18] Jess: And the vet said, "Sorry."

[00:13:21] Mikki: Yeah. They, um- Hmm. I, I messaged them while we were in...

I was, I can't even... When the vet told me

This, something just broke inside of me. Like, it, that just we rely on these people to take care of our animals and- Mm-hmm ... give them the care that they need. And I, I can imagine how difficult it is to treat animals, right? They can't talk to you. They can't tell you- Right ... what's going on. Like, I can't imagine the, the level of difficulty there.

But this wasn't even like, "Oh, the dog couldn't tell me what was wrong." It was you just didn't look. You didn't look to see what medication he was on.

[00:14:10] Jess: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Or you just, I mean, it's negligence.

[00:14:15] Mikki: Oh, it's 100% negligence. Mm-hmm. Because this is my life and I'm clearly being punished for sins of a past life, my last mastiff, not in the same way, but M- Daisy was killed by medical negligence at NC State.

Um- Mm. We won't get into all of it. It was horrible, and she horribly suffered because of them. And it was, it was a situation where it wasn't as cut and dry. Mm-hmm. And there's, there's something very unique about a dog dying that was perfectly healthy versus like, well, Daisy had cancer. Mm. So she was going to die, we knew that.

But how she died- Right ... it could have been very different.

[00:15:00] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:15:02] Mikki: They made a mistake and she ended up dying very badly. But it was one of those things where it's like in your back of your mind you know that it's coming. Right. Whereas-

[00:15:11] Jess: Prime ...

[00:15:12] Mikki: Prime was perfectly healthy. Because I invested my whole heart into his care and into the lifestyle that he had and, and, and just loving him and caring for him.

So the vet, they acknowledged that those prescriptions should never be mixed. Mixed. And they said they were sorry. They didn't offer to pay for the, um, the emergency vet care. They didn't offer to refund me for, you know, the $1,500 that I paid for them to end up killing my dog. Like, they didn't, they were just like, "We're, we're-" And

[00:15:52] Jess: which vet is that?

[00:15:53] Mikki: So it's Care First on Oberlin. Mm. Um, and it's, you know, the thing that I told... It's a real juxtaposition because our, the last vet that c- you know, pr- c- contributed to killing Daisy took absolutely no responsibility. Mm-hmm. So when this vet, like they called us the next day to check on Prime because at the time that I'd emailed him he wasn't dead.

[00:16:17] Jess: Mm.

[00:16:18] Mikki: So they called me to check on him and I told them that he was dead, and they were very sorry and, you know, he sent me an email taking full... And this wasn't the vet who actually did it, this was the guy who owns Care First.

[00:16:31] Jess: Oh.

[00:16:32] Mikki: He took responsibility, he told me he was very sorry, that they were gonna review the situation and see what they need to do to make sure that, you know, it doesn't happen again.

Mm. But it wasn't, you know, it was just that. And so at first I was like, well, I guess that's better than the way the other vet treated me, but then I was like, what is, what is the standard here? Right. Like, is the standard like, oh, well I guess I should be happy that you took responsibility and just be happy with that?

No. I, I'll tell you guys, like I, the, the, the scorchedness of the earth that will b- be behind me when I'm done dealing with all of this, I'm going full scorch, scorched earth.

[00:17:11] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:17:11] Mikki: Um, but the two drugs again are carprofen and progesterone. They do not mix, and when mixed it will, it is guaranteed to kill your dog.

And I don't want you guys to have that experience. Um, I would avoid Care First. One, they're very expensive. So I've always, me and Jess have always joked, you know, that I'm never gonna retire because I spend so much on vet care. I actually did that on purpose. Like, after Daisy was killed by the last vet-

[00:17:39] Jess: Right

[00:17:40] Mikki: I went to Care First intentionally. I knew they were expensive. But

[00:17:44] Jess: you think, like, expensive is going to be a, like-

[00:17:47] Mikki: Better level

[00:17:47] Jess: of care ... they're gonna be more careful. Yes. They're-

[00:17:49] Mikki: That's exactly what I thought. And I told the doctor that when he called. I said, "You know, I want you to understand that my last mastiff was killed by the vet in a similar way.

Different, but similar."

[00:17:58] Jess: Mm-hmm. "

[00:17:59] Mikki: And I intentionally brought all of my pets here to get care for, for, cared for by you because I knew that you were supposed to be the best." Yeah. "That you were expensive, and that I was gonna pay for the best, but I was gonna get the best."

[00:18:13] Jess: Right. "

[00:18:14] Mikki: And now you've killed my dog."

[00:18:15] Jess: Right.

[00:18:16] Mikki: And he, all he had to say was that he was very sorry. I mean, he, he was very genuinely sorry. Mm-hmm. Like, but I'm still, that doesn't really do much for me.

[00:18:26] Jess: No.

[00:18:27] Mikki: Or anybody. No. Like, being sorry isn't gonna prevent this from happening again. Like, it's, there's gonna have to be some diligence. And I think there's gonna have to be some consequences, um, which I'm gonna try very hard- Mm

to make happen.

[00:18:40] Jess: Oh, I mean, when you told me, I was like, "It's not even my dog." I'm like, "Well, how..."

[00:18:45] Mikki: Oh,

[00:18:45] Jess: my. I'm gonna go, like, full wrath on them.

[00:18:47] Mikki: Dude, I'm, it's... I've had so many people reach out, too, 'cause I-

[00:18:51] Jess: Mm ...

[00:18:52] Mikki: I've shared a little bit about it on Facebook just to let people know. Um, and there's been a lot of people who've reached out and been like, "Are you gonna do this?"

or, "Are you gonna do that?" I'm like, "Oh, that's actually a great idea." I'm like, "Keep 'em coming." Like, 'cause I know that we, in Nor- the state of North Carolina, pets are considered, um, pro- personal property. So you can't- Mm ... sue for, like, da- like, emotional damages, which I'm being b- perfectly honest with you, I don't know what's more emotional than my pets.

Um, but that's the law. Yeah. So you can sue for property damage, like damages to your property. Yeah. But that limits you in what you can sue for. Mm-hmm. And I know that we can report the doctor to the veterinary licensing board, which we absolutely will be doing.

[00:19:33] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:19:33] Mikki: Um, but you know, if you guys know of any- Other ways.

Mm-hmm ... additional consequences, I would be thrilled to know them. Um, because I just, I think, I know for me in my career, I learned a lot from other people's mistakes. But I also learned the most from my personal mis- mistakes when there was very, um, severe consequences. Mm-hmm. So you know- And there will be consequences

in situations where, where I made a mistake and we lost a bunch of money, those stories, like, those experiences have stuck with me longer than just your average experience. So I think there needs to be some pretty steep consequences, um, so that it stays with them. Mm-hmm. So the next time that woman goes to write somebody's prescription she looks back and she checks and she makes sure.

So we're gonna move on to some homeowner horror stories, but I wanted you guys to be aware of that, um, and I wanted to share that with you, so hopefully no one else finds themselves in that situation. But I don't- we're gonna transition s- tr- transition somehow in- into these homeowner horror stories.

[00:20:57] Mikki: Okay, so now that we're done with that- Mm. Mm ... we're gonna get into this super delightful homeowner horror story that is brought to us by a gentleman in Massachusetts.

[00:21:06] Jess: Yes.

I want you to... Well, I already told you how to say the, the town, but

[00:21:10] Mikki: that- You did. But I'm gonna tell you, one, I've already forgot it, and two, I immediately was gonna go to Worcestershire. That's where my head was gonna go. That's all right. That's not at all how it's spelled, but that's exactly how I was gonna read it.

It's Worcester. Worcester.

[00:21:24] Jess: Now-

[00:21:27] Mikki: The chances ...

[00:21:27] Jess: you have- The chances ... Worcester, 'cause it ends in an R. Right. But if you are from Massachusetts, it's Worcester.

[00:21:33] Mikki: And if you're not, they know you're not, 'cause you say Worcester, and I'd 100%- Or,

[00:21:39] Jess: or Worcester as how it's, it... They actually spell- Wor-

[00:21:42] Mikki: yeah, yeah.

[00:21:43] Jess: They, they actually- Worcester

spelt it

[00:21:44] Mikki: wrong.

[00:21:45] Jess: Oh, did they? Just I, I'm pretty sure there's an H in there. He must've been typing fast. Y'all,

[00:21:50] Mikki: I couldn't even tell you. Couldn't... We all... As we know, reading is not where I shine. Okay. It's not. It's not.

[00:21:57] Jess: But luckily, I'm from Massachusetts. But we got Jess

[00:21:59] Mikki: here.

[00:22:01] Jess: And I know... It's, but don't even get me trying to start pronouncing things in North Carolina, 'cause some of these- True

[00:22:07] Mikki: story.

True story. Good luck,

even just Raleigh is so hard for people. Yeah.

[00:22:12] Jess: Well, I mean, I live in-

[00:22:13] Mikki: Raleigh. No, it's not Raleigh.

[00:22:15] Jess: I live in Fuquay, and like, when I first moved here, I was like-

[00:22:19] Mikki: Fuqua.

[00:22:21] Jess: No. I say Fuquay. Fuquay.

[00:22:23] Mikki: Fuquay. I've heard people say Fuqua, um, and I'm just like, "It's not that French. Calm down." Got it.

Like...

[00:22:29] Jess: It ends in A-Y. But spelling it for people when they're like, "Can you spell that?" I'm like, "F-U"-

[00:22:36] Mikki: Period ...

[00:22:37] Jess: Q-U-A-Y.

[00:22:40] Mikki: F you, moving on.

[00:22:43] Jess: Yeah. And my husband's like, "Oh, I don't... I start... At first I would do it like that." He goes, "Now I go F- F-U-Q." I was like, "Oh, you're so nice."

[00:22:51] Mikki: Oh.

[00:22:51] Jess: I don't.

[00:22:52] Mikki: F you, period, Q-U.

[00:22:55] Jess: A-Y

[00:22:56] Mikki: dash. Just to let you guys know, we're probably gonna do two homeowner horror stories, because this one's pretty short.

Mm-hmm. So we might bundle. We'll see how the day goes. We'll see how the day

[00:23:05] Jess: goes. You can bundle and save.

[00:23:06] Mikki: We're gonna bundle and we're gonna Jake from State Farm it, okay? Sponsor us. Yeah.

Please, God, someone. This podcast needs to make money at some point.

[00:23:16] Jess: Um, all right, so getting into it.

[00:23:18] Mikki: Here we go.

[00:23:20] Jess: So this comes from a gentleman in Worcester- Worcester

Mass- Massachusetts. "We live in an older home outside Worcester." Oh, so it's actually outside, which is one of those little tiny small towns that no one's ever heard of.

[00:23:32] Mikki: Oh.

[00:23:32] Jess: Mm.

[00:23:33] Mikki: So it couldn't even... It's not Worcester, it's something else, but he's not even gonna bother.

[00:23:35] Jess: He's not even gonna bother.

[00:23:36] Mikki: That's fair.

[00:23:37] Jess: Mm-hmm. He doesn't want people to really know where he lives. That's fair, also. You know what? It's probably so small that if somebody heard the horror story, they'd probably- They would know ... "I know who you are." Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's that ti- kinda tiny. Um, "We have plaster walls and wiring- Mm ... that probably should've been replaced decades ago.

We budgeted $52,000- We figured we could get us a beautiful new kitchen with an island, new cabinets, updated plumbing, and better lighting. That number felt like a lot of money to us, and it was. Mm-hmm. But we had no idea how much we were going to pay.

[00:24:13] Mikki: The sad part is, like, full stop, $52,000 is an obscene amount of money.

Obscene amount of money. Yes. Mm-hmm. Okay? Like, I, I don't, at no point wanna be like, "$52,000 is a drop in the bucket." Absolutely not. We all work really hard for our money. Mm-hmm. That's a, that's an insane amount of money. Unfortunately, for up north, that's not even remotely close. No. Like, the numbers that we have seen people pay- Mm-hmm.

Remember that one where it was, like, $110,000- Yes ... and it was just a kitchen? And I was outraged, and Jess was like, "Yeah, but it's up north, so everything's just more expensive."

[00:24:46] Jess: It's so expensive.

[00:24:47] Mikki: So I'd like- Mm-hmm. Sadly, yes, sir, you are right. That is an obscene amount of money. Unfortunately, in the world of renovating your house, it is not nearly enough, and I hate that.

Mm-hmm. I hate that for all of us.

[00:24:59] Jess: Yeah, especially for an island and cabinets.

[00:25:01] Mikki: Yeah. Oh, yeah. Mm-hmm. Oh, and plumbing? Oh my God. My God today.

[00:25:05] Jess: Oh my- I know.

[00:25:05] Mikki: My God today.

[00:25:06] Jess: And wiring too, right? All the things. So-

[00:25:10] Mikki: Sadly,

[00:25:10] Jess: sadly

[00:25:11] Mikki: sir ...

[00:25:11] Jess: yeah, it's gonna be, it's gonna be-

[00:25:12] Mikki: We already know. Well, you wrote in, so we knew where-

this was going to start with, but-

[00:25:17] Jess: Sorry ...

[00:25:17] Mikki: with that budget, I'm sorry in advance. Yes, so

[00:25:20] Jess: for those of you who are thinking about updating your kitchen, $52,000 is not enough money no matter where you live.

[00:25:26] Mikki: Yeah, it's not, 'cause like y- I feel like 52,000, if you're keeping your cabinets and maybe just refreshing-

[00:25:32] Jess: Refresh

[00:25:32] Mikki: it could get you countertops and tile and maybe some new fixtures. Mm-hmm.

[00:25:37] Jess: W- Maybe a little bit new hardware. But,

[00:25:38] Mikki: like, again, that is insane. Mm-hmm. That is insane.

[00:25:44] Jess: Yes.

[00:25:44] Mikki: It's insane.

[00:25:46] Jess: It-

[00:25:46] Mikki: You're not wrong, everybody. You're not wrong. But unfortunately, like- COVID

[00:25:50] Jess: made the prices go up, and they just never

[00:25:52] Mikki: came down And they never went down.

And, and 100%, 100%, that is the greed of these supply companies, 'cause basically what happened was, 'cause this happened in drywall.

[00:26:02] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:26:03] Mikki: They, you know, all this stuff was happening. COVID was happening. Like, everything just shut down for a little while, and everybody was fine for it being shut down for a little while.

Mm-hmm. And then everybody was like, "Okay, we're done with everything being shut down," even though COVID was still out there. So they're, they started doing stuff.

[00:26:18] Jess: People,

[00:26:18] Mikki: all the stuff. Mm-hmm. "Okay, we're gonna remodel our house since we can't go anywhere." And I'm like,

what about the people who, who have to do the work to remodel your house?"

Like-

[00:26:26] Jess: Yeah

[00:26:28] Mikki: So con- like factories shut down, material, there was a material shortage. It was crazy, and suppliers realized that they could just charge whatever, and if, if this company needed the materials bad enough, they would pay it. Mm-hmm. And so literally the cost of drywall almost overnight doubled for no reason.

The, I mean, it, other than COVID. Mm-hmm. Like, there's no issues with the materials. There is no issue with the supply of materials. There is no issue with the demand of the materials. Like, all of those are the same. The only thing that was different was COVID. So you would think, right, like after COVID, we're what?

Six years out of COVID. Prices would go down. Nope. They never changed. Mm-mm. So that's the thing, is they increase their prices because they're greedy SOBs, and then instead of saying, "Okay, well, we got, you know, we- the goose was good while it was, but we're gonna bring the prices back down," they're like, "No, you're just gonna keep paying it."

So the cost of everything is so much because material suppliers are evil, and they aren't being held accountable- Mm-hmm ... by anyone.

[00:27:36] Jess: No, they can charge whatever they

[00:27:37] Mikki: want. By any- there's nothing stopping them, so they're just gonna keep raising the prices until s- until literally nobody can afford the to, to, to, to have their house re- renovated or built.

Mm-hmm. Which we're already seeing that, but it's gonna take a real act of Congress, which is a joke, s- for, for that to happen. Yeah. So unfortunately, it's really sad.

[00:28:01] Jess: Well, that's like, like, we wanted to put a pool in our backyard and during, um, like, it was, like, mid, like, COVID was, like, slowly coming down- Yeah

and we're like, "Oh, we'll just wait a couple years when the prices aren't-"

[00:28:13] Mikki: Nope. T-

[00:28:14] Jess: they, they still haven't come down. Never went down.

[00:28:16] Mikki: They-

[00:28:16] Jess: I'm like, "You know what? You can keep your pool."

[00:28:18] Mikki: Yeah.

[00:28:18] Jess: I'll just walk.

[00:28:20] Mikki: To the neighborhood pool. I'll

[00:28:21] Jess: walk to the neighborhood pool. It's six houses down. We'll- Yeah ...

[00:28:23] Mikki: we're fine.

It's insane. Yeah. It is insane. Sorry, that was- Sorry ... that was, that was the soapbox. Sidetrack. I'm off the soapbox now. We can continue with the story. "

[00:28:31] Jess: We found our contractor through a flyer stuck in our mailbox."

[00:28:35] Mikki: Oh, Shawn. "

[00:28:38] Jess: I gave him a call, and he came over. He measured a few things, looked over our kitchen, and he seemed friendly enough.

Gave us a verbal quote of $42,000- " Oh "... and told us he could start in two weeks. He never gave us anything in writing-

[00:28:56] Mikki: Shawn ...

[00:28:57] Jess: before we handed him a deposit. I didn't know that Massachusetts law actually limits how much a contractor can ask for up front."

[00:29:05] Mikki: Neither did I. That's great that that exists. Mm. I mean, if you know about it.

[00:29:09] Jess: Yeah, if you know. That's the- Yeah,

[00:29:11] Mikki: the more you know.

[00:29:12] Jess: The m- The more you

[00:29:12] Mikki: know.

[00:29:12] Jess: That's why we're here. "And a real contract is supposed to spell out the start date, the completion date- Yes ... and exactly what work is being done."

[00:29:24] Mikki: 100%. Shawn, you figured it out.

[00:29:27] Jess: Yep. "I just wanted my kitchen done, so I paid him half the total cost- Oh

before he even picked up a hammer."

[00:29:37] Mikki: Poor Shawn. I'm so sorry.

[00:29:39] Jess: Mm. The fear, the The first few weeks weren't bad. Just as

[00:29:44] Mikki: rebooted. Ooh.

[00:29:48] Jess: Um, it's Monday. Well, Tuesday when you're watching this, but today is Monday, and it feels- It feels- ... as much of a Monday as a Monday can feel ... the

[00:29:55] Mikki: Mondiest of Mondays.

[00:29:56] Jess: Mm-hmm. The demolition happened fast. It always does. Within four days, our kitchen was down to studs and the subfloor. Mm. And we were eating takeout on paper plates in the living room.

Then things slowed to a crawl.

[00:30:11] Mikki: Dude, every single time.

[00:30:12] Jess: Every time.

[00:30:13] Mikki: Because I'm telling you, I am telling you, I'm, I am saying this with my whole chest, I think it's a strategy. Mm. They demo your house so quick so that you're uncomfortable enough to keep paying them. Because, like, think about it. When it, it feels so, so much more high pressure when your kitchen doesn't exist, and there's no sink, and you're washing your dishes in your bathtub-

[00:30:36] Jess: Yeah, eating takeout all the time.

[00:30:38] Mikki: Mm-hmm ... to keep paying dummy dumb dumb, who's not doing... You're not happy with what they're doing. You're, you have no confidence in what they're doing, but you feel pressure because you don't, you can't do your- Nothing ... you live your regular life. Mm. I'm telling you this is strategy. It is, it has to be.

[00:30:54] Jess: It has to be.

[00:30:54] Mikki: It has to be.

[00:30:55] Jess: Because every single story.

[00:30:56] Mikki: Every single one, you guys. You- It- Every single one.

[00:30:59] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:30:59] Mikki: The demo happens like that.

[00:31:02] Jess: Yep.

[00:31:02] Mikki: Every time

[00:31:04] Jess: Oh, goodness. Um, okay. So days would pass with no one showing up. Yeah. When I'd call to ask what was going on, I'd get vague answers about permits or about waiting on materials.

I didn't know that in Massachusetts, contractors are required to be registered, and that certain electrical and plumbing work legally had to be done by licensed tradespeople.

[00:31:32] Mikki: Yeah.

[00:31:33] Jess: Not just whoever the general contractor has on his crew that day.

[00:31:37] Mikki: Yeah, facts.

[00:31:39] Jess: I found out later that the guy who rewired our outlets wasn't licensed for that kind of work.

[00:31:43] Mikki: Mm.

[00:31:45] Jess: I only found out because an inspector flagged it when he finally, when it-

[00:31:51] Mikki: When we finally called them ourselves.

[00:31:54] Jess: Finally called. Wow. I told you.

[00:31:56] Mikki: That's okay. Thank you.

[00:31:57] Jess: They

[00:31:57] Mikki: had to call the town themselves, like, and that's how they found, found... Like, he didn't even find out from the GC, like, "Oh, there was an issue with the electrical."

Mm-hmm. He just, like, finally got so fed up with nobody showing up, he calls the town- Yeah ... and they're like, "Oh, yeah, that got, that got failed because,

the, the wiring was all wrong."

[00:32:15] Jess: Yeah. I can't even.

[00:32:17] Mikki: Mm-hmm.

[00:32:19] Jess: What in the world? People would come to the house on random days and times. We never knew who was showing up or when.

Oh, yeah. I would get calls at work saying that someone was there and couldn't get in because no one was home. It was a disaster, and my wife was wicked stressed about it.

[00:32:33] Mikki: Oh, wick- Say it, say it like they would say it, Jess.

[00:32:36] Jess: Wicked.

[00:32:37] Mikki: That's how? It's like a- Wicked. Oh, I think I'm thinking of, like, the Boston accent.

[00:32:42] Jess: That's

[00:32:42] Mikki: so wicked. Where they're like wicked. It's, like, real thick. Wicked. It's wicked. Sorry.

[00:32:46] Jess: That's what we say- Sorry ... when, when something's really terrible. That's wicked. Wicked. Um. Wicked stressed. Um, as they were installing things and putting our kitchen back together, we were getting the feeling that something just was not right.

[00:33:02] Mikki: Mm.

[00:33:03] Jess: I started doing some research and realized we had made some major mistakes.

[00:33:08] Mikki: I'm sorry, Sean.

[00:33:09] Jess: We called the town to get an inspector out to make sure our home was going to be safe. I can just imagine, like, somebody's putting, like, the kitchen back together, and you're like-

[00:33:18] Mikki: You're like, "But did you expect that?"

[00:33:20] Jess: Ooh. Like, Or, like, how wrong does it have to be for, like, just- I know ... like, if I was watching people put my kitchen back together, like, it would take it being really wrong- Yeah ... well, not now. Right. But, like-

[00:33:30] Mikki: Now you're know. Now I know. But, like, as a homeowner who's not, doesn't have a podcast about homeowner stories- Homeowner horror stories

imagine how, like, messed up- It, big ... it would have to be for you to be like, "I think I should call the town." I don't

[00:33:42] Jess: think that's right. It, like, it's gotta be wires somewhere- Yeah ... or plumbing that just doesn't look-

[00:33:49] Mikki: I can't even imagine ...

[00:33:49] Jess: right. Like, it's gotta be real bad-

[00:33:52] Mikki: Yeah, it's gotta be pretty bad ...

[00:33:53] Jess: for you to, um...

Okay. So- The inspector fai- failed our electrical work outright. He told us plainly that what had been done didn't meet code and- Ugh ... would need to be torn out and redone by a licensed electrician. I remember standing in my gutted kitchen holding that paperwork feeling like I'd been punched in the stomach.

[00:34:18] Mikki: Oh, man.

[00:34:19] Jess: We had already paid our contractor for that work. Now we'd have to pay somebody else to fix it on top of everything else.

[00:34:26] Mikki: Yeah.

[00:34:27] Jess: Money started disappearing faster than I could track it. Oh, God. We began as a $42,000 project, which crept up to $50,000 by the time all the dust settled.

[00:34:39] Mikki: Still not-

[00:34:39] Jess: There were the cabinets that arrived damaged that had to be reordered.

Right. There was a plumbing issue under the sink that the contractor claimed wasn't his responsibility, even though his crew had installed it.

[00:34:53] Mikki: Yes. Fun. Yeah. That's definitely not your responsibility. No,

[00:34:56] Jess: not at all.

[00:34:57] Mikki: Nah.

[00:34:58] Jess: There was the six weeks he disappeared entirely.

[00:35:03] Mikki: Oh, that's fun.

[00:35:04] Jess: Mm. It

[00:35:05] Mikki: was- Six weeks is a month and a half.

And a half. Wha- oh, my God.

[00:35:10] Jess: At that point, like, wouldn't you think, like, "Maybe I should call somebody else- Yeah ... to come finish this?" Dude. Um, where he was apparently working another job- Classic ... while ours sat half-finished, walls open- Ugh ... no working sink, three of us washing dishes in the bathroom. I mean, I-

[00:35:27] Mikki: Every time.

Mm-hmm. Every time.

[00:35:30] Jess: I felt embarrassed more than anything.

[00:35:32] Mikki: Yeah.

[00:35:32] Jess: My wife would ask me what was happening, and I didn't have good answers because I didn't understand half of what was happening.

[00:35:39] Mikki: Oh, wow. Um,

[00:35:41] Jess: terms like rough-in and load-bearing and subcontractor got thrown around like I was rounds. Like, I was just supposed to nod along.

And for a while, I did.

[00:35:54] Mikki: And f- And- Every- John, everybody. Mm-hmm. Like, you are not alone. You are not alone. That is, the people that write in, that is one of the most repeated themes, is, "I didn't understand what was happening, but I didn't wanna look stupid. I didn't wanna seem like I didn't know what I was talking about, so I just went along with it," until it got to a point where they just realized, like, "Okay, I'm gonna have to start asking questions."

Like, you are, I don't wanna say, like, in good company, but honestly you are, because every single person that has written, written in- Mm-hmm ... and shared their story with us, w- it is not your job to know what those things mean. It is the job of a contractor to explain to you what those things mean as they're talking to you about it.

In layman's terms. And, like, even saying, "Hey- Mm-hmm ... this is load-bearing. Let me explain to you what that is just in case you don't know." And I always say to, to everybody that I'm dealing with, like, "Hey, stop me if you know this," because I don't wanna just assume that somebody knows this. So I say- Yeah ... "Hey, listen, if you know this, stop me.

But if not, I'm gonna explain this to you in a little bit more detail." Yep. Because this stuff matters. I don't wanna say that all general contractors that don't do layman's terms or don't make it a point to explain what these things mean are bad, because I think there are a lot of, like, OGs out there that have literally been doing this since Jesus was a baby.

[00:37:15] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:37:15] Mikki: Like, working side by side in Jesus' carpenter studio, you know what I'm saying? Like, and they just are so old school- Mm-hmm ... that they just expect you to know. Because I'm gonna be honest, getting old is weird. It, it is the weirdest experience- Mm-hmm ... ever. So, like, seeing the world change and seeing, like, in real time culturally-

[00:37:43] Jess: Yep

[00:37:44] Mikki: us lose things is very strange. When I was younger There were a whole lot more people that you would interact with on an everyday basis that knew about building things.

[00:37:58] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:37:59] Mikki: I, I would very rarely meet men that didn't know how to use power tools. I would very rarely-

[00:38:05] Jess: Yep ...

[00:38:05] Mikki: come across people, like, especially, like, older people or, like, people who were older in my version but are just now my age.

Yeah. You know, like, they were old then 'cause I was in my 20s and I was like, "Oh my God, that's so old" And now I'm like, "What are you talking about? That's not

[00:38:18] Jess: old." I'm still young and in my

[00:38:19] Mikki: prime. You do... I have no wrinkles. What are you talking about? Look at this face. So, you know, now- Mm-hmm ... I- it just w- it was very rare.

Like, the, the, the subset of people just knew shit. Mm-hmm. And now it is very rare that we encounter people that know stuff. Wanna know why that is? And it's not like... What is it? The internet?

[00:38:41] Jess: No. It's because- Wh- whose

[00:38:42] Mikki: fault is it? I'm like, who can we blame?

[00:38:44] Jess: Well, so what happened was everybody was told that your child had to go to college- Yes

to get a degree to work in these corporate places. 100%. So there is- 100% ... this whole generation where we were told- There

[00:38:58] Mikki: was no shop class. There was none of that ...

[00:39:01] Jess: No. Yes. Thank God. Like, that was for the dummies who wouldn't- Right,

[00:39:05] Mikki: who couldn't go

[00:39:06] Jess: to college ... succeed in college. So-

[00:39:08] Mikki: Yeah ...

[00:39:08] Jess: so you either have them-

[00:39:10] Mikki: Yeah

[00:39:11] Jess: and, like, some of them didn't. Like, I remember in high school all the people that took those classes. Ah. And I don't know if I would wa- have wanted them working- That's fair ... on electrical in my house. That's fair. But yes, we were all told-

[00:39:25] Mikki: Yeah ...

[00:39:25] Jess: go to college, get a good job- Right ...

[00:39:27] Mikki: work for the man. So now there's this whole class of people- Yeah

that didn't do wood shop, didn't go- Nope ... work with their dads in the field. Like, I've met people in construction that have ch- children that are old enough to, like, work with them. Mm-hmm. And I'll be like, "Oh, your son doesn't frame with you?" "Oh, I would never let my son frame with me. This is too hard work. I don't want my kids to work this hard."

Well, then whose kids? If not yours, then whose? 'Cause somebody's kids are gonna have to learn how to frame.

[00:39:54] Jess: Yeah.

[00:39:55] Mikki: So, like, it's a whole thing. You're absolutely right. Yeah. And it's... Like, the, the whole point of this is it's not your fault. No. Like, culturally, we stopped teaching- Mm-hmm ... our kids and our students and the world- Mm-hmm

how t- what to know about construction, how construction works. Like, what's normal, what's not. We stopped teaching this, so it's unbelievably common, and there's... it's not your fault that you don't know what these terms are. Nope. It's not your fault that this guy didn't explain it to you. And the whole point of this, and you writing in and us sharing, is so that- people can learn from this mistake, that we can normalize this a little bit more.

Mm-hmm. So that when you're experiencing this, you don't feel ashamed. You just say, "You know what? I actually don't know what that means. Can you explain it?" And then if they can't explain it, then you probably don't hire

[00:40:41] Jess: them. Then you know, then you know you don't k- you don't give them any more of your money.

[00:40:44] Mikki: Yeah, no more money. No more money for you. No more

[00:40:45] Jess: money for you.

[00:40:47] Mikki: Same.

[00:40:49] Jess: No soup for you. Um, eventually I stopped nodding. I started- Good for you ... keeping a folder of every text message, every receipt, every promise he made and broke. I called the Massachusetts Office of Consumer Affairs and Bigi- Bus- Business Regulation, good Lord, and asked how homeowners were supposed to be protected in situations like ours.

That conversation changed everything for me.

[00:41:17] Mikki: Awesome

[00:41:18] Jess: I learned that our contractor had never given us the three-day right to cancel notice he was legally required- Hmm ... to provide when he first took our deposit.

[00:41:30] Mikki: Clock that Massachusetts. Hmm. That's a law.

[00:41:33] Jess: Yep, three days.

[00:41:35] Mikki: I didn't know that.

[00:41:36] Jess: Me neither. Huh.

And I live there, and I had work done in my house-

[00:41:39] Mikki: Yeah ...

[00:41:40] Jess: by contractors who now I'm like, "Mm."

[00:41:42] Mikki: You're like, "Excuse me. Where was my three-day notice?"

[00:41:45] Jess: Yeah.

[00:41:45] Mikki: Rude.

[00:41:46] Jess: So rude.

[00:41:47] Mikki: That

[00:41:47] Jess: is so rude. I- and, like, actually, the, the work that I had done on my house there, I'm like, "Oh, we did not... I-"

[00:41:53] Mikki: You're like, "Uh-oh."

[00:41:54] Jess: Uh-oh.

[00:41:56] Mikki: See, this was before the podcast.

[00:41:57] Jess: This was before the podcast. I'm like, did we... I don't know if there was an inspection done on any of it. Oh, man. And we took out, like, a whole wall, and there's, like, a, a beam there now. My house will not fall down.

[00:42:10] Mikki: It's fine. It's fine. It was built in, like, 1705. It's fine. And- It's been here that long, it'll be fine.

[00:42:16] Jess: Yeah, it'll be fine. I mean, it was built when, you know, things were built right- Yeah ... not with toothpicks and splinters. When

[00:42:21] Mikki: they actually

[00:42:22] Jess: had

[00:42:22] Mikki: wood that was dried out.

[00:42:24] Jess: Yeah, no. We don't do

[00:42:25] Mikki: that anymore.

[00:42:26] Jess: Who needs wood that's dried out? Takes,

[00:42:27] Mikki: it takes too long. Rude.

[00:42:31] Jess: da, da, da, da, da. Sorry. Um, I learned that homeowners in Massachusetts can file a complaint against a contractor's registration, and that there's a-

[00:42:44] Mikki: Oh, the fund

like,

[00:42:45] Jess: guarantee fund that can help cover losses from bad contractor work. None of that made the stress disappear-

[00:42:52] Mikki: Yeah ...

[00:42:53] Jess: but it gave me something I hadn't had in months, which was a plan.

[00:42:58] Mikki: Yes. This is giving very Kevin McCallister vibes. Mm-hmm. Like, his house is about to be broken into. And he's like, "I've got a plan."

He's been left in Chicago, but he's got a plan. He wrote it in crayon. It is down. It's time. He's coming for you.

[00:43:12] Jess: At least he's got that written in crayon. This guy doesn't have anything. He's just

[00:43:14] Mikki: like, "Listen, now I have a plan." Now I got it. "It's written in crayon."

[00:43:17] Jess: We ended up letting that contractor go.

[00:43:19] Mikki: Smart.

[00:43:20] Jess: It felt terrifying- Yes ... at the time. It does. And that's what so many people- Yep ... feel. They

[00:43:25] Mikki: don't do it. So street cred to you, Shawn, because so many people don't let them go- Mm-hmm ... 'cause they're scared. Yep. So you were scared, but you did it anyway- Yep ... and I'm proud of you.

[00:43:34] Jess: Growth happens outside your comfort zone.

[00:43:36] Mikki: Look at you. We

[00:43:37] Jess: did

[00:43:37] Mikki: it. Jess does that stuff pr- professionally. She gives little talks.

[00:43:40] Jess: Well.

[00:43:40] Mikki: You can hire her. Just

[00:43:42] Jess: checking. Give you a little vibe check.

[00:43:44] Mikki: She does vibe checks.

[00:43:45] Jess: Yep. Um, dun, dun, dun.

like we were burning the bridge that was- Yeah ... supposed to lead us home. Oh my God. Yeah. I am sorry, guys. Also, the little old lady, and literally she's little- Yeah

she's like five feet tall, she told me on the phone, that is renting my Airbnb right now-

[00:44:02] Mikki: Yeah ... ugh.

[00:44:05] Jess: She is just, like, message... She is, she has not stopped messaging me since she moved in

[00:44:10] Mikki: four days ago. Oh, God, Jess.

[00:44:14] Jess: I mean, I think that she's just lonely 'cause it's just her there. Oh. So it's "Did you know that your neighbor's dog-

[00:44:22] Mikki: No.

[00:44:24] Jess: is outside and they didn't clean up its poop?"

[00:44:27] Mikki: Ma'am, absolutely not. I did not know that, nor did I wanna know.

[00:44:31] Jess: I don't care. Don't care.

[00:44:34] Mikki: And she's like, "What am I supposed to

[00:44:35] Jess: do about

[00:44:36] Mikki: that?"

[00:44:36] Jess: She's like, "Um, there's no light bulbs in the outside, like, the front entryway."

[00:44:42] Mikki: Okay.

[00:44:43] Jess: Um, we think that one of the people that we hired to do work at our house, that ended up being a scam-

came by and smashed them.

[00:44:52] Mikki: Oh.

[00:44:53] Jess: This was, like, when we first were doing it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, like, it's been a year, and, like, um, he got arrested. But, um, it's

[00:44:59] Mikki: fine. I remember that story. Yes. Brad was like, "Try me."

[00:45:01] Jess: Yeah. Yeah. Um, so but when we put in another light bulb, it didn't work. Hm. So, like, I just took the light bulbs out- Yeah

'cause I was like, I don't want something to, like, spark or anything. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So she's like, "Do you know that there's no light bulbs?" Yes, ma'am, I do know that there's no light bulbs. It doesn't work. Don't- It's

[00:45:18] Mikki: broken.

[00:45:19] Jess: I was like, "Leave the lights on." It's, there's no stairs to come into the house. Yeah, it's not like she's

[00:45:23] Mikki: gonna, like, eat shit-

[00:45:24] Jess: Yeah

[00:45:24] Mikki: falling down stairs

[00:45:25] Jess: or anything. No, there's no, there's no stairs. It's a smooth walkway into the house. I was like, "You can leave..." And there's, like, a little window, but it comes, like, from the stair. Yeah. I was like, "Leave this hallway stair light on, and you can still see." And she's like, "Oh, I don't go out much at night.

I was just..." I was like, "Then leave me

[00:45:44] Mikki: alone." Yes. I think, like, my bad karma might be rubbing off on you.

[00:45:47] Jess: Mm. I'm sorry about that. No, you keep your bad karma right over there. You keep... That's a story for the

[00:45:54] Mikki: next- That's a story for the next podcast ...

[00:45:54] Jess: next podcast. Stay tuned. Um, so I'm sorry. I get... It just pfft, 'cause I c- I- I

[00:46:00] Mikki: don't know where that came from, but it was living in your head.

You needed to get it out.

[00:46:03] Jess: Well, you know what? It's because she's messaging me now.

[00:46:06] Mikki: Oh.

[00:46:06] Jess: So, like, I'm trying to read, and it comes up.

[00:46:09] Mikki: That... I was like, normally, when we do a side quest, it-

[00:46:14] Jess: It's your fault ...

[00:46:14] Mikki: is, one, my fault, but, two, somewhere it ties into the story. But that was... Now we know where that

[00:46:20] Jess: came from.

Now we know why. I can't read when my... And I don't know-

[00:46:23] Mikki: Lady, stop messaging me.

[00:46:25] Jess: I have tried to shut off the, the, like- The notifications ... notifications, and she still gets, gets through.

[00:46:30] Mikki: She's like, "

[00:46:30] Jess: Ma'am, this is urgent." This is... All right. I- Sorry about that ... sorry that she is-

[00:46:37] Mikki: Insane

[00:46:39] Jess: she's just needy. I think she's...

I feel bad because she's obviously old and alone and, like, maybe needs a friend, and-

[00:46:44] Mikki: You're like, "But I'm not it."

[00:46:45] Jess: I'm busy.

okay. Da, da, da, da, da. A friend recommended a small licensed remodeling company that actually walked us through a real contract-

[00:46:57] Mikki: Yay ...

[00:46:58] Jess: before touching anything. They explained what needed fixing from the previous work, gave us a clear timeline.

[00:47:05] Mikki: Yes.

[00:47:05] Jess: And for the first time in this whole process, showed up when they said they would.

[00:47:12] Mikki: Shocking how that works.

[00:47:14] Jess: I mean, that should be the standard.

[00:47:16] Mikki: Yeah. I mean, it's,

I guess the thing to realize too is that y- if you don't watch this podcast, you don't have anything to compare it to. Mm-hmm. So, like, this guy didn't know what he didn't know.

We say this all the time. Right. You don't have anything to compare it to. If somebody comes in and wants, you know, you get a good feeling and it seems like they know what they're talking about, and they, they give you a price you can live with, you think, "Oh, well, he's just given me a handshake. Like, this must be how it does."

[00:47:41] Jess: Yeah.

[00:47:41] Mikki: So it took him having that bad experience to know, oh, oh, that's actually not at all how it works. Right. So you don't know what you don't know, which is why you guys should subscribe to our podcast and then share it with a friend- Yes ... that might be having a renovation. 'Cause you don't want them to end up on the wrong side of this, guys.

You don't want them- Right ... writing in, unless it's to tell us how great they think we are. Which I'm not gonna lie to you, does not happen often. Okay? So-

[00:48:05] Jess: It should happen more often ...

[00:48:05] Mikki: we could use some good news around here.

[00:48:08] Jess: Yes. Go ahead.

[00:48:08] Mikki: chicksinconstruction.com. Write us a love note, but don't be weird.

Please.

[00:48:15] Jess: Keep it on the up and up. Back to it. All right. So it took another two months-

[00:48:19] Mikki: Damn ...

[00:48:19] Jess: to finish what has, what should have taken six weeks in the first place. Mm. The final cost, once you add up the wasted materials, the electrical rework, and the second contractor's fees, came in around $80,000. Oh my

[00:48:34] Mikki: God.

I am so sorry.

[00:48:36] Jess: That number still makes me wince.

[00:48:37] Mikki: Yeah.

[00:48:38] Jess: But when I stand in my kitchen now with the island we always wanted and the lights that actually work the way they're supposed to-

[00:48:45] Mikki: Shocking

[00:48:47] Jess: how that works ... I don't just see a renovation. It is a beautiful kitchen, and we enjoy cooking in it.

[00:48:53] Mikki: Wonderful.

[00:48:53] Jess: I see everything we learned about asking the thing... I see everything we learned about asking for things in writing- Yes ... about checking a license before we ever hand over a check- Ding, ding,

[00:49:03] Mikki: ding, ding ...

[00:49:04] Jess: and about trusting our own instincts- Yes ... even when somebody with a tool belt and the confident voice tells us not to worry about it.

[00:49:11] Mikki: So dude, yes, all of that. Like, these are the things that we talk about. We're only gonna do this one, because the, you know, we've gone on so many side quests. Mm-hmm. The podcast is gonna be s- six hours long- ... if we do another Homeowner Horror Story. But literally, yes, like, always, always, a- a- It is hard to find a contractor.

[00:49:35] Jess: Really hard.

[00:49:35] Mikki: It is hard to say where is a good place to find a contractor.

[00:49:39] Jess: Not in a

[00:49:39] Mikki: mailbox. We know of some absolutely amazing, like Nicole from,

the Kitchen and Bath Remodeling Center. Yeah, the Bath Remodeling

[00:49:45] Jess: Center in

[00:49:46] Mikki: Cary. She is one of our absolute favorite- Mm-hmm ... general contractors in this area.

Like, we recommend her with our whole chests.

[00:49:52] Jess: Mm-hmm.

[00:49:53] Mikki: You can find her on Facebook. You can find... But, like, is that the only place you can find her? No.

[00:49:59] Jess: No.

[00:49:59] Mikki: You can find her on, you know, Google. You can Google, search her company on, on Google. You can see reviews that she has. You can see her all over social media.

She has a really big presence. It's not just Facebook. So I don't wanna say, like, you should never find your contractor on Facebook. That might be a great place to start, to give you some ideas. Mm-hmm. But then that's where, like, that's the beginning. That's the baby step. Then it's like, okay, we're verifying licensing.

Mm-hmm. We're looking to see if they have judgments against them. We're making sure that they have insurance and that they are specifically insured to do the work that they're doing. We are, we're making sure that they're, they don't have, like, multiple companies registered in their name- Mm-hmm ... and it's, it looks like, okay, well, they've, they just changed a few letters.

Yep. It looks like the same company. 'Cause that's weird, 'cause that says, like, it gives, like, oh, we shut down and started again. Mm-hmm. But didn't wanna redo all of our branding.

[00:50:51] Jess: Yep.

[00:50:51] Mikki: And you know what? Which is a flag on the play.

[00:50:52] Jess: Um, when we see the people recommended on Facebook all the time- Yeah ... 'cause, like, you'll go and, like, you'll see, like, all these people recommended.

You know what I did?

[00:51:01] Mikki: What?

[00:51:02] Jess: I went to a person who recommended somebody, and I was like, "Can you send me a picture of their work?"

[00:51:05] Mikki: Oh my God. How'd that go?

[00:51:08] Jess: They're like, "Oh, well, they didn't do work at my house." I say- Oh. Because you know what happens is their friends are going to recommend them. Oh. And like, so like, I recommend...

Like, I have seen the work- Yeah, yeah ... that Nicole does, 'cause-

[00:51:22] Mikki: Yeah, yeah ...

[00:51:22] Jess: I-

[00:51:23] Mikki: She does her social media ...

[00:51:24] Jess: I do her social media. So, like, I have been

[00:51:25] Mikki: in- Jessica do your social media, too.

[00:51:27] Jess: I- Check

[00:51:28] Mikki: us

[00:51:28] Jess: out. Yeah. I love it. Um, Brick by Brick Media. Um- But like, I have been in-

[00:51:35] Mikki: Yeah ...

[00:51:35] Jess: the homes.

[00:51:36] Mikki: Yeah.

[00:51:36] Jess: I have seen the progress.

I have seen before and after. Like, and I know that it's- Yeah ... high-quality work. But a lot of people will recommend somebody that is in their BNI, that they've networked with- Oh ... that's their friend. And so they don't, they haven't actually experienced it.

[00:51:52] Mikki: And that's not necessarily, like, a bad- No ... like, like, like they have bad intention.

Because I recommended a general contractor to a friend that I had never worked with as a GC. Okay. That I had worked with him, 'cause he was a trim guy. Mm-hmm. But we had all, we had all known, 'cause he had told everybody, he was a licensed GC. Turns out he wasn't. Mm. I just, for 10 years I'd worked with the guy, and he always told us he was a licensed general contractor.

Okay. So when a friend needed one, I was like- Okay ... "Oh."

[00:52:18] Jess: Yep. "

[00:52:18] Mikki: Steve probably could, would be a great rec- recommendation." Yeah, he screwed her over. He screwed her over. So it's one of those things where it's like, that is such a good quest- Can you send me pictures? Can

[00:52:29] Jess: you send me pictures- Ooh ... of their work?

Because then you know.

[00:52:33] Mikki: Yeah, they actually

[00:52:34] Jess: did the work. They actually did the work. And like, that's not the going to be where I stop. Right, right. But like, that was like, okay, well, now I need to go see if anybody else recommended them. That

[00:52:43] Mikki: is a great question to ask. Can you send me pictures of their work?

Because if they- Mm-hmm ... didn't do any work at your house, you have to say, "Oh, well, they didn't do any work at my house,"

[00:52:50] Jess: but- Yeah. And if you say, "Oh, I don't have any pictures," you liar. Right. We have this in our hands 24/7.

[00:52:56] Mikki: 24/7 a day. 24/7. 24/7.

[00:52:58] Jess: You took a picture of something. 100%, If somebody's doing something in your hou- you are taking a picture.

Oh,

[00:53:01] Mikki: absolutely.

[00:53:02] Jess: So. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. So there's, there's a little tip there, too. Man,

[00:53:04] Mikki: that's a great one. I love, that's such a good add to your list of things. If somebody rec- if you get a recommendation off Facebook- Mm-hmm ... you're going to s- to those people and saying, "Hey, can you send me a picture of their work?"

[00:53:15] Jess: Mm-hmm. Oh, that's great. Or you could describe your experience with them. Something.

[00:53:18] Mikki: Yeah. So. Yeah. That's such... Yeah, so that's the thing is like-

[00:53:23] Jess: Facebook

[00:53:23] Mikki: might not be the place, but you can start there. Mm-hmm. But then, then you do all these other things. You make sure that your scope of work is in the contract.

You make sure that it says in the contract how you're gonna handle delays, how you're gonna handle changes, how, what is and is not your responsibility as the homeowner, because we have... This is a hill I have died on multiple times- ... on TikTok, because I've been come for so many times. So many times. You are not responsible for a general contractor failing an inspection.

Mm-hmm. If there's a cost to fix work, if there's a cost for a re-inspection, that is never a homeowner's, a homeowner's cost. That being in your contract, having really clear language is how you prevent yourself from getting into these experiences. So that is what we are here for. We want you to have the best experiences you have.

If you have had a bad experience, we wanna share it with our audience so that other people don't have to make the same mistakes. You can go to our website at chicksinconstruction.com. You just scroll down a little bit. There's a little form. You can fill it in. We will read your whole story, except for Jess will never say your full name because she's not about that life, and everybody will know, and people will learn.

Mm-hmm. And that's, that's the ecosystem we're trying to create here on the socials and on YouTube. Speaking of socials, Jess, where can they find us?

[00:54:44] Jess: On Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn, it's @ChicksInConstructionPodcast. On TikTok, it's @ChicksInConstruction.

[00:54:50] Mikki: All right, guys. We'll see you in the next one. Bye.