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Ohio's public schools serve 1.6 million children - 90 percent of students in the state! What happens in the classroom has impacts far beyond the walls of the K-12 school building or higher ed lecture hall. So, on behalf of the 115,000 members of the Ohio Education Association, we're taking a deeper dive into some of the many education issues facing our students, educators, and communities. Originally launched in 2021 as Education Matters, Public Education Matters is your source for insightful conversations with the people who shape the education landscape in Ohio. Have a topic you'd like to hear about on Public Education Matters? Email us at educationmatters@ohea.org
Erin Nusker 0:00
It is very imperative right now in the classroom, and especially at the youngest ages, that we try to address as many of the problems that we're coming across with children not being able to identify and manage their emotions. And I was like, teachers need these resources now.
Various student voices 0:23
Public education matters. Public education matters. Public education matters.
Jeff Wensing 0:30
This is public Education Matters, brought to you by the Ohio Education Association.
Katie Olmsted 0:41
Thanks for joining us for this edition of Public Education Matters. I'm your host Katie Olmsted, and I'm part of the communications team for the Ohio Education Association and the 115,000 K-12 teachers, education support professionals, higher ed faculty members, and other public school educators OEA represents around the state. These educators are highly trained professionals who have dedicated their careers to meeting students' needs, academically and beyond. And one of those needs to succeed both in school and in life is learning to recognize and self-regulate emotions. That's what social emotional learning is. And even when SEL became a big culture wars buzzword among certain politicians a few years ago, our guest on this podcast episode did not back down from her mission to help her kindergarten students and other young learners be able to name, talk about, and begin to manage their feelings in a safe, supportive way. And as part of that mission, she wrote, illustrated, and published the "Cloudy with a Chance of Feelings" book series, from exploring what anger feels like and some tools to help control it in "Sometimes I Feel Like a Tornado", to the positive thinking affirmations to help move through sadness in the book "Tears Are Like the Rain", to the kid-friendly strategies offered to manage worry, disappointment, and more in "Sometimes I Feel Like the Weather". Erin Nusker uses weather characters to help readers connect with abstract concepts like feelings and develop emotional intelligence, we had a chance to connect with Erin a couple months ago to talk about how she developed her book series and why, and what may be coming next.
Erin Nusker 2:41
My name is Erin Nusker. I'm a kindergarten teacher for Madison Local School Districts in Lake County.
Katie Olmsted 2:47
And you are the author of the Cloudy with a Chance of Feelings series of books. Let's start at the beginning. What made you want to write these kinds of books?
Erin Nusker 3:00
Well, actually, I didn't start with coming up with an idea to write a children's book. That was not actually my main goal. I wasn't strategizing like, "Ooh, what kind of book series could I write for you know kids and teachers? I, since I am a kindergarten teacher, I was doing the normal you know midnight, 1am. You wake up and you start thinking about your students, and it was post COVID, and so you know, just seeing that drastic change in behavior within the classroom and the needs that children were coming in with, and you know, so I'm at my midnight, 1 am wake up and try, I'm trying to think of ideas, and I have always loved weather. I consider myself an amateur weather enthusiast, and so I've always used terminology with children related to their emotions. You know, with weather like anger, like a tornado, and so my early wake up call. I started came up this idea of like, ooh, you know, it would be really great to like have like visuals and things that I could make. And so I was, I wasn't at this point even thinking of a book. I was just thinking of things that I could create for my students, and it really stems from using the methods that I was using before with my my classroom wasn't working. The color coding and things like that, like my students just weren't resonating with it. And so when I came up with the idea, I actually put it in my notes app on my phone. So I have like the a whole list of all the characters I originally came up with first, and like how each one represents a different emotion, and then I was like, you know, this would be really cool to put into a book, and then I just became obsessed with it, honestly, and I started researching, you know, how could I write a book? Like, what is the process? How do you get. How do you get a publisher? And then I realized that wow, that is like a 10-year process. And I was like, teachers need these resources now. I felt like you know that we needed something that you know that would really resonate with young children for like the abstract colors moving into something more concrete that children could relate with, which is weather, and so that's whenever I realized that I could self publish, and so and open my own self publishing company, and so that's what I did, and so that's kind of how my books came to be, and so it really stemmed from trying to create resources that would help children in the classroom, children at home, parents, and teachers. So trying to like encompass helping everyone essentially.
Katie Olmsted 5:52
And I can tell you, my focus group of one. I have a five-year-old incoming kindergartner, and we were reading "Sometimes I Feel Like the Weather" last night, and one of the things that really resonated with me while we were reading it is, it really-I mean, she she connected with it, she understood it, she was doing it along with me with the questions. It was perfectly written for a five-year-old, but also the resources for the adults. The the this is the why and the how at the end. Obviously, you bring a lot of your experience as a kindergarten teacher to how do you talk to kindergarteners about this?
Erin Nusker 6:27
Yeah.
Katie Olmsted 6:28
The weather obviously is a big one for you. Do your kids, the the kids in your classroom, connect with it in that same way?
Erin Nusker 6:37
Yeah, as educators, we are constantly like looking at research, and so I really have found like colors are very abstract, and like red in other cultures doesn't mean anger. It means prosperity and all of that. So, like being more culturally aware of the the students that you're representing in your classroom where weather is universal, all children have experienced weather, and they can really resonate it. They like, oh, I I am like that character right now. Like I am like a tornado. Like they even if you haven't experienced a tornado, you've experienced severe weather. You know, and so that is just really where students connect a lot more. We're moving from more abstract to because feelings and emotions are abstract into concrete experiences, and so that I really tried to like bridge that gap as I was creating the series.
Katie Olmsted 7:38
And part of the problem with the feelings and emotions being abstract is little kids and some adults have a lot of trouble even identifying what that feeling is. This is by making them these characters by by giving them names and attributes. They I think that really helps them connect with it and and understand it better.
Erin Nusker 8:01
Yeah, and I I. As I was researching to write the write the book, once I had decided that that's the direction I was going, I started looking up like art frameworks that are already available that follow science because I, I mean, I'm not a behavior like expert, but teaching young children, I felt like I had this advantage that I could really help not only teachers but parents and the children. But I wanted also make sure that the book series, like, what followed some type of science and structure where I wasn't an expert in, but I could research, and so that's where I aligned it with Castle's social emotional framework. So you'll see in the back of the books, like it has like the different categories, like the self awareness, self management, social awareness, relationship skills, and responsible decision making. So a lot of the resources that go along with the books also follow that framework. And so whenever I was writing, I did it like with intent. You know that it's going to be valuable and also follow the research and very relatable for for the children as well so.
Katie Olmsted 9:21
I want to touch really quickly on those resources. The books have that QR code to to go to your website and get these downloadable resources. What can people get there, and why was that an important thing for you not just to have the book be itself?
Erin Nusker 9:38
Well, I guess I wanted it to be more of an experience. You know, you're not just getting a book. I wanted you to like create, be able to create systems and have resources that like are extensions. And since I love weather, that's very science based, and I knew that there could be more hands on. Things that children can do, and being a teacher, we create all the time. You know, so it was just natural for me to create resources that parents or teachers could use with the students that would be fun and hands-on. So, with the QR code, you can get resources, worksheets, coloring pages, and again, they're all aligned with the castle social emotional framework, and and then I also did the tornado tube science experiment. So, and this is also great as a calming resource that you could use in your room. It would require I did put links that you could just make like a glitter jar that you could swirl around, but the little tornado connectors that you can get for really inexpensive on Amazon. And I, to tell you, this is like the star of the show. I mean, the the kids in my class when I do I do this every year at the beginning of the year, and like you twirl it around, and the kids watching the tornado go down. I mean, they're mesmerized, and so it just the science kind of pulls into making hands on, and then now that's a resource that you can use as a calm down tool. You know, so trying to piggyback those together. So the resources are meant to be an extension and provide more opportunity for learning because it's not just reading the book one time. We know repeated exposures and repeated activities is what really helps children to internalize and be able to name those emotions, and that's the first step in being able to manage them.
Katie Olmsted 11:43
I talked about my focus group of one with my five-year-old. You have quite the focus group for people who can give you the feedback and the actual watching the the impact of this in real time. When you have shared these with your students, what difference has that made?
Erin Nusker 12:00
I definitely feel that I have better a better system now in my classroom, and it's very relatable. So I'm able to like implement it over and over again. And I, I mean, all the resources I create, I also use. So I do feel that they're meaningful, and and the students really resonate with with the weather. So and the characters. So it's really easy, you know, like oh, how are you feeling? And like I have like little posters and things that they can like point to, like which what character they're feeling right then, and which weather type they're feeling, and so I've I do feel that it has really helped create a system within my classroom that has been effective. You know, nothing is going to be foolproof. Obviously, you know we have outliers and kiddos that have additional special needs that and resources that they'll need, but I do feel that it has really resonated with my students.
Katie Olmsted 13:08
Do you have a favorite character that you've created of all I mean, we we have a lot of characters here. We have. I'm just going to go through it. We have Iris the Rainbow, who is calm and caring? Sunny the Sun represents happy. Dew the Raindrop is sad. Worried is Gale the Wind. Bolt the Thunderstorm is disappointed, and of course there is the angry tornado. Twister the Tornado. When you're coming up with the stories, when you're coming up with this whole series, was there one of them where you're like, yeah, that's my that's my guy there?
Erin Nusker 13:44
I feel like it's like, and it's kind of cliche because it's like the rainbow, you know. But Iris, just because when I'm like writing about her, she in the stories she is helping with the problem solving. She's like essentially the teacher, you know, and she's the one that's like doing the more the questioning and guiding children's thinking, and so I really felt like for me that's who I resonated with the most when I was writing because that is like she and I are very much the same. We're the ones helping, helping the others so.
Katie Olmsted 14:23
There was one part, especially in this. Sometimes I Feel Like the Weather one, where it's all of them together, and Iris steps in or steps towards the storm, and I, I don't know if it just hit me at that moment, but it really was like the teacher in that moment, and also just the idea of there's no bad emotion. It's okay to feel sad sometimes. It's okay to feel disappointed sometimes. And stepping towards that emotion and working through that emotion, I thought was a very powerful thing. Was that intentional?
Erin Nusker 14:55
It is intentional and Sometimes I Feel Like the Weather is the third book that I wrote, and so I wanted to be able to show all the emotions. And not only that, like weather changes all throughout the day, and so do our emotions. And I really wanted children and parents and teachers to see that and recognize, oh, I'm the same way. I my feelings change throughout the day too, and so this is normal and okay to have these waves of up and down, and then that at the end of every storm is a rainbow, and so like that is like my motto. I always write in books if if anybody wants me to sign them, I say be sure to weather the storm because that's what we're doing, and you you always end up with a rainbow at the end.
Katie Olmsted 15:49
I also like that these help us get to that rainbow. It gives us the language and the actionable things we can do with our children. It gives us the affirmations we can have them repeat with us. Again, backed by the science, backed by your own experience. But what's it like for you, knowing that parents like me, other educators, are able to put this into action the second we pick up the book?
Erin Nusker 16:19
It honestly, it just it warms my heart because you know you sometimes we come up with these ideas and you know you don't know if they're going to be successful. You don't know if the way that I'm imagining it in my you know scatterbrained mind. Sometimes my ideas are all over the place, so you know I I wasn't sure if the system I was creating was going to be received the same way, especially because I love weather so much. You know, I just didn't know if I was like you know the one oddball out. So it does it it warms my heart and it it makes me feel like the purpose behind what I did is meaningful to others, and that that it makes it worthwhile, like doing putting in all this work, you know. Because I, you had them. you
Katie Olmsted 17:10
You illustrated them, you self published them.
Erin Nusker 17:12
Yes, and whenever I first published my the first book, Sometimes I Feel Like a Tornado. During my research, there was one woman I was watching her YouTube videos on her process, and she was like, "Listen, you're not going to be an expert the first time you do it. Like, especially if you're illustrating on your own, you're not going to be the expert and just publish it. Like, you can always go back. And I was like, "You know what? We teach our students this all the time that you don't have to be the expert that it that it's okay, and you know you make it the best that you can, and then it's okay to go back and revise, and so that's what I did, and and I have gone back and I've re did a revision of of the first book, which I'm pretty happy with, and so, yeah, it's just it it's very meaningful, and you know that I went through the same process that I'm teaching other children, you know, and that it's meaningful to other people. That it it makes it worth all the effort.
Katie Olmsted 18:17
Okay, so timeline wise, we had Sometimes I Feel like a Tornado that came out first.
Erin Nusker 18:22
Yes.
Katie Olmsted 18:22
Then Tears Are Like the Rain. That was number two.
Erin Nusker 18:25
Yes.
Katie Olmsted 18:27
Did Sometimes I Feel Like a Tornado? The revision come out next, or did Sometimes I Feel Like the Weather come out next?
Erin Nusker 18:33
Sometimes I Feel Like the Weather.
Katie Olmsted 18:35
And then you went back and did the revision on tornado.
Erin Nusker 18:39
Yes.
Katie Olmsted 18:40
Are we expecting our other friends? Are we? Are there more books on the way?
Erin Nusker 18:44
I have taken a slight little break, you know, but I definitely like have all my ideas written down. I guess it really. I I had a really good question from a student at a school district that I recently went to do an event at, and I read my books, and she said, "What about the snow? If that could be an emotion, what emotion would it be?" So I like it. Got me thinking. Like I like whenever I get feedback from from other from children and what their interests are. So I haven't committed on what my next one is. I've kind of dabbled with ideas of making my characters more into the classroom and see if I could pull an element like you know within the classroom setting and like starting the school year, so I have I just have a lot of ideas. I do need to commit to one. I have a hard time with committing to one idea and going with it. So, um, I try not to rush it because that I do my best work whenever I get really excited and I hone in and. And then I become super dedicated for an extended amount of time, and that's all I think and do until it's completed, so.
Katie Olmsted 20:07
And that's hard when you also have a day job with a whole bunch of kindergartners in your class and a whole lot of other demands on your time.
Erin Nusker 20:14
For sure. Yeah.
Katie Olmsted 20:16
As we're continuing to think about what book comes next, we are living at a time when SEL has become kind of a a boogeyman buzzword. How do you navigate that?
Erin Nusker 20:31
I became a lot more concerned about it after I had already written my first book. Sometimes I feel like a tornado, and I did dabble a little bit on ways I could navigate that, and I got a little bit worried at one point with all the book banning and stuff in some of the other states. You know, what would my book? I mean, I'm not a massive, huge author by any means, but you know, if it was found in classrooms that they were having to report. You know, would my book get banned? And so I was very concerned for a little while. Now I feel like I I get a little bit more worried about how educators perceive SEL, and that you know sometimes there is a little bit of pushback, and I find it mostly on social media whenever I'm creating resources and putting that out there. And I I often get you know pushback saying you know well it's the parents' job, and you know although I do agree with these statements, you know I can't control what what parents do at home, but I can control what I do in the classroom, and so I have researched ways to navigate some of those areas. But I just try to focus on creating good content, and hopefully, you know, I don't get a lot of pushback on my books. I feel like it has waned a little bit in the political world as far as SEL. You know, I'm sure that'll become a hot topic again at some point. But I do just try to promote that we are encouraging and focused on students and children, and trying to like navigate that pushback whenever the SEL debate does come up.
Katie Olmsted 22:26
And I feel like if anybody actually read the book, can you imagine how ridiculous you would have to be feeling standing up at a school board meeting with like the most non-controversial book about your feelings are okay and being like, ah, I don't like the weather. I think maybe a nice. Sometimes I feel like a tornado book might be okay for them. Managing that anger. Why is it so important to even in in the face of those fears keep moving forward? Why can't we afford for our students not have some of this SEL Foundation?
Erin Nusker 23:02
Um. Honestly, we're. I feel like we're kind of on. Um. I don't want to say borrowed time, but um. It it is very imperative right now in the classroom, and especially at the youngest ages, um, that we try to address as many of the it the problems that we're coming across with children not being able to identify and manage their emotions now, because we want to we want them to get the best education that they can, and to be able to do that, we have to be better at regulating our emotions, and so we can can kind of try to control that as best as we can within our environment, and so implementing this in the classroom will help them later on in life exponentially. And so, the more that we implement now, even if we don't see massive results in the earliest craze, we do see those results as they get older. So, I really do think that we're like at this crossroads right now, and that it's really important to implement as much as we can at the youngest ages.
Katie Olmsted 24:07
And again, as a parent of of young kids and somebody who's entering kindergarten this fall, I I appreciate having these resources to help just support that work and and help young learners be the best learners they can be, and then the best adults they can be.
Erin Nusker 24:25
Exactly. Yes.
Katie Olmsted 24:27
Well, thank you so so much for sitting down to to share all of this with us, and thank you for your work around this.
Erin Nusker 24:33
Thank you so much for having me.
Katie Olmsted 24:39
As we mentioned in our discussion, in addition to the three "Cloudy with a Chance of Feelings" books that are available now, Erin Nusker has put together a ton of resources for educators and parents. The link to her website is in the show notes for this episode. And while you're there, make sure you subscribe to Public Education Matters wherever you get your podcasts, so you don't miss. Episode in the future. New episodes drop every Thursday this school year as season seven continues. Because in Ohio, public education matters.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai