In this episode, we explore wage theft. What is it, why is it, and what can be done about it? We speak with a panel of brilliant, passionate, and overall badass guests which include Ruth Silver Taube (Supervisor of Workers Rights Practice, Coordinator of The SCC Wage Theft Coalition, and many more), jean Cohen (Executive Officer of the South Bay Labor Council, Vice Chair of the SCC Democratic Party, and more), and David Bini (Leader of Building Trades Council). We start the episode discussing the demographic makeup of unions in the local area and the many challenges of working and living in the Bay Area- whether in a union or not- due to the unruly cost of… Everything. We then jump into today’s topic of Wage Theft and discuss the problems of wage theft, which Ruth describes as an “epidemic” and a “public health problem”. We discuss the overall lack of enforcement surrounding wage theft in which workers are cheated of their owed compensation. Finally, we end the episode with some hope regarding the current and future role of unions during this historic movement and moment. Have you heard of Slavery Towers here in Downtown S.J.? Stay tuned for the episode insert and conclusion where we provide additional context about some of the egregious projects occurring in our very own backyard!
Please Please Please like, share, and follow us on Instagram @Sanjo_lodown and consider donating to the show through the San Jo Lo Down Website https://www.sanjolodown.com. Thank you for being here with us today and we look forward to hearing from you soon!
In this episode, we explore wage theft. What is it, why is it, and what can be done about it? We speak with a panel of brilliant, passionate, and overall badass guests which include Ruth Silver Taube (Supervisor of Workers Rights Practice, Coordinator of The SCC Wage Theft Coalition, and many more), jean Cohen (Executive Officer of the South Bay Labor Council, Vice Chair of the SCC Democratic Party, and more), and David Bini (Leader of Building Trades Council). We start the episode discussing the demographic makeup of unions in the local area and the many challenges of working and living in the Bay Area- whether in a union or not- due to the unruly cost of… Everything. We then jump into today’s topic of Wage Theft and discuss the problems of wage theft, which Ruth describes as an “epidemic” and a “public health problem”. We discuss the overall lack of enforcement surrounding wage theft in which workers are cheated of their owed compensation. Finally, we end the episode with some hope regarding the current and future role of unions during this historic movement and moment. Have you heard of Slavery Towers here in Downtown S.J.? Stay tuned for the episode insert and conclusion where we provide additional context about some of the egregious projects occurring in our very own backyard!
Please Please Please like, share, and follow us on Instagram @Sanjo_lodown and consider donating to the show through the San Jo Lo Down Website https://www.sanjolodown.com. Thank you for being here with us today and we look forward to hearing from you soon!
The San Jo Lo Down is San Jose’s first podcast on working class culture, politics, and life–at work, at home, and at play. SJLD is a show about and for the incredible, diverse, talented, inspiring working people of our communities. Though we’ll have content on local music, politics, art, night life, events, and more, the podcast will feature the lives and perspectives of people like you, without whom San Jose would grind to a halt.
Armaline:
How would you frame the size and sort of qualitative aspects of the problem with folks?
Ruth:
Well, if you think about robbery and other theft crimes, they pale in comparison to wage theft. They're about a quarter of wage theft. There's an epidemic of wage theft in the country.
Armaline:
Sorry. High is good at Spanish.
Armaline:
Pretty much any of us who've had a job, like, ever have experienced getting screwed over at work or by our employers somehow. For many of us, that's meant not getting paid one way or another. If you've never had this experience, consider yourself among the fortunate as data suggests many California workers are not always paid with their own.
Armaline:
According to survey data by Harvard University and UCSF, forty one percent of hourly workers in California have experienced serious labor law violation in the last year. This includes, but it's not limited to something called wage theft. Wage theft is a broad term referring to any case where a worker is not paid with her legally entitled. So what does it look like? You may have your wage or hours cut, not receive overtime or holiday pay, work through lunch or even other breaks without pay, or be required to work, quote, off the clock.
Armaline:
Now if you're living paycheck to paycheck, trying to get by or provide for a family, this can mean death by a thousand cuts. However, as our guest for today's episode will share, wage theft is not always piecemeal. It can also be part of a larger scheme of human labor trafficking and even human slavery where workers are targeted for next level exploitation, working without pay at threat of deportation, and other forms of coercion. In all of its forms, wage theft is way too common in our communities. According to a recent series of reports on wage theft by CalMatters, in 2022, almost 19,000 workers filed wage theft claims with the state, totaling over $338,000,000 in, quote, lost or stolen wages.
Armaline:
This is likely a vast undercount as experts suggest only a fraction of workers successfully file claims with the state. I mean, typically, this happens to workers all the time, and either they don't have the wherewithal or know how to file for these claims or or they frankly just don't feel supported enough or don't feel confident enough, that those claims are are gonna be, answered, that they're going to be, responded to, and that they they can reasonably get their money back. And in fact, this is backed up by research by Rutgers University in May of this year that suggests that workers may have lost between 2.3 and $4,600,000,000 to wage violations in California's major metro areas annually between 2014 and 2023. Though today's show will focus on the building and other related trades so critical in creating desperately needed housing and public infrastructure, interestingly, the Rutgers study points to private households and personal services like laundry and this kinds of this kind of stuff as having the highest rates of wage violations among all of the occupations in San Jose. As we'll find, wage theft operates at large corporate industrial scales in ways that produce significant wealth for employers and owners, such as the building of a huge luxury apartment complex downtown, for example.
Armaline:
But it's also alive and well in the households and daily lives of the local owning and asset classes. And by the asset class, I mean, those of us that are, lucky and wealthy enough to own homes, where people are apparently ripping off domestic workers who take care of all their precious shit. It comes as little surprise that across industries, claim rates for wage theft are highest among immigrant workers, workers of color, and workers with lower levels of formal education. According to the Rutgers study, workers without a college degree were three to five times more likely to be ripped off by their their employers in California cities. Wage theft is absolutely a crime in California and can be charged as a felony depending on the amount stolen by from employees, resulting in fines and potential incarceration.
Armaline:
However, employers are rarely criminally prosecuted. And even when caught, it can take years for workers to be paid back if ever. In fact, only about an eighth of wage theft claims are ever paid to the claimant in California. In many cases, by the time the state or federal government recovers the money from employers, workers can't be reached in order to be paid. Think about migrant work, for example, workers that move around throughout the year in order to to do their work, and some of those folks are in agriculture, some are in other industries.
Armaline:
But as you can imagine, for workers that that have to change, their geography, change where they live, change where they stay, it's very difficult for these workers to be tracked down and and repaid years after they've made these claims. And And the craziest part is that California is among the most successful states in recovering stolen wages, suggesting the considerable amount of work this should be done to reign in the practice nationwide. So, again, it's pretty bad in California, but in California, you have a much better chance to get your money back than you do anywhere else. That speaks to how bad it is all over the country. So we're all pretty geeked to introduce you to today's guests.
Armaline:
We'll speak to the problem of wage theft in San Jose and Silicon Valley and what workers are doing to fight back on the ground and at the policy level. If you if if you think you or someone you love is experiencing wage theft, check out the information and link on the episode description for available resources. And with that, we'll get right to the show. Well, I'd like to first of all say welcome to Sanjo Lowdown to our guest for today. And why don't we start off as we always do, if you wouldn't mind just introducing yourself to our audience.
Armaline:
Tell us who you are, what you do, and how long you've been in San Jose or Silicon Valley, please.
Ruth:
Okay. My name is Ruth Silvertobe, and I, supervise the workers' rights practice at the Alexander Community Law Center. And I also am a coordinator of the Santa Clara County Wage Theft Coalition legal service provider, cochair of the South Bay Coalition to End Human Trafficking, and a founding member of the, of the Bay Area Equal Pay Collaborative. And I also supervise the, legal advice line through the Office of Labor Standards Enforcement.
Armaline:
Ruth, your card has to be the size of, like, a it's a notebook paper.
Ruth:
Yeah. No. I have separate cards
Armaline:
for each of
Ruth:
those. Otherwise, I'd I'd have to have a I wouldn't be able to store that card.
Armaline:
Well, it's a pleasure to have you, ma'am. Audience, if if you don't know I mean, Ruth is a legend. I'm I'm just gonna say that. I don't care if she's embarrassed about it. She's a legend in this area in terms of fighting for the rights of workers, fighting for the rights of all kinds of folks, inside and outside of the courts.
Armaline:
And, if you know anything about lawyers, you know that people like Ruth are few and far between, who are willing to do that work and also capable of it. So we're really honored to have you here today, and so it's it's a real it's a real pleasure to have
Ruth:
you on the show. Thank you. Yes. We like to call ourselves movement lawyers. It's just to distinguish us for the ones that everybody hates.
Ruth:
Yeah.
Armaline:
Yeah. No hate for you here, fam. No hate for you here. Who
Ruth:
wants to go next?
Jean:
Sure. Thanks. Hi. Jean Cohen. I'm the executive officer of the South Bay Labor Council.
Jean:
I also serve as the vice chair of the Santa Clara County Democratic Party and, involved in San Jose jazz as well. Just kind of the intersection of arts and labor is where my passion lies. I was born in San Jose, and I've lived here for a super majority of my life. And, it's an honor to lead the labor movement with my colleagues here.
Ruth:
So thank you
Armaline:
for having me. Where'd you grow up in San Jose?
Jean:
Downtown San Jose. So just down the street from here.
Armaline:
Oh, bet. Okay.
Armaline:
Okay. Okay. Well, it's also a pleasure to have you. Would you mind saying just a little bit about what what what, you know, what is South Bay labor? Sure.
Jean:
So, the labor movement is a collection of working people who come together to use their power to improve the conditions for all people. And the way that looks in the South Bay is that the South Bay Labor Council represents Santa Clara County and San Benito Counties. I represent a hundred and five unions, and they represent about a 20,000 workers here in the South Bay. And we collectively come together to work on politics, policy, and organizing to help workers irrespective of union affiliation.
Armaline:
That's beautiful. Thank you so much. And that was so so well put as well. Very, very concise. Also amazing work and and really necessary work.
Armaline:
And, hopefully, we'll we'll get to talk much more about South Bay Labor and and with some of your members in the future. Yeah. Last but not least.
David:
Thank you. I'm David Beany. And, like Jean and Ruth, I wear a number of hats. But, my current main role is as the leader of the Building Trades Council, which is a place where 23 different craft unions come together. Many of those unions, Jean shares.
David:
So we we are focused on their needs and what it takes to move them forward.
Armaline:
If you don't mind me asking, again, we like to do as much sort of, like, education as we can for our audience in the labor movement. What's a craft union?
David:
That's what we refer to, the construction unions as craft unions.
Armaline:
Okay. But, so like trades, if you will.
David:
Trades. Yeah. That's right. Building Building Trades Council.
Armaline:
Beautiful. Beautiful. Great. And, again, welcome. It's really, really nice to have y'all here.
Armaline:
So one of the things I I I kinda wanted to start off with today, was to to begin sort of painting a picture of who are, you know, your your members who are in these trades. Right? And I know that's a really big broad question. But, again, if we could just kinda start to paint the picture for our audience, how would you describe your membership sort of broadly speaking? What kinds of folks tend to work in the trades and be be some of the members of this this union collective?
David:
You know, I don't think you can, just put them into one category. We've got folks that, have always worked with their hands and always known they wanted to work with their hands and others that are college graduates that that think, oh, I wanna try something different.
Armaline:
Sure.
David:
Everything in between.
Armaline:
Sure. Race and ethnicity, pretty diverse?
David:
Certainly, yeah. Race. We are a majority minority unions in the construction trades here in this area. Very diverse.
Armaline:
Yeah. And I I asked that, of course, because I think, at least in some parts of the country, there's still this kind of outmoded idea about, like, when you think about union members in the construction trades or in in in the trades in general, there's still this notion of the, like, the hard hat white brute kinda situation. You know? And so I I one of the things we're doing is trying to be really, good about painting an accurate picture of our today's labor movement. Right?
Armaline:
And so yeah. And and beyond that, I guess, one of our questions that we're we're trying to explore with all of the folks that we bring on representing, you know, working class, employment across the board are how people are faring. Right? So we are unique in the country for our massively, disparate wealth. Right?
Armaline:
The difference between the rich and the poor where we live, and we're also unique in terms of the levels of homelessness, housing crisis, and cost of living. And so one of the recurring themes in the show is, and I I imagine we'll continue to be asking this question, like, how are your members faring in that environment? Are they are they doing well? Are they struggling? How would you describe, how they're doing in this economic environment here?
David:
Well, I'll leave it to Jeanne to talk about the broader labor movement and the workers. But for construction, the construction unions have done extremely well for workers. And when you juxtapose them against the unrepresented workers, it's it's, it's a multiple of two for how they're compensated. So, nonunion workers make about half of the compensation of a union worker, and still, it's incredibly difficult to be able to afford to live here in the Bay Area and, and just make it as a family.
Jean:
Yeah. I think well, one to your first question. Well, I think the labor movement is an ecosystem that mirrors America. Right? And so we have every ideology, every race, kind of every perspective that come together under the umbrella of of unionism.
Jean:
And so that actually creates an environment where people's answer to your question really depends on their current lived experience. So even if you're in a union and you have a good contract, the cost of living in the Bay Area is so expensive that, people are struggling. So whether it's being able to buy a house or afford an apartment, because some of the workers who we represent are making, you know, a hundred and $50,000 a year. Some of them are making $20 an hour. All of those people share some of the same struggles in the Bay Area just because capitalism is, you know, what runs this country, and that's what we're trying to be the counter to.
Armaline:
I think that's that's very well put and well received. You know, you said something that really stuck in my head since you said it, David. You said, you know, there's two to one ratio. Could you kinda flush that out for me? Like, what would be some common differences between the union and nonunion worker in some of your fields?
David:
I think the starkest difference is that unions are able to negotiate health care and retirement packages that, I would say 90 to 95% of nonunion workers just cannot access. That's that's
Armaline:
really Which is huge. Right? I mean, if we if we're aware, right, the the kind of money that's required for a real dependable retirement is is in the 7 figures. Right? That one has to be able to invest and put away if it's to make up for what otherwise have been a pension or something else from an employer or from a union package.
Armaline:
So, I mean, that's partly what what how why we will be able to live Manel and I later. It's certainly not out of making so much dough at the CSU. Right? We at least it was in the last yeah. Because of our union, we're
Armaline:
one of the last
Armaline:
folks that have a pension. Right? So this is for our audience members that haven't looked into it, right, the, the value of those retirement, benefits is is enormous, right, in terms of what you could otherwise save. Okay. Well, this is good.
Armaline:
I I really appreciate, you being patient with my my my opening questions, but I guess we should get right to the topic of our show for today, which is the issue of wage theft. So I'm gonna ask the super obvious ignorance, you know, silly question first, which is, would someone like to define wage theft?
Ruth:
I can do it. So wage theft is not paying a worker, not paying overtime, not providing rest breaks or or meal periods, misclassifying a worker as exempt from overtime when they really should be being paid overtime, misclassifying workers as independent contractors, not, paying them below minimum wage. So that generally, that's what wage theft is.
Armaline:
Sure. Sure. How big of a problem is it? Like, what like, how would you frame the size and sort of qualitative aspects of the problem with folks?
Ruth:
Well, if you think about robbery and other theft crimes Mhmm. They pale in comparison to wage theft. They're about a quarter of wage theft. There's an epidemic of wage theft in the country.
Armaline:
Sure. Well, I guess what I what I also wanna say is, how would we paint the picture again for audience members that may not be familiar with wage theft or how it's affecting our workers specifically? Right? So what are some of the problems that our own workers or how have our own workers locally been experiencing wage theft in such a way that garnered a response? Right?
Ruth:
Well, I think wage theft is a public health problem. Because if you don't get paid, you can't afford to eat, you can't afford housing, you can't afford to take care of your family. And we spent quite a long time trying to convince governments that it was that kind of problem. So now in San Jose, we have a restaurant permit revocation program. If you don't pay judgments, the environmental health is is is closing you down, basically.
Ruth:
Because the problem is that not only is there wage theft, but the enforcement agencies, like the labor commission, are understaffed, and they don't really do very much collection. I mean, they do a little of it. So only about 12% of judgments are ever paid. So that's a huge problem. So here's workers cheated out of their pay.
Ruth:
They don't get it. And if they do, it takes three or four years. So it's a huge problem. So we've tried to get governments to to have a role, to say you can't contract with us or you don't get permits. And so, you know, it it we wanna be able to help workers because it affects them so dramatically
Armaline:
Sure.
Ruth:
When you don't get paid.
Armaline:
Sure. I'm wondering, Jean or David, if if you can tell us any specific stories of workers that have been, like, deeply affected by these kinds of practices.
Jean:
Do you have an example?
David:
Well, I can offer my own example. Prior to being able to join a union, I've had been the victim of wage theft more than once. Just one instance, the contractor was working us ten hours a day.
Armaline:
It's okay. Ruth's got one of her hats on, everybody. It's alright.
Jean:
Someone calling for help.
Elora:
Yeah. I'm sure
Jean:
it is.
Armaline:
She's on call.
Jean:
So I'm
Ruth:
a superhero. I so stupid.
Jean:
I know.
Ruth:
Yeah. Someone with someone ready to give an example. They heard you say they wanted an example. Yeah. Okay.
Ruth:
Sorry.
Armaline:
No. It's okay.
Ruth:
Go ahead.
Armaline:
Go ahead, David.
David:
I I was working for a contractor, and we were working ten hour days. And, the superintendent came out and told all of the workers for that contractor that they would not be paying overtime. They would be paying straight time rate for, for all work. And that's just a a very egregious example. There are others.
Armaline:
So, I mean, how does that go down? I mean, like, not not to not to get in the weeds here, but I'm genuinely interested. Right? So, you know, you you realize this is happening. Do you confront the boss?
Armaline:
Is it like, what how does this work out?
David:
Most workers do not, and and that's because, if word gets out that you will stand up for yourself, then you no longer will have the opportunities to work that the other people do. So
Armaline:
So how does that kind of situation work out differently if I'm part of a union?
David:
Well, I'm trying to imagine that happening in a union. I just I mean, if
Ruth:
it can't. It if it does, you file a grievance. It gets taken care of instantly. It's typically a mistake if it happens in a union. It's just an error.
Ruth:
We have someone who crunches numbers for us in in the construction industry, but in other industries as well. And, basically, it there is no wage theft. I mean, statistically insignificant where there's a union. And the thing is that people speak up because you can only be fired for just cause. If you're not in a union, you can be fired at will for any reason or no reason except discrimination based on a protected class like your race or your religion or gender or because you spoke up about something that violated state or federal law.
Ruth:
And often you do it verbally, so it's just your word against theirs, and you're not gonna win. So it's a huge difference.
Jean:
And you have a union rep.
Ruth:
Yeah. You have you have a union rep. You have a contract. You can file a grievance, and it has to be a good reason if there's any discipline. Retaliation is not a good reason.
Armaline:
So it sounds to me that this this is a a wide reaching problem from the data also that that we review in in the intro to this episode. It's a pretty wide ranging problem in terms of, like, working class, areas of work, employment, and it's a national problem. Right? And it affects not just, you know, American workers, but also immigrant guest workers and farm it's rampant in farm labor, as well. So that that is evident.
Armaline:
And the other thing that you seem to be saying is that one of the best protections against this practice happens to be unionization. Is that my interpreting that?
Ruth:
Yeah. My feeling was that there would be we wouldn't need a wage theft coalition. We wouldn't need anybody to try to fight for laws that protect workers if we if if there was wide unionization.
Armaline:
So maybe we should go there for a moment. Would you mind talking a little bit about the wage theft coalition and how that got started?
Ruth:
Yeah. So I was at my workers the workers' rights clinic I supervise, and five workers came in that night. And they Where did
Armaline:
they work? What kind of
Ruth:
workers There were there were, a lot of fast. They were fast food workers. There were laborers, day laborers, care home workers
Armaline:
Okay.
Ruth:
From a vast array of an array of industry.
David:
Sure.
Ruth:
And they had judgments, court judgments. They went through the labor commission, and the judgment was recorded, and they weren't paid. And I just went home and actually cried and went on the computer and tried to see if there were other parts of the country where there there were laws that help these workers. And believe it or not, Miami Dade, Houston, there were certain cities, and we used that argument when we advocated. So then I went around to every nonprofit and the unions and working partnership, and I said, we want a wage theft coalition because I've read about them in other places.
Ruth:
And so we formed that, and, of course, we work hand in glove with the unions, and, we because, you know, a, we wanna see unions, but we all that's something that unions do. Because not only do they advocate for union workers, but they advocate for all workers. And they, you know yes. And so, it we decided sort of, that we would keep meeting. And we've actually been meeting for ten years.
Ruth:
We just had our I know. I I didn't think we would, but every month, we have a meeting, and we have, diff people from different industries and and unions and working partnerships, and they come to our meetings. And, we we have had, quite a bit of success in getting wage theft ordinances enacted, and that's what we do, basically.
Armaline:
And that's a perfect segue for us. Jean, would you mind jumping in a little bit to talk a little bit about the responsible construction ordinance and
Ruth:
how you
Armaline:
all came came around to putting that forward?
Jean:
Sure. There's there's been a real effort, as Ruth articulated to to do some organizing and some accountability, in terms of wage theft that's occurring in Santa Clara County. And it became really clear that it wasn't enough to, to invest in labor organizing. We also had to invest in public policy and electoral work to make sure that we have protections for workers. And in the city of San Jose, we recognized that there was an opportunity that we could say, if you wanna do business here, you have to demonstrate that you don't have any outstanding wage theft violations or OSHA violations.
Jean:
So, basically, if you didn't steal a worker's money and you didn't make them unsafe, you've met what I think is a pretty low bar standard
David:
Yeah.
Jean:
Of entry into the city of San Jose. Yeah. And what we saw simultaneously was the Slavery Towers development happening across from San Pedro Square.
Elora:
Dude, Joaquin, had you ever heard of Slavery Towers before?
Joaquin:
No. Not before this episode. It's insane. It's an insane story that I think more people should know about.
Elora:
Can I tell you more about it? Yes, please.
Joaquin:
Okay. Great. Because I've done a lot of research into this, and it's an insane story. So Slavery Towers, this was once known by its development name Silvery Towers, was a building project here in Downtown San Jose on a Hundred And Eightieth West Saint James Street. They look like you're pretty standard luxury high rise condos, you know, very tall, lots of glass windows, giving very much office building.
Joaquin:
It's kinda boring to look at. But what makes these condos worth talking about is the fact that they were built using what many local activists are calling slave labor, hence the name Slavery Towers.
Elora:
Yeah. That's horrible. I it's kind of a trip. I've passed by that area so many times, since being back to San Jose, and I didn't even notice them. They kinda just look like every other shitty high rise that's been put up, and I don't know.
Elora:
It once I heard the story, it's like, oh, damn. There's so much to this. How did I not know about this?
Joaquin:
Yeah. For something so boring looking, you wouldn't even begin to imagine the details of this insidious case. Mhmm. So to go and provide more context, an unlicensed subcontractor named Job Hernandez was working for the property development company formerly known as Full Power Properties. Job's construction employees and for the our listeners, I wanna stress that I'm using air quotes because in this case, the FBI found that at least 22 immigrants, immigrant workers from Mexico had been conned into labor trafficking using advertisements in Tijuana newspapers put out by job that spoke of fair wage work and even access to legal citizenship in The United States.
Joaquin:
Now, unfortunately, we now know that that wasn't the case. And once the workers had across the border and arrived in the South Bay, jobs forced them to work extremely long hours during the day. And at night, he locked them in shipping containers with only access to one restroom and zero access to running water. Additionally, if any of these workers attempted to retaliate, they were often threatened with violence, that would come to them by the hands of the cartels.
Elora:
Yeah. That's gnarly. Imagine coming to San San Jose, Silicon Valley, you know, just just play swimming in tech and corporate money and not being paid for your labor and not having basic human, you know, needs. That's I that's again, that's just beyond comprehension. Are there any updates about the towers?
Joaquin:
Yeah. It's sick to think about. And, actually, I do have an update. So Slavery Towers is actually back in the news recently because, they're being connected to the city council member or a potential city council member named George Casey. He's currently running for District 10 seat on city council.
Joaquin:
Now you may be wondering why the reason his name is being connected to Slavery Towers is because as reported as by the San Jose Spotlight, he worked as an adviser for the company that belonged to Chinese developer, Zhang Li, whose US affiliated company, Full Power Properties, spearheaded the Slavery Towers development project. You know, in the article, it said his role as a senior development manager was to help Li sell his properties to other developers, and his intention was to get the property to better developers for the benefit of San Jose citizens. And as it stands, this statement from Casey is being accepted so much that in the same article by Spotlight, it is reported that Casey is still endorsed by mayor Matt Mahan.
Elora:
Wow. That says a lot. Thank you so much for all of this very important information. Again, something that I wasn't aware of or knowledgeable about, and I feel like I'm pretty on top of this stuff for the most part. And it was it's pretty big presence in the media as well.
Elora:
Yeah. So we really encourage everyone to do your research, to look into some of these politicians and contractors who are essentially taking over San Jose and, going against everything that we stand for, which is justice and community. So thank you so much for taking the time to listen. And now back to the episode.
Jean:
It became very clear that the vulnerabilities that were affecting the workers have also really negatively affected the development community and the economy. But despite all of those conditions, it took us five years until this year to fight back all the opposition to enforcing what I just told you, which is don't steal people's money and make them unsafe.
Armaline:
Sure. And for the audience members who might not be familiar, what are the Slavery Towers, and how did they earn that name?
Jean:
Sure. So if you've been in Downtown San Jose and you know where San Pedro Square Market is or, over near Saint John And Julian, there was a a a high rise development there of two towers that was nonunion, constructed nonunion. And it became clear through an investigation that Ruth was part of with the federal government that not only was their wage theft happening, but there was human trafficking happening. That became basically the model for us to show why we need more protections and also the model that really indicates who San Jose values. Is it developers or at work is it workers?
Jean:
And and we fight that every day.
Armaline:
And I think this is incredibly important. And I wanna stop here just to emphasize this for a second. So, you know, I think when a lot of people, even folks that are familiar with the the concept of wage theft, think about wage theft. It's things like, well, I got shaved off a little bit. You know?
Armaline:
I didn't get paid exactly what I was supposed to, or I got paid a little late. Or, you know, maybe I work through like, we were talking about this earlier. Joaquin mentioned a lot of service jobs. Like, they won't count breaks that you didn't take and, like, all these sorts of things. And, you know, and even some overtime stuff and seeing that.
Armaline:
But if if again, if you're listening to what our guests are saying, like, you know, we started with Ruth telling the story of these workers coming to her kind of unsolicited, you know, really, really in a in a bad way. And these are also people that I would imagine have children, have families to care for, and all of this. And they're put in really desperate situations by having spent all the time, energy, and sweat having done work, but then don't have anything to feed their families on, after that, but also having no real legal recourse or or political recourse to get that money back. Even if they do win in court, they're not gonna get that money back for a long time. And for a working class person, I don't know about y'all audience, but, like, how long can you go without your paycheck?
Armaline:
Right? I mean, how long can you wait that out? And then we hear Jean telling the story about the slavery towers. Like, we're talking about human trafficking. We're talking about people not getting paid at all.
Armaline:
You know, in in in my world and in sort of my work, I call this a form of expropriation. Right? So we as workers, when we're wage workers, we are in the Marxist sense, we're exploited. Right? So we're working for a wage, but the value we create for our employer is much less than what we get paid in that wage.
Armaline:
Right? And that's how capitalism works. Right? And that's how, money flows upward and not back down. But in terms of expropriation, used in colonization and slavery and really hyper exploitive labor practices, that means they're just taking your shit.
Armaline:
That means they take your time, your life, and everything that you give them, and they give you nothing in return. Again, what are you gonna do about it? Right? That's there's no, actual recourse for that. So, again, I I'm struck by this, right, that when we're talking about this as an issue, it's it's first of all, much bigger than I think I I would have imagined, a lot of folks would have imagined.
Armaline:
But also the qualitative aspects of it can be pretty hardcore. Again, we're not talking about just folks that had a little shaved off the top. Like, these are folks that worked for, you know, full time, doing very difficult and dangerous work in many cases. They're building these towers, etcetera, and who are simply not being paid. And I'm gonna take a wild guess and say that a lot of the investor class folks involved in these developments are doing just fine.
Jean:
They're doing beautifully. They're
Ruth:
doing beautifully.
Armaline:
Yeah. Yeah. And, And
Ruth:
there's Yeah.
Armaline:
Go ahead.
Ruth:
There's really they do it with impunity. Yeah.
Armaline:
Can you speak talk could any of you talk about that a little bit? Anyone who wants to jump in on it?
Ruth:
Or do you want to
Armaline:
What does that impunity look like?
Ruth:
It means that they're not held accountable.
Armaline:
So so can you give an example of, something really egregious that was just
Ruth:
Yeah. Well, I mean, there's Slavery Towers itself where there was there was a court case, but the workers only got a fraction of what they were owed. And they they didn't get anything for emotional distress, at what they went through. I mean, when we went out on Slavery Towers, the South Bay Coalition, there was a mobile medical unit there because they were hurt so badly. They were locked in.
Ruth:
They they didn't have their passports or their papers. Their families were threatened back in their in their country, and, it was terrible. But that that we see human trafficking, labor trafficking all the time, and there's always wage theft. They're greedy employers. And they typically you know, there's not many of these cases that are prosecuted.
Ruth:
There are there's a lot of sex trafficking prosecuted, but not labor trafficking. And you're so right about the exploitation that you have sort of a a gradation. You know, you start with the small wage stuff, which is still big to these workers who live paycheck to paycheck, but then you get the really greedy ones that know they can get away with it.
Jean:
May I give another example that San Jose is managing or we're facing right now? So in Santa Clara County, there are, over 25,000 fast food workers. Most of those fast food workers are women, predominantly immigrant women who have multiple jobs. 13,000 of those workers live in the city or excuse me, work in the city of San Jose. For the last year and a half, the labor council working partnerships has been trying to secure, one day workers' right training for those, 13,000 fast food workers.
Jean:
We have faced every political obstacle at city hall that you could ever imagine, including not having the votes to get that policy passed. And it's not because people want to just get rich and get richer, which is, I think, one motivating factor, but it's really about power. Because why these workers want in is because they wanna be in the union. And so it's about fear and power just as much as it's about capitalism.
Ruth:
And we had one Rainbow Bright, which was a series of care homes. And, sadly, it kept falling through the cracks. The Department of Labor looked at it. It they owned, like, nine different care homes and day care centers.
Armaline:
And In San Jose?
Ruth:
This is this was actually in San Mateo, but they called us. I mean, it could have been in San Jose. And we have had oh, we have labor trafficking in the care home. We even had one where when they filed suit, the trafficker tried to kidnap the person. And she screamed, and they pulled her you know, someone ran out of their house and pulled her away.
Armaline:
That's fucking wild.
Ruth:
It really is wild. But but for this one, Rainbow Brite, there were, like, nine different care different care homes. And the Department of Labor handed it over to the San Jose DA who just sat on it and sat on it. Turned out that that the state attorney general happened to be looking through files, like, nine years later and saw this and went ahead with it. So the workers had to endure these horrible conditions, on and on and on.
Ruth:
And then there was a trial, and now it's on appeal. And, you know, it there's no accountability, really, and they're so rare when you when you get those and even wage theft. I mean, if you robbed a bank, you would end up going to jail or prison. But if you rob workers, it's it's the system. You know?
Ruth:
It's okay. It's a business model is what it is.
Armaline:
Well, that's what's so interesting. Right? When you when you start to try and put this through a criminal justice filter, right, once you go over, it's nearly a thousand dollars worth of wage theft, right, in a year. It becomes a felony.
Ruth:
But they don't prosecute it.
Armaline:
They don't prosecute it as such, and nobody goes to jail. Although No. There have been a few. So the only cases I was doing some research for our intro for the episode, and and oddly, one of the only cases I found where someone in wait went to jail for wage theft. It was it was a cannabis
Ruth:
farmer. Right.
Armaline:
Of course. Yeah. Not a corporate, not a corporation, not a major financial institution. It's a fucking hemp farmer. Or It wasn't even wasn't even a cannabis farm as a hemp farmer.
Ruth:
Or workers' comp fraud. They'll throw in a wage theft or human trafficking. I mean, yeah, I'm not a huge fan of the carceral system, but it just shows where priorities are. They're property, not people.
Armaline:
I just but it's to your point. Right? If any of us walked out of here and got caught stealing over a thousand dollars, right, got caught up in a grand theft, right, over so much money in in in because it was a car or so much money in in a retail place, you know, I'm going to jail. I'm a call on somebody like Ruth to help me out. You know what I'm saying?
Armaline:
Like, that's that's not gonna be like
Ruth:
a criminal lawyer. But Yeah. Yeah.
Armaline:
Well, you had such a long list now. You you just did that on the side.
Ruth:
You know what I mean? Employment lawyer. Yeah.
Armaline:
No. So so so yeah. I mean, I guess what I'm trying to say is that the difference is obvious. Right? Is it when it's an an employer class, doing something like this, and it's and even at a broad level where you're affecting hundreds, if not thousands of people, no one sees a jail cell.
Armaline:
But if you walk over and do that at Target, it's your ads. Right? And and so that I I think that is really, really important for us to point out that, like, our our even our moral sort of construction is very different for the corporate and employer class than it is for, you know, us slowly workers. Right? Even we get the legal side is complicated as it is, of course, but even ethically, morally, people don't equate the two.
Armaline:
Right? So I think it's an important point for us us to work out. I wanna come back to this really quickly because I I just wanna make sure that we get this this accurately for our audience in terms of what the responsible construction ordinance actually does. So what does this ordinance do to help protect, some of our local workers from some of this stuff?
Jean:
Well, that's the one that we were able to finally get in place that basically creates the standard for not being able to do business in San Jose if you have the but what it means now is implementation. You can pass all the rules you want, but to Ruth and David's point. Right? Like, all of these decisions have been made to help workers, but unless people are organizing or, you know, keeping our finger on the pulse, it's not going to be implemented.
Ruth:
It's it requires disclosure if you have judgments. In San Jose, they have to look at a database. In Sunnyvale, Nopidas, and Mountain View where we also have it, they have to disclose.
Armaline:
And These are all the places that have passed the settlement ordinance.
Ruth:
Yes. And also other wage theft ordinances too about who they contract with and all of that. Sure. But with this one, they cannot get a certificate of occupancy. In other words, you can't really revoke in the middle of construction, but at the end, they can't occupy the building.
Ruth:
They can't take possession of the building unless they pay the workers or close the bond. Yeah.
Armaline:
Alright. Well, that definitely sounds more effective.
Ruth:
It does.
Armaline:
Effective approach.
Ruth:
It does. And as a matter of fact, there was a restaurant under the restaurant permit revocation closed down. In a week, it reopened. They paid immediately. Usually, they pay right away.
Ruth:
That's the only way to get them, to hurt them in the pocketbook.
Armaline:
So how how what do we need to do then, we as a community, in terms of this implement implementation side?
Jean:
One, I think that you need to let your elected officials know or people who are in positions of influence that wage theft affects everybody, and you expect that your local government's gonna have a standard about who they're gonna do business with and that you support working people by making sure that the responsible construction ordinance is implemented and expanded in every city, in every county.
David:
I think another thing you can do is to unionize every single workplace you can. You know, one of the things we talked about was, that there just is no enforcement, and why you have so little wage theft, in unionized workplaces is because the enforcement is done by the union. They take the resources, the small resources they have, and they will fight for the workers every single turn. They don't allow the work workers' wages to be stolen, and they don't allow the workers to be misclassified, and they and they make sure that the contract is followed, breaks are taken. That's what unions do, and that's what we'll continue to do.
Armaline:
What if I'm a a nonunion worker in any of these trades, but I'm interested in making that move? What where do where do I go? What resources should I pursue in San Jose or or Silicon Valley where I can get some help to unionize my shop?
David:
I think the first thing to do is find out what union covers the industry that you're working in. And once you do that, you can approach the union and find out if the best way to get in is to to join with an application or to organize the workplace where you are so that that union can now represent the workers at that place. Sure. We'd also talked about wage theft as a, as as being rampant outside the unionized industry. And and there really is I like to think of it as an iceberg of wage theft.
David:
The things we hear about, the slavery towers, we'll occasionally hear about, some contractor or some employer getting caught stealing from the workers in one way or another. But all these different ways that workers can have their wages or their hours or their benefits stolen, You you lump them together, and what you see is just the tip of that iceberg. Underneath that, there is a huge fear of, of coming forward because workers are afraid that once they make their employer angry by telling the truth or by asking for their wages or their benefits, they're not gonna be, employed very much longer. And so it's all comes back to that enforcement. Without a union, you rely on the local laws and regulations to enforce.
David:
And if that's not being done, you've got nobody at your back.
Ruth:
In the mean oh, the Cal Labor Fed also has a website.
Jean:
Unionized California.
Ruth:
Unionized California. But I would like to say that if a nonunion worker wants to try to navigate how best and protect themselves from, retaliation, if they could call the legal advice line, which is (866) 870-7725. We have attorneys who speak English, Spanish, Tagalog, Visayan, Mandarin, and Vietnamese.
Armaline:
That's one
Ruth:
And it's free.
Armaline:
We'll make sure to put the, the information in the episode info too so, any listeners or anyone can can find that info.
Ruth:
Definitely.
Armaline:
Can we do that, Nick?
David:
Yeah. Absolutely.
Armaline:
I was nodding at Nick as I said that because, of course, I don't know how to do those.
Ruth:
Thank you.
Armaline:
So, yeah, I wanna I wanna wrap this up with a sort of positive, optimistic, forward looking kind of question. Well, let's see. It kinda depends on how you're gonna interpret my question and whether it's positive and, you know, optimistic. But, I just wanted to get, just a quick round round robin of where you well, how do I wanna say this? What's next for the labor movement in our region?
Armaline:
So what's the next necessary step? What are the next necessary things that we need to be doing as an organized labor movement? Whether you wanna talk about this as part of the broader org sort of national labor movement that's really kinda kicking up right now, which I think is wonderful. And so we will we like to talk about on the show. But, we also like to keep it local here too so people are actually connected to it.
Armaline:
But I'm just curious what you all think of, like, where we are in this present moment of the movement, and what do you think is next for for that movement and for us specifically? I know it's a big question, but I wanna end on looking forward. You know?
David:
You know, for me, I I think it's about taking all of our elected leaders and and having them walk the walk and look at every piece of policy that they're doing through the lens of how this is gonna impact the people who are living and working in their jurisdiction in this city, in Sunnyvale, in Milpitas? How how is this policy gonna affect them? And how can I make this policy better for those workers so they have a a better chance to make a living, and feed their families and go to school and do all the things that we wanna do? Sure. Sure.
Ruth:
Do you wanna go?
Jean:
I I think that we're in a moment right now where the concepts of dignity and compassion and respect are are, are potentially realized at the national level. And I think that that in in combination of power is not only a reflection of the movement of of of workers and the labor movement, but of politics as a whole right now. So I'm feeling inspired to capture this energy to make sure that the dynamics of of power in the South Bay are ones that represent, working families and and the opportunity to join a union.
Armaline:
Yeah. We we agree with that. Yeah. We'd love to be a part of that as well.
Ruth:
Ruth, what do you think? I I I've seen an uptick in interest in unions and supportive unions because I'm on the English advice line and workers call, and, they seem to be very positive about unions, very supportive of unions.
Armaline:
Why do you think that is?
Ruth:
I think that the unions have done a really good job in educating people about the benefits of unions, and we have unions that have really made strides for workers. And we have people like the leader of the UAW and also local union Sean Feine and other other unions where they really see them fighting for them. And they really understand that the wages are better, they have more rights, and it's power. It builds worker power, and I think that's what what is happening. We're building worker power, and I'm I'm optimistic.
Ruth:
Unions are growing. They're supported, and, I think the future is bright for unions depending on who wins the election.
Armaline:
Isn't it interesting that one of the one of the candidates was actually most known for wage theft in New York
Ruth:
City? Exactly. Yes. Right?
Armaline:
If anyone who doesn't know their Trump history, right, check that out.
Ruth:
Yes.
Armaline:
Screwed over entire ethnic populations of workers.
Ruth:
Yes. And as a matter of fact
Armaline:
Famously in the throughout the nineteen eighties and seventies.
Ruth:
Under this particular administration, the NLRB has come out with very pro worker, given the constraints of the law. And, if you read project twenty twenty five, basically, it's, a road map to destroy the labor movement.
Armaline:
Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And I I think that this is one of the big questions left right now. You ended us on such a beautiful note, Ruth. I think that's a great place for us to wrap.
Armaline:
So I I I really wanna say, bottom of my heart, thank you so much.
Ruth:
Thank you.
Armaline:
Jean, Ruth, David, it's been really wonderful to have this conversation. It's really great to have you all on the show. We absolutely hope you all come back sometime. We hope you'll you'll you'll come back and share some more of your knowledge. I'm sure you'll be working on some other project here soon, Ruth.
Armaline:
But but we'd love to have you back on. And and, and and and, hey, if you have anything that's happening, anything that that your folks are working on, any campaigns happening, just remember us, and, we'll we'll make sure to give it a shout.
David:
Thanks for having us.
Armaline:
Much. Thank you. Well, I hope everyone enjoyed the interview as much as we did. Obviously, it was a fascinating conversation. I wanna absolutely thank our guests today.
Armaline:
I wanna thank Jean and David, South Bay Labor Coalition. I wanna thank the OG Ruth for sharing her time with us to take a break from her 6,000 other jobs. Wanna shout out and thank the Wage Theft Coalition and shout out all of our union peoples all over, South Bay because this is really part of of of all of their sort of struggles and lives. And with that said, I wanna kick it over to my colleagues and start getting some reactions to today's show. Joaquin, what'd you think?
Joaquin:
Dude, so I'm a be real with you. I didn't know anything about wage theft prior to this. You know, I was like, okay. They're stealing wages. I don't know.
Joaquin:
But after sitting in the room, getting getting to experience, the conversation and learning a little bit more about it, it's so crazy that some of these things are allowed to pass. I mean, Ruth mentioned in this that, like Mhmm. You know, businesses you can steal from a business and you're going to jail. But if you're, like, stealing from workers, you most companies we find. I mean, that's and she mentioned that it's part of the system, and I was like, yeah.
Joaquin:
That's right. That's real. Like, it's crazy to me. I don't know. What did you what did you think about it, Alar?
Elora:
Yeah. Definitely. Something that really stuck with me was when David was talking about the differences between being in a union and not being in a union. And it definitely took me to some of my previous, job, experiences in which, you know, when I was in the mental health field working here in San Jose, I was part of a union, and that really did help when the pandemic kicked in. And everyone was just like, okay.
Elora:
What now? You know, we're frontline staff, and we're expected to, you know, be out there, sort of in the trenches, keeping, the programs going. And I feel like without, being in a union, we wouldn't have, had the opportunity to voice our concerns, get more protective, measures in place, versus when I was living in Virginia for a little bit, and, they're very much anti union. And, sad to say, that was one of the only jobs that I was, quote, unquote, fired for, due to being, overqualified, they said.
Joaquin:
Oh my god. What?
Elora:
But, basically, it was, like, the day before, I woulda gotten, like, this $500,000 bonus. It was the day before my health insurance was supposed to kick in, and, I was the thirteenth person that they had let go within, like, I don't know, three or four months. So it was pretty sketchy. So I really do appreciate the benefits, and I definitely see and feel the benefits of being in a union versus not being in a union. But, also, it was a bummer hearing David say that regardless of workers being in a union or not, here in, Silicon Valley, that everyone's struggling to meet basic needs, and that shouldn't be the case.
Armaline:
But that said, you know, I I I, like I said before, I feel really, really, fortunate that we had the time that we did with these guests. Yeah. They're very, very busy folks. They've got a lot on their plates. And so, hopefully, our audience joins us in in showing some love, toward the guests and toward towards South Bay Labor Coalition and others.
Armaline:
And like I said before, thanks again for joining us today, and hope you have a great day. We'll see you next time on the episode. Thanks.