In this thought-provoking episode of The Uproot Project Podcast, we explore the concept of syncretism and its profound impact on faith, particularly within Christianity. Join hosts Chris, Whitney, and Christian as they explore how blending different beliefs and practices can lead to a richer, more inclusive spiritual experience. From the historical roots of syncretism to its modern-day implications, this episode challenges listeners to embrace change and find peace in the evolving nature of faith. Whether you're a devout believer or simply curious about the intersections of religion and culture, this episode offers fresh perspectives and deep insights. Tune in and discover how to live fully, learn openly, and love deeply in a world of complexity and diversity.
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Chapters
Introduction and Welcome
Holiday Season and Weather Chat
Mindfulness Moment
Syncretism and Holiday Traditions
Historical and Theological Insights
Personal Reflections and Experiences
The Role of Intention in Faith Practices
Theological Debates and Interpretations
Practical Advice for Embracing Change
Closing Thoughts and Season Wrap-Up
In this thought-provoking episode of The Uproot Project Podcast, we explore the concept of syncretism and its profound impact on faith, particularly within Christianity. Join hosts Chris, Whitney, and Christian as they explore how blending different beliefs and practices can lead to a richer, more inclusive spiritual experience. From the historical roots of syncretism to its modern-day implications, this episode challenges listeners to embrace change and find peace in the evolving nature of faith. Whether you're a devout believer or simply curious about the intersections of religion and culture, this episode offers fresh perspectives and deep insights. Tune in and discover how to live fully, learn openly, and love deeply in a world of complexity and diversity.
Christian Barnes is an avid reader and spiritual seeker on a journey of excavating and rebuilding the tenets of her faith one belief at a time. She is a proud mom and wife who believes in the power of connection and creativity. She cherishes the moments spent with friends and family, sharing food, laughter, and love. When she doesn’t have her nose in a book, you can find her painting her nails or watching football.
Host
Christopher Barnes
Chris Barnes is a pastor, theologian, and mystic leading The Tree Community, a progressive Christian space in Houston, TX. He is dedicated to creating inclusive environments that encourage people to live fully, learn openly, and love deeply. With over two decades of ministry and church experience, Chris helps individuals deconstruct toxic beliefs, relearn truths about God, and grow into their full potential. Through The UProot Project Podcast, he explores faith, mental health, and spirituality in a pluralistic world. His approach emphasizes grace, presence, and intentionality, guiding others toward authentic transformation and a deeper connection with the divine.
Host
Whitney Weathersby
Whitney is a very Black, queer, neurodivergent, recovering church kid and intuitive therapist who is all about deep conversations and disruptive cackles. She is the friend who will pull your card while making you laugh because while healing is hard work, it never gave stuffy. Known for what her friends have dubbed 'Whitney-isms,' you can count on her to unwittingly drop a gem that will shake things up – and to immediately forget what she said. A student of Black feminism, womanism, and decolonial thought, her perspectives are grounded in the liberation of all people—collectively and individually. Whitney’s work centers the experiences of marginalized folks, amplifying often silenced voices, and holding space for the messy, nonlinear path to self-actualization. Whether in therapy sessions, on the podcast, or in everyday conversations, she brings a mix of radical honesty, irreverent humor, and a deep sense of care, leaving people feeling both seen and challenged to grow.
What is The UProot Project Podcast?
Welcome to the UProot Project Podcast, where we delve into and dismantle toxic beliefs about God, ourselves, and each other. Together, we replant these insights in the fertile soil of wisdom and love, fostering growth and transformation for our souls. Join us on this enlightening journey.
Christian:
Welcome to the Uproot Project podcast, where we dig deep to uncover and dismantle toxic beliefs about God, ourselves, and each other. Our goal is to replant new insights in the fertile soil of wisdom and love, fostering personal growth and transformation. Join us as we explore new ways of thinking and living in a world of complexity and diversity.
Christopher:
Welcome to the Uproot Project podcast. My name is Chris. My pronouns are he, him, and his.
Whitney:
I'm Whitney, she, hers, and southern girl. Rest in peace, Frankie Beverly. We're recording this in September. Cheers. And I'm Christian, sheher.
Whitney:
And thank you so much for joining us. This is going to be the grand finale of our first season. And we just wanna thank you for joining us for these first few episodes and wish you a merry Hanukkwanzuka. If you're over the age of 30, you know what that means.
Christopher:
So I'll let you speak no time. Merry Hanukkwanza kah.
Whitney:
Happy Christmas Hanukkwanza kah to you. Okay. There's a net. I'm sorry. Good?
Whitney:
Did it leave? I don't know. He gone.
Christopher:
Tell me he's gone.
Whitney:
And so this episode is our we're gonna call it the holiday episode, but we will be focusing on some of those holidays in later in the year like Christmas. But before we get into that
Christopher:
beginning to look a lot
Whitney:
like snow. In the South, they don't look like Christmas. Sure. You know what? We don't know yet.
Whitney:
What if global warming doesn't You know? Cooling thing? We did have a three plus years ago. All showed up this year. All showed up.
Whitney:
All showed up. I am in August. Early. Y'all, fall came in August. Yeah.
Whitney:
It is. I think it came at the beginning of this month. It was at the very August. That's crazy. I was shocked.
Whitney:
Shocked.
Christopher:
Did I tell you?
Whitney:
Look, y'all. It is not a common for we to wear shorts on my birthday, and that's not till November. I normally sweat in a set sweater on Thanksgiving. I I I refuse not I'm like, I'm not wearing shorts on Christmas, but could I? Yes.
Whitney:
Yeah. And it was like it went below 90. That's fall for the Texas. That's fall for us. It's fall, y'all.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Well, y'all be complaining about heat waves and like, oh, it's 89. I'm like, that sounds perfect.
Christopher:
It's okay. Yeah. I
Whitney:
don't think I don't think we anywhere this country had 89 this year. It was actually fucking hot. No. I'm not talking about this country. No.
Whitney:
No. No. I mean That's fair. Yeah. I'm talking like, oh, we had a little heat wave.
Whitney:
What temperature was it? It was it got up to 89 Fahrenheit up to Okay. That's the starting temperature here. Yeah. That's the nighttime.
Whitney:
That's the night time. And it's humid. And so it feels like night time to melt your face away. Oh my. I mean, that's how that be
Christopher:
feeling, though. I'm I'm around without to the garage. There's a evil.
Whitney:
That coming for you too. See, it's the same book. Nat, it is. Oh, really? It's the same.
Christopher:
I was trying to see what I was motherfucker.
Whitney:
Say it again. I'm sorry. I was trying to keep it from flooding. Get out.
Christopher:
I was trying to.
Whitney:
Nope. I'm not gonna do it. Don't do it. Don't do it. I ain't gonna do it.
Christopher:
There you go do it. Anyhoo, I was saying that I went outside for, like, thirty seconds to just try to find some tools in my garage. And I felt beads of sweat falling in my head. And I was upset.
Whitney:
I'm upset.
Christopher:
And I found what I found quickly and got the hell back in. Me and Sydney was like, was like, we gotta find the tools. I was like, yeah, we gotta find them. And so I won't be she's like, it's so hot. Alright.
Whitney:
Yeah. I think I'm melting. I mean Let's
Christopher:
go back inside.
Whitney:
When I walk out the door, pull in my pull in my little suitcase that I go get in the car, it's not that far. I park in the second spot, but it ain't that far from the door. There's sweat forming on my back before I get to my trunk. Oh, wow. Y'all sweat easily.
Whitney:
Mhmm. So much sweat. I mean, listen.
Christopher:
I mean, I'm three hundred and twelve pounds. I mean, you know, so
Whitney:
Are you really? Mhmm. Oh, wow. You're really compact. You are.
Whitney:
Solid. Solid. Damn. I used to never guess that. Solid as a rock.
Christopher:
Alright. I don't
Whitney:
know what that looks like.
Christopher:
That's the that's that's the main version of you carry it well.
Whitney:
That's what we got.
Christopher:
Is that your version of you carry it well?
Whitney:
I know you literally compact my nigga like it's like where where is it where is that?
Christopher:
That's what they told me. I want to did my physical yesterday. They was like, get 312. That was what she was on.
Whitney:
Oh, well, you know what? That means you probably like 3 at least, like, $3.00 7, 3 0 8. Yeah. You chose that, David. You probably had
Christopher:
I did not eat that day. I had
Whitney:
Oh, damn. Well, I tried. Okay. 308. You had your phone in your pocket?
Christopher:
No. I took my phone. I take my phone in my kitchen.
Whitney:
Those are only several ounces. I mean, I was trying to help. What I'm trying to say is also, I just wanna say this to my doctor, and y'all know who y'all are down there at the place that I really love. Thank y'all for y'all service. However, y'all scales ain't calibrated right.
Whitney:
I know that's right. Yes. They listen. I can step on a scale everywhere else and it'd be relatively consistent within one or two pounds. You get on they scale and go over there.
Whitney:
To twelve pounds. And I'll be like, now, bitch.
Christopher:
Tell my goddamn it.
Whitney:
Now who put this baby in my pocket? Because you're packing around a whole ass hamster. Okay.
Christopher:
Oh, Jesus.
Whitney:
What an eight pounds, 10 ounces difference we got going on in this bitch. And so, you know, I was like, you know what? One of my favorite nurses Yeah. Be like I'll be like, you know, I weigh myself every morning. And I do.
Whitney:
It's not because I'm tracking. It's because I'm nosy. It my my scale is by my window.
Christopher:
I'm not tracking.
Whitney:
But I literally keep my scale in a closet. I tried to The scale is in my closet. And like, there was also a closet. It's like in a cabinet. Like, I have to bend down and go dig for it.
Whitney:
No. No. No. It's literally at the bottom of my window. So I step on it to be nosy and look outside every morning.
Christopher:
Oh, okay.
Whitney:
As is my custom. Yeah. And then when I look down, I'll be like, oh, shit. I weighed myself. And then I'll be like, ah.
Whitney:
So I thought I was like, I weighed myself every morning because I do. And I look out the front window mostly right like my my suite takes up front to back of the house. So I look that's the front window. Yeah. And I'll be looking out just to see whose car is still in the street, who blinds is open, what the others looking I am a I am an auntie.
Whitney:
You hear her ice rash? Look at her. I'm an auntie. Hey, man. It's not an ASMR.
Whitney:
Yeah. Go ahead. Thing. But but yeah. And I told I you know, my favorite nurse, I'll be like, you know, I weigh myself every morning.
Whitney:
She say, well, what did it say this morning? And I told her and she put it down. I say, you know what? May God add a blessing to the reading and hearing of my weight by you. Because you, sister, you are really you are the Doing the Lord's work.
Whitney:
She is out here Doing the Lord's work. The Lord's work. So before we go another further, y'all, we are going to that was so texting of me. It was. I love it.
Whitney:
We're gonna go ahead and drop into our mindfulness moment so we can all come into the space Drive. And be grounded. And so for today and also keep in mind, if you are driving, please eyes on the road or doing something that requires Spin. Focus. Stay focused.
Whitney:
But if you are able, please join us. Mhmm. Everybody, if you are able, close your eyes and we're gonna take a deep inhale and a deep exhale just to clear out the day. So inhale, hold, and then let that all out. One more time and this time, I want you to feel the surface that your feet are on.
Whitney:
Feel the ground beneath you. Inhale. Hold. Let it out. And before we go further, just set your intention for this time that you're spending with us as we set hours for the time we're spending with you.
Whitney:
So just take a second, find your intention. Mine is going to be to listen. I want to listen well and deeply. So find whatever yours is, and we're gonna cement it with an inhale and an exhale. Alright?
Whitney:
Inhale. Hold. Exhale. Alright, y'all. Let's get started.
Christopher:
Alright. Oh, I've always done all nice after that. That's great.
Whitney:
Yours? He did a he did a did a work. Yeah. And grounding.
Christopher:
Yeah. Right. That was the grounding. It is the grounding. The tea was space as hell, but they're grounded.
Whitney:
Okay. You know, dude, that's the Mayan part of the cocoa. I like it. Okay. Yeah.
Whitney:
I thought you would like it. I like it
Christopher:
had a little bite.
Whitney:
But it feels good in the throat, though.
Christopher:
Yeah. Yeah.
Whitney:
You're right. Oh, I love my voice. You sound you sound like you just woke up.
Christopher:
That's what the vibe.
Whitney:
I said that the husky vibe. And you're the only one that know what
Christopher:
you're saying. Like Hey. Well, that's a good look. I'm turning my cell phone talking like this. You're wonderful.
Whitney:
Now, sir. Just kidding. So what we're talking about today Yeah. Is come on. Syncretism.
Whitney:
Or practice. That's it. Yeah. That's all. That's all it means.
Christopher:
It's going to theological
Whitney:
Yeah. Give us an example of that. Because I think that's
Christopher:
the blending
Whitney:
in words, but Right.
Christopher:
The blending or merging of different religious, cultural, or philosophical traditions into a unified system of beliefs and practices. In the context of Christmas, syncretism describes how various pagan, Christian, and cultural elements have been integrated into the celebration of the holiday over centuries. Mhmm. And this conclude everything from the date of the celebration, which is aligned with the winter solstice and the Roman Saturnalia Mhmm. Which is the
Whitney:
Okay, Saturnalia. Whatever the fuck that is. I mean Right.
Christopher:
It's a celebration of the god Saturn.
Whitney:
Oh, there you go. Saturnalia. Mhmm. Rhymes with genitalia. Has nothing to do with it.
Christopher:
I mean,
Whitney:
it might though. You know what? It is Roman.
Christopher:
No. That means it's Latin.
Whitney:
Freaks like a data Howard.
Christopher:
Mhmm. Alright.
Whitney:
Rome is like the
Christopher:
gift card. To to traditions like gift giving, the yule log, and even the use of evergreen tree.
Whitney:
Gift giving the yule log? Where people Gift
Christopher:
giving and the yule log.
Whitney:
Gotcha. Like, comma. Yeah. I was like, do people give them those? They do.
Whitney:
Would that mean it? It's again, like, fruitcake?
Christopher:
You'll tie.
Whitney:
I thought you had to go buy your own. No. People do give it. Yeah. You'll log a fruitcake?
Whitney:
You. No. No. No. No.
Whitney:
Those are separate things. That's what I thought. Why would you say fruitcake? That's kinda what you thought.
Christopher:
Fashion in the form of a yule log.
Whitney:
They do do that. I'm sorry. I'm being distracting. I just had questions. There we go.
Christopher:
And even the use of evergreen trees, which is which have roots in pre Christian rituals. So it's a mixing and mingling of of, you know
Whitney:
Tradition.
Christopher:
Tradition, European Mhmm. Healthy kind of vibes here.
Whitney:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Lots of
Christopher:
different things.
Whitney:
Even Santa Claus. Right?
Christopher:
Even Santa Claus. Yep. Where
Whitney:
where does that do for him? I'd have forgot. Was it Germany? Austria.
Christopher:
There's a there's a there's a it's a Claus. Sorry. It's a confluence of different ideas. So there's Saint Nicholas, which is like the Bishop of I forgot what what her name. I I can't
Whitney:
Faith. We'll find Ishmael.
Christopher:
He's yeah. He's a bishop of Christmas. No. He's a he's a bishop in the Yeah. In the early March piece March during the time of the Nicene Council and all the stuff when all the Christians got around to try to have a unified understanding of the Trinity.
Christopher:
Well, not necessarily Trinity, but they were meeting to combat some heresy.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Mhmm.
Christopher:
And trying to understand and confirm the the nature of Christ in who we know who we supposed to be. Mhmm. And so that's what that was about. And so Saint Nicholas was a a bishop that was of that. So there's some tradition that comes from that.
Christopher:
And then there's also this idea of center clause.
Whitney:
Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Which is I felt
Christopher:
I wanna say the Scandinavian region.
Whitney:
Netherlands. Yeah. That's what it is.
Christopher:
I know exactly where. That's the
Whitney:
one I know.
Christopher:
Yeah. Yeah. So there's, you know
Whitney:
Saint Nicholas.
Christopher:
Intersection. That's what I was looking at.
Whitney:
Just so where. Asia Minor.
Christopher:
Asia Minor. I want y'all
Whitney:
to know that. Those facts
Christopher:
he turned
Whitney:
off, he just came off the dome with those, didn't he? Yeah. He did. Yeah. He he just took shit.
Whitney:
I I warned y'all that this nigga was smart. I warned you. Is that a warning? I prepared. Formed.
Whitney:
I just remember starting. Prepare
Christopher:
for the
Whitney:
$5 words. Yes. Share for the Crazy. The random founts of knowledge that are not like surface but like he remembers it all. Beep, beep, beep.
Christopher:
So I guess, round and round in my brain somewhere in here. All you gotta do is just give the keywords, you know, come out.
Whitney:
There you go. Oh, man. I wish my brain did that. I know right.
Christopher:
I wish my I wish I knew what my brain did.
Whitney:
I wish I could remember the keywords for maybe maybe that's probably my man got the keys. Keys. Keys. Carry on.
Christopher:
Y'all got the keys. The keys are scattered out in other people's words and then they'll be able
Whitney:
to talk about it.
Christopher:
Get triggered.
Whitney:
Oh, yes. But, Santa Claus.
Christopher:
Oh, yes. So Santa Claus and all of that. So those concepts are what makes Christmas what it is right now. Yeah. Yeah.
Christopher:
And so the etymology the etymology behind Christmas is the Christ mass. That's what it is. And so that's it is a feast holiday that was, you know, that it was a Catholic Mass as it were.
Whitney:
Mhmm. It's
Christopher:
a Christ Mass that was done around the December region. December December season. So let me let me pull this up because this, I don't know.
Whitney:
That's okay. You're allowed not to do things.
Christopher:
Yeah. So yeah. So it was
Whitney:
So Yeah.
Christopher:
It was a shortened form of Christ's mass. And the word is was recorded as Christian mass in October. And I'm not gonna butcher that. But
Whitney:
It's all good.
Christopher:
Yeah. So, essentially, it is was used on certain periods, but it's also considered art, I guess. Let me not go where. But anyway, that's what it means. It is Christ's mass.
Christopher:
Really? Of course, it has Catholic for Catholic origins. And so
Whitney:
I'm sorry. I'm being nosy while he's scrolling. Mhmm. You know, do you remember when everybody was up in arms about them
Christopher:
doing instead of writing out Christmas, they were gonna ask. Right. Tell it
Whitney:
tell it tell were supposed to say.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Tell tell them what that say right there.
Christopher:
So Tell
Whitney:
them what that say right there.
Christopher:
So yeah. So people all over the also, you know, of course, the whole climate of the world.
Whitney:
Trying to erase Christmas. Trying to erase Jesus.
Christopher:
Xmas when in reality, Xmas was a shortened form of Christmas that came from us because the Greek word for Christ is kristos Mhmm. Which starts the Greek letter chi.
Whitney:
Yep. Which is an x.
Christopher:
Which is an x. And so they shortened it to Xmas.
Whitney:
X is literally abbreviation for Christ, Joe.
Christopher:
Is it abbreviation for Christ?
Whitney:
Yep. I think so. That's how we got there.
Christopher:
So put Christ back in Christmas. It never left, nigga. I see. This x was They was that.
Whitney:
Was Then I learned then I learned they didn't. That's That's why they was yelling about it. Mhmm. That's why they
Christopher:
Y'all tell my Halloween and all hallows eve.
Whitney:
Oh, we gotta get to that.
Christopher:
All hallows day is the next day.
Whitney:
It's literally It's supposed to be on the day.
Christopher:
It's the Yeah. It's the day before Saints Day.
Whitney:
All Saints Day?
Christopher:
All Saints Day. November the first.
Whitney:
Yeah. I
Christopher:
don't know. So, I mean, I'm just saying, the shit came from us because we don't
Whitney:
Oh, okay.
Christopher:
We don't keep up with it.
Whitney:
We gonna go Alright. We gonna go back there.
Christopher:
This is this is, again, this is a part of syncretism. Shit gets all mixed up that you forget what stuff comes from.
Whitney:
And isn't I think this is what irks my spirit and and subsequently makes my ass itch every Christmas season. Yeah. She asks. Okay? So is that, like, most religious holidays are like an amalgamation of several traditions.
Whitney:
Right? And so for y'all to be so up in arms about the particulars because they're not Christ like, they mostly wouldn't in the first place. So Yeah.
Christopher:
We I mean, and and that's and I think that's the one of the biggest things that we don't understand is that Christianity as we know it would not exist without the exer external culture.
Whitney:
Yeah. So No syncretism. No Christianity.
Christopher:
No Christianity. Period.
Whitney:
Period. Not as you know it.
Christopher:
I mean, the Trinity itself is, is based in a Greco Roman philosophical framework. Say it again. I'm sorry.
Whitney:
I was singing.
Christopher:
I said the trinity itself. The concept of the trinity itself is building on the Greco Roman philosophical frameworks. So a lot of the New Testament that we get is rooted in a lot of stuff like stoicism and Puritanism. Like, there's a different Greek
Whitney:
God, Alice.
Christopher:
Greco Greco Roman philosophical frames of of thought that are happening in there.
Whitney:
So things that happened after Jesus?
Christopher:
Things that happened before Jesus.
Whitney:
You're right.
Christopher:
So there's thoughts and streams of thoughts, and so they use things that were existing that were existing in the culture to help us understand the possible revelation that has gone on within the book. So All within what Christ so so we use things that are already in other cultures to help us understand the light of Christ.
Whitney:
So what you're saying is the Bible is actually written in a context, a space and a time, and is culturally relevant in its detail for that culture?
Christopher:
I mean, yeah.
Whitney:
In a way?
Christopher:
In a way, yeah.
Whitney:
I mean, not to say it's irrelevant.
Christopher:
It's not yeah. We're we're not saying that it's not irrelevant, but we can't just quote scripts.
Whitney:
One to one. Right.
Christopher:
Exactly. We can't quote scripts to devote, divorce from
Whitney:
The context of
Christopher:
the context. In which it was written. Yep. Like, you can't sit here and interpret Charles Dickens' The Tale of Two Cities without understanding where the fuck he was when he wrote that.
Whitney:
Which cities, nigga? Right. Right. Yeah. Like,
Christopher:
there are some overarching principles and things that you can pull from it, but if you wanna understand the richness of how what he's saying, you gotta know what culture. Yeah. Y'all know where he's coming from.
Whitney:
Which seems true for most things. No?
Christopher:
Which seems true for
Whitney:
most things. None of us exist in a vacuum. Everything exists in context.
Christopher:
Yeah. Christianity was not developed in a vacuum. Gospel music wasn't developed in a vacuum.
Whitney:
Wasn't?
Christopher:
So yeah. It
Whitney:
was developed in a juke joint.
Christopher:
It was developed
Whitney:
And harpos.
Christopher:
Right. Came out of blues and jazz and all that stuff. Yeah. That's what gives aside from, of course, what we call the anointing, we can develop that later on. But but besides that, it is also what gives it its seasonally, the the blues, the the jazz roots, and the chords and things like that, which is
Whitney:
Chords, the instruments?
Christopher:
Instruments. All of those things are blended into what's in you know, so for like, say for example, kind of a thing that's been going on for the past thirty, forty years since Kirk Franklin came on the scene.
Whitney:
Mhmm.
Christopher:
That, you know, oh, he's too worldly or such and such or still is that, you know, I like the old stuff like that. What do what do you think Thomas Dorsley got his shit from?
Whitney:
That part.
Christopher:
You know, like, the death that's the that's the that's the sound you like. And you talking about James Cleveland and all that? Where you think they got that from?
Whitney:
Yep. Andre Crouch.
Christopher:
Andre Crouch?
Whitney:
All of it. Yeah.
Christopher:
I mean, I think And so when you think about James Cleen's like, what? Jesus is the best thing that ever happened to me.
Whitney:
Jesus. That
Christopher:
came from Aretha Franklin.
Whitney:
What's funny is that there I don't know. Okay. I'm a take a side side road.
Christopher:
Madam or whatever. It's my
Whitney:
favorite. Mhmm. That's there's a honest. Yeah. There's a video.
Whitney:
It is glad. Yeah. There is a video. I don't know if y'all ever seen it. It was popular back when we was in college, and it's this lady singing, Jesus is the best thing ever happened to me.
Whitney:
More than a four hour orgasm. Yeah. I remember that.
Christopher:
Wow. I
Whitney:
said jeez. And she's like more than a successful singer.
Christopher:
Oh my gosh.
Whitney:
She say, gave me syphilis three and herpes and AIDS. And then she keeps singing, I'll take Jesus. Had me crust up crust up like cornbread. Yeah.
Christopher:
Oh, no.
Whitney:
I say that so often. Oh, child. I love crusty crusty like cornbread. I don't know if I'm ashy. I'm not crusty like cornbread where she was.
Christopher:
We left the Cleveland, so that's just nasty.
Whitney:
I'll take Jesus. Yeah. I bet you will take Jesus.
Christopher:
I bet you will take Jesus. I'll take Jesus over.
Whitney:
What what?
Christopher:
I'll take Jesus over.
Whitney:
Stuff like that.
Christopher:
Over misplaced crust. Yes. I'll take Jesus.
Whitney:
Misplaced crust. But I mean, like, this is and this is
Christopher:
Well, show the way you don't want it to be. Okay. I'll take Jesus. Jesus the Christ. I mean, Christ.
Whitney:
Could you no. I'm not gonna go there. Christian, what was you gonna say? Oh my god. Y'all are I'm sorry.
Whitney:
Jesus is the Christ. I'm a new creature. Y'all is something.
Christopher:
It's about you. Oh,
Whitney:
that sounds But
Christopher:
you're a newer creature.
Whitney:
You are somebody. So I mean, this is the issue. Like, syncretism itself is not the issue. Even though a lot of Christians think it is. And that that's Right.
Christopher:
What we
Whitney:
wanna talk about. Mhmm. Like, syncretism is already very, very present in everything that we hold dear. Yeah. Like, people who subscribe to the crystal, you know, the Christian faith practice as a at large.
Whitney:
Mhmm. We hold a lot of syncretism dear already. Mhmm. Right. So this there's this, you know, reluctance to let anything, you know, defile the Christian faith, whatever that means.
Whitney:
You know, you need to keep it pure. And, like, when you're talking about stuff like music, what frequently what happens when you try to, you know, it's like, oh, we in the words of Kirk Franklin's album, you won't be coming doing that mess up in my church.
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
Your church about to die. Because you know what? Those people in your pews, they like this music. They don't like that stuff you still singing. They want something else.
Christopher:
They want something else.
Whitney:
You want somebody new to come here?
Christopher:
Not just something else. They will probably want someone in addition to what we got.
Whitney:
Yeah. It And
Christopher:
that's what that's what incorporation
Whitney:
more. They want
Christopher:
They want more.
Whitney:
Expansion of creativity. Because what frequently this does is it it hampers creativity. It
Christopher:
stifles it.
Whitney:
It stifles creativity. Because, I mean, you know, you don't you don't get some of the music now that
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
Like us in our age group, we're in our thirties, that people our age love the most and associate with Christianity.
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
People 20, 30 years older thought it was garbage. Uh-huh. It's like, man, we wouldn't have stayed around as long as we did if all you did was play some of that stuff that y'all like. Now don't get me wrong. Some of that stuff that they liked is good, but Mhmm.
Whitney:
Good grief. No. It's still his spirit. Some of it's depressing. Okay?
Whitney:
Right. Sometimes I wanna be able to dance when I'm at church and not sob.
Christopher:
Yeah.
Whitney:
Just a little bit. Oh, do you hear me? Okay. I think also, like, when this does happen, I think there's how does how does Whitney wanna say this?
Christopher:
Think about it.
Whitney:
It is well, I did. I was like, what if she say, I'm finding it. I think there like, even sometimes when we see this happen, when it's not happening in, like, spirit and truth, it can look manufactured. It can look corny. It can look outrageous.
Whitney:
Right? Sure. Like, in the name of relevancy. Absolutely. And so and
Christopher:
I don't I mean, stripping for Jesus. Jesus stripper
Whitney:
for Driving low for Jesus. The only Mister Lord and mine. Jesus Christ.
Christopher:
Because I got that bread
Whitney:
While you dirty one, drop it, but you y'all ain't heard that. That's my shit. That's a lot.
Christopher:
Anyway. But you but you're right.
Whitney:
Her drop it low for g okay. Anyway, but, like after 02/2009. Well, it was like a jokey thing and it was on the inside. I didn't see. I didn't.
Whitney:
But but I think, like, there's that. Right? So, like, there's this piece. There's an aspect. When we say, like, relevance, people are like, oh, well, people are like this and it's like, no, no.
Whitney:
We are not saying just, oh, update your shit. No. Right? But it is allowing
Christopher:
A thoughtful incorporation.
Whitney:
Or influence even. Right? Like, I think about so one of the things when we first started talking about syncretism because Chris did introduce this big ass word, like, I don't know, a month or two ago. He did. And we were like, That's that's exactly what And so as he started describing it, I was like, oh, hoodoo.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Like hoodoo. Right? Like Indeed. That is a a merging of, like, traditional African beliefs and, like, root work with Christianity.
Whitney:
So, like Right. Who do workers use the Bible? Right? Like, they sing praise and worship. Like, it because they those things are not mutually exclusive and they go together.
Whitney:
So, like and that's also my point of reference. It's outside of Christianity and so I'm like, oh, this makes sense because multiple things can be true in in one space. Right? Right. They don't have to be mutually exclusive.
Whitney:
Right. And it's like it's actually about the heart of the thing and the heart of the practitioner. Sure.
Christopher:
It's really is. Like I mean, that's that comes from if you like you said, if you're a hoodoo practitioner or you Yeah. A conservative theologian and stuff like it really depends on your intentions behind it because you you can hide your bullshit
Whitney:
anything and everything.
Christopher:
Behind anything. You you can hide your bullshit behind, you know, accurately interpreted words and use them and weaponize scripture against
Whitney:
Absolutely.
Christopher:
Groups of people in the name of being pure or whatever.
Whitney:
Welcome to Texas.
Christopher:
So, you know, like like you said, you know, like, you know, for example, like, you you could you could you can cuss or you can cuss somebody out.
Whitney:
Yeah.
Christopher:
And it is there's very
Whitney:
Big difference.
Christopher:
It's a big difference.
Whitney:
Yeah.
Christopher:
And even in cussing somebody out, they can understand the intention behind why you did it. Yeah. You know, sometimes cussing people out in the form of endearment and so for such, you know, or whatever. Yeah. And, you know, like fussing and whatnot.
Christopher:
But then there are some there there are some malicious intent behind those words that can really cut to the soul. And sometimes you ain't gotta use cuss words You
Whitney:
don't. To cuss people out. I was skilled at mail. I feel like garbage without zero customer.
Christopher:
Zero Half of the
Whitney:
time it would be put on purpose. But I was really good at it. Yeah. I was like, matter of fact, when I as much as I can, and I know y'all are probably sick of me. Y'all hate to see me coming.
Whitney:
I don't cuss people out. Like, when I I will read you the filth. Mhmm. Your soul will be in the back of your ass.
Christopher:
In shape.
Whitney:
Like, you will be up, done, undone. Total. Mhmm. Undone. I don't here's the thing.
Whitney:
I don't do that anymore because I lead with love. But even as a young person, like, I I used to, like, accidentally unwitting That's what I'm saying. It wasn't always the intent. Right. Like, utilize my my gifts of sight and knowing to, like, I could read you for for shit you ain't never said to nobody right now because I see you.
Whitney:
Right? Never cussed. Was that was that the right heart? No.
Christopher:
Not at all.
Whitney:
Not at all. Yeah. But You know? The effect. When I didn't cuss?
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Oh, no. That shit was effective. Yeah. I did. That's the that's what I'm saying.
Whitney:
I used to do that shit so good. I wouldn't even go to the principal office. The other person would go for not keeping up. But also, I don't start no shit. So if I came for you, you have some shit.
Christopher:
Oh, yeah.
Whitney:
You know shit.
Christopher:
Yeah. Yeah. I don't get back into a corner as you come out swinging.
Whitney:
As especially as a youth. Now I don't have to because, darling, this battle was not mine. Yeah. I
Christopher:
can leave. Right.
Whitney:
Okay. If
Christopher:
if what it is. If that's saying.
Whitney:
Yeah. But I mean, that that reality that a lot of what we already hold dear, the things that we value, the things that have, like, established practice in a lot of Christianity are borrowed, stolen, bastardized, whatever version of that you wanna use. All of those things. They're you they're from other faith practices whether or not we remember or acknowledge them. When you get into, you know, 2024 Mhmm.
Whitney:
And beyond, you know, you get into the twenty first century, and all of a sudden now, there's this fight to keep things pure. And it's like, who does that benefit? Right. Why why do what what are you just afraid? Is that the goal?
Whitney:
Like, are you just straight up afraid of things changing? But why? You know? Also, can we operationalize purity? Because at the end of the day, what you're calling pure is we've already discussed is muddled.
Whitney:
Like, it's it's already it's already, you know
Christopher:
It's already tainted.
Whitney:
Exactly. They whitewash.
Christopher:
Tainted quarter growth.
Whitney:
Yeah. Like, it's already blended. Yeah. Yeah. Other things.
Whitney:
Yeah. Mhmm. And so it's already a mix.
Christopher:
Yeah. I mean, even even Christian, we're talking about pure Christianity. Some of the shit came from, like, Judaism.
Whitney:
Yeah. Absolutely. What is the first thing as, like, there
Christopher:
is no
Whitney:
a bunch of other people that you
Christopher:
Yeah. Exactly. There is no point in time where God just broke in and started some whole ass of the movement without some inspiration from what came before. And so the idea the Yeah. I was gonna say the very idea of hell as we understand it now
Whitney:
Tomorrow from somewhere else.
Christopher:
Came during the period of the Babylonians. Yep. Like, you when you hear when you think of when you see anything that's called Sheol or whatever in the Old Testament. Yep. Very much so it is just called the grave, the pit.
Christopher:
Like when you go to, you know, you just die. You just you sleep in your grave till God bring you back. That's basically how they understood it.
Whitney:
That was the Jew the Jews understand. Right.
Christopher:
The Jews understand it. And then you get to the Babylonian period and they're exposed to Zoroastrianism. And Zoroastrianism is a, very much a I don't wanna say Zoroastrianism. Yeah. Yeah.
Christopher:
It's it's very much
Whitney:
Babylonian saying.
Christopher:
You know Zoroastrianism. Thank you. I'm sorry.
Whitney:
Like Zoro. Zoro. The guy who Why why so much fervor? I like I can help the people. You need the Zoro.
Whitney:
I'll try it with a z. Yeah.
Christopher:
With a z.
Whitney:
They can't see you with the sword. That's why I said that They know what that is. Because I thought that was thighs rubbing together. You was chafing?
Christopher:
Tell about the absorbent.
Whitney:
Go in pant.
Christopher:
The absorbent. Starter jacket.
Whitney:
I don't like how you compare it.
Christopher:
Starter jacket thighs. Like. Like. It's two starter pants.
Whitney:
Here she come. You know what that show
Christopher:
was probably saying? It was a not a lot of
Whitney:
pop I loved them. In middle school.
Christopher:
I did middle school.
Whitney:
So much. I need some thunderstorms coming down the hallway. Well, those of us whose thighs have always touched. Hello.
Christopher:
I know. That's that was hilarious.
Whitney:
That account of loose thighs.
Christopher:
That's not a bitch.
Whitney:
I'd never not.
Christopher:
Taking standard of stairs.
Whitney:
Every move. You was disrupting people during the test.
Christopher:
That's Stanford last test.
Whitney:
Every move. Not the Stanford. Every Did they make you take that in middle school?
Christopher:
I
Whitney:
thought that was elementary.
Christopher:
I mean, I mean, I'm just saying. That's what that's what it was probably. I'll do that time.
Whitney:
That's fair.
Christopher:
But, yeah, that that was for a while, but that just but where where was I at?
Whitney:
I don't remember. We got way off topic. We've talked about Zoroastrianism. We were talking
Christopher:
about Zoroastrianism. Yes. And so That was like So you you and Zoro Zoroastrianism had this idea of a of a heaven or hell of two opposing forces and Satan and or, you know, their name for god, their name for for the evil forces and one of them. And so that got blended into into Christian, Judaism at that point in time. So you see Isaiah, I think, is the text that really introduces those concepts into the Old Testament.
Whitney:
Mhmm.
Christopher:
And so and then we get to the New Testament, that idea of Satan and hell and all that is fully formed Yeah. To the point you see, you know, Jesus interacting with the devil in the wilderness.
Whitney:
Right. And going down to hell.
Christopher:
And going down to hell and all of that stuff. So now that's now the concept of hell and Satan are fully fleshed out. Whereas, when you see Satan in the Old Testament or we would call it the satan, it is really just meant.
Whitney:
Satan?
Christopher:
The satan.
Whitney:
But not the seitan.
Christopher:
Not the seitan.
Whitney:
Because that's made of soy.
Christopher:
It's s a
Whitney:
No. No. Yeah. Not that one.
Christopher:
Not the seitan. I can't
Whitney:
eat that. Y'all, I'm sorry. I'm out of focus today. I'm a I'm a buck them out. Yeah.
Whitney:
Not the satan.
Christopher:
This is a satan.
Whitney:
Like a satan. Never mind. Yeah.
Christopher:
No. They're the Satan. This is not like a Satan. Like, Hasatan. Never mind.
Christopher:
Yes. Hazatan. Hazatan. Hazatan.
Whitney:
So Like, hi, Satan.
Christopher:
Yeah. H a Satan.
Whitney:
Satan. Exactly. Right. Hot karate. It's Sorry.
Whitney:
I'm sorry
Christopher:
about Hi.
Whitney:
Hi, yeah, niggas. Sorry. Yeah. The neurodivergence is on twelve. Yeah.
Whitney:
Nope. Please bear
Christopher:
with me. It's gonna be a fun episode. This is what they came for. This is what we get. We got on the people with the cane for.
Whitney:
Get a people what they want.
Christopher:
With neuro heroes. Anyway.
Whitney:
Love it. I need a t shirt. I love it. Neuro heroes.
Christopher:
Neuro heroes.
Whitney:
Better t m net before we put this up. Right. Yeah. Miss t m, we said it, ho. Yeah.
Whitney:
Is that time work?
Christopher:
I don't know where the circle is.
Whitney:
This was the first date. This is our proof of the pudding. Right. Today's date.
Christopher:
With neuro It's
Whitney:
not the air date, but we can prove this the date we recorded it. With neuro heroes. Effle lumps.
Christopher:
Right. Effle lumps. Absolutely. That is so much.
Whitney:
So Alright. Welcome.
Christopher:
So, anyway, heaven and hell. Zoroastrianism. Where was I?
Whitney:
You were just talking about how it's all blended. And then when you get Right.
Christopher:
Right. Right. And then you get to the Bible and the and the Hasatan. That's what it was called. Yes.
Christopher:
Yeah. And so when you think when you see Job and and God will talk with the Hasatan, what who's really is who the satan really is is like prosecuting attorney.
Whitney:
Which we use A We use that.
Christopher:
But it is an angel. It is a he is a part of the of God's pantheon, but he is not like a fallen angel. He is
Whitney:
Interesting. Right. He's not Lucifer.
Christopher:
No. He's not Lucifer.
Whitney:
He's just like the cross examiner.
Christopher:
Right. He's a cross examiner. I'm
Whitney:
gonna make him a defense attorney.
Christopher:
He and he's not a defense attorney.
Whitney:
He's a prosecutor. He's a prosecutor. Wanna say you fucked up. Here are the charges against you.
Christopher:
Basically. Yeah. No. He's a a an opposing attorney. Like, because the worst statement means it's absurd.
Christopher:
No.
Whitney:
No. No. That means opposing to the defendant.
Christopher:
Right. Opposing to the defendant. So he's he's bringing up the case against Job and all of that.
Whitney:
Right. And
Christopher:
so now he's he's
Whitney:
So wait. That's not Lucifer. That's Hasatan?
Christopher:
That's Hasatan. It's not Lucifer. And even Lucifer is a concoction.
Whitney:
Well, I knew that. Wait.
Christopher:
I said,
Whitney:
no. No. Go ahead. Alright.
Christopher:
Alright. People
Whitney:
what they want. Get a people of what they want. I'm a
Christopher:
little rusty. But yeah. So when you look on Isaiah, I think it was I forgot the the text, but in Isaiah, it was talks about where he's making the prophecy against the prince of Tyre Mhmm. Tyr.
Whitney:
Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Prince of
Christopher:
Tyre. Okay. Yeah. Can you look that up for me?
Whitney:
I will. Keep going.
Christopher:
Yeah. And so he's going through, you know, you know, sun in the morning. That's the little that's the Latin name.
Whitney:
Yeah. Ezekiel 28.
Christopher:
Ezekiel 28. So sun in the morning, sun in the light. Lucy light fur.
Whitney:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Christopher:
Sorry.
Whitney:
Y'all put it together. Put it together now.
Christopher:
Lucy fur. And so you have though you have that traditional, understanding that he was preaching it. He was prophesying against the the principality of a particular nation. Mhmm. He was not necessarily talking to the devil.
Whitney:
The devil.
Christopher:
And so this whole idea about Satan being a fallen angel and and taking the third of heaven with her, that is in crass terms, made up.
Whitney:
Come on, context.
Christopher:
He's saying
Whitney:
that you're saying that the Ezekiel the condemnation for the king of Tyre is more like more like what Nathan was doing with David.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Like condemning him for a thing he does. Right.
Christopher:
It's prophecy against of nations. And and so because, you know
Whitney:
Nobody called David Satan. That theological nigga is really on one today. He own it. Yes, please.
Christopher:
But but, yeah, that's how you see the incorporation and the syncretism that's going on
Whitney:
Mhmm.
Christopher:
Within the within the text, within your own Bible.
Whitney:
Yeah. Yeah. That you
Christopher:
see the introducing of certain context over time. And and and but then when when we say the Job, we say now to say I guess the new term is retconning. We're reading back into the text. Okay. With This modern understanding.
Whitney:
What's retconning?
Christopher:
Retconning?
Whitney:
Retroactive what? I'm guessing. Contextualizing? No. Is that it?
Whitney:
Retcon. Yeah. Sure. Retcon.
Christopher:
Retcon. We gonna look it up. We we doing
Whitney:
a lot. I was like, yeah. You you can't be using a word. Retroactive continuity.
Christopher:
Continuity. Right. Retroactive continuity. Yeah. So so basically Don't
Whitney:
be saying abbreviations like that. Like, we supposed to be
Christopher:
That's a that's a social media child. That's you
Whitney:
know for me. No. It's for your social media. Alright.
Christopher:
My bad.
Whitney:
Why the fuck would that be on mine? Tell him again.
Christopher:
Came off the dome.
Whitney:
Tell him again. Highway. Carry on.
Christopher:
So basically means to revise. I got it. Oh, I'm sorry. To revise some aspect of a fictional work
Whitney:
Uh-huh.
Christopher:
Retroactively retrospectively. Yep. Typically, by introducing a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events.
Whitney:
So retcon is what happened to them niggas in Job. Right.
Christopher:
It happened it happened in Job, happened in Genesis three.
Whitney:
Uh-huh. And in Ezekiel, what you just said?
Christopher:
It happened in Ezekiel. So there's a lot of retcon that goes back. And and, you know, and so for a lot of the early Christian Christian theologians and philosoph philosophers at the time, they were trying to but again, like like Paul says, when you read the Old Testament by itself, you know, when you read or when you read Moses, a veil is over, but in Christ, the veil is taken away. So for them, they wouldn't necessarily try to retcon as it were, but they were just trying to read reread the text with new eyes. Mhmm.
Christopher:
In light of
Whitney:
Interesting.
Christopher:
The revelation of Christ. So now they're seeing Satan here and Satan there. Yeah. It was like, he's Satan's been here all the way. It was like, well, that is that is, you know, that is your understanding that you're imposed on the text, which robs it of the original meaning.
Whitney:
So it's human sense making
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Convoluting the message. Yeah. Yeah. Got it.
Christopher:
Convolution the message. I mean, it's it's it was helped them because they were trying to preach a new message
Whitney:
Yeah.
Christopher:
Of Christ's hope and all that stuff. But now that in two thousand years later, we're losing the plot as it were to what Christianity means. Now we have to go back to what they the niggas was actually originally saying. Yeah. And then, you know, re and, you know, try to redo or rewrite a new narrative for where we are now.
Christopher:
And that's generally what I'm, you know, trying to do even with, like, so rereading Genesis three. Mhmm. Because I'm not reading it as, oh, this is the fault. Mhmm. You know, like, this is an actual point of history.
Christopher:
If I believe that evolution is what it is and that's scientific thing, that's a theory, then what is Genesis three actually about as opposed to a historical event.
Whitney:
Uh-huh. Uh-huh. What are they what's the story? What's the allegory? What's
Christopher:
the allegory? Yeah. What was the intention of the composition? What are they
Whitney:
trying to explain? What are they trying to represent?
Christopher:
Exactly.
Whitney:
Yeah. Yeah.
Christopher:
And and how can I put that in what we understand to be God's redemptive narrative in the world? Yeah. I still have a chief belief, a chief belief that God is doing some restorative work in the world. That that, yes, that the process of evolution as we are, I mean, if we're if we're coming from a particular state of primate and we're coming now, then God is still doing a work to evolve us and to cause us to ascend to higher planes.
Whitney:
Mhmm.
Christopher:
And so what is God doing in terms of restoring the earth? And what is God doing in terms of redeeming it? And Genesis three or Genesis is one story that we can look to to kinda see some overarching principles of themes to help us better understand our part in this generation Yeah. Moving forward. But but anyway, syncretism.
Whitney:
No. We're not gonna but anyway, that was all incredibly useful, incredibly informative. It is. Mhmm. You know?
Whitney:
And I think it what I will acknowledge in this moment is that for some people listening, that might have been really hard to hear. Absolutely.
Christopher:
It was very yeah.
Whitney:
And really hard to digest because what what syncretism can do, especially a new form, an aware form of syncretism, and this is something that if we're talking about, like, the the mental health impacts of things. Right? Like, it can cause conflict, like, internal conflict. It has. Hello.
Whitney:
It has. Come on, somebody. Right? Like, in your thing and and when when you have been taught that to believe other than what you are strictly taught is to basically sign up for damnation.
Christopher:
Yep. Right.
Whitney:
That shit gets scary.
Christopher:
It gets very scary.
Whitney:
Right? And so but to hear you break that down like this, it's like this is actually a very natural part. So I I think back to, like, there being nothing new under the sun. We will not be the first people to practice syncretism. Okay?
Whitney:
No. Like, this is this is a practice that has been common throughout religious practices throughout time. Right. And I think Exactly. What's an intro like, a Before
Christopher:
it was ours, it was somebody else's.
Whitney:
Exactly. Always. And I think the more interesting thing to think about instead of, like, fleeing, right, in a like, resisting syncretism because it's happening whether you want it to or not, is to be intentional about it
Christopher:
Yeah.
Whitney:
And to look at things and be like, okay. What what things should I incorporate and why? Yeah. And let me do it on purpose. Mhmm.
Whitney:
And let me learn about this thing rather than having somebody tell me that this thing is is the devil. Right? Talking to my ancestors is evil. It's like, why would that be evil?
Christopher:
Why would that be
Whitney:
They the God of Abraham, they started to start every prayer. God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Like, that was how everything started. And so I'm I'd like the idea
Christopher:
God of their ancestors.
Whitney:
God of
Christopher:
their ancestors.
Whitney:
God of their ancestors. You can't I think the only given a whole Jesus' lineage. Oh my gosh. There's, like, a whole chapter. Twice.
Whitney:
Twice. Yes. It is twice. That's that's just Jesus. Think about numbers.
Whitney:
Oh my god. Numbers ain't nothing but lineage. Literally a book of nothing but lineage, and that's not the only one.
Christopher:
There's table of nations,
Whitney:
Genesis two. Yep. Like, it's important. It's it's clear that
Christopher:
where they come from is hella important.
Whitney:
No. That dead ass. And and looking to those things and those people and taking from their narratives and from their strength and, like, being, like, what do they call it? The cloud of witnesses? Like, these niggas not just sitting there.
Whitney:
They're useless. Yeah. You know? And so, like, that's it. That's it.
Whitney:
What do they call it?
Christopher:
A lot of witnesses is in Hebrews 12, but the actual witness
Whitney:
The list.
Christopher:
Is in
Whitney:
Hebrews 11.
Christopher:
The hall of faith.
Whitney:
The hall of faith. That's what it's called. Right? And so we have all of these things that have been, for lack of a better term, demonized Yeah. In I think that is the term for you.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Yeah. That that's what we do with it. We turn them into into demons and they're literally
Christopher:
Demonized, antagonized things.
Whitney:
There are literally people out there calling your ancestors demons. Like, that's something they think. Crazy.
Christopher:
Bitch, I fight you for my ancestors.
Whitney:
Period. I fight you for my gravy. Get alone. That was the first time. Alone.
Whitney:
I will fight you for my gravy alone, let alone everybody else. Yes. Oh my god. You are yeah. Literally calling me my ancestors here.
Whitney:
Literally calling anything that I'm not gonna go there because that's not what we talking about today. However
Christopher:
No. You know, I've been there.
Whitney:
There's a there's a There's this desire to limit syncretism particularly when it goes against a specific organism's Yeah. Best interest. Yeah. Yeah. And instead of trying to figure out I'm not gonna talk about that either.
Whitney:
I see you over there. I hate when people do that. I hate the rabbits. I'm trying to stay on topic. We could go back to Don't say it.
Whitney:
Just stay. It's it's hard. I know. I'm struggling. I know.
Whitney:
I've been struggling. I'm just trying. I wouldn't say it anyway. Yeah. I know where that was going.
Whitney:
Then we're done. Carry on. Carry on. Yeah. But, like, if it goes against the best interest or the perceived best interest of an organism, the tendency is to just resist it as long as possible to demonize it, to make it the worst thing in the world that you could do.
Whitney:
And And then when it becomes an inevitability and people are like, well, you're kinda full of shit. It's like, oh, well, never mind. We guess it's okay. And then you back down. And I'm pretty I'm actually pretty sure that's actually what happened with Christmas.
Whitney:
So there were groups of people who were celebrating Saturnalia, and they were like, they won't stop celebrating.
Christopher:
Right. We gotta find something.
Whitney:
We gotta find something. Alternative. We have to make a new party. Hallelujah. Night for a holiday.
Whitney:
We have to take over this holiday. Yeah. We and that's that's what happened. Yeah. And so that is like, they resisted it.
Whitney:
They resisted it. It's like these party. Which did it. That's hallelujah. Now it's syncretism.
Whitney:
It is literally synchronic.
Christopher:
But it's
Whitney:
real like the syncretism of the syncretism because initially, it was ours, and then we said it wasn't. And they didn't want it syncretism. I don't I just make make it to nobody listen
Christopher:
Yeah. And that's the whole thing too. It's like, you know, even with yeah.
Whitney:
It's so silly.
Christopher:
And I was gonna say even I understand enough, like, things about casting out demons and stuff like that. It's very
Whitney:
Mhmm. Sometimes. Absolutely. Talk about that.
Christopher:
So every religion has every system started to believe has its own demon casting in, order.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Okay? That's a word. I would know nothing. Share.
Christopher:
So, you know, like I said, with for us, blacks, we we call that deliverance ministry.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Well, you know,
Christopher:
they cast out devils and spirits.
Whitney:
They never runs.
Christopher:
Catholic church, they call it the exorcism.
Whitney:
Yeah. That's true.
Christopher:
Exorcism and the and the way they do their exorcism, they're doing the way we the way we do truth. Mhmm. That their exercise has a is rituals. They're they they call on a mediating body and things like that. And us, we're more so standing in the power that God has given us.
Whitney:
Mhmm.
Christopher:
We stand as God in that moment and casting out things.
Whitney:
Right.
Christopher:
Now no intermediary It's giving you truth.
Whitney:
Rituals. Yeah.
Christopher:
He's very
Whitney:
Like as a vessel for God to enter and do the work.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Yes.
Christopher:
We say come out.
Whitney:
Yes.
Christopher:
We don't we don't plead, but we say come out.
Whitney:
Yep. Through the power of the Holy Spirit. Right. Through the power of Holy Spirit. Yeah.
Whitney:
Through
Christopher:
the through the through the energy that God has invested us and channel us and that and a gift us and assign us from from eternity past.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Mhmm.
Christopher:
To have this moment to be able to do that And, you know, there are people that's like, yeah. I've called and I felt God all in me and it was in the air. Like, it was very different. It's very electrified and and I had a
Whitney:
channeling, babes.
Christopher:
Right. So
Whitney:
Holy. Holy. You're gonna scam with that word. No scam. Oh, we can talk about I have my whole theory about that.
Whitney:
You know about that.
Christopher:
Yeah. Yeah. But but but basically, it is it is the idea and the same thing with the gift of human. I I was reading somewhere where he said, you know, somebody was telling me about their their sickness and I just really immediately felt like that sickness did not have the authority to be there. And, like, he, like, in the name of Jesus Christ, he he he cast out whatever sickness.
Christopher:
I was just like, see, like like that shit.
Whitney:
Yep. Okay.
Christopher:
Like, yeah. Like Sit right there. But this this don't need to be. This state this out of place. And so your ability to spiritually design
Whitney:
Yeah. Yeah. Or read.
Christopher:
Or read. Exactly.
Whitney:
I'm just saying.
Christopher:
So But I'm here for the for the the borrower That's
Whitney:
what it is.
Christopher:
And the and the interchange. That's what I'm about. I'm about seeing the parallels.
Whitney:
That that literally are other faith practices that do the same thing and use different words.
Christopher:
And I think Use different words.
Whitney:
So this is where and Chris the three of us have had this conversation. Mhmm. And I I also have these conversations with people because this thing that really gets under my skin mostly because I don't like playing semantics. Mhmm. But, like, whether we have a table we don't have a table here.
Whitney:
But if we had a table here, right, that table would be a table. It would serve however it it would in that purpose. Right?
Christopher:
You could
Whitney:
put drinks on top of it. We could put our feet up if you ain't got no home training. Like, whatever you would like to do, we can call it table. We can call it Mesa. We can
Christopher:
call
Whitney:
it a skibbidy boop. Like, whatever. It doesn't matter what we call it. Service function. Serving the same function.
Whitney:
And I think that is what happens with people in religion so often, which is why I am inserting these words is because we get hung up on the symbol that we missed the thing. Yeah. Right? Right. Words are symbols.
Christopher:
So here here's the thing too. It is e.
Whitney:
Oh, yeah.
Christopher:
You know, like I said, Romeo Juliet, it always gets me. You know, Romeo Romeo, wherefore art thou Romeo?
Whitney:
Why did you wait, Tommy? Get get to the thing. Pause. No. He did a pause.
Whitney:
He did a call and response pause. Did you hear Romeo Romeo, wherefore art thou? Romeo. He did his hand. I didn't even hit his hand at me.
Whitney:
It was like And you filled it in. Churchy as hell. Though. I did. Because he imprompted me.
Whitney:
Right. How dare I leave a preacher hanging? Tell him to part you want to share.
Christopher:
So what's in the name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet. So Romeo would, were he not Romeo called, retained that dear perfection which he owes without that title. Romeo doff thy name. And for that name, which is no part of thee, take all myself.
Whitney:
A multidisciplinary.
Christopher:
He said, okay. What they call you? I need you. Your essence.
Whitney:
I like
Christopher:
you. Attracted to you.
Whitney:
And I won't you.
Christopher:
I don't give a damn if you're a Montague. I don't care.
Whitney:
Baby, you could be a capital
Christopher:
You could fuck this capital at all you are. Half at me. Okay. And so the idea of the the again the it is bringing up a central that tenant but like yes we call a rose I may call it a rose in my language and it may be rosa in in Spanish and then some other named in the right you you get what I'm saying like it's it's Yeah.
Whitney:
I just said it. I get what you're saying. Right.
Christopher:
Right. Right. But but the like you said the essence like you said call it the table and so it is the essence or what is that essence for us when we talk about things of the spirit that we that connects us all? It is love.
Whitney:
Yeah.
Christopher:
And and if we are connected and and if we're doing things in an effort to help alleviate somebody else's pain or provide comfort or encourage them or to communicate them that we are here with them and here for them.
Whitney:
Promote growth.
Christopher:
Promote growth, holistic being, and all of that. But all of those things for me is Christ.
Whitney:
Yeah. It's the Christ consciousness. Right? It's
Christopher:
the Christ consciousness.
Whitney:
Like thinking of the Christ because, yeah, it's thinking of, like, Jesus h Christ. Right? Right. As a person person living being died. Right.
Whitney:
Somewhere not dead. And but Christ is not really clear.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
But like
Christopher:
Christ is a principle.
Whitney:
Yes. The Christ consciousness. Like, what does it mean to be Christ minded? Right? What does it mean to live your life pattern after Christ?
Whitney:
Right? With that Christ consciousness. Right.
Christopher:
Yeah. So yeah. So that that that's that's really the essence of it. So, yeah, we I don't need to be paranoid about what I'm allowing you to my space.
Whitney:
Yeah. Come on. Paranoia. I don't
Christopher:
I don't need to be paranoid. I don't need to be scared about it especially if I'm interpreting and discerning that it that is coming from a place of love.
Whitney:
I also would just like to throw out god has not given us the spirit of fear. Alright. Look at the love and sound mind. And so, like, here's the thing. And this is so as a person who has had to practice syncretism by force, just and when I say by force, it is one of those things where there are things that have always felt innate to me.
Whitney:
Right? And so, like, this idea, like, oh, you learn. No. No. No.
Whitney:
Sometimes you learn, like, ancestry. Like, it's not always a book. Right? LeVar Burton is not always there with a wreck. And so Would that be LeVar?
Whitney:
We do oh my god. So much. If you ever please bring back LaVar Burton Reads. I need it. Anyway, shameless plug.
Whitney:
One of my favorite podcast ever. Anyway but it is not always that type of knowing, which also let's, like, let's decolonize what we consider legitimate knowledge and learning. Anyway, but that's a whole another podcast. You know? There he is.
Whitney:
The $5 words. Yeah. And it's not always epistemological what it is in this context. But okay. Yeah.
Whitney:
But fuck. What was I saying? Hold.
Christopher:
I'm vibrating.
Whitney:
Different knowing. Oh, this knowing. Right? Like, this like, if you feel you get this urging Mhmm. To do this thing.
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
Do the fucking thing. Right? Right? Yeah. Do the thing.
Whitney:
So this idea of, like, like, I have had to do these things. Right? Like, so the fact that I have always been able from a very young child before I had words to be able to see shit nobody else could see.
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
Right? And then learning because I I was afraid. I was, like, a kid. I was taught to be afraid, which is very confusing, dear Christian family. Isn't it?
Whitney:
But but, like, then learning as an adult that, like, no, babes. I if I say God is who God is. Right, and if that is has power, if I have power because of the Holy Spirit or whatever
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Then this shit actually don't have no bearing.
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
Right? Like, I can say to the fucking mountain, be thou removed and be cast into
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Or in my case, I can say, hey, dark energy, you are not welcome to hear.
Christopher:
Because if I tap into the mind of Christ, then I'm I'm automatically operating on a high frequency. That's what it means
Whitney:
That's it.
Christopher:
When when God has put things under his feet.
Whitney:
That's
Christopher:
it. Anyway, so if I if I have the mind
Whitney:
scared for?
Christopher:
What am I scared? Like, somebody said somebody asked about that on threads. It was like, is monitoring monitoring spirits biblical? I was like, I don't give a damn if it is biblical. Why are you why are you concerned about it when God has given you the Holy Ghost and God never sleeps no slumber?
Whitney:
Why you
Christopher:
give a damn about what spirit is watching you when God has never what never ceases to watch over you?
Whitney:
Right.
Christopher:
I don't give a damn what witch is seeing and hear my conversation. Let him hear my conversation.
Whitney:
And? Because where's your power?
Christopher:
Because where are my power? Do I believe in the power of God or do I not?
Whitney:
That's really it. And that's that's my thing. So, like, even if you don't believe in your own power, which that is not my ministry, y'all go off of you powerless beings. But if you don't believe in your own power sourced from wherever, if you say you believe in the power of God, why are you so scared of every fucking thing? That's a good question.
Whitney:
Everything a threat to you? Why?
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Why is why is everything a threat to the belief system? Why? Explain it. Make it make sense.
Christopher:
I don't yeah.
Whitney:
I I'm not I'm what I what I would like to be clear, I am not asking this it probably sounds accusatory. My apologies. I am not asking it to be accusatory. I am asking because these are the questions I had to ask myself. I have journal proof.
Whitney:
When I'm fighting with my own spirituality, when I am like, Lord, this is this feels right, but I don't wanna go to hell. Like, if I'm gonna go to hell, make it stop. Right. You know?
Christopher:
Take me off this path.
Whitney:
Okay. No. That deadass. Deadass. And so like these are the questions I had to ask myself.
Whitney:
These are the things I had to say now Whitney girl. This don't make sense. Like this these two things actually can't exist at the same time. Right.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
God is all powerful. Both of these beliefs. What why are you fear? Why are you fear? Why are you fear?
Christopher:
Why are you fear?
Whitney:
Who shall I fear? Not a The Lord
Christopher:
of the light of my body.
Whitney:
Body. And that's hubris but like that's hubris backed up.
Christopher:
You know
Whitney:
what I'm saying? And it's not hubris in me. Right? Right. Right.
Whitney:
It is hubris in in God. Right? Right. And the power that any power that I might have that comes through God from God. Mhmm.
Whitney:
There we go. Yeah. So I mean and and this goes back to what I said earlier. We think about the things that we have been taught to be afraid of. It is good to also ask the question, what do they get of a out of me being afraid of it?
Whitney:
Mhmm. Yes.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Yes. So Who who does it benefit? Who does it who does my fear benefit? If I am afraid, if I am I saw there was something from Black Liturgies that got posted the other day talking about, like, me being disembodied is very valuable to somebody. Yeah.
Whitney:
I reposted that.
Christopher:
Yeah.
Whitney:
You did too. I saw it on the Yeah. The whole thread. Was fine. It was.
Whitney:
But it's just like this idea that, like, the more despairing, the more afraid, the more convinced that you are that there is no hope, that is beneficial to someone. Yep. Who is it? Because once you start asking that question, you might be like, oh, if it's beneficial to you, then it's probably not true. It's probably not to me.
Whitney:
Mhmm. It ain't beneficial to me. If I'm in despair, if I'm constantly having to run out of my own body, fleeing my own feelings and thoughts Yeah. Who would I don't feel benefited, literally.
Christopher:
You know?
Whitney:
So who's who's it who's it working for? In in the words of the terrible doctor for you, how's that working?
Christopher:
How's that working for you? Yeah. I mean, that's the the most salient thing he's ever said to
Whitney:
me. No. It is. Listen. A broke clock is wrong right twice a day.
Whitney:
Twice a day.
Christopher:
It's very
Whitney:
much a broke clock.
Christopher:
Right. Right.
Whitney:
Absolutely broke it.
Christopher:
How's it working for you? This is
Whitney:
a valid question that we should ask ourselves whenever somebody is trying to convince us to be afraid of something. Oh. Especially when we need
Christopher:
to feel free to those spells, man.
Whitney:
Especially when we're supposed to be serving this omni pa all powerful, all knowing, all present
Christopher:
Yeah.
Whitney:
God. If God is everywhere all of the time, I don't need to guard my ear gate and my eye gate. Right?
Christopher:
No. And the
Whitney:
point I can listen to a thing and go, this is garbage and move on.
Christopher:
And the point about guarding your ear gate, God, is not to, like, shut off your ears and your eyes from anything, but it's actually to see a thing, process it, discern, and reject whatever's coming.
Whitney:
I didn't say it. Right. Right. That's If reject what needs to be rejected.
Christopher:
You reject what needs to be rejected, but it doesn't mean you can't, like,
Whitney:
you gotta process stuff.
Christopher:
Every pre yeah. You will have there there will be things that will be presented to you and does not mean you need to process it.
Whitney:
Yeah. But that's tough. I think in our culture where that the approach is, no, we don't ever want anyone to process. It shouldn't exist so we don't have to process it. But, beloved, you do have to process it.
Whitney:
You live in a society. You don't live in a bubble that I mean Right. Unless you do, which also, like, send a link. But I mean, well but I mean, you know what I'm saying now. So I thought about an actual bubble that I could bounce around in.
Whitney:
That sounds exciting. However but no, that sounds terrifying to me. But you do use this. No. That's all a thing where, like, you you you're on a thing in the water, a trampoline, and then Alright.
Whitney:
If somebody launches a bubble and then your bubble flies to the next trampoline. Oh, like the blob. Yes. Right. But you're in a bubble on the blob.
Whitney:
So you don't even get wet. I wouldn't mind getting wet. But okay. I mean, I don't know that it looked like that. Right.
Whitney:
No. This is true. But but yeah. Go ahead, Chris.
Christopher:
I was gonna say, I've been, you know, looking for a lot of us that are concerned about the the amount of scripture we do and don't have. I mean, we've been talking about words. So we've been talking about them.
Whitney:
We're talking about words. Wait.
Christopher:
Let me give you scripture references for where we're going
Whitney:
in Genesis. We gave Ezekiel 28 already. In Genesis three.
Christopher:
And that's it.
Whitney:
And Hebrews eleven and
Christopher:
twelve. Yeah. Look at
Whitney:
us listen off. I I look.
Christopher:
But I Look
Whitney:
at me paying attention. I couldn't remember what I just said, but I remember that.
Christopher:
What's up? And here's alright. And here's the thing. Like, I've been wanting to revisit Romans a lot because I when I read Romans, I get the gist that it's not about what we've made it to be. Mhmm.
Christopher:
We have made this to be a primer for, like, doctrine and stuff like that when when when Paul is really just trying to write to people to, like, have them be in harmony with each other. Yeah. And he started off with the premise of all your motherfuckers jack up. Y'all ain't got y'all not on a good standing to judge anybody.
Whitney:
Yep. That's the
Christopher:
point. And so and then he goes through this whole treaties of making this case for why. Mhmm.
Whitney:
All of
Christopher:
us are fucked up and in need of a savior. Yeah. And so and then he spends the rest of the alright. Now y'all need to get a loan. Not allowed and to to toy your asses up argumentically.
Whitney:
Right. It's basically this the parent, like, all your kids acting up and you, like, you don't sit both of you sit your raggedy asses down because I saw what you did and I heard what you said. Right. Right. Either one of y'all know how to wipe good.
Christopher:
Yeah.
Whitney:
Okay. So stop that.
Christopher:
Stop that.
Whitney:
Get it together. I see that. And get along. It's
Christopher:
a it's
Whitney:
a get along t shirt.
Christopher:
It's the same thing.
Whitney:
It's the get along t shirt.
Christopher:
We're stuck with one another. And so Romans 14 from you know, in the end, in Romans 12, he kinda turns a corner there because it's in view of God mercy. Yeah. Renew your minds. Be do not conform any longer to the pattern as well.
Christopher:
Don't be transformed by the
Whitney:
renewing of your mind.
Christopher:
The renewing of your mind. Mhmm. And he's saying that in light of, don't fall prey to these divisive rhetoric or or these ways of thinking of classifying yourselves, but be transformed and rethink how to live together amongst yourselves with all your differences, with all of your idiosyncrasies, and renew your mind about this. This is the way the world acts. The world classifies y'all and and puts, you know, and and Everybody in action.
Christopher:
And behaviors with levels of period by those who not put you something like you should put in a box, put labels on it. And so he goes in, Romans 14, and he talks about starting I'm gonna probably read a good chunk of it. And then he says, welcome those who are weak in faith, but not for the purpose of quarreling over over opinions.
Whitney:
Mhmm. Don't invite people just so you can say, hi, Jerome.
Christopher:
Def oh. Right. So that's a lot of it's a lot of evangelical Christians. I was like, but anyway
Whitney:
Christians and some apologists.
Christopher:
Some apologists. A lot
Whitney:
of lot of You
Christopher:
you invite I like to say, yeah. You can tell if somebody's asking a question to get an answer or is asking a question to give you their answer.
Whitney:
Right. Exactly. Absolutely.
Christopher:
Uh-huh. Continue. Some believe in eating anything while the weak eat only vegetables. Those who eat don't don't get though we hung up on that.
Whitney:
I was like, no. But that's a word.
Christopher:
It's a word. Those who eat must not despise those who abstain, and those who abstain must not pass judgment on those who eat. For God is
Whitney:
Climb off that climb off that pedestal.
Christopher:
For God has welcomed them.
Whitney:
Everybody. Who
Christopher:
are you to pass judgment on slaves of another?
Whitney:
Who are you?
Christopher:
If it is before their own lord that they stand off all, and they will be upheld for the lord is able to make them stay.
Whitney:
Look at god being powerful. I just feel like that's so basic. How could we don't like, somebody put that on social media post. Like, that just makes so much goddamn sense. And it would shut up a lot of niggas.
Christopher:
I'm not just saying it's in your goddamn book. I don't understand. It's in your It's
Whitney:
right there in the book.
Christopher:
It's in your book.
Whitney:
Take a look. Right.
Christopher:
It's in the book. It's in the book. It's in the book.
Whitney:
The holy bible. I mean, here's the thing, though. We said this earlier. Mhmm. People can take anything and twist it to do what they want with it.
Whitney:
Yeah. And who does that benefit? And who does Who does that benefit? That working for you. Yeah.
Christopher:
So it says so verse five, it says some judge one day to be better than another, while others judge all days to be alike. You know, Jehovah's Witnesses, anybody? Yep. Let all be fully convinced in their own minds. Those who observe the day, observe it for the Lord.
Christopher:
Yeah. Intention.
Whitney:
Amen. Go for it.
Christopher:
All those who also those who eat, eat for the Lord. Intention. Hey. Since they give thanks to God, while those who abstain abstain for the Lord and give thanks to God. Yeah.
Christopher:
And, again, I've always I've I've been in this year trying not I mean, in recent years, not trying to judge them either for their practices, but I'm always helping them understand why they do what they do.
Whitney:
Yeah. Not because other people are wrong.
Christopher:
Right. Not because other people are wrong, but if if you understand that this works for you, for again, if you know, if you if you're trying to abstain from sex or whatever because you feel like God has called you to do that because there's some things you need to work out in your own life, great.
Whitney:
Mhmm.
Christopher:
Don't sit here and unilaterally impose that on everybody else.
Whitney:
Everybody in a unit.
Christopher:
Because everybody in a unit because, again, God's working on everybody.
Whitney:
Yeah. Everybody's at a different place and they need a different thing.
Christopher:
They need a different thing.
Whitney:
That literally I remember having this moment in college. So our youth pastor at the time, he's now a pastor of his own church, was doing, like, this tour where, like, those of us that went to school in Texas, he was coming around and having, like, dinner with us. Yeah. You know, he did great dude, just checking on us and stuff. And I remember me and my super Christian ass at the time.
Whitney:
Yeah. I remember telling him I was like, oh, you know, I've stopped listening to secular music. And he was like, why? That sound like him too. He was like, why?
Whitney:
And I was like, well, I don't know. I just feel like it's something I need to do right now. And he was just like like, he kept probing, but, like, probing in such a way that was like, you need to be clear why you're doing this. Mhmm. And
Christopher:
And not just a And
Whitney:
not that it is the right thing to do. Like, you're not That is the thing. Secular music because you're Christian and it's secular. It's worldly. But because there is something that, like, you need in your spirit that maybe that's not reaching right now.
Christopher:
Right. I need to detox.
Whitney:
I think in my absolutely obnoxious young late adolescent brain where I was really striving to, like, have the right action to get to God. Yeah. That really shook up something for me. I don't think I've ever told him that. If you're listening.
Christopher:
If if you somehow found it.
Whitney:
Oh, but if you're listening, thank you for that. He gonna find it. We gonna send it to them. Yeah. We'll send
Christopher:
it to
Whitney:
them. But, like, no. That really that changed that one moment, and it wasn't instant. Right? Like, it was when it started to shift.
Whitney:
It did. It started shifting my thinking. Like, this is good for you. Right. Right now.
Whitney:
Know that why it's good for you right now in this moment. And, like, don't insist. Like I said, it didn't change immediately. So all y'all that was in gospel choir when I was chaplain, I apologize. Listen.
Whitney:
I y'all. I'm different. Yeah. College. Yeah.
Whitney:
It was a wild ass time. We were trying
Christopher:
to find ourselves.
Whitney:
Yeah. I tried to figure it out. You know? And so here's here's the truth. Pause.
Whitney:
We're all still trying to figure it out. Right. Period. We're all still trying to figure it out. So that energy that you had when you thought you knew everything and you was constantly telling everybody how they needed to live their life and how wrong they were.
Whitney:
For a lot of us, once we get older, we realize that we was wrong as fuck. Wrong as Yeah. Like, because the more we learn, the more we realize we don't know shit. That's really cool. And so for those of us who may have found this podcast and you're like, y'all are wrong.
Whitney:
Okay. You are okay. I'm I'm okay with you to believe me.
Christopher:
Gonna judge you. I don't
Whitney:
need you to change what you think.
Christopher:
I was where you were.
Whitney:
That part, I don't need you to change what you think. I do not think I am better than you. What I want to encourage you to do is remind yourself that where you are on your journey is not where I am. Right. And the things that I need are not what you need.
Whitney:
If I'm gonna drive to Timbuktu, I'm going to not be able to do it because I don't live in China. However, if I wanted to drive to Telluride, I could do that. And I need different equipment to get to Timbuktu from where I live than I do to get to Telluride. If I'm on my way to Telluride, you can't tell me what to pack. That's right.
Whitney:
Because you're on your way to Timbuktu.
Christopher:
Yeah. So I am.
Whitney:
Have fun on your journey, but don't worry about mine. Right. Or even, like okay. So even taking that analogy a step further because you know I love an analogy. Right?
Whitney:
Yeah. Even if we're going to the same place, if we're taking different routes, we are going to encounter different things. Also, we're individuals. Exactly. My sis here, her and dairy don't be getting along.
Whitney:
No. Dairy eats me back. I feel like I've said that before. You have. Please don't send me anything dairy.
Whitney:
If you see me, you won't see me eating anything dairy. Mhmm. And so we're on a journey. We could be in the same car. We're not gonna eat the same steak.
Whitney:
Been in the same car.
Christopher:
Yeah. Two simmers in the same family don't experience two parents the same way.
Whitney:
Literally. Everybody journey's gonna be different. Christian will have a cheese stick. I will. Literally.
Whitney:
I will have several in a I will literally buy a hunk of cheese from Buc ee's and just eat it on a trip.
Christopher:
Right. Now that ready to travel is the same.
Whitney:
Right. Exactly. You don't need the same gear for your travel. You don't need the same music. You don't need the same.
Whitney:
My husband he could pack four shirts and two pairs of pairs and I'm like where are you going to have for how long and I got two suitcases that's absurd I'm being dramatic I know but but
Christopher:
he wants a laundromat I guess
Whitney:
he might which what for me I'm like, I would I but right and it's I don't wanna do laundry on a trip. It's also methodology. Right? Yes. If I am driving my car, I'm going to need gasoline.
Whitney:
If I am taking my feet, I'm going to need good shoes and socks.
Christopher:
Right? Water.
Whitney:
And and electrolytes. Elect y'all, it's really electrolytes. Let me tell you. Change of things. But, like, if I'm on a bicycle, I'm going to need a bike repair kit, tires, patches, pump.
Whitney:
Like, you we can all be on the journey to the same place, but we won't do it the same. Mm-mm. And that's okay. I need y'all to be okay with that. I need y'all to be so okay that if y'all decide to fight in the comments, know that you're fighting alone.
Whitney:
Right. You're not fighting.
Christopher:
You're not fighting. And here's another thing. Like you said, we're all going to say, we're at the same place, God. We came from God. We're going back to God.
Whitney:
Back there.
Christopher:
He said the flesh goes to the earth and the and the spirit goes back to the god to God who gave it. That's Ecclesiastes.
Whitney:
That is. So
Christopher:
you argue with the book all you want. I'm not, you know, you I mean, even even if you believe and subscribe to some level of hell, you're only gonna be there temporarily. You belong to God.
Whitney:
Period. Period. Point blank. God's problem.
Christopher:
Where the weather Take it away, Kurt.
Whitney:
Stop it, mate. She be. No. You're with that.
Christopher:
You're going back to him. There's some essence of you that is undeniably him. Yeah. And so he will reclaim it all. Whether you have to go through hell in this life or the life after the next hill of your own door.
Christopher:
Yeah. Whatever. You're going back to him.
Whitney:
And whatever listen. Whatever your concept of god is.
Christopher:
Whatever your concept of god is.
Whitney:
Yeah. You're going back home.
Christopher:
Going back home.
Whitney:
Take And love. Going.
Christopher:
Love reclaims his own.
Whitney:
To God. No. That's it, though.
Christopher:
Love reclaims his own. And so
Whitney:
What if reincarnation is just for the niggas that didn't quite get love right? Like, you're not at the right love level, and so you gotta keep doing it until you
Christopher:
get Even if that even if a reincarnation is that, it could be that or it could
Whitney:
be I was Alright. She just told us about the
Christopher:
Why you said or like you said, it could be your soul's development. Or you could be That part.
Whitney:
You're not done with the journey yet. Right. You're so
Christopher:
back to others. You you know, sometimes maybe in one iteration of life, she got too real and you check yourself out of here too early. Yeah. Because I gotta come back and we can redo some shit.
Whitney:
Redo that. Redo. Redo. Redo. What I would say is if I gotta come back for somebody else, they better get it the fuck right because I'm ready to go.
Whitney:
This shit is dumb. It's not like I'm ready to die. That's not what I know. That's not what I'm saying. I don't know.
Christopher:
You may have come back on my ass.
Whitney:
Put it together. Do he gotta it yet? Jesus.
Christopher:
Like I said,
Whitney:
I was like, I'm listen. I'm committed to this life.
Christopher:
I'm just I'm I'm going right.
Whitney:
This would serve. Alright. Right. Right. I'm a try to try to get my big years out
Christopher:
of it. For those Christians who are iffy about reincarnation, that's not that's not necessarily something I'm teaching or
Whitney:
or Yeah. No. I've You're just
Christopher:
playing around with the idea.
Whitney:
Because I'm a tell you this. I I don't ever That's the secrets. I don't ever remember dying before. That's what I'm gonna say. I'm not gonna say and I'm not saying that to say the reincarnation is not real because I don't necessarily think that.
Whitney:
What I'm saying is I ain't got no proof for shit. Yeah. So I can't I can't tell you exactly how this shit go. We're not trying to get you. It's real.
Christopher:
We're not we're not.
Whitney:
I'm not trying to get you. We're I'm not saying it's fake. I'm we're we're also not scared enough of it to not talk.
Christopher:
Right. Right. Right. Exactly. We're just talking about ourselves to tease our circumstances.
Whitney:
Exactly. I'm open to it being real as long as I don't have to come back. Now if I gotta come back, that shit is not real.
Christopher:
And I'll just be like, look, who didn't get it? Because I'm upset. I'm coming for your ass next time.
Whitney:
Come early. Can I give it to you as a six year old and be out? Somebody make me angel, baby.
Christopher:
I'm a give it to my hands. I can just lay hands on somebody.
Whitney:
Hands. Just transfer. People are because
Christopher:
earth the earth is ghetto and I wanna leave.
Whitney:
Earth is ghetto. I wanna leave.
Christopher:
Now and again, it's going to some woo woo talk.
Whitney:
Yes. My favorite kind. So Woo woo.
Christopher:
Is a little tangent here. There's there's I've been watching guys, poop some people who has had near death experiences, and they talk about how out of all the planets, all the all the worlds, Earth is, like, one of the hardest tests.
Whitney:
I have heard that.
Christopher:
Yeah. Yeah. And I was just like, that's wild. It is. That's like, yeah.
Christopher:
I I believe it. Because it's the hood. I can believe Earth is a hood. You know?
Whitney:
Alright, I can't roll. I cannot tell you how many books I read that are like sci fi. And it's like basic. It's it boils down to Earth is gay. No.
Whitney:
Dead ass. We're like the least advanced. We're behind everybody else.
Christopher:
We're the
Whitney:
only ones who don't travel.
Christopher:
And it almost
Whitney:
I don't mean like travel to other countries. Right. Travel other planets. Yeah.
Christopher:
And it almost
Whitney:
the ones who never leave.
Christopher:
It almost feels like we're like you know, in the end of the line in the back of my head. I was like, you know, it feels like this is always gonna be set up this way. I guess this is this is detesting.
Whitney:
Right. You're the testing facility. Right.
Christopher:
We'll never really admit.
Whitney:
So I bet you if you can get this together, you'd be Alright. Right. Right.
Christopher:
This is just gonna be the
Whitney:
This is this is your test. And once you've passed, you graduate. No. So Graduate to where real
Christopher:
another space in the universe.
Whitney:
And then, like, I had you pass this? We can't trust you with another shit we got to trust you anywhere.
Christopher:
Yeah. Oh, but again, you know, you've been faithful over a few things. I'll make you rule over a minute.
Whitney:
I'm like, oh, okay. You better make it Bible.
Christopher:
Going back to the Bible. They were so we're so blasphemous. But, we are right.
Whitney:
Is that blasphemous? Yes.
Christopher:
I don't know. So I don't
Whitney:
feel listen. I think it's again, it's about intention, and I don't know consider it black. Well, y'all don't know my heart, bitch. So Yeah. Then, okay, we didn't test for that.
Whitney:
Can you go? That is that
Christopher:
is just
Whitney:
Honest.
Christopher:
Out there.
Whitney:
You can't you can't say nothing because you listen. We're in a different
Christopher:
world now.
Whitney:
God looks at the heart. Listen. From where you come from, Hope
Christopher:
I mean
Whitney:
But, like, God looks at the heart of man. You cannot you literally don't have the capacity to.
Christopher:
No. You don't.
Whitney:
Right? Like, you don't know the intentions of people within their life.
Christopher:
Even what God gives you to see about another person is a glimpse of what he knows.
Whitney:
Exactly.
Christopher:
So, you know, tread carefully with that. That's knowledge that has been entrusted to you.
Whitney:
Yeah. There you go.
Christopher:
So
Whitney:
when we think about syncretism and, like, the the reality that faith is going to shift and change and be influenced by parts of the culture in in other cultures. Right? Like, we've already discussed. How how do we how do Pete, Christians, specifically, I'm sure this is a black could apply to other faiths, but this is the one I know. Right.
Whitney:
But how do Christians, specifically, like, get more find more peace in the reality that things will not always be the same, that they will change, and that that is not bad?
Christopher:
Re anchoring yourself in the narrative that love is the constant and not being like like Louisine says, not being hang hung up on the symbols. Yeah. And understanding what the symbols are supposed to do. Baseball is that's what we talk about when we, you know, anoint people and we say the power hitting no oil. Yep.
Christopher:
But but that isn't what God has already been referring. This is just a symbol Mhmm. Of saying, hey, this is we we seek our time in your life. And so we lay hands on you in agreement with what God is already
Whitney:
Doing.
Christopher:
Yeah. Evidently, he's doing. And so it is about not being hung up on the symbols and really peeling back the essence behind why those symbols are what they are. Yeah. And really being more in love with intention and that routine and that ritual.
Christopher:
Yeah. And sent if you need to do rituals, excavate the rituals you're doing and see what the intentions behind that are. Yeah. And if they're not coming from a real place from you, from your authentic self, then argument the ritual so that it can come from your authentic self. Because that's where that's where its power is.
Whitney:
Yeah. And that's what I was gonna say. It's not the intentions. It's your intentions.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
It is about you. You if you are the practitioner of whatever you're the practitioner of, of Mhmm. What are your intentions? And so we have to get very clear on that. I think I would
Christopher:
Why are you putting that tree up?
Whitney:
Right. I mean, first of all, because it's pretty. Jake, look.
Christopher:
And that could that could be just as And
Whitney:
I intend to have cute shit. Okay. But that's but but, like, seriously, I I would add in addition to that, and I think it ties back into the theme of this season, releasing control. Mhmm. Right?
Whitney:
Like, this idea of certainty, this need to have control over a narrative, this need to know exactly that it will never change. Right. Like, you have to like, we have to and I've said this so many times this season. You have to become comfortable with discomfort in reviewing your beliefs. Right?
Whitney:
Yeah. In reviewing your intentions, you might find an uncomfortable spot. Right? Yeah. In trying to learn what other things are emerge in, what feels resonant to you.
Whitney:
That especially if you feel like it's grinding up against what's already there, which
Christopher:
is Right.
Whitney:
It doesn't have to. Like, we we tend to dichotomize things, but most things are not dichotomies. Things are not often black and white. They exist in like, life is a gray scale. Yes.
Whitney:
There you go. Life is a gray scale.
Christopher:
It's all it's all spectrums.
Whitney:
Right.
Christopher:
Spectra.
Whitney:
Right. And so, like, this like, roll with the resistance is something we say in therapy. Right? So when you are feeling that resistance, follow it. So instead of shutting down, instead of fighting the resistance, instead of whatever it is judging the resistance or judging yourself for being resistant, rather wave, Just ride it and see where you land.
Whitney:
Mhmm. See where you land. Usually, nine times out of 10, if you roll with the resistance, you're gonna land somewhere that makes sense.
Christopher:
Yeah.
Whitney:
Like, even if if you don't like it, it'll make sense. Right? You'll be like, oh.
Christopher:
Right. It makes sense. And there's
Whitney:
a right.
Christopher:
And there are some things that, like, you look back. It's like I should not have done that. You would not have known it if you had done it.
Whitney:
That part. Well
Christopher:
I mean, I'm Some of
Whitney:
the best lessons are learned hard.
Christopher:
Right. Wherever you go there, you know.
Whitney:
I was like, I learned a really hard lesson at 30, and that was and the the end result of it all was I don't know shit.
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
That's the best lesson I've ever learned in my life. I'm telling you. I feel like I thought I knew shit. Turns out, I don't know shit. I I thought I knew shit.
Whitney:
And then
Christopher:
I thought it did too.
Whitney:
College, I was like, oh, wait. Maybe I don't.
Christopher:
And I was,
Whitney:
but I was still, like, I'm a act like I know. Because I thought I knew before, and I don't want people to think something's wrong. Right. And then it was like, you know what? No.
Whitney:
I don't I don't I don't know about that. You you telling me this is an eventuality of a belief system we hold. And I'm like, well, if that's the eventuality, I don't know about the belief system. Yeah. Period.
Whitney:
Right? Like, I got to go backwards.
Christopher:
I gotta go back. Yeah. That's that's what I was telling somebody. I was like, I know one thing for sure. It don't make sense for me to be in a relationship with a god that at one point wanted to have killed me.
Whitney:
That part
Christopher:
I I don't if it's given Stockholm Syndrome
Whitney:
It's given it. It's gaining
Christopher:
I'm not necessarily in love with that idea. Now if you wanna if you're not one of those trans who believe that believe that, well, there's somebody else that does because it was taught to me.
Whitney:
Yeah. Yeah. I wanted
Christopher:
to kill me if I step out of line.
Whitney:
That part.
Christopher:
And and What
Whitney:
y'all think
Christopher:
he was love him because he didn't kill me.
Whitney:
Eternal damnation is not is that not a form of death? That's what he's talking about. Right.
Christopher:
That's what
Whitney:
I'm so I'm saying. Y'all if y'all was Christian and it passed me
Christopher:
to the person God don't send you to hell, you send yourself to hell. Well, who has a hell for me to be sent to?
Whitney:
Why did it why was it made?
Christopher:
Who powers hell?
Whitney:
Who powers hell?
Christopher:
He created the people that power hell.
Whitney:
Where is the earth god?
Christopher:
It all comes back to Where
Whitney:
is the earth god? Sorry.
Christopher:
It all comes back to god. Like, wait. Wait. Who is who is who's on the grid for him?
Whitney:
That Who's
Christopher:
paying the light bill for him?
Whitney:
Right. And we're like, oh, oh, well, it was it was Lucifer because he was a fallen angel. So wait a minute.
Christopher:
So who created me?
Whitney:
Made Lucifer.
Christopher:
So who we we again, we
Whitney:
The option to fall then had to be made by God.
Christopher:
You got to keep going. You gotta keep going back because he again Yeah. It all comes from the law.
Whitney:
Deconstruct. Deconstruct.
Christopher:
So it's you know, it's one of the things that you can have some of them some cute theological arguments against it if you wanna stay if you wanna stay bound to that. That's fine. I'm not I'm not here to hold you to that.
Whitney:
Yeah. I'm
Christopher:
not here to hold you to that.
Whitney:
Right.
Christopher:
You know, if you wanna be if you wanna again, like, Romans 14. I'm not gonna judge you if if you still wanna believe in hell.
Whitney:
If it's serving you
Christopher:
If it's serving you. If it's keeping you on the straight and narrow because some people are saying, I I wouldn't be good if there was no hell.
Whitney:
That's not right. Well, you know what? Then hell is a tool for you.
Christopher:
Hell is a tool for you. I'm I'm not I'm not gonna sit here and make you feel like What are you?
Whitney:
Right. What are you trying to do?
Christopher:
What is the only
Whitney:
option to keep you alive?
Christopher:
Just go do it. Just go do it. Whatever whatever you wanted to do.
Whitney:
Maybe you can't tell everybody.
Christopher:
Well, I mean, there's laws. There's laws. So there are some things that we're putting people here for that are legal. So I'm just saying.
Whitney:
And then it don't harm others.
Christopher:
Don't harm others.
Whitney:
But also the idea is is if we're leading in Christ consciousness, we lead in in love. So Mhmm. What in love do you want to do?
Christopher:
What in love do you want to do?
Whitney:
That's the question. Because yeah. I like that.
Christopher:
If we're if we're living the fruit of the spirit, again, Paul comes at the end of that out of out of those nine fruits. He says against such things
Whitney:
There is no law.
Christopher:
There is no law.
Whitney:
That's right.
Christopher:
And that is that is that is on the books.
Whitney:
It's in the books.
Christopher:
Or in it like, you know, you got people, for example, you know, I think in Georgia, they pass not yeah. I think it's the state. Yeah. Georgia, like, they they pass some voter restriction laws where, you know, you can't pass out water.
Whitney:
Voter restriction?
Christopher:
Voter restriction law. Voter.
Whitney:
Voter restriction. Okay. Gotcha.
Christopher:
I was
Whitney:
like, what's a voter?
Christopher:
Right. Voter restriction laws.
Whitney:
Gotcha.
Christopher:
And I may be in I don't remember what state that's happening. But it's a state where, you know, where they won't let you, like
Whitney:
They were talking about you
Christopher:
You know, pass out water to people in the line. So I was like, well, you can always do something different. You you this I believe in what malicious compliance. You can still you can, like, you can still okay. That's how
Whitney:
I was supposed to say I left the cooler
Christopher:
Right. Open. And just walk out. Water. Again, against against kindness, there is no law.
Christopher:
Yeah. There is no law that can keep people from being kind if they wanna be kind. There is no law that can keep you from being patient if they wanna be patient. There there is no law against it. And so you are free.
Christopher:
Indeed. Indeed. If you're operating according to the mind of Christ, you are free indeed. There is no law in heaven, earth, or or hell
Whitney:
Below beneath.
Christopher:
That could stop you from living in love. Yeah. Because love is what you are.
Whitney:
Love is what you are. Put it on a shirt. Put it on a shirt.
Christopher:
Then that's neuro heroes.
Whitney:
So I this came to mind when we were talking about the idea of quote unquote keeping Christianity pure. Right? And there is a verse in James one. It's the twenty seventh. There's a it's James one twenty seven.
Whitney:
And it says this is the the passion translation, which is a a favorite of one of the ministers at a church we used to attend. Yeah. And it says this, true spirituality that is pure in the eyes of our father god, there's a word, is to make a difference in the lives of orphans and widows in their trouble and to refuse to be corrupted by the world's values. Now when you hear the world's values, people are like, oh, yeah. See, people trying to do it.
Whitney:
Mhmm. When you look at what Jesus spent the most time talking about, his favorite topic was money. Any idea why? Because people who are greedy and more concerned with making more for themselves are usually not concerned with the welfare of others. Mhmm.
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
So if we think about what is corrupting the world's values, it is not love. That's for sure. Yeah. So if you operate in love, in caring for those who can't take care of themselves, who have been ostracized and left alone, if you operate in that, that is pure and everything else is optional. Yeah.
Whitney:
You know what? That that feels like a solid place to wrap this shit up. No. But, like, do Yeah. We have other things?
Whitney:
No? No. No. Because that that's No. That's really the be all end all day.
Christopher:
Because I could have gone on in chapter 14. Like, it's a beast. We'll we'll probably have
Whitney:
to take it out. Do you want do we need to go on? I mean You could pick you wanna edit it
Christopher:
in Let's let's let's let's close it out at fourteen twenty three. That's the last verse. But those who have doubts are condemned with the eat because they do not act from faith. From whatever does not proceed from faith is sin.
Whitney:
Y'all, we got two good ass endings. Choose your own. Pick your own adventure because basically they the same adventure.
Christopher:
They're the same adventure.
Whitney:
Same adventure.
Christopher:
And so if you're not coming from a place of intention and believing anything that is not done from faith, if you're not sure about why you're doing it, if you're not sure about about what this means for you
Whitney:
You got sick if you got second second thought
Christopher:
It is it is sin. What a sin to miss the mark. You've missed the point Yeah. If you're not able to track back why you do what you do.
Whitney:
Exactly. And does that does that sense and you to hell? Oh, well.
Christopher:
I mean
Whitney:
Maybe a personal one.
Christopher:
A personal one.
Whitney:
Look. I tell you this.
Christopher:
Maybe all personal chaos.
Whitney:
I will give you an example of somebody that I feel like this actually happened to it. It sent him to a little personal hell. So there was a man, Chris talks about this, and it's one of the reasons that he feels very strongly about being a minister. There was a man who had converted to Christianity as an adult. He was at church in 2016.
Whitney:
He was learning everything about the Bible, and his pastor says, you need to vote for Trump. This is what his pastor says. And he's like, this this doesn't feel this doesn't feel right. Something doesn't feel right about this. And he talks to his pastor, and his pastor is like, it's what you have to do.
Whitney:
And he's like, okay. And he felt terrible. Terrible about it.
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
And I forget exactly what you say when you read it, but it he basically Chris basically said that it broke his heart.
Christopher:
It did. It it put me in tears because I was like, you know, that person that function in his office.
Whitney:
Right.
Christopher:
He's not he's he's
Whitney:
You're out of scope.
Christopher:
You're out of scope, and you're you're not functioning in your place and to see it was almost like like what Jesus called it, like, you know, they were sheep without a shepherd. Yeah. And, like, in that moment, he was a sheep without a shepherd. Because whatever that was, that was not shepherding. Yeah.
Christopher:
And it it made my heart break for them. I was like, this is this is why I do what I do, or this is why I wanna do what I wanna do.
Whitney:
You do it. I'm not doing that.
Christopher:
Yeah. What's up?
Whitney:
Well, he he meant back oh, back then. Alright.
Christopher:
This is what he was talking about.
Whitney:
He this is why he was trying to do a faith community. But, yes, I'm
Christopher:
not hearing Pastor. Right. This is what yeah. This is why I wanted to do what I wanna do, shepherding because it's like, you know, this is a sacred thing. You have somebody's mindset and and I guess in a way, soul or spiritual you have a part in this person.
Whitney:
Yeah. Mhmm. Spiritual journey. On it.
Christopher:
And you're you're corrupting the pure intentions behind that.
Whitney:
Mhmm.
Christopher:
You're making you're convoluting the idea this is what Jesus talks about when he talks about blaspheming the Holy Spirit. When he's when because the context that come before, I think it's in Matthew 12, where he's he's casting out a demon. And then the Pharisees, like, he's casting out demons by the way In the
Whitney:
name of Satan.
Christopher:
In in the name of Beelzebub. And Jesus, like, niggas, like, who you talking about? Like, a kingdom divided against itself
Whitney:
And I stand.
Christopher:
Cannot stand. Why is Satan casting out Satan? Satan has an order. Right. What the fuck you mean I'm doing this by the power of a d like, who what y'all all about?
Christopher:
And he says y'all committed to it because you you can be, unforgivable sin because you are blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. You're calling a good thing
Whitney:
A bad thing.
Christopher:
Casting out a demon devil an evil thing. Yeah. Like, this this person is whole, and we say they say no want nobody whole, so why would he give me the power to make a person whole in this moment?
Whitney:
That part.
Christopher:
Y'all are convoluted this shit. And now, because you have committed the unforgivable sin in terms of convoluted good evil or evil good, you have no reference point to getting to pull and that's why he calls him, you are of your father, the devil. You are the you are part you are lying. Yeah. And you don't have any way to get to the truth because you have sold yourself to some narrative, to some system of thought that maintains your position of power at the expense of people's understanding of good Yeah.
Christopher:
And the people and the and people's access to God. Like, yeah. So, yeah, my heart broke for him.
Whitney:
And it was in that moment, his pastor led him to do something not from faith.
Christopher:
Not from faith. Because he was like, I don't he was like, no. You know. This this ain't right. You know it.
Whitney:
Yeah. But he he was towing a lot.
Christopher:
Somebody you know, he was trying to be a part of a group and things like that. And then now, good is evil and evil is good.
Whitney:
Yeah.
Christopher:
And again, I'm I'm not saying that Trump or, I probably am, but I'm trying to find one c three. I'm trying to skirt the lines about who you should vote, who you should not vote for. But I have a particular opinion about certain candidates. And so I'm not trying to demonize you for voting for Trump. But what I am saying is that if you had a particular if you don't know why you did it and just somebody told you do it because some group was is Yeah.
Christopher:
Is is doing. You might wanna rethink why they told you what they they told you.
Whitney:
I think that's true for this is how we advocate. I think that's true for any candidate. It is. Yes. Yes.
Whitney:
Right? And so, like, any when, like, on Solange's album, where it's do nothing without intention. Mhmm. Do nothing without intention. Always know why you're doing what you're doing.
Whitney:
Right? And that that
Christopher:
Mhmm.
Whitney:
Requires you to be present with yourself. Right. And not just like a zone out. No. You don't get to zone out.
Whitney:
You don't get to move mindlessly through the world. And I think is as much as we enjoy moments of disconnecting. Of course. Right? Because we feel constantly connected.
Whitney:
Like, maybe we evaluate that. Right? Like this, why do we feel constantly connected? How can we disconnect from other things instead of disconnecting from ourselves? Mhmm.
Whitney:
You know? Mhmm. Which will allow us more space to be intentional with our all of our life. Right? Our relationships with our spiritual practices as well.
Whitney:
Right? Our practice of love, our faith. Yeah. Exactly.
Christopher:
For
Whitney:
a Disconnecting from other stuff and staying else.
Christopher:
Movement that is has its basis to incarnation. We spend a lot of our times getting lost in disembodied concepts.
Whitney:
Absolutely.
Christopher:
And that's a quote from somebody else.
Whitney:
But I
Christopher:
can't remember.
Whitney:
Google it.
Christopher:
But, but we we just do. I mean, and and I thought Jesus was about helping us reunite ourselves to ourselves.
Whitney:
That was supposed to be the point. That was supposed to be the point.
Christopher:
So, anyway
Whitney:
So on that note, we want to thank you.
Christopher:
Put your damn tree up.
Whitney:
Enjoy your also take that whole down in a timely fashion.
Christopher:
In a timely fashion.
Whitney:
If it brings you joy, you can keep your tray. Okay. But change the decor? Like, make it a holiday tree.
Christopher:
Make a holiday tree.
Whitney:
If you got planning to read that, go for it. But if you don't and if you want
Christopher:
a Charlie Brown
Whitney:
tree Yes. You can leave your things up, but please take down your outside life.
Christopher:
Outside lives. You said it.
Whitney:
Especially if you live in Texas, the grid is not strong enough. The grid is not strong enough. Things.
Christopher:
And don't you put that tree around? You have yeah. Better not put that tree up after before Thanksgiving.
Whitney:
You can't if they're they're absolutely gonna do that. Where I listen.
Christopher:
I'm going to hell.
Whitney:
At this point wow. If hell is a highlight bill, yes, you are. We got LEDs. They don't be angry.
Christopher:
There we are. Yeah.
Whitney:
They really don't add that much money. I don't notice a difference at all.
Christopher:
I'm just
Whitney:
Compared to the summer?
Christopher:
Right. I
Whitney:
noticed nothing. Well, that's fair.
Christopher:
I'm just kidding.
Whitney:
Yeah. You're not going to hell, but we are side eyeing. Too many. But you know what? If that's the first leaves
Christopher:
and them candy gams, you're going to hell.
Whitney:
But you know what? Listen. I'm a say this. Life life is hard as fuck. And you're putting up your lights, ushers in a happy spirit for you.
Whitney:
Yeah. But assure it.
Christopher:
Do it. Do it.
Whitney:
Hoes up in July. Okay?
Christopher:
We not in your house.
Whitney:
We we really don't care. And
Christopher:
even if
Whitney:
I want to be bullshitting, like, we really bullshit.
Christopher:
Don't care.
Whitney:
But, like, we don't care. Like, live and let live. Let people Enjoy our nobody in the season. Right. Whatever that means to you.
Whitney:
That's right. If you listen to our Thanksgiving episode, you know how to deal with those family members that don't wanna mind a business. If you listen to the You might wanna revisit that one for Christmas. You might wanna revisit that one.
Christopher:
All I know is
Whitney:
Listen to the Halloween episode. You know how to deal with people who trying to make you afraid of everything, including this one. But this is the end of the season, y'all. It's the end of the season. But you know what?
Whitney:
End of the season.
Christopher:
And Jesus is the reason for the end of the season.
Whitney:
But, also, y'all don't have to fret. I know that's Freight not. It seems like, oh my god. That was such a short season. Let me know what when when are they coming back?
Whitney:
Give us a month. Mhmm. We just need one. We just gonna we're gonna take some time. You know?
Whitney:
Probably. We also wanna prioritize our own well-being and self care. Mhmm. And, you know, make sure And
Christopher:
do more research.
Whitney:
Do more research. Get you know, maybe maybe next season, we'll come back with a little video. Yeah. Y'all wants to see us. Y'all wanna see the food you Oh.
Whitney:
We might have I won't. You probably
Christopher:
certain look at all they face.
Whitney:
If you can't tell, we're ridiculous. Yo. We outrageous. Listen. I said I said to my brother today, I said, yo, I just figured out that I have a problem.
Whitney:
Why do I make the ugliest goddamn faces? Like, I make he's like, that's crazy. He's like, you are so gorgeous that you do make ugly. I don't listen. I can't help it.
Whitney:
And I'm not alone in this here room. No. We all talk with our hands. We'd be making faces. We'd be having inside jokes with our eyebrows.
Whitney:
Like, it's
Christopher:
it's wild.
Whitney:
This y'all is wild.
Christopher:
We we gotta put one camera, like, in the corner.
Whitney:
Now I was thinking two. Right?
Christopher:
Two. Yeah.
Whitney:
Like, one in Are we gonna have to rewrite?
Christopher:
We have to think about it.
Whitney:
Yeah. Mhmm. But, yeah, if y'all wanna see if y'all wanna see the foolishness, I don't know if it's gonna be for everybody. I ain't gonna lie. I don't know if you get to watch all the foolishness for free.
Whitney:
We're gonna see them.
Christopher:
Put them on the Patreon.
Whitney:
I mean, we'll see, baby, TBD. We'll we'll see. And, you know, there may be a live episode every now and then where y'all can come hang out with us. But if you're enjoying this, if you have any suggestions on topics you wanna hear about
Christopher:
Right.
Whitney:
Hit us up. But, also, y'all, please, we value feedback. We're not gonna listen. Feedback where you're not trying to argue. I wanna be clear about that.
Whitney:
Mhmm. I'm not fighting with a goddamn body. Okay? Howsoever. But, like, we we welcome feedback.
Whitney:
So this is our first season and in the spirit of not knowing shit. Yeah. We're figuring it out. Right. We're figuring it out as we go.
Whitney:
So if y'all have suggestions, if y'all like, yo, y'all little rabbit trails are sending me, please stop. Like, okay. Alright. Alright. We can edit them.
Whitney:
And it's still gonna happen. We'll edit differently.
Christopher:
We'll edit judiciously.
Whitney:
And then we'll put all of the rabbit. Well, the the rabbits are still gonna happen. So the Patreon still want the rabbit.
Christopher:
Right. Well, we'll call them rabbits.
Whitney:
And we'd be having free show recordings. And when Chris just hit the button, it don't tell us when he hit the button. And y'all oh my goodness. Y'all might get a drop of some of that.
Christopher:
Like, it's
Whitney:
a little teaser. We do. Y'all season. We'll see. Just It's usually the crazy stuff.
Whitney:
Like, the way I you. Yo. I'll be trying not to talk about my personal life. So if we ain't dropping none of that shit.
Christopher:
No.
Whitney:
I mean,
Christopher:
we do.
Whitney:
Because sometimes we just be in here talking about I have to tell you once the mics go off. Oh, but Right. But yeah. So, you know, if you like it, like and subscribe. If you like it, but it could be better, let us know.
Whitney:
Mhmm. If you don't like it, you can move along. Hey. Listen. We're also open to you saying this is some heavy content.
Whitney:
I wanna use this in my bible study. We want I wanna invite invite them to listen. Cool. Y'all talk about amongst yourselves. Yeah.
Christopher:
If you're okay with the profanity, then I
Whitney:
mean No. I'm sorry, y'all. I'm gonna cuss. I listen. I haven't I haven't been Again,
Christopher:
we not alone.
Whitney:
You're not alone. You're not alone.
Christopher:
Members of the tree community and at the tree, we live fully. We learn openly. Yeah. And we love deeply. And that live fully includes a little cussing in there.
Christopher:
Amen. I'm just like, we're bringing our full selves. I I I
Whitney:
do it with intention to God
Christopher:
to help you. We prayed that God delivers where we were really in the in the developing phase, but it just it just didn't happen.
Whitney:
You know, I stopped, though. I think I you know, I I
Christopher:
think my job is what really kept me cussing. I really got a lot. My job was really You
Whitney:
know, I stopped cussing. What was that? High school? Yeah. I stopped happened.
Whitney:
It just came. Right.
Christopher:
And then I began to be proficient.
Whitney:
In 2016. Are you fucking serious? Oh, gotcha. Okay. My bad.
Whitney:
I'm sorry. I was thinking
Christopher:
I see. The rose up in it.
Whitney:
Y'all see how that hit different than oh, my God. Are you serious? That that fucking does something different. I thought I thought you were talking about something personal. No.
Whitney:
It brings But I got it. It brings
Christopher:
I'm not gonna lie. Cussing brings a level of clarity to the energy of
Whitney:
Absolutely. It does.
Christopher:
I we're we're here. This is Right.
Whitney:
You
Christopher:
know, like, what the fuck?
Whitney:
Like That part.
Christopher:
Oh, this is where we are energetic.
Whitney:
And also let you know the severity. Right? Like, I used to say that, like, all the time. The difference when your mama say sit down, sit your ass down Oh, that's energy. That's a
Christopher:
a shift.
Whitney:
Different energy. That's a shift. That's a shift in the urgency they're in. Right. They said watch When?
Whitney:
In a tone, she tuning up.
Christopher:
When Paul
Whitney:
Me, me, me, me. Right. Shoot at your head.
Christopher:
I don't know about that you. Paul was like, look. All of this all of the stuff I can all all the stuff I have accumulated in this life
Whitney:
or whatever it's shit.
Christopher:
It's shit. Uh-huh. No. No. The Bible translates it.
Christopher:
I don't know whatever. But now he
Whitney:
And done done.
Christopher:
It was skibbidy. It was shit.
Whitney:
Come on. Did he just He says skibbidy.
Christopher:
He was Ohio. I don't know.
Whitney:
Oh my god. Are we relevant right now?
Christopher:
Yeah. We're trying to be.
Whitney:
Where is the syncretism?
Christopher:
Oh, no.
Whitney:
Somebody come save us.
Christopher:
You see?
Whitney:
I'm not insane. So Try to be relevant. Take it over. I would Make it over.
Christopher:
So that shit is over. Alright. Anyway
Whitney:
Show is over. Season is over. We'll see y'all next year.
Christopher:
Bye. Bye.
Whitney:
Thanks for joining us for this episode of the Uproot Project Podcast. We hope you found fresh perspective and continue to make space for real growth. If you enjoy today's conversation, be sure to subscribe, share, and leave a review wherever you listen to your podcast. You can follow us on social media at the uproot project podcast on Instagram, Facebook, and YouTube, or visit us at www.theuprootpodcast.com for more content. To contact us, feel free to drop us a line at hello@theuprootpodcast.com.
Whitney:
Until next time, keep living fully, learning openly, and loving deeply. We'll see you soon.
