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Welcome to One Hale of a Conversation where your host, James Hale, talks with Artists, Actors, and Creatives, trying to understand both where they come from, and how they tick. Join Us!
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Maddi
This podcast is brought to you by Mad Company, a nonprofit theater company based out of New York City.
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James
Hello and welcome to another episode of One Hale of a Conversation. My name is James Hale. I am your host for this podcast. With me today is the wonderful actor, director, creative and all around great human being, Annie Kefalas. Hi Annie, How are you?
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Annie
Hi, James. I'm good. How are you?
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James
I'm well, thank you. So, Annie, you and I met at LAMDA…
Annie
Mmhmm.
James
A couple of years ago, three years ago now. Wow.
Annie
Oh, my God.
James
Yeah, that happened quick. You hail from a couple of different places. You're from Chicago. You grew up down south a little bit. You also went to school in Wisconsin. Where do you say you're from?
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Annie
Well, the short answer would be, I say I'm from Chicago. People from Chicago would be in an uproar about that because technically, I am born in Saint Louis and then spent a lot of time in Decatur, Illinois, which if you're not sure where that is, point to a map of Illinois and then point to the dead center. That is it.
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Annie
And then I lived in Chicago and then I lived in Milwaukee and then Chicago again. And then Savannah, Georgia, and then London and now here. So I just say Chicago.
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James
Chicago. Excellent. One of one of many places, maybe. So before we dive into sort of what you're doing now, I wonder if you could just sort of track your journey maybe from what made you want to become an actor or a director and then how you found your way to Marquette and then LAMDA and then here. Like what…
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James
What..As brief, as briefly as you feel. What does that… what does that journey look like?
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Annie
My answer of how I became an actor is very boring in the sense that, like, I've never done anything else. When I was… I've been told when I was two, I used to stand on top of fireplaces and put my arms out and yell at people. So that was my stage. And you know, when they ask a kid, What do you wanna be when you grow up?
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Annie
I said, a princess and an actor. So…
James
Naturally.
Annie
Naturally. So I never I never had that moment of… and now I think I'll be an actor. It was always there, which is the boring answer. And people roll their eyes at that. But I don't have another answer.
James
Sure.
Annie
I was deadly, deathly… deadly, whatever, afraid of auditioning when I was a teenager.
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Annie
So colleges… the idea of auditioning for colleges made me kind of want to jump in front of traffic.
James
Sure.
Annie
So Marquette is… I wanted something small. Well, that's not really true. I wanted to go to New York or to California, but my parents took a map of Illinois, a map of the Midwest, made a circle and said, don't go beyond the circle for college.
00;02;36;21 - 00;02;53;18
Annie
And as an 18 year old, I was like, this sucks. But then I found Marquette and I have pretty good intuition. So I got there and I felt this overwhelming wave of calm. And then they told me, You don't have to audition to be in the theater program. And it was small enough. It was 60 people, and I did...
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Annie
I was in ten shows. I directed five. I helped costume design, I helped build sets. I did everything. And I really appreciate that small program. And then LAMDA was always kind of on my radar in the back of my head. And when I decided I wanted to do a Masters, I decided, okay, now I'm going to do the whole competitive auditioning, cutthroat conservatory thing.
James
Sure.
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Annie
And my audition for LAMDA was wonderful because Rodney and I sat there and talked about cupcakes and muffins for about 5 minutes. And then he said, okay, do your thing. I did my thing. He goes, Do you have more monologues? I did a couple more. He goes, Do you have more contemporary? I did a couple more. We talked about the cold because he hated Chicago weather.
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Annie
I was the first of the day and he said his first in Chicago. Then I went home and then a couple of weeks later, I got a call.
James
Amazing.
Annie
And that was… it's ironic that I was afraid of auditioning. And that was my audition.
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James
Yeah.
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Annie
Which… the universe always has a way…
James
That’s right, yeah, it was meant to be.
Annie
Which is pretty funny. It was. And I mean, I'm not bad, but I just don't like auditioning.
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James
Right. That was a pretty gentle audition.
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Annie
Exactly. Well, I don't like auditioning for programs. Auditioning for shows is very different…
James
Sure.
Annie
A program is… it's so much bigger in your head than it would be to do something. Just a normal audition. Yeah, that's why I got to LAMDA. Was that the end of the question?.
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James
Sure, yeah. So you said LAMDA had always been on your radar.
Annie
Mmhmm.
James
How wass that? I feel like there's lots of… especially Americans who, even if they're into arts and drama and theater, they aren't as familiar with the UK program.
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Annie
I mean, LAMDA is one of the top, I think, five in the world...
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James
Yeah, it is… flex.
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Annie
That's humble flex for us. It's one of the top five in the world. When I was younger, I was like, I have to be the best. And I looked up the best programs and I auditioned for all the best ones and LAMDA stuck. And also, I mean, to chalk it up to my intuition, LAMDA always felt like it was going to be a thing… I don't know how that sounds really like…
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James
But I understand that. Yeah.
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Annie
Yeah. So and then when the vibe of the audition was just completely muffins and cupcakes and Shakespeare, it was great. So… but yeah, I always, I always had… just because I was not, maybe going to the best top theater college or like my high school at middle of nowhere, 200 people. I was always tracking the best.
James
Yeah.
Annie
So I knew.
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James
You knew. All right, very cool. I mean, I didn't know LAMDA was a thing, you know, I like, I heard its name in passing once…
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Annie
I mean, you also weren’t an actor from the start.
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James
That's true. That’s true
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Annie
You are. You are a little transformer.
James
Yeah, I came to it late.
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Annie
I can not relate.
James
I always, always picking up on things. Um, very cool. So LAMDA was a few years ago. You moved here basically immediately after graduation? Yeah? There was a couple months that you…
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Speaker 3
Yeah, I was. I spent a couple of months back in Chicago with my family in Decatur or whatever, and then I came here in January of 2021.
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James
Right. COVID makes things difficult as well.
Annie
Oh, yes.
James
So you came here and then… so you are currently super busy, you're doing a lot of stuff. Were you… this was early 2021… Were you working pretty immediately in theater then, or did it take you a while to build up some steam?
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Annie
It took me a while. I would say it was a combination of a lot of things. I would like to blame fully COVID, but I mean, like it wasn't really fully COVID.
James
Sure.
Annie
I was adjusting to a new area. I didn't know anyone in New York in the theater scene all that much. It takes… it took a while to get started, but once I got started, I was fortunate enough to keep going and making connections.
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Annie
So no, not really. I would say the first… my first show in the city was June of 2021, right? Yeah.
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James
All right. Well, that's quick. I mean, that's six months after landing here. So.
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Annie
Wait a minute. It might have been the next year. I don't remember, but…
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James
Alright, well 2022 would make more sense to me because I don't think…
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James
Even Broadway…
Annie
I think it was 2022.
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James
Wasn't even open till fall.
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Annie
Again, I'd like to blame COVID. I think it was a little bit of COVID as well as just me adjusting... And other life things just got me. So theater was the last thing on my mind after moving to the city…
James
Yeah.
Annie
And a lot of things were happening for me that I, I kind of let it… let myself be in the background…
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Annie
And then once COVID kind of lifted, I was like, got to get my shit together.
James
Right.
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James
I mean, that makes sense. That's… that's often how it goes. And, you know, we've...
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Annie
I think a lot of us are like that, actually.
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James
Totally. Yeah. And I've talked to lots of people either on this podcast or not, who, you know, it takes years and years to sort of build up momentum and build up steam.
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Annie
And then once you do it, it just...
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James
And then eventually. Right, eventually it starts…
Annie
It keeps going.
James
It has its own momentum that you could build. Right. So far. So I want to talk about… you've had it… you've done a few things recently, actually, to start with this… you are right now in tech for a workshop production. We were, we were chatting before we hopped on the mics here would you tell us a little bit about this project?
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James
I actually don't think I ever got a name for it.
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Annie
Oh yeah, I didn't tell you the name of it. That's why… this is… it's so much fun.It's called like a queen or whatever.
James
Okay.
Annie
And it is about 17 year old high school boarding student girls all competing to be class president. And they end up basically trying to kill each other to get into Yale and…
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James
As happens.
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Annie
As… I actually had someone tell me this isn't far off from their boarding school experience. And that made me a little nervous for them as…I didn’t ask too many follow up questions. It's with HB Studios in Greenwich Village. It’s so much fun. I found this through someone who saw Amish Project… the one woman show I just did… and asked me if I'd be interested in auditioning.
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Annie
It's really fun. It's cool. I've never been a part of a workshop that wasn't like a staged reading. So it's interesting to like, see two actors have their scripts on hand because that's equity rules for a workshop. That's not a stage reading. It's cool, it's interesting. It's just act one right now being produced, and then hopefully in the New year, the whole show will be because the whole show is nuts.
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Annie
It's crazy. Act one ends crazy, but it's really fun. I'm having a really good time with it.
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James
Wonderful. So speaking of the Amish project, this was your one woman show. You did this at the Secret Theater in Queens.
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James
Is that correct?
Annie
I did. That is correct.
00;08;51;06 - 00;09;01;08
James
That's what this is produced by Between Us Theater Company, which is… your… this is a theater company you helped start or you found are now on the board of…What’s
00;09;01;12 - 00;09;29;05
Annie
I am on the board of now. My really good friend of Emille is the man who started it. He is an immigrant and then his friend Alessandro is also an immigrant who actually lives in London right now doing London theater.
James
Oh, wow.
Annie
And they started this company for basically untold stories and for minorities and immigrants, etc. And they asked me to be on the board after I was in their production of Egg, which is the post-apocalyptic drama, which is very fun.
00;09;29;05 - 00;09;48;03
Annie
And they were looking for a piece of work that hadn't been done a lot and a story that hasn't been talked about a lot and maybe representing a group that hasn't been talked about a lot and they were having a hard time finding something that they wanted to do. And so I recommended Amish Project, which is about an Amish community and a school shooting that happened there in 2006.
00;09;48;03 - 00;10;04;27
Annie
And I pitched it and they went for it, and this is my second time doing it. So they helped produce it. And now we're working on doing our second show, which I think we're going to do a little bit of a classical thing. I think that's what we decided.
James
Very cool.
Annie
Yeah, we haven't... We have a meeting this Sunday, so we got to talk about it.
00;10;04;27 - 00;10;13;20
Speaker 2
Right… plans must be made. So that's fascinating to me that this is the second time you've done the Amish Project, which is a one woman show with is it seven?
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Annie
Seven different characters.
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James
Distinct characters?
Annie
Yeah
James
That's a lot. You did this show… correct me if I'm wrong, as you're like senior thesis at Marquette?
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Annie
That is correct.
00;10;23;19 - 00;10;44;19
James
Okay, So you have this is the same show. You're doing it in two different times, two different places, two different productions. I mean, it was directed by different people.
Annie
Very different.
James
That is something that I feel like not many actors at any stage ever get the chance to do. Go up and… unless its maybe a Shakespeare… go back and revisit a show under different circumstances, different directions.
00;10;44;22 - 00;11;06;26
James
Can you just talk about what that was like as… as a creative, but also specifically as an actor and performer, like playing a familiar part under unfamiliar circumstances? What was… how how difficult was it to approach the second time you did it without preconceptions from the first? Or did you not? Did you keep your preconceptions?
00;11;06;28 - 00;11;11;22
Annie
I would say that for the first. We rehearsed for six months.
00;11;11;24 - 00;11;13;09
James
For this current one?
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Annie
For Amish project. Yeah.
00;11;15;05 - 00;11;15;16
James
Six months. Wow.
00;11;15;16 - 00;11;38;00
Annie
Six months. That was my choice. Because after doing the first time, I really wish I had dived deeper into some of these characters. And when I did it the first time at Marquette, we only really dived into maybe five of them. There were two of them that we didn't look at as much, and I wanted to. I wanted people to be so clear in their head of who each character was and how…think that, Oh, I know this person.
00;11;38;02 - 00;11;58;10
Annie
And in order to do that, I made the decision to do six months of rehearsal, which was very tiring.
James
Yeah that’s…that’s insane.
Annie
Yeah, but I mean, it's just me. So we did a lot of it in my apartment, which was great. You didn’t have to rent out a space, which is great.
James
Love that.
Annie
I would say for the first couple of months it was a lot of, Oh, I don't know how to say, I don't know how to do this any different than I did before…
00;11;58;10 - 00;12;20;29
Annie
And my director Dominika was so great at kind of shredding down what I thought of each character, except maybe one. There's one character that probably stayed very similar… and building back up from what, what we were talking about versus what I had before. So it wasn't as hard as I thought. Maybe the first couple of months of me being like, Oh, I wouldn't think of it that way, but that makes sense… versus the last time it was very set in my head.
00;12;21;02 - 00;12;48;26
Annie
It was very different this time. Yeah, in the sense that like… A - it's been five years since I did the last one, so I have a whole Masters program in between different life, just like different life experience. I'm older and also more understanding of how to develop characters. I think I did a good job of it at Marquette, but even my mom, who saw it twice in the city here, said This is so much better than the first time, which is a backhanded compliment, but she meant more so.
James
Thanks mom.
00;12;48;26 - 00;12;59;24
Annie
Yeah, Thanks. Thanks a lot, Mom. She meant more so, of like… this show was… I understood the characters more and she also said more. She said that my dialect and articulation was better. So thank you LAMDA.
00;12;59;28 - 00;13;00;13
James
There we go.
00;13;00;13 - 00;13;18;27
Annie
Which is very funny to me. Yeah. So it. It was a lot easier this time, actually.
James
Sure.
Annie
I think because I'm a more established, grounded actor, it was a lot easier and I had more fun diving really deep into the characters in ways I probably hadn't before, which I think made it better.
00;13;19;02 - 00;13;43;08
James
Sure. But… so you did. It sounds like you did sort of approach the initial rehearsal process for this second show in New York, holding on to everything that you had already done with Marquette. I mean, obviously you've already done some work, so that makes sense to me. But it also feels risky from the outside, like on the approach to this show, thinking or feeling certain things about these characters already.
00;13;43;09 - 00;14;06;18
Annie
Let me give you an example.
James
Yeah.
Annie
The six year old girl that I play…
James
Yes.
Annie
Who was a crowd favorite…besides the murderer actually. She was the one that was most talked about besides the killer. Which. Okay, great…
James
That’s a little…
Annie
That's fantastic. And because people were people were really, really surprised that I could play a child that well. For a reference…
00;14;06;18 - 00;14;25;04
Annie
My type is… I never get to play children. I mean, obviously, I never get to play children and I never get to play the comedic role. I'm always playing someone really dramatic and like strait-laced, and that's kind of what I'm good at. But when I walked in for the rehearsals for Velda, this the six year old, I had everything in my head.
00;14;25;04 - 00;14;41;26
Annie
The way I'd said it before,and my dialect was different and my director was like, Have you ever heard a child talk about like… draw and talk at the same time? And I was like, I don't know if I have. And this character draws the entire time of the show and she's like, Why don't you give her a lisp and see if that helps you?
James
Wow.
00;14;41;28 - 00;14;59;05
Annie
And I gave her a lisp and then…that naturally helped with like when children breathe really quickly and they have a lot to say. The breath came with it and then the pitch went higher then it was less on my vocal colds, vocal chords, vocal chords, whatever. And it was a lot of just the faster I drew, the more, I had a lot to say.
00;14;59;09 - 00;15;10;29
Annie
And then this would happen. And then I added the lisp and it made the whole character fell into place. I was like, I know who this little girl is. I have met her. I was not her because I had… my voice was a lot weirder when I was a kid. But I have met children like this.
00;15;11;03 - 00;15;11;10
James
Fair enough.
00;15;11;12 - 00;15;37;17
Annie
And it was just a simple little thing of cool, I like what you're doing, but like a six year old wouldn't be that put together. And I'm like, you are correct. It…
James
That’s a good point.
Annie
Little things like that. But the character completely shifted. Or the character of America, the New York pregnant girl. A - we made her from New York instead of where she's written to be from in the script, which I liked that difference because I got to try a New York dialect, which was really cool…
James
Yeah, it worked.
Annie
It was hard.
00;15;37;18 - 00;15;51;05
Annie
I thought my Chicago dialect would help. It did not.
James
Oh no.
Annie
Did not help. I worked with the dialect coach, actually on that from Stella Adler Studios, and that was really hard.
James
Sure.
Annie
He said I did better than he thought I would, but it was still really hard.
00;15;51;06 - 00;15;52;21
James
Another kind of backhanded compliment.
00;15;52;26 - 00;15;53;16
Annie
I get a lot.
00;15;53;20 - 00;15;54;00
James
You just collect those.
00;15;54;00 - 00;16;14;24
Annie
I get a lot. But that was really fun. And her… once I added the New York accent, her entire posture just changed completely from how I was doing it the first time. And her… like leading with my belly, which she's pregnant, but she's not showing. So the first time I did it, I was more like… upright and bubbly… and I'm like, She would be…
00;16;14;24 - 00;16;23;01
Annie
But she'd also have this. Like she's back on her hip. She's probably playing with her Nails.
Annie
She has to…
James
This is her thing right.
Annie
Yeah. And that changed the whole character. It was fun.
00;16;23;02 - 00;16;37;07
James
That's super cool. Yeah.
Annie
Yeah.
James
So it was…it was a lot of, um. To me, it sounds like then a lot of the work was physicality or… or vocal changes, more so than like the psychological digging in because you'd already done some of that.
00;16;37;07 - 00;16;57;20
Annie
A little bit. But also it was like… we also like paired this. So this show, if you took all the seven characters apart, it would just be giant monologues of each character.
James
Right.
Annie
We rehearsed it like that a couple of times, just doing one character all the way through because the arc makes sense, especially for Carol the widow. Her arc makes sense if you just do it all the way through without interjections from other characters.
00;16;57;22 - 00;17;21;19
Annie
And my director would be like, okay, who are you talking to? And it couldn't be like, I'm talking to the audience. She like… she's very clearly sitting on a porch. At the end of the day after the Amish forgave her. She's smoking a cigarette. She's talking to a friend of hers, she's in an oversize sweatshirt and she's in Hollister jeans and she's looking out at a field and she is just disheveled.
00;17;21;19 - 00;17;44;00
Annie
And once I had this very clear image in my head, it's probably like 9 p.m.. Everything else made sense where each character was… because they don't really talk to each other all that much. That made things… psychologically made things different. Like you would… you would talk about this whole story very differently. Sitting on a porch with a cigarette at 9 p.m. versus having coffee at a restaurant. Talking to a friend is very different than, like talking to a cop.
James
Yeah.
00;17;44;00 - 00;17;57;24
Annie
Like the killer who we said we have to like, we have to play as if he's alive, even though he's dead. When he's talking, the audience is like he's in an interrogation room at a police station and the first thing said to him is like…do you want to tell us what happened? And he doesn't say anything…
00;17;57;24 - 00;18;14;23
Annie
And then the cops keep going. Look, to clear your name, you have to say what happened. But then his first line is, I'll tell you right now, I'm not going to say why. Things like having such a clear idea of this. If this was a movie. What would be happening?
James
Right.
Annie
I… as a director, I asked my actors a lot that too… okay, in the hallmark film, what are you doing?
00;18;14;23 - 00;18;39;09
Annie
If this was an animated series, what are you doing? If this was CSI, what's happening? That's my little director tool, my brain of like… in a movie version, you see so clearly something. But on stage people get really tripped up…
James
Right
Annie
Because a lot of time it's not that. So you have to just be like, okay, Eddie is in a… he's in like a really, really intense movie or he's in like a… like the Jeffrey Dahmer documentary.
00;18;39;09 - 00;18;45;18
Anie
Like, where are you and what is the tone of this and who are you talking to? And how do you feel about them?
James
Right.
Annie
I love doing that kind of stuff.
00;18;45;19 - 00;18;47;22
James
Just hyper focusing on the circumstances.
00;18;47;22 - 00;19;05;13
Annie
Yeah. Or the little girl because she's also dead. But she… we said she was in… she was in a police station as well, like one of the child, like in the back room with a child's room. And there's a nurse there talking to her and trying to get her to tell what happened. But you wouldn't ask a child, how did you get shot?
James
Right.
00;19;05;14 - 00;19;07;22
Annie
You’d be like, can you draw me pictures?
James
Right.
Annie
Yeah.
00;19;07;22 - 00;19;09;15
James
Wow, That's so interesting.
00;19;09;17 - 00;19;11;24
Annie
It's really cool. I can talk about that forever.
00;19;11;24 - 00;19;23;09
James
Yeah. I mean, that sounds like an incredible product to be part of and, like, really great, like, because you had done it before, coming back to it, getting to see it with all these fresh eyes is just. That's so exciting.
00;19;23;09 - 00;19;40;07
Annie
I was so nervous for people to see it. I was like, I talked the show up so much to everyone around me and I loved this show.
James
Good. As you should.
Annie
As in… But then come the opening night and I, I don't get… egh, humble brag. I don't get nervous a lot anymore when I do shows. I just don't. Maybe when I'm on Broadway someday.
00;19;40;12 - 00;20;03;19
Annie
When. Yeah, but I just don't get nervous. But contemporary work is my thing, and there's a lot of people in my life that have not seen me do contemporary work because I've been doing classical. And classical is great, and I think I'm a good performer, but contemporary work is my shit and I've been talking about it forever. And right… hours before the show, I stopped drinking coffee…
James
Oh no, yeah.
Annie
Which I never do.
00;20;03;21 - 00;20;21;05
Annie
James knows I never stopped drinking coffee as I hold a coffee in my hand currently. I was so nervous and people's reactions were actually… far exceeded anything… I thought they were going to be like, Yeah, I really enjoyed it. I had people come to see it multiple times. I had an old couple bring me an Amish doll very creepy looking.
00;20;21;05 - 00;20;23;20
James
Yeah, that's kind of horrifying. A very sweet gesture.
00;20;23;21 - 00;20;25;19
Annie
It’s very... It's still at the theater.
James
Yeah, fair.
00;20;25;22 - 00;20;29;11
Annie
Yeah, I got to do it.
James
A prop for someone someday.
00;20;29;13 - 00;20;57;09
Annie
I had to go pick it up this weekend actually. I had people reach out to me in a way that… and a lot of my friends, which I mean I love all of my friends, but they're like, I didn't know you were that good. Again, backhanded compliment. But like, man, now that I say all this out loud, but it… it was… and I… somebody asked if I would do it again and somebody mentioned there's a festival that happens in New York and actually a manager in L.A. when we were doing Showcase mentioned this to me when she saw… it's actually kind of why I did it.
00;20;57;11 - 00;21;00;16
Annie
When did we do showcase in L.A.? Two years ago?
00;21;00;19 - 00;21;02;05
James
October 2021.
00;21;02;07 - 00;21;17;28
Annie
So I had dinner with a manager and she said, I noticed on your resume you have this one woman show. And I was like, Oh yeah, you know, I did it, blah, blah, blah. And she's like, okay, you need to do it again. And I was like, I don't know about that. And she said, There's a festival in New York for all these one people shows...
00;21;17;28 - 00;21;32;28
Annie
And then like, it's a contest. And the winner of it gets like some sort of produced on television special.
James
Wow.
Annie
And she was like, you should do it. And I was like, yeah, this woman's crazy. And then now somebody brought it up to me again actually. The guy who runs the theater was like, have you heard of this festival?
00;21;32;28 - 00;21;38;26
Annie
And I was like, I have. And then so… the baby thought is for me to do it again.
00;21;38;28 - 00;21;51;04
James
Interesting. Yeah, I had not heard of this, but yeah, I mean, that feels like kind of… talking about how like, the momentum keeps moving. You do a thing, someone sees it, you get encouraged to do another thing and then it just builds on itself.
00;21;51;05 - 00;22;05;23
Annie
And you meet people… like the people that run the secret theater are wonderful. And they said if you ever, like, want to do a show here, let us know. So now I know of a space.
James
There ya go.
Annie
And, the other company that shares the space with the theater company is a really cool company that's doing like a bunch of shows this next season…
00;22;05;23 - 00;22;19;22
Annie
And they sent me their invite audition… or they're like, do you want to assistant direct? A sister direct? Whatever… are like my wonderful friends that are at Aracne Theater, which is a classical company. I'm hoping to direct Stupid fucking Bird for them this next year.
00;22;19;27 - 00;22;20;21
James
Wow, great play.
00;22;20;23 - 00;22;23;07
Annie
Wonderful play. I wouldn't do The Seagull, but Stupid Fucking Bird?
00;22;23;09 - 00;22;25;11
James
But, something about Aaron Posner? Yeah.
00;22;25;13 - 00;22;44;29
Annie
A little bit more my speed, the more people you meet. And I think the most cliché thing I ever told someone was like, somebody was like, how do you deal with theater people? I was like, I have gotten a lot of productions because I've just made friends with these people.
James
Yeah.
Annie
And that's something that was never talked about in the networking seminars we go to and the stuff they used to teach us at LAMDA.
00;22;44;29 - 00;22;58;16
Annie
Like if you're friends with someone and they do shows and stuff, they'll always remember you.
James
Yeah.
Annie
And that's like, Whoa, what a concept. Besides, like, networking, Like I'd be a great whatever.
James
Yeah.
Annie
I'm friends with some of these people and they're like, hey, do you want to do this production? I'm like, yeah, I do.
00;22;58;18 - 00;23;01;07
James
Yeah. There's no connection like being in a show with someone ‘cause it’s…
00;23;01;07 - 00;23;13;24
Annie
Being a genuine fucking friend to people. It's, you know, if the whole industry worked like that, that would be a lot different. But one day, I mean, we know is like we're friends and all the LAMDA people are friends and it’s the same ordeal.
00;23;13;24 - 00;23;19;21
James
Totally. Yeah. I mean, that was the whole idea behind MAD Company is… we like each other, we want to do shows. Bada bing bada boom.
00;23;19;24 - 00;23;30;08
Annie
Yeah, exactly. And you guys always run through my head when I'm doing productions. Or if people ask me for things, you guys are always the first people I think of.
James
Aww.
Annie
Aww.
00;23;30;10 - 00;23;52;20
James
So let's pivot a little bit. You mentioned your directing sort of way in and you are a director who has been working quite a lot in New York. First of all, how do you balance performing and directing? Is there… do you have to think about focusing on one or the other for a particular point? Do you just take whatever project comes?
00;23;52;20 - 00;24;06;09
James
How do you how do you split your time? How do you split your energy? And I'll leave the question at that. How, how do you deal with sort of these two distinct but not completely separate interests and personas that you have?
00;24;06;11 - 00;24;26;12
Annie
My answer is really lame because I… when I'm a director, I will only think with the director's brain. When I'm an actor, I will only think with an actor's brain. I kind of turn off my director brain when I'm in rehearsals. Even if something… even if a director does something that there might be a split second… I'm like, wow, I would do that so differently as a director.
00;24;26;14 - 00;24;52;16
Annie
But I think I understand my intention when I walk into a rehearsal room very clearly that I just don't even tap into the other side.
James
Sure.
Annie
I love directing. I... I, actually at LAMDA, I was up for I was up for both programs, I was up for directing and I was up for acting.
James
Right.
Annie
And acting was picked. And I, I think I chose acting because I, I wanted to learn more about it.
00;24;52;16 - 00;25;13;10
Annie
Directing, I wanted more experience…
James
Sure.
Annie
Before I started to learn about it. And I've been thinking about directing in schools. But I, I love directing and I yeah, I have done a lot in New York. You're right. I did. I guess I didn't really think about that. And I'm going to be directing a one…one act in a couple of months. I think… I like directing.
00;25;13;10 - 00;25;31;13
Annie
I miss it. I haven't directed in a while. Yeah, I… directing makes the most sense in my brain. Sometimes Acting doesn't make a lot of sense in my brain.
James
Sure.
Annie
Especially like contemporary acting work makes a lot of sense to me. But a lot of times something classical doesn't make sense from an actor perspective, but a director perspective, it does.
00;25;31;16 - 00;25;37;26
Annie
I've been directing since I was like, little… I used to in grade school. I used to direct the Christmas pageant plays.
00;25;37;28 - 00;25;38;13
James
Oh, no way.
00;25;38;13 - 00;25;48;05
Annie
Yeah, I would do the whole Mary Joseph thing. I would cast it and I would stage it. Yeah, I'm sure.
James
That’s adorable.
Annie
Yeah, I'm sure I was a nightmare.
00;25;48;11 - 00;25;49;25
James
Yeah, well, I'm sure.
00;25;49;28 - 00;26;08;19
Annie
But I, then I. Yeah, I really like it in my day to day life, I'm a trainer. I think there's something about this idea of, like, teaching isn't the right word, but teaching and leading in a sense of something that I really like to do, like the arts or fitness or something. It makes a lot of sense to me and I know how to...
00;26;08;25 - 00;26;24;14
Annie
I like communicating with someone. I like talking to actors, and every actor works in a very different process, which as an actor is very frustrating when you're working with someone that doesn't have the same process, but as a director, it's really encouraging and very challenging in a good way because then you have to learn, how do I talk to this person?
00;26;24;21 - 00;26;32;26
Annie
How do I relate this? And then I started doing if this was a movie what would be happening? And that was the most universal question that people understood when I directed. And then we.
00;26;32;27 - 00;26;33;23
James
Everyone knows what that means. Right.
00;26;33;23 - 00;26;49;21
Annie
Everyone has seen a movie or they've seen an animated movie or something that we... We could start a conversation and get them to their best spot to perform as opposed to me just like barking commands.
James
Yeah.
Annie
And once I figured out it was like a little puzzle. I really like puzzles. So it made a lot of… it was really fun for me and it made a lot of sense.
00;26;49;21 - 00;27;02;07
James
Very cool. So the most recent thing I've seen that you directed was our mutual friend Anais’ one woman show, Six Stages of Breakup, which correct me if I'm wrong, it premiered at the Edinburgh Fringe.
00;27;02;08 - 00;27;04;01
Annie
It premiered in the Camden Fringe in London.
00;27;04;03 - 00;27;06;21
James
The Camden Fringe and then moved to Edinburgh?
00;27;06;21 - 00;27;19;15
Annie
It went from Camden to Edinburgh to the Pen Theater in London to the Pen Theater in London again. Here in New York. And then it'll be at another theater in London in May.
James
Right.
Annie
Yeah.
00;27;19;17 - 00;27;41;29
James
Yeah. So it's been, it's been traveling around and it's… it's very good, both because of Anais and because of what you've done with it. What was that process like working… So, Anais, For those who don't know, went to LAMDA with us as well. So what was the process like working with someone who you know super well? You two lived together for a year to create her show?
00;27;42;05 - 00;27;46;05
James
Also put your stamp on it and then see it move to all these different places?
00;27;46;07 - 00;28;03;27
Annie
What was that like? It was a lot of fun. The show has gone through five drafts. The ending was slightly different each time and we had theaters give us feedback about… we like your show, but the ending needs to be like this if you want it produced to etc. etc..
James
Interesting.
Annie
Which is interesting. It was for the better.
00;28;04;00 - 00;28;30;07
Annie
There was a theater in London that gave us a suggestion that completely changed the tone of the play and it needed to come from the theater, I think at that point because I could give suggestions, but because it's such an intimate piece of bits of her story and bits of my story of just relationships in general, to have someone objective give us an out… a perspective from like a third party audience was actually really helpful and it changed the show in a really good way.
00;28;30;07 - 00;28;58;25
Annie
Yeah, it was good with a lot, a lot of collaboration.
James
Yeah.
Annie
It was just Anais’s show for a while and then we found ways to like… I added a couple stories and lines and of my own personal just relationship experience in there, which made it part of mine. And then the way we directed it, I'm really big on if someone is doing a one person show and they speak as somebody else to change locations, to have characters live in different spots, etc., which is what I did with Amish Project.
James
Yeah.
00;28;58;27 - 00;29;19;03
Annie
And once we added that for her, that made more sense then it was a big trust thing of trusting me with this baby of hers.
James
Yeah.
Annie
And yeah, it was very collaborative and every time it's something new or I tell her to do something ridiculous and she'll question it for a second, and then when she does it, I then she's like, What if we do bits?
00;29;19;06 - 00;29;36;19
Annie
So it's things like that where the other shows I've directed aren't as collaborative per se, but this because it's more a… like you said, it's a, it's a friendship, it's a bond. And also the show is constantly being rewritten. There's constantly things being added. So yeah, that was, that was a different process in the rest of my directing, I'd say.
00;29;36;23 - 00;29;43;02
James
Absolutely, yeah. I mean, I can imagine working with the performer who's also the writer who can change things sort of at will is sort of…
00;29;43;07 - 00;29;52;14
Annie
It's tricky. It's tricky to work with an actor who's also writing the show because they're… two of their brains are on. And if one part of their brain is unhappy, the other one will also be unhappy.
00;29;52;17 - 00;29;53;14
James
That's really interesting.
00;29;53;14 - 00;30;03;11
Annie
You know what I mean?
James
Yeah.
Annie
If someone takes… swipe… like why would you change this as a writer, then the actors like, Well, I don't want to change this. It's something like that. So it's, it, it's a tricky dance.
00;30;03;14 - 00;30;10;03
James
Interesting. I assume this is the only one one person show that you have directed.
Annie
No.
James
No? What was the other one?
00;30;10;09 - 00;30;12;21
Annie
The one man Christmas Carol.
00;30;12;23 - 00;30;15;04
James
Okay. What is this? A one man show…
00;30;15;05 - 00;30;16;13
Annie
Well, Charles Dickens wrote it.
00;30;16;16 - 00;30;17;05
James
Yeah, that. Wow.
00;30;17;06 - 00;30;22;25
Annie
It was. It's last year. It's actually happening again this year.
Annie
Oh. That's what I'm directing right now.
00;30;22;27 - 00;30;24;07
James
She forgets about her project.
00;30;24;08 - 00;30;48;06
Annie
I do. I… so last year at the ATA Theater - the American Theater for Actors, which is on 54th. Sean Coffey, who is a wonderful, wonderful Muppet of a person. He knows this. I've called him that. He adapted A Christmas Carol for one man. It's been done on Broadway by what's his name, Sir Pat… Sir Patrick Stewart and all those kind of people.
James
Okay.
00;30;48;08 - 00;31;03;07
Annie
But he adapted his own way and asked me and my really good friend Xenia, who is the head of Aracne theater company, who I met her… we became friends and now we do what basically all of our projects together, either my projects, I bring her on or she brings me on for hers. And he asked us to direct it.
00;31;03;07 - 00;31;32;09
Annie
And so she handled a lot of story and fluidity, and I handled his performance like as a movement and voice and stuff.
James
Okay. Sure.
Annie
We tag teamed. That was, that was 55 characters that he did. And this poor man we destroyed him. We… it was a boot camp. It was actors boot camp. It was so much fun. Everybody, I got really good reception for that show and now it's being…another theater company saw the show and asked us to do it for them.
00;31;32;09 - 00;31;40;10
Annie
So we're doing it for Red Monkey Theater Company. And the cool part is this show is in a Victorian mansion in the Bronx.
00;31;40;13 - 00;31;41;02
James
Whoa. Okay
00;31;41;02 - 00;31;58;28
Annie
So you go from a couple of different rooms to do like the story. It's immersive. It's, it's actually very specific. It fits very well with a Christmas Carol. Like one room is the Cratchit’s house and one room is his counting office. So then, like the room where there's all the ghosts that come in and it's… A - the place is haunted.
00;31;58;28 - 00;32;18;16
Annie
I walked in and I said, this place is haunted. And the people that run the theater company go, Yeah, we've heard that before, but I love a good ghost. So yeah, that so I, I'm actually, for whatever reason, one people shows are becoming my thing. So if you are listening and if you have a one person show you'd like to be directed, I'm very familiar with that at this point.
00;32;18;17 - 00;32;19;09
Annie
It's really fun.
00;32;19;15 - 00;32;21;08
James
anniekefalas.com
00;32;21;10 - 00;32;22;07
Annie
anniekefalas.com
00;32;22;10 - 00;32;40;16
James
Okay, Well, so that… that leads me to my next question kind of nicely. So you have done multiple one person shows. You've also directed ensemble pieces. What are some of the differences between directing a full show, multiple characters that a single person plays and directing a show with multiple cast members.
00;32;40;23 - 00;33;02;09
Annie
Multiple cast members… If you're doing a scene with someone and you're directing it, you are working with two sets of reactions, two sets of perspectives, two sets of opinions, two sets of eyes, ears, arms, whatever. For a one person show, you're working with one perspective that needs to be split into two. And for instance, let's take six stages of a breakup.
00;33;02;11 - 00;33;30;25
Annie
The second character in that show is the Man. Jamie. He… he does speak. She does speak as him, but he's not… he's the second character and he's not really in it. But she needed to create his, his perspective, his reactions, his story. So clearly, the audience knew the character. Same with Amish project. If I didn't create all seven people very distinctly, it would just be me, as me telling you a story versus you being in the story with me.
00;33;30;25 - 00;33;56;02
Annie
And to an ensemble of actors, you already have your perspectives there. Now it's about…okay… blending everyone else's interactions as opposed to… here's one person split into different perspectives and make them interact. I would actually say it's more work for multiple ensemble members because then you don't you don't get to create from scratch the other perspective.
James
Right.
Annie
It's already there.
00;33;56;02 - 00;34;05;17
Annie
You… you have molded clay and it's your job is take a little bit of water and mold it versus one person is like here's a giant thing of clay, Split it, split it up and make it what you need to.
00;34;05;17 - 00;34;09;23
James
Interesting. Do you have a preference for working with one or the other? With...
00;34;09;28 - 00;34;16;11
Annie
I love doing ensemble…
James
Sure.
Annie
I had a really great time directing Enrique's piece.
00;34;16;13 - 00;34;17;08
James
Something far away.
00;34;17;09 - 00;34;37;15
Annie
Oh my God. A - I had really good actors. Kelly is a friend of mine and I'm I got I knew she'd be great for that part. And then Alessandra, who is a wonderful actor, came into auditions and was absolutely hilarious. They were really fun because they… I gave them a lot of homework because the idea of the show is that you can't… you can't look at each other and you can't see anything.
00;34;37;21 - 00;34;56;02
Annie
So I asked them on day one to come in with basically a design of their apartments that they're in basically a sketch of who they're talking to, what they're wearing, and what they had done that day and the day before. And then once they gave me their answers, they were really timid at first. And once we got into it, it was like playing make believe.
00;34;56;04 - 00;35;13;13
Annie
And then once they had did like… done that, we went, okay, cool, now we're going to do it. And then we work from there because everyone's talking to someone, even if it's like the whole idea, you're looking out into the distance. I'm like, No, you are each talking to a version of death. Is death a police officer? Is death a friend? Is death a cat? Kelly made death a cat.
00;35;13;13 - 00;35;14;11
00;35;14;13 - 00;35;16;20
James
Of course, death’s always cats.
00;35;16;20 - 00;35;18;03
Annie
Death is cats.
00;35;18;05 - 00;35;39;00
James
That's super. And so, for for context, for our listeners, something far away was a play that a very wonderful man named Enrique approached MAD Company about helping him produce. Could be he had been accepted into a play festival in Williamsburg and we matched him and Annie up, who collaborated on it. And it was a really nice… it was, what, like a 25 minute…
00;35;39;06 - 00;35;39;28
Annie
It was great.
00;35;39;29 - 00;35;41;00
James
30 minutes?
Annie
Yeah, about 25 minutes.
00;35;41;00 - 00;35;44;04
Annie
Actually. He gave me another piece he wants to work with me on.
00;35;44;05 - 00;35;44;22
James
Oh, amazing.
00;35;44;22 - 00;35;51;05
Annie
Yeah, which is cool. After Amish project. He came to see Amish project. And he went, you act as well. And I went, Yes, I do. And he sent me the script.
00;35;51;05 - 00;36;06;22
James
Shocking. Yeah. So that was a really interesting process because I, for me, I was I, you know, basically put the two of you in touch and that was kind of it. And then I went, saw the play, I read the script, and then I went and saw your production. Oh, yeah.
00;36;06;22 - 00;36;08;24
Annie
What'd you think of it? I think we talked about it.
00;36;08;26 - 00;36;21;24
James
Oh, we didn't talk about it? Let’s do it live. The first time. I thought it was really interesting. Yeah, the, the play festival in which it was performing was a very eccentric affair.
00;36;21;24 - 00;36;23;16
Annie
Did you see the target show?
00;36;23;18 - 00;36;50;13
James
I don't know if I saw the target show.
Annie
I think you would know if you saw the target show.
James
I might have. Okay. I don't think I saw the target show. So something far away was easily the closest to like a traditional theater piece in the show or in this… in this festival. In this night that I saw, which for me was refreshing because that's I like my theater somewhat traditional.
00;36;50;16 - 00;37;06;18
James
I yeah, I thought it was really interesting and it's a comp… it's a difficult thing to do. Though there are three characters on stage standing in their sort of their spots, speaking out to the audience, and they're kind of loosely connected stories about like…
00;37;06;21 - 00;37;08;25
Annie
They do, they do talk to each other. The, um.
00;37;08;28 - 00;37;10;04
James
Oh, they talk direct? Okay I forgot that.
00;37;10;07 - 00;37;25;28
Annie
The Masseuse and the creepy dad do interact a lot, but they just and actually we staged it that he only… only one character looks at the other at a very specific line. It was like, I have never listened to anything you ever said. And then he's the only… he turns his head.
00;37;26;00 - 00;37;27;16
James
Oh, that's right. Because that's right.
00;37;27;22 - 00;37;34;29
Annie
It's the only moment of acknowledgment they get for each other. That was on purpose and that was fun. When I watched it, some of the audience went, Oh.
00;37;35;01 - 00;37;57;00
James
Yeah, I actually… I really remember that. Mostly because it's something about the space in the theater and how everything is sort of these parallel lines running out and after, whatever, 20 minutes, that's just the world we inhabit. Then all of a sudden rules come around or something happens to break the rules and we're suddenly in three dimensions and it's a really shattering moment.
00;37;57;02 - 00;38;17;20
James
But yeah, I really enjoyed the show. I thought it was…
Annie
Yay.
James
I thought it was good. It felt… it felt strongly like, like a workshop piece. There was, there was lots of work to be done on the script, on the… on the acting. You know, there was always more to be done. But I, I thought it was a really strong starting point.
00;38;17;23 - 00;38;20;06
James
Do you know if he’s… is he planning on doing it again?
00;38;20;07 - 00;38;27;20
Annie
I actually don't know. He has a different piece.
James
Yeah.
Annie
That he sent me… that I need to read, but I don't know. Actually, I need to talk to him about that. Okay, I’ll reach out.
00;38;27;20 - 00;38;42;03
James
Wow. Very cool. So, acting, directing, personal trainer, living it up here in the big city. What…
Annie
I’m really trying…
James
What else do our listeners need to know about Annie Kefalas?
00;38;42;05 - 00;38;47;01
Annie
Oh, God. What do you need to know about me?
00;38;47;04 - 00;38;49;28
James
Or nothing if you don't want them to know anything else about you?
00;38;50;01 - 00;38;52;02
Annie
I like to hula hoop.
00;38;52;05 - 00;39;09;18
James
Oh, yes. So, wait, looking at your resumé here.
Annie
Oh, God.
James
I mean, so a lot of acting critics, professional theater, professional theater, educational training, training, training skills down here at the end, we have others: hula hooping, sheep noises.
00;39;09;21 - 00;39;11;18
Annie
Uh huh.
00;39;11;20 - 00;39;18;06
James
Which, okay. Sort of a personal trainer next item is not fluent but can cuss you out in Greek.
00;39;18;10 - 00;39;21;04
Annie
I actually had an agent told me to put that on my resume.
00;39;21;05 - 00;39;23;14
James
Interesting. A sample right now, please.
00;39;23;15 - 00;39;24;12
Annie
Scusi.
00;39;24;14 - 00;39;25;12
James
But I don't know what that means.
00;39;25;14 - 00;39;26;26
Annie
Shut up and die.
00;39;26;29 - 00;39;29;00
James
Really one word means shut up and die?
00;39;29;00 - 00;39;30;12
Annie
Greeks are lazy.
00;39;30;14 - 00;39;34;13
James
Okay so cussing out in Greek. Pole dancing…
00;39;34;15 - 00;39;37;01
Annie
Oh, I do, do a lot of pole dancing.
00;39;37;04 - 00;39;41;11
James
Excellent. Aerial hoop and aerial silks.
00;39;41;11 - 00;39;44;01
Annie
I do that as well.
00;39;44;03 - 00;39;51;15
James
Eclectic and. And very. I don't. I'm sure there is not another resumé that has these items on them.
00;39;51;18 - 00;40;03;28
Annie
I mean I can… I've now upgraded now, now when I pole dance I pole dance with eight inch heels and I guess I could do that and make sheep noises at the same time. And cuss you out in Greek.
00;40;04;00 - 00;40;04;16
James
Oh, my God.
00;40;04;21 - 00;40;06;07
Annie
I could do everything together.
00;40;06;07 - 00;40;22;17
James
Can we get a sample of sheep noises?
Annie
No.
James
Okay. Yeah, that's fair.
Annie
No, no.
James
Fair enough Wonderful. Well, Annie, it has been a wonderful little pleasure speaking with you here. And any. Any words of wisdom for our listeners.
00;40;22;19 - 00;40;24;11
Annie
Words of wisdom…
00;40;24;11 - 00;40;25;14
James
Fond farewell?
00;40;25;17 - 00;40;56;06
Annie
Oh, my. If you're an artist, I challenge you to not take yourself too seriously and not chase dollar signs when it comes to projects, because you will probably miss out on a lot of potential connections that will lead you to dollar signs in the future. It's very cryptic, but I've taken a couple of jobs and did not pay and have gotten me in agent interviews and in rooms I probably wouldn't have gone in the first place.
00;40;56;08 - 00;40;58;06
Annie
That would be my cryptic wisdom.
00;40;58;08 - 00;41;06;13
James
Love it. Make those sheep noises people. Do the weird art.
Annie
Sheep Noise
James
Oh, there it is. Beautiful. And with that bombshell.
00;41;06;13 - 00;41;07;24
Annie
And with that.
00;41;07;26 - 00;41;17;26
James
Thank you so much for listening. This has been one Hale of a conversation. My name is James Hale. I was here with Annie Kefalas. I hope you have a wonderful rest of your day y’all. Bye bye.
00;41;36;14 - 00;41;43;24
Maddi
Thanks for listening. To learn more about any of the creatives who spoke in this episode, check out their social media links in the episode description.