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Lighting is the subtle shift. That spark of brilliance. The element that transforms a space from ordinary to extraordinary.
The Reveal is where lighting professionals, residential experts, and designers come together to explore the art and business of outdoor design. From the intricacies of running a design company to the transformative power of lighting itself, this channel gives you the insight, inspiration, and tools to bring every project to life.
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Episode Transcript
This has been generated by AI and optimized by a human.
Andy Schwindler (00:00:09):
Welcome everyone. Back to the reveal, Michelle and Andy Schwindler. We're here today to talk to you about lighting and lighting psychology, why it matters. Michelle had the opportunity to meet with Amy of Lafayette Custom Interiors, and we're just going to talk about some of the things that she learned from that conversation. We're going to share that conversation with you today, and we hope that you come away with as much as we did.
Michelle Schwindler (00:00:37):
Yeah, and I think that we're also going to hit and talk about the fact that when you are involved in a project, whether it's a new home build or a customer renovation, there are so many people involved in that process. So it is key to bring the right people in at the right time and make sure everyone is communicating so that that final product is cohesive and it speaks to each other.
Andy Schwindler (00:01:02):
Yeah. So what I hear you saying is that, and we feel this a lot, is we are brought into the project after all the decisions have been made. And it was funny because listening to you and Amy talk, it was consistent that if we can just get in sooner, we get to have more influence on the outcome. And let's just put it out there. We're all in it for the outcomes.
Michelle Schwindler (00:01:26):
Yeah. And it's something I've been thinking about a lot lately. Obviously, we always want to figure out ways to better serve our clients and to have better end products. And to me, it's kind of wild. Obviously, lighting gets installed last. We know that we don't come in until after the landscaping, and that's when we install the actual fixtures, but that is not when lighting starts to be considered or when lighting is designed. But it's the same way with the interiors and the cabinetry and the window selection. Obviously, those are installed. Those are one of the last things that are installed in a home when it's being built, but it can't be one of the last things considered or else nothing works. And it actually is the same with lighting. We see it, we walk into a space and it just doesn't feel right or it feels flatter.
(00:02:13):
It's not communicating with what's happening in the interior. And it's clearly a situation where communication wasn't established early enough.
Andy Schwindler (00:02:22):
Yeah. Well, and again, me not being part of that conversation, I have to kind of translate what it is that you're saying. And I think that what I'm hearing is we can come in after the fact. We can retrofit lighting, and we do that a lot. But how much better could it be if it's thoughtful? If we're coming in early, we're not letting the electrician per se put all the can lights in the soffits or oversized chandeliers in the entryway because we need one light to light all the things. We could talk about those things. What do we need? And then what is going to make us happy, right? Is happy the right word?
Michelle Schwindler (00:03:11):
Maybe. I think what you're saying is what's going to make our portion of the project shine as brightly as it should?
Andy Schwindler (00:03:19):
Well, I think happy is the end result. So when I say make people happy, I mean, are you going to be happy with the end result? Have you thought about all the things? And I'm sure you have. As the homeowner, the builder, the architect, I'm sure you thought of all the things, but we add a layer of impact that I think is so understated. Can you agree with that?
Michelle Schwindler (00:03:44):
Absolutely. And like you said, we do our fair share of retrofitting, especially when it comes to homes that are already existing and a client calls us and they want to add lighting to their home. Of course, we can- Because I can get light anywhere. Absolutely. But I think what's heartbreaking to us is when we see these beautiful custom homes being built and we come in way after everything's been set and settled and we see a space and it's a little heartbreaking when we're like, wow, if we could have only used this sort of light in this space, it would be perfect. Instead, I'll use this light and it's going to be great. But we take all these considerations into play in these custom home when it comes to the finishes, the cabinetry, the countertops, the fabrics we use inside the living room and the drapes we put on the windows.
(00:04:39):
But for some reason, we're not taking this into consideration with one of the biggest finishing touches, which is the lighting.
Andy Schwindler (00:04:46):
Yeah. I 100% agree. Intention is what I'm hearing. It needs to be more intentional because it does play such a huge role. And I think that's what Amy covers a lot. It's funny how the inside and the outside coexist the way they do, but thought of so separately. So I can't wait to kind of dig in to her approach. What are some things that stood out about the conversation that you guys had?
Michelle Schwindler (00:05:15):
Well, I mean, we have a very similar design approach and we have a very similar client journey in which she spends a couple of hours with her clients getting to know what their intentions are, objectives, priorities. Everyone's different. And then from there, it goes on into a design phase and she works alongside the builder to make sure that at certain points things are being considered and communicated so that possibilities aren't being limited
Andy Schwindler (00:05:44):
Through
Michelle Schwindler (00:05:44):
The process. And I think that what I wanted to ask you is since it does make such a huge impact, us being a part of the schematic portion of the design process, what is it that you do as a designer when you walk onto a job site, the home hasn't been built, you do have some idea of what's happening, but you're just looking at the property. What are some things that you're able to gather that's going to help you get to step two?
Andy Schwindler (00:06:15):
Got it. So first things, it doesn't really matter which property I show up on. I'm looking for a focal point. A lot of times that's going to be the entryway to the home. And so I want to know where it's positioned because we've got different things that we take into consideration, sunset, sunrise, things along those lines. I'm looking at the trees. If there's no home there, I'm looking at the trees, I'm looking at the plans. Do we have a pool in the back? What are these focal points that need to create the hierarchy of light? Because that's where we want to guide the eye. We want to guide people through the journey. That's my job. My job is to make sure people know what the journey is supposed to be like. And I guide that with light.
Michelle Schwindler (00:07:02):
And I would assume too, you're thinking about entry into the property as well.
Andy Schwindler (00:07:07):
Absolutely.
Michelle Schwindler (00:07:08):
Views out the window.
Andy Schwindler (00:07:09):
That's right.
Michelle Schwindler (00:07:10):
What are they going to look at when they're sitting on their patio at night?
Andy Schwindler (00:07:13):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (00:07:13):
And there are a lot of recommendations I think that the lighting designer can bring to the table
Andy Schwindler (00:07:18):
When it
Michelle Schwindler (00:07:18):
Comes to that too.
Andy Schwindler (00:07:19):
Well, and what you just described as focal points, but the priority of them, like the perspective. And so we have all these unique perspectives. I feel like it's my job to prioritize those. That way it doesn't get too busy too fast. And we can do all that with light. Obviously safety, security, we want to concentrate on those functionality, but the good news is we can make that beautiful too.
Michelle Schwindler (00:07:44):
Right. And not only just the aesthetics, I think it's also important that we get in and we establish zones so that we have proper power over on this side of the home. That's right. Proper power over on this side of the home. We don't have too long of runs. And I know this is a lot of things that people don't think about, but this is exactly why I think us coming into the project earlier than later saves a lot of people, a lot of headaches. Honestly, it saves the homeowner money in the long run too. It does. Because it always costs less to do things the right way than to have to rethink things or retro.
Andy Schwindler (00:08:24):
Right. Well, and to your point, I think a lot of people think that lighting design is where I put the fixtures, but it's so much bigger than that. I'm designing an ecosystem of where your lights live and I'm designing the entire system not only to be outside in the weather and the conditions and the freeze thaw. I'm taking all those things into consideration when I'm building this out. So design is where the lights go, but how it performs and how it lives on your property is something that I don't know if it gets taken into consideration or not. Maybe that's just for me to worry about.
Michelle Schwindler (00:09:02):
Well, I do know that when I am working with my builders and my designers, one thing that they are pretty good at taking into consideration is pre-wiring. And that is something that they typically do understand like, let's have you come in, show me where you'd like your conduit run.
Andy Schwindler (00:09:17):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (00:09:18):
But I think we've got more work to do when it comes to shifting the mindset.
Andy Schwindler (00:09:22):
I agree. And just so we're clear about what our design process is, we've got a schematic phase, right? We've got the design concept phase, we've got construction documents and then construction administration. So we're not different than your landscape architect, your home architect. We're doing all those things and we make it really easy to bring us into the program. And it's one thing to be brought into the program, we also make it easy because we do all the things. So I wanted to get that across today. I know that Amy wanted to get that across too, because I think she's a huge part. Her position is a huge part of the success that you can have on the interior. And I'm just going to say it, lighting is the most impactful thing that we can do to create a scene, to change the scene, to change the feeling, the mood, all those things.
(00:10:20):
And I know you guys touched base on it and I love your perspective on the idea that lighting is meant to be thoughtful, but not the first thing you think of. Can you touch on that more?
Michelle Schwindler (00:10:35):
Well, I mean, I think a great lighting isn't something where one would walk into a space and say, "Wow, the light." You're actually noticing what the light was meant to draw the attention to, whether it's the focal point, whether it's the overall living space, whether it's the architecture, but you're rarely complimenting the light.
Andy Schwindler (00:10:52):
That's so true. It's so true now, you and I.
Michelle Schwindler (00:10:55):
We do.
Andy Schwindler (00:10:56):
We do.
Michelle Schwindler (00:10:57):
That's the first thing we see, but it's a feeling. When you walk into a space and there's good lighting, you're actually not noticing anything in particular besides how wonderful and great and harmonious- It
Andy Schwindler (00:11:08):
Makes you feel. ... the space
Michelle Schwindler (00:11:09):
Feels.
Andy Schwindler (00:11:10):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (00:11:10):
And that's the goal.
Andy Schwindler (00:11:11):
Well, you do notice bad lighting. I think people can notice bad lighting.
Michelle Schwindler (00:11:15):
I should have led with that.
Andy Schwindler (00:11:18):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (00:11:18):
Yeah.
Andy Schwindler (00:11:19):
Good deal.
Michelle Schwindler (00:11:20):
Yeah. And I really loved Amy's perspective too. So I'm glad she was able to join us. She's such a great asset to our community. She works with a lot of the high-end builders around here and she's a go- to for a lot of the residents. So
Andy Schwindler (00:11:33):
Excited
Michelle Schwindler (00:11:34):
To spend some time with her.
Andy Schwindler (00:11:35):
Well, I can't wait for everyone to hear what you and Amy had to say. So without further ado, let's break to the clip. Let's
Michelle Schwindler (00:11:43):
Do it. Well, hey, everybody. This is the reveal and I'm really excited to be here with Amy Smith-Phillips. She's with Lafayette Custom Interiors. They're located right downtown in Lafayette, Indiana. I'd love to hear a little more about your business, Lafayette Custom Interiors, Amy, and a little more about you too.
Amy Smith (00:12:02):
Yeah. So downtown in Lafayette, I started my business in 2018, so I went to Purdue and I studied interior design. I ended up while I was at Purdue working with a local interior designer. I interned with her during my junior year of college, and then that actually kind of turned into more than I probably ever could have imagined it to be. So kind of one thing led to another, and I ended up working with her part-time and then full-time. And after about seven years of that, I started my business as she was retiring. So right now, the business has evolved and changed here and there over the years. Currently, I offer design services for either people that are building or remodeling, that type of thing. I also offer furnishings and decor. Some of our projects are strictly just that. And then some of them are a little bit of both where maybe we start off designing a new home and we finish it with area rugs, window treatments, furniture, that type of thing.
Michelle Schwindler (00:13:03):
Okay. Well, when did it occur to you that interior design was your path? What sparked that interest?
Amy Smith (00:13:09):
I don't know that it was a time I can probably pinpoint. I think it was something that I always was interested in even as a kid and I always noticed things about spaces, that type of thing. I was always a creative person, but I was never somebody who was probably going to make it being a professional painter or something like that. And so I think what really, and still to this day interests me about design is it's definitely a creative business and there's a very creative side to it, but there's pretty distinct boundaries with it. It's a lot of just on a daily basis problem solving. So while my projects are very creative, there's still limitations or there's things that we're working around, whether that's a wall or a budget or a timeline or whatever that might be. So it allows me to be creative, but it's a little bit more structured, I guess, if that makes sense.
Michelle Schwindler (00:14:00):
Yeah, definitely. And I think sometimes too, when you're working with your client, you've got your own kind of creative theory or perspective, but then you also have to balance that with their vision too, right? Right.
Amy Smith (00:14:12):
Yeah, that is true. And because of that, I feel like every project is different and it's definitely guided by that. So yeah, it's not like it's up to me to just start from the blank canvas every time. It's like you're usually coming into it with either some parameters or a certain style they're working towards or something as a starting point.
Michelle Schwindler (00:14:34):
Gotcha. And do you feel like your design perspective has changed over time or have you stayed pretty steady in your style?
Amy Smith (00:14:41):
I'm sure it has. I'm sure it probably has over time here and there. I think overall my perspective, my projects are style-wise, I feel like they are all different. I feel like I'm working with clients that are really, really traditional homes. I have some that are very modern and everything in between. Personally, I feel like my personal style has probably evolved some, but at its core is probably the same. But I think my perspective on design has probably remained mostly the same. And I kind of look at that as the reason I think I'm able to work on projects of so many different styles is because at its core, I'm kind of coming into it trying to do the same thing. And I think my perspective on a space that is comfortable and works well for somebody is exactly that. It's a space that they feel comfortable in and that's different for everybody.
Michelle Schwindler (00:15:35):
Exactly.
Amy Smith (00:15:35):
And so trying to figure out what that is for this person, and then how do we apply that to this house or this situation?
Michelle Schwindler (00:15:44):
Right. Well, so talk to me a little bit about what your design process looks like from the moment you first meet a client, you're walking in their space. What's that look like when you first start working with someone and you're kind of trying to figure out what moves them and what motivates them?
Amy Smith (00:16:01):
Yeah. So our very first step when somebody reaches out is we schedule a time for, usually it's a brief phone call, sometimes it's in person to just help them understand exactly how we work, what that's going to look like as far as timeline and all of that to make sure it's a good fit. And then from there, we would schedule a time to meet at the house. I will go to the house and meet with those clients in person. And that meeting, honestly, can sometimes, depending on the size of the project, be a two-hour meeting where we're really getting in pretty detailed with what they like about the space, what they don't like, or if it's a new house, really getting into, okay, what do you like about your current house? What are we trying to change? And so from that meeting, I want to obviously gather the information that I need about the house itself to put a plan together, but it's also a chance for me to really understand the personalities of who I'm working with, the dynamic in that house, how they're interacting together, who's using the space, how they're using it, and really trying to understand how it could function for that person today, but then also maybe down the road.
(00:17:05):
Sometimes I have people that come to me and they say, "Look, we're only going to be here for five years." Whereas other times it's like, this is our forever home. And you have to think through how that changes over time to make sure that I'm not designing something that's relevant today and is really not going to work when the kids move out or something like that. So it's really a time for me to just understand. And then from there, once we are all kind of aligned on the scope of the project and what all of that looks like, I'll get to work. And we have a series of meetings. So I would say it's a very collaborative process, but the client's really not doing any of the heavy lifting. So it's up to me at that point to, if it's a construction-based project, I am going to all of my different sources to gather samples and bring them all to my studio.
(00:17:53):
And so when we're meeting to review drawings and finishes and fixtures, we're looking at everything together on one table. So they don't have to go to five places around town and look at cabinets at one place and tile at another and try to remember how that might look together. And then if it's a furnishing project, it's really similar, same kind of idea. And in that, I'm requesting feedback and we're making modifications in both situations as the project progresses. And then in the end, we present that final plan. Depending on the project, it looks really different. A lot of times it includes drawings and just visual aids that can help them to understand what the space is going to look like when it's complete, and of course, physical samples. And then from there, it's up to me to really execute. So especially on a furnishing project, while a client is heavily involved in those decisions and they have a really clear understanding of exactly what they're getting, that day the transformation occurs, they don't have to do anything.
(00:18:54):
So we're the ones doing all of the ordering, the receiving, the inspecting to make sure nothing's damaged. And then typically it's a one-day installation. We come with our team and remove anything that's leaving the space, bring all the new stuff in and set it up so that it's just ready to be used when they come home.
Michelle Schwindler (00:19:12):
Right. Well, that sounds a lot like our design process actually. It starts with a phone call. Is this a good fit? But really getting into someone's space and trying to figure out how they use that space and how they'd like to use it differently and what their life actually looks like. And sometimes it's hard to get people to articulate what it is. So what are some simple cues that you can pick up on without them really having to say it?
Amy Smith (00:19:38):
Yeah, a lot of mind reading.
Michelle Schwindler (00:19:40):
Yeah.
Amy Smith (00:19:40):
I think it's something that a lot of people honestly don't know how to articulate it, but also don't really know why they don't like the space or why it's not working. So for me, I'll always ask that question and sometimes there are some obvious things that come up where they're like, oh, we just hate that the refrigerator's here or whatever. But a lot of times it ends up being me trying to just understand what their life looks like, what their day-to-day looks like. And then from there, making some assumptions on like, "Oh, if you're coming home at whatever time, you might want the light switch here," or things like that. And so there's that piece of it. I think also just, I guess, trying to understand what types of spaces do they feel comfortable in. And so a lot of times the conversation heads that way where just I think through questions and just brainstorming, typically people will naturally come to me with something about another space that they've been in and they use it as a comparison or a way to explain something to me.
(00:20:46):
And I find that that can look like, oh, we were at so- and-so's house and did not like the microwave on the island or something. Or sometimes it's a positive association and it's like we loved either a previous home we were in had this. I have clients that typically if they've moved into a new home and it just doesn't feel right, I find that they spend a lot of time talking about where they came from and trying to figure out how they can make this space feel more like that. Or if a lot of times vacations come up where people have stayed somewhere on a trip and they're like, "We were in this rental house and we loved something about it. " And so I think for me, it's kind of like when I have people that have a hard time articulating, I usually come from the standpoint of like, okay, let's talk about spaces you've been in where it felt really good or it didn't.
(00:21:37):
And then on top of that, when we're in meetings and once we get a little bit further into the process and we're actually making selections, I have found that it's way easier for people to point to something and say, "Oh, I really like this. I don't like that. " And explain why from there. Because even when it comes down to style, if I have somebody tell me what they think their style is, that could mean one thing to you and something else to me.
Michelle Schwindler (00:22:03):
Right. Yeah, absolutely. And I know that you mostly specialize in redesigning someone's space for them, but what are some really small, little subtle things that people just don't think about that they could just do right away that changes how a space feels or how they move in their space?
Amy Smith (00:22:22):
I think layout is a big piece of that. For some reason, most people think if they paint a room, it's going to solve the problem and make it feel better. And sometimes that's true if the color is just wrong, but a lot of times paint doesn't really do as much, I think, as people expect it to a lot of the time. And so it's like if a space feels off, it's usually because of either the layout of the room or the lighting is really bad or just the pieces that you have in it maybe just aren't really serving the right purpose. And so I feel like there's never really just this one fix of like, "Oh, try this. " I think it's usually try moving the furniture around, whether it's in that space or taking something from another room and bringing it in or taking something from that room and bringing it out.
(00:23:12):
And I have had clients who will make subtle changes in that way and come to me and say like, "Oh wow, this made a really big difference." And it happens a lot if we're looking at furniture for a room where we're looking at a new layout and sometimes they have some of those components around the house, even if it's not the right piece, but they might have a chair, a ottoman, whatever, and can bring it in and set it up in a similar way that I'm proposing and live with it. And usually that's when it's like, oh, really that is the arrangement of this space that's causing most of the tension.
Michelle Schwindler (00:23:43):
Right. And I could see too, and we see this a lot with even outdoor furniture interrupting with traffic flows. If you regularly find yourself moving from this area to the other area, keeping that flow nice and open and visually airy is a big deal too. Yeah. So talking about lighting a little bit
Amy Smith (00:24:03):
In general, it's like having too much stuff for furniture or too little is usually when you end up in that zone of something's not working.
Michelle Schwindler (00:24:13):
Right, right. Well, and with lighting too, I'd love to hear your perspective on the inside, the interior lighting. Do you specify different interior lighting styles and moods or how do you help your clients with that?
Amy Smith (00:24:26):
Yeah, so that's obviously a big piece of a space, an interior or exterior. I think for me, as I mentioned, my projects fall into two buckets, I'll say. And so if it's a construction-based project, we definitely, for the most part, have a little bit more opportunity to bring in the right lighting. If we're remodeling a space and we're down to the studs, it's easy to add lights or remove lights if we need to. Or of course, in a new home, sky's the limit usually. But if we're working more on furnishing a space and I'm coming in and it's a home office or it's a living room or something like that, we kind of do have to work a little bit more with what's there. And so in that situation, I feel like it's, okay, sometimes there are no lights in the space, there's just nothing.
(00:25:15):
And then we're adding lamps and trying to figure that out. Sometimes, and a lot of times actually it's a lot of just overhead can lights. And while that is really good light to light the space just generally, if you're sitting in your family room at night and you have all of these overhead lights on, it can be kind of jarring to sit there and it's definitely not a calm, relaxing environment. So in that case, what I usually do is layer lighting. And so you obviously have that and you can turn it on if you need or want to, but if we can add a dimmer to it, that's always the best case scenario because then we, again, have a little bit more opportunity to play with that. And then of course, adding table lamps or floor lamps, things like that provides a little bit more opportunity to light either a task or just have a softer glow, I think.
(00:26:09):
And then in new construction, a similar approach where, yeah, I always try to have layers. So it's like if we can have that general overhead light on dimmers, that's the first step. And then from there, it's up to me to add in some of those more decorative fixtures that might be providing light to a specific task like over a kitchen island or over a dining table and being able to operate all of those independently under cabinet lighting and of course adding some lamps and things like that help visually as well.
Michelle Schwindler (00:26:36):
Yeah, that's the exact same way we approach the outside too. And I think that a lot of people look at lighting as just functional and they don't understand how it can really affect your mood and your environment. So the layer lighting is everything to us too. We kind of have this thing we say in the outdoor world that a lot of people, they use floodlights and we call that the one light to rule them all, right? But it can kind of make an area look flat and kind of overwhelming, right? Yeah. So being able to layer the light and kind of have a little bit of a foreground, midground background situation going on really gives you some depth and dimension and some just really interesting things to draw your eye around and really pay attention to the details.
Amy Smith (00:27:21):
Yeah, I agree. And I think because we're doing this all the time, you realize the importance of it, but I don't think a lot of people do. I mean, I think that it's never the first thing that comes up when I go to somebody's house. It's always, they're focused on it's the wrong rug or it's the wrong chair or the wrong fabric or the wrong paint, but nobody ever really thinks about that piece of it. And that can honestly make or break the space. And sometimes it's a simple fix that if we just fix that one component, everything else kind of does work a little better together. But I notice that even if I'm in certain stores or restaurants or things like that, I can immediately tell, I feel like when the lighting is off in a space and it usually ends up being somewhere that I'm like, I just don't like being in here.
(00:28:01):
And it's not because of that business or the people, it's more just because how I feel in the space. But I don't think it's as easy for everybody to just pick up on that.
Michelle Schwindler (00:28:12):
Yeah, we talk about that all the time, how lighting absolutely can affect someone's mood. And that's something I've been thinking about a lot lately. We talk about every winter, people get these winter blues, right? But is it really about the weather or does it say more about your space? Because we're kind of forced inside of our spaces more. And have we created an environment that makes us feel good? Are we just noticing it more this time of year because we're all cooped up inside?
Amy Smith (00:28:41):
I think both. Yeah, I think we're inside and then you're realizing you don't really like being inside, but you just don't like being inside that room probably is what it is, I think.
Michelle Schwindler (00:28:53):
Yeah. And we're all trying to, we all say we just need to get away. We go on vacations. And the thing I notice about these resorts, they've got it down to a science. They've got the lighting down, they've got the textures down, they've got the feel, the smells, all of it that makes us feel good in that space and makes us want to come back. So it just kind of makes me feel like, why aren't people putting this much emphasis on their everyday environment? Just curating that space that just feeds them.
Amy Smith (00:29:23):
Yeah. And I think for me, that was even more apparent during COVID because it was like for the first time in a very long time, people were home all the time. And so everybody was realizing projects that they had put on the back burner or maybe even projects they didn't even know needed to be addressed, all of a sudden it was top of mind. And I think since then, obviously things have changed and that still is more of a priority I think that maybe it was, but yeah, we are back to traveling. But then, I mean, the amount of people that I will have say to me, "I just want to I come into this bedroom at the end of the day and feel like I'm at a really nice hotel. I know what they mean when they say that, but then part of me is like, it's kind of sad that you want to feel like you're not home because the way I look at it is I want to be somewhere and be like, oh, I just want to be home in my own bed.
(00:30:16):
And so it's like it should be the opposite. You should want to be here as much, if not more than somewhere else.
Michelle Schwindler (00:30:21):
Right. Well, what are some things you feel like people are looking for when they say, "I wish this was more like that hotel." How do they make that little staycation or boutique feeling at home? What is it that they're missing they don't know?
Amy Smith (00:30:34):
I think just a lot of times it's cohesion, especially using the bedroom specifically, that seems to be the last space that people prioritize when they are furnishing a home for whatever reason. And I'm sure it's because you're just sleeping
Michelle Schwindler (00:30:48):
In there. No one's looking in the bedroom, right? No one's
Amy Smith (00:30:49):
In there. Right. And so it feels like it's easier to justify a living room or a basement or something where a lot of people can benefit from that. So with that, it ends up being a hodgepodge. It's always just this accumulation of stuff that was from other rooms, previous homes. You don't really have a spot for it. We'll stick it there. And then over time, that just makes it feel really unorganized and it has no relevance.
Michelle Schwindler (00:31:15):
Not a lot of intention behind it.
Amy Smith (00:31:16):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (00:31:16):
Right.
Amy Smith (00:31:17):
And so I think it's not really comfortable to be in there. It's probably frustrating and it feels messy. And then people just don't really know where to start with it. I think it's like, okay, what should leave? What should stay? And so I think we recently completed a bedroom project that we honestly didn't end up purchasing a lot of new furniture, but the things we did do, we had new window treatments. It was more decor. It was all new bedding. It was new lamps, wall decor, things like that. And all of those things together, yeah, it definitely made the space feel more intentional. And it was layering of textures. I feel like that's a big piece of it. I mean, you rarely go to a hotel where it's really bold in any way. A lot of times it just feels very luxurious because it's quality textiles and it's layering those textures in a way that makes sense.
(00:32:07):
And the scale of things feels appropriate, that type of thing. So I think in this particular project, we had window treatments, we did some larger table lamps. The ones they did have just didn't really feel proportional. Wall decor made a huge difference layering the bedding, so it wasn't just a comforter and a couple pillows. I mean, we had multiple layers of blankets, and that was the way to introduce, again, some more color and texture pillows and not creating something that was in any way a chore to make the bed every day, making it really simple for the homeowner, but making it so that when they come in at the end of the day and the bed's made up, it does feel like you're walking into a hotel.
Michelle Schwindler (00:32:48):
Do you have any recommendations on clutter? I think that that's something that in my home when I walk in and I see things cluttered and things everywhere, and I've got kids, so it's not that season of my life where I get to have a completely sterile home where it's just clean. How do you recommend people with families and small children can kind of keep things out of the way and still not make a huge chore of it?
Amy Smith (00:33:14):
Yeah, I mean, I think we all have it. And I think it's almost like sometimes I'll go places where there's nothing and it's like, well, that's almost worse in a different way, I think, because I'm like, you don't have anything out. That's not real either. So yeah, I think we all have it. I think it's just setting the house up in a way that makes it easy for things to have a spot, I guess. And even family rooms. Okay, the kids are going to have toys out and blankets and all that kind of stuff, but it's like if we can have baskets to easily just throw things in and you're not really seeing what's inside of it, but it looks pretty when it's on the shelf, that's a big thing we'll do. We just completed a family room furnishing project before the holidays and they have small children.
(00:33:56):
And so it was like the clients really wanted it to be a nice spot for them and a place for them to entertain. But at the same time, that is where their kids play and they don't want to discourage that, which I think is important. So we ended up doing some really pretty shelving units that had some open storage that the kids could just toss things in baskets and put it away. The furniture was all performance fabrics. So when something happened, it was going to be really easy to clean up. It wasn't going to be a big deal or people weren't going to be upset about it. I think that's a big piece of it too. And then just even as you walk in the front door, okay, or the garage door, is there a spot to drop keys or to neatly hang keys, a place to put shoes that makes sense, it feels organized, but it's easy to do.
(00:34:43):
And I think it's about just repeatable things that are easy to repeat in those steps as you're kind of coming and leaving at times of the day where it is busy, I guess. And then beyond that, we usually just refer a organizer because they have all the answers if it's anything more detailed.
Michelle Schwindler (00:35:01):
Like you said, having a spot where the things go, I think in my house sometimes it's like, okay, well, this is where the keys end up every time someone comes home. So there should just be a place for the keys to go in this exact spot. Exactly. As opposed to training the family against their habits, you just lean into it, right?
Amy Smith (00:35:16):
And that's exactly it. And I feel like it comes up a lot, again, in family rooms with remotes because it's like, okay, you have them, that is just part of it. So where are we keeping them? So let's make sure there is a table with a drawer and you can just kind of throw everything in there. Or a big one that comes up is tissue boxes. It's like, where do we put that? Same thing. It could be out if maybe it has a nice cover. Or again, can we just have a little cabinet somewhere or a drawer next to the sofa, things like that. I mean, a good place to store coasters, all of those things that can kind of accumulate and feel knickknacky, but really if they had a space that you could easily just throw them away when someone was coming over, it would just make it a lot easier.
Michelle Schwindler (00:35:56):
So that's what's happening in all those homes I go to and they just look so beautiful and clean. They've got spaces where they just throw everything before- They have
Amy Smith (00:36:03):
Drawers, yes.
Michelle Schwindler (00:36:03):
They arrive. Nice. So I've seen that you're doing some window shades and that sort of thing as well. What are you seeing as far as controls go when it comes to interior lighting and shading and all that? Because I know we've got our whole controls outside that we work with and I think they're all merging in a really fantastic way. I'd love to hear what you guys are doing.
Amy Smith (00:36:27):
We do sell window treatments. So we work with a local seamstress for draperies and soft treatments. And then I work with Hunter Douglas for all of our blinds and shades, shutters, that kind of thing. And we are, yes, seeing a lot of people that want things motorized. And sometimes that means it's integrated into a system within their home. Other times they might not have that. And that's typically what I've been finding lately. And we use, Hunter Douglas has a component that we add to the shades. It's called PowerView, and it can be controlled in a few different ways, different battery types depending on the situation. But typically it will have a remote, but most people do like to control it from a phone or an iPad. And the nice thing about it is you can set it to schedules. So if you want the shades to automatically come up at a certain time of day and close at another time, you can do that.
(00:37:18):
If you want to do that from Florida, you can do that. You don't have to be here to do it. And because every room is used differently, it can be something where they're on different schedules too, or you can just go in and do it yourself. So there's just so many options within all of that, I feel like. And that's kind of another area where it's usually a lengthy conversation to get to the bottom of what does this person need specifically in this space? Because it's not always the same room to room. If we're doing window treatments for a whole home, there might be some windows that they do need to have motorized, but then other ones, it's like, okay, there's really no reason why I can't get up and just go open this shade or close it. Or maybe it's one that will be just closed all of the time if it's in a bathroom or something like that too.
Michelle Schwindler (00:38:08):
We have the same thing. We have different clients. With our controls, we have controls that are wifi enabled. We have controls that are set up on the whole smart home system. We have some controls that are remote controlled. And it just depends on the client. Some clients are completely uncomfortable with the smart home controls, and they would rather just have a remote or a switch. And some clients love, love, love, love the smart home addition. Oh
Amy Smith (00:38:34):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (00:38:36):
Yeah. Yeah. What are you finding when it comes to new construction? What direction are most people going in?
Amy Smith (00:38:42):
It's honestly the same. I do know that there are some people who are just like, "Because it's a new home, let's make it so we can hardwire everything and just it's all motorized." So there's some of that going on. I would say for our clients, it seems like it's really still a mix of people aren't necessarily motorizing or adding motorization to every window. And even within that, it's like, okay, there's certain rooms that we want options of light filtering and room darkening. There's certain rooms where it's only going to need room darkening or only going to need light filtering. And so we kind of go room by room and then sometimes within that, even window by window, there might be windows in a great room that are really high up and out of reach and we would need power on those. But the lower ones, it's not as much of a priority.
(00:39:31):
And when we're looking at the whole budget, maybe that's a space to save. So I feel like there's a lot of, I guess, components to those decisions, especially when you're looking at a whole house if it's a new home.
Michelle Schwindler (00:39:41):
Well, talking about windows too, that makes me think of one of my favorite things about what we do. Every time I see a home, the first thing from the inside, the first thing I look at are the windows. And then what do we see outside of the windows? Is that something that you would pay attention to as an interior designer with your clients, what's happening outside?
Amy Smith (00:40:02):
I think while I feel window treatments can complete a space in many situations, there are times where maybe the view is better than the decorative window treatment and you hate to just cover that up. Especially, I find we have clients that are up at a lake house or something like that, more of a vacation home where they do have really nice views and you do need something for privacy, but it's like, okay, how can we get something on those windows to offer privacy or offer light control, but keep it really discreet and make this room about the view and not about the shades because we don't really need that decorative element. There are other times where it's the opposite and you might have a really big window and during the day it's a pretty view, but at night it's just like this big black square. And so it's like, how can we just diffuse that a little bit so that it's not so cold feeling when you come into the room?
Michelle Schwindler (00:40:56):
Right. Well, that's one of my favorite things I like to check out. When we're finished with a project, I like to go inside and I like to see what they're looking at outside that picture window in their living room and what they're looking at outside. I mean, even the kitchen window where you spend a lot of your time doing dishes or that sort of thing. So I love to see that and I love to see my clients sending us pictures of their view from the inside. It's just one of my favorites and not something I had initially thought about when I got into this line of work with Andy was how much it does affect the inside. I've just seen some of the prettiest pictures looking out someone's window with some of the work that we've created, right?
Amy Smith (00:41:35):
Oh, I'm sure. Yeah. Well, because I feel like to put so much time and resources really into your yard or your outdoor space and then only be able to enjoy it, but it's daylight. So I feel like what you guys do really gives people the chance to enjoy it inside, outside during the day, in the evening, really all times of the year too.
Michelle Schwindler (00:41:57):
Absolutely. And I think too with, I think the outdoor space and the outdoor living room has really grown a lot over the last 10 years or so, and it's kind of merging, right? It's like how do you bring the indoors out? It's kind of making the space one.
Amy Smith (00:42:15):
Oh, completely. Yeah. And we're seeing a lot too with outdoor fireplaces and in areas that are kind of semi-enclosed, especially given the weather I feel like we've been having in the past few years, it extends your living space because there's really only a couple months out of the year that you can't use that space at all. I mean, because by the time you get done with your heaters and your fireplace and all of that, even if it's a little chilly outside, you can still use it really into the late fall and part of the winter and early spring. So we are finding that a lot of people are spending a lot more time talking about those spaces. And for us, it's furniture. But then of course with you guys getting into how can we light these spaces to make it an area that we can continue to use throughout the year.
Michelle Schwindler (00:43:00):
Do you find yourself decorating the exterior space at all? Are people bringing you outside to the patio area and having you help them with that too?
Amy Smith (00:43:09):
Yeah. And it's a lot of ... I don't feel like we do a ton where it's just a table. It's more kind of like what you're suggested, what you're mentioning. It's like the outdoor living room kind of, or a combination where it's like they have an outdoor kitchen, we're going to need some seating here, but then we need sofa, chairs, things like that to warm it up in the other areas of that patio or that deck too.
Michelle Schwindler (00:43:31):
Right, absolutely. Yeah. So do you find yourself doing mostly residential projects? Have you been brought into any commercial type projects?
Amy Smith (00:43:42):
We do. I do almost all residential projects. So I will say we have a few here and there. I would say maybe one a year where it's a small office or I would call a light commercial project. Typically, it's something where maybe we've worked with the client on a home and now we're helping them with their workplace, that type of thing. But for the most part, yeah, almost all of our projects at this point are residential.
Michelle Schwindler (00:44:06):
So we're going to talk a little bit more about lighting, Amy. So I wanted to ask you, how have you seen the exterior lighting portion of homes grow over the last handful of years? Are you seeing more homeowners put more emphasis into that?
Amy Smith (00:44:23):
Yes, I do think we are seeing people put more of an emphasis on the exterior, especially lighting. I think something that comes up a lot in conversations with my clients, especially if it's a new home or a large scale remodel. So sometimes I'll be working with clients that have decided we're going to stay in this home and just make it exactly what we want. And so it's essentially building a new house. A big part of that conversation is how do we make the exterior and the interior work together? It's a weird feeling, and I've definitely been in houses where this is the case where it looks one lay on the outside and then you walk inside and I'm like, that's never what I would've expected this to be like. And so it's like somebody's gone in and made these improvements at some point in time, but it's a totally different style.
(00:45:06):
And so I think that definitely is a big part of the conversation throughout the design process. And then at some point, yes, it does get into lighting. And how can we emphasize some of these features that do exactly that on the outside? And then how can we light the exterior in a way that, again, allows us to get more use out of it, I think is a big piece of it.
Michelle Schwindler (00:45:29):
So I'd love to hear that in a perfect world, how would you best work with the exterior lighting designer to help make sure that that does tell a cohesive story at the end of the project?
Amy Smith (00:45:43):
I think a lot of times if I'm working on a new house, while I'm not necessarily buying the gutters, I'm helping people pick the colors and we're looking at different siding and different stone and landscape comes into the conversation. And so I think at that point in time is when obviously that lighting conversation comes up. And I think when the lighting designer or somebody like you would be involved in that conversation and understand architecturally what are the things that we're trying to really emphasize, what are the things that make this home unique or give it some character? And from there, look to you to tell us what are ways we can do that in a way that I guess seems intentional and again, works with the surrounding landscape and all of that as well.
Michelle Schwindler (00:46:27):
Well, I'm glad you had said that because it brings up a point and something that's been on my mind a lot lately is that the landscape lighting tends to be, it's the last thing that's installed, but it's not necessarily the last thing that gets designed. So what we find is that we're being brought in on the very end of the project and we're designing retroactively, and then that's exactly what you're seeing when you're seeing a space where the inside isn't speaking the same language as the outside because there hasn't been a cohesive process. And so although yes, we are the last to come in, installation wise, we're not involved in the design process enough.
Amy Smith (00:47:07):
Yeah, and I could see that for sure. I feel the same way with window treatments. It seems like even if I'm working with somebody on a new home and we might be talking about it in dribs and drabs here and there, there are a lot of people who just don't really want to fully have that conversation because there's so many other decisions to be made that it just seems like that's something that should wait until the end. But I always try to make sure people realize as we're working through the process, it's like, okay, we can make adjustments now that are going to make it way easier later and the end result way better later. And sometimes that's moving a doorway or moving a window, shifting it even a couple inches here and there gives us room to stack a drape so that you have better view, you can see your lighting outside, things like that.
(00:47:53):
So I completely could see where that would be the case and that it seems like people know it's important, but it's also like there's just so many decisions to be made in such a short period of time that I think clients get caught up in just attacking the things that are in front of them and it's like, we'll deal with that later. But it's like, yeah, if it was thought of on the front end, I'm sure there's way better ways that it could be executed had it been thought about even when electricity was going in or things like that.
Michelle Schwindler (00:48:24):
Absolutely. And I think sometimes too, although people think that involving the designer early in the process can cost more money or can be more costly, it's actually more costly on the backend, sometimes having to come up with the out of the box solutions to make that thing
Amy Smith (00:48:39):
Completely work. Yes.
Michelle Schwindler (00:48:41):
Yeah.
Amy Smith (00:48:41):
I would completely agree with that.
Michelle Schwindler (00:48:43):
Yeah. Yeah. And a lot of times too, when we are brought in late in the process, the home's already been specified with a ton of can lights and a lot of lighting that we see when we finished our project, they never turn those lights on again. And there's a little bit of frustration of the investment that they made in that lighting, but they weren't led down the right path in the first place.
Amy Smith (00:49:05):
No, and I think it's difficult when you're working with things like what you guys do or what I do, and it's so highly customized to a need and a space, and it can be. And sometimes when you come in on some of these projects that whoever was advising that client was advising them to do what most people do, and that doesn't necessarily mean it made sense for this situation. And so then it's kind of like a lot of education that comes with that too. And like you said, some backtracking and it is more costly to then fix the problem. You feel bad getting rid of things that are brand new, but you're not using them. And yeah, it can be a little bit more challenging that way, I think.
Michelle Schwindler (00:49:45):
Absolutely. So do you have a lot of builders and designers in Lafayette that you work with that tend to bring you in or recommend you- We
Amy Smith (00:49:53):
Do. We do. Yeah. So clients typically find me through their builder. I feel like that's a really a big source because I think the builders find that working with a designer early on, again, as we're saying, one, it speeds up the process a little bit. It allows me to understand what the client's looking for and come to them with the best options and let them pick from there rather than this person potentially hitting a point of just complete overwhelm or decision fatigue. So it definitely keeps things moving. We're organized, I would say too. So there are a lot of times where a builder will come to me and say like, "Hey, I have this client. We want to bring you in on this job early on. " I also have clients that either come to me through a referral or find us on the internet or through a realtor if they're new to the area.
(00:50:40):
And sometimes they're coming to me and saying, "I already have a builder lined up. This is who we're working with. " And other times it's, "We need help with this project. You are our first stop. Do you have some builders that we can get in touch with that you would recommend knowing what you do about the project?"
Michelle Schwindler (00:50:56):
Absolutely. So what is your ideal timing if someone were to bring you in on a new construction project? I know myself, we like to get in on the schematic phase when we're just deciding the layout of the house, which ways the windows are going to be facing, what's your ideal timing?
Amy Smith (00:51:12):
Yeah, we're about the same with that. There are a lot of times where it's like people think they need to have their plans fully set and in place and kind of get a little further along in the process and then bring us in. And I mean, that's fine. We still obviously can have an impact working that way, but I feel like for me, the projects that have been the most successful and that I've had the biggest impact on have been ones where we were involved while the architect was still involved at the very beginning. And that doesn't have to be from the very first meeting with the architect, but I think things get to a point with plans where it's like, oh, we maybe have one or two more rounds of revisions. When clients bring me in during that time, I can be another set of eyes on those plans and point out things like we mentioned where it's like, okay, move the window three inches or move the door so that when you walk into the powder room, you see a beautiful vanity and a mirror and a light and not the toilet.
(00:52:06):
Things like that that are really simple changes that really do make a big difference and they're much harder to change and sometimes impossible to change once the project hits a certain point. Yeah,
Michelle Schwindler (00:52:18):
Absolutely. So
Amy Smith (00:52:18):
The earlier the better, I would say. You're
Michelle Schwindler (00:52:20):
Locked in at each phase, right? And sometimes it gets harder and harder to design around that.
Amy Smith (00:52:25):
It really does. Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (00:52:27):
Yeah. I know sometimes we walk in and we have a completely different view and vision than what you would see and you see things completely different than us and even what the builder or the original architect is going to see. So having everyone involved, I think is just doing the client huge service.
Amy Smith (00:52:45):
Oh yeah, I think so too.
Michelle Schwindler (00:52:47):
When you first get involved, are you meeting with the architect and the homeowners together or are you meeting with the homeowners alone and having that conversation?
Amy Smith (00:52:58):
Both. Honestly, it really is project by project. Sometimes it's, okay, we're involved with the architect and I'm sitting in on that meeting and offering suggestions. Other times the homeowner kind of acts as that middle person and they might meet with the architect and then bring the plans to me and we all sit down and pick it apart and go through it and then they go back to that person with revisions. And it works both ways. I think it's successful either way. It just depends a little bit on how involved or uninvolved people like to be. And I have some that really want to be in all of those meetings and I have others who either maybe feel like they can be a little bit more open with their thoughts with me if the architect isn't sitting there or they might think that I might point things out, but I wouldn't if that person was there.
(00:53:45):
And same thing, once we get into the building process, I do have some clients who kind of just pass things off and they're like, just we know where this is headed, all of these detail questions, you just kind of make a judgment call. And then I have others who do like to be there for each and every conversation and look at things and visually be able to say, yes, I want the light fixture in that spot or move at six inches, that kind of thing. I really feel like it's like every project is so different in that sense. And even like we were mentioning when we get started, I mean, I feel like I've come in at probably every phase at this point and I think we can make an impact anyway. It just, there are certain ways that I do feel like it's a little more successful than others.
Michelle Schwindler (00:54:27):
Right. And I think it's just as simple as asking when the designer or the builder's sitting down with their clients, I mean, do you anticipate working with an interior designer? And that's when Q, Amy, right?
Amy Smith (00:54:40):
Well, and I think too, it's like I sometimes feel like people are afraid to give up that control or they think they're really excited about this process and they want to be able to go out and make some of these decisions and do some of the sourcing. And the big thing I always try to point out is you still can. We can still do all of that. You can still have a say, you can bring me your ideas. But the reality is, especially with a new home, there's going to be so many decisions that you're just really not going to want to think about hinges and doorknobs and grout colors, all these things that are just not that exciting, but there are decisions that need to be made and they're actually more important than I think people realize. And so it's like even if you could have somebody in place to help you throughout the whole process, but just kind of be the point person for that stuff.
(00:55:28):
And you can handle some of the fun stuff, but have someone else to take something off of your plate, I think is important.
Michelle Schwindler (00:55:34):
A lot of builders that I've worked with and architects have people inside or inside their office that do the interior design. And how do you work with them when you're brought in per request for the homeowner when they also do that in their office?
Amy Smith (00:55:50):
I'm trying to think if we've really crossed over with many that have done that. I have had some where they might have somebody they work with for cabinetry, that's a big one. Some of the builders we work with, they build custom cabinetry. And so they can kind of get a jumpstart, I feel like on that. And they might come and say like, "Okay, we're going to handle the kitchen and the bathroom vanities, you handle the rest." And then they kind of do the first round of cabinet drawings and then pass it off to me. And I kind of take a look at it with the direction it's headed in terms of finishes and fixtures and just overall style and then might say, "Okay, here are some things we want to change or details we'd like to incorporate. We'll pick the finishes," that type of thing.
(00:56:35):
So it ends up being, in that sense, a little bit more of a collaboration, I would say, but it does take some work off of my plate in the sense that I'm not sitting there figuring out what size cabinet is in each spot. It's more like big picture overall look and feel rather than getting really technical in those spaces. And so that does happen quite a bit on the cabinetry front. Otherwise, I feel like a lot of builders will have somebody they work with as far as vendors go that might also provide a design assistance. And in those situations, really it just kind of turns into, okay, we'll pick all of these things and just turn the order over to that person. So they are still involved, they're still handling logistics, and we know that they work well with that builder, but they don't have to meet with the client really and make all of those little decisions.
(00:57:25):
It's kind of made and just hand it over to them in a different phase.
Michelle Schwindler (00:57:28):
Yeah. I'm really glad we hit on this because I think there was a lot of good things here because I just think that there's a lot of gaps in communication sometimes in between all the different people involved. And especially now, there's just some beautiful homes coming into Lafayette and West Lafayette, just a whole different caliber. I mean, these people are building some amazing, beautiful homes where they're going to want the interiors completely settled when they move in. It's not a work in progress type situation like it used to be. They want their exterior lighting going when they move in. They want their outdoor space done when construction is wrapped. And so I think it's so important that we all just get better at communicating on the beginning stages because it's just people are different now. People are building a new level of home here.
Amy Smith (00:58:17):
Yeah, no, I would agree with that. And I think people are realizing too that there's something to be said about taking your time. And it is a process and figuring out once you're in the space, maybe what you want and how you use it. But if you're somebody who's moving to the area, you're busy, you're starting a new job, kids, all this stuff, there's a lot of moving parts and it really is more efficient to just get that team in place on the front end and work through those decisions and have everybody working well together to just get a project that's complete and it's something you love and you're not going back and making a lot of changes as time goes on, and then you can just use the home.
Michelle Schwindler (00:58:53):
Right. And then I'll end with this too, I keep talking about our frustrations, but another thing that we see too is that when we come in, what I'd say is that if no one takes responsibility of the exterior lighting early in the process, who's going to pick it up? Sometimes it's the pool builder, sometimes it's the patio guy, sometimes it's the landscaper, but what ends up happening is that that area gets lit, but the rest of the property is forgotten. And so like you said, we're not entering into this whole entire scene. We have a beautifully lit pool and the rest of the architecture is flat or forgotten, or we've forgotten the wood line back here that's going to provide us the depth on that property. And so that's, I think, another reason why we prefer to come in early just so we can take responsibility and we can really drive that for them.
Amy Smith (00:59:45):
Yeah. And I think that's a huge, huge benefit to have that on the front end for sure.
Michelle Schwindler (00:59:50):
Yeah. Yeah. Well, do you have anything else that you feel like you'd like to hit on as far as interior design or anything that you have Coming up or anything you want to bring awareness to?
Amy Smith (01:00:04):
Not necessarily. I mean, I think we kind of covered service offering and yeah, I mean, it seems like it's been a busy winter so far, which is unusual, but also a good thing.
Michelle Schwindler (01:00:14):
What do you think has contributed to your busy winter? Is it the early cold or is it that it's warming up now? It's been kind of backwards.
Amy Smith (01:00:21):
And maybe it's the cold because everybody was just in the house, but it seems like for us, typically January is a very quiet month where everyone's kind of coming off of the holidays and not really wanting to spend a whole lot of money for a month or so. And you've got that piece of it. But this year it seems like we just had a lot of people reaching out about new projects in January and things that ... A lot of furniture. So I think, yeah, a piece of it is like we're inside and this isn't working and some new homes, some larger remodels. So I feel like it's really a good mix, but yeah, it'll be interesting to see where the rest of the year takes us.
Michelle Schwindler (01:00:55):
Yeah, it's been an odd one. Usually the end of the year, it's pretty warm still until you hit Christmastime. This year, it was a very, very cold start of the winter. And now look at us, we're like in the 50s and 60s, so people are a different mindset right now. So I'm loving it.
Amy Smith (01:01:13):
I get it. I feel like I'm there too. It's like I'm inside, I'm outside. Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (01:01:18):
Yeah. Yeah. People were over the winter, over Christmas decorations this year earlier than usual. Well,
Amy Smith (01:01:24):
And because it started so early. I think that's a big piece of it too, is the holidays being so close together and all of that. It seems like that whole season started a little earlier than it normally does and people were ready to wrap it up a little earlier on the other end.
Michelle Schwindler (01:01:38):
Yeah. Well, I am ready for a big year this year. I think it's going to be huge. We've been building some big momentum. I've been seeing you guys a lot too, and I look forward to working with you more this year.
Amy Smith (01:01:50):
Yeah, me too. I'm hoping we can cross over on a few more projects for sure.
Michelle Schwindler (01:01:53):
Absolutely. All right. That was a really great interview.
Andy Schwindler (01:01:56):
Oh my gosh.
Michelle Schwindler (01:01:57):
I really enjoyed talking with her. She had some really good insights. I always learned so much from other professionals in the space.
Andy Schwindler (01:02:04):
Yeah. But beyond that, how about you driving the show? I thought she did an amazing job. You asked all the right questions. I just really enjoyed the back and forth.
Michelle Schwindler (01:02:14):
Yeah. Well, I met Amy a couple of years ago. That's kind of one of my biggest roles in the company is establishing relationships, people that we can work with out in the field that are taking on the same kind of projects and clients as we are. And she's just been a great relationship for us. So we really appreciate that. A lot of things that stuck out to me with Amy's interview, I think first and foremost, she really did hit on the whole lighting isn't necessarily the first thing that people notice
Andy Schwindler (01:02:44):
Is
Michelle Schwindler (01:02:44):
What's off in a room. And we talk about that all the time.
Andy Schwindler (01:02:48):
Yeah. So when something's off in the room and you can just feel it, you're saying that most of the time it is the lighting.
Michelle Schwindler (01:02:57):
A lot of the time it is the lighting. And most of the time people will blame the paint colors or the couch with pillows or the drapes, which obviously those are improvements too. But I think lighting is a huge layer that people fail to see.
Andy Schwindler (01:03:12):
I can't agree more, obviously. What are some things that you took from the conversation? Just quick things that people can do to improve their lighting just right off the bat, whether it's inside or outside.
Michelle Schwindler (01:03:25):
Well, I think a huge theme here is, and we talk about this all the time, is layered lighting as opposed to just one light source.
Andy Schwindler (01:03:34):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (01:03:34):
We have a thing that we say out in the field. I'll let you explain that.
Andy Schwindler (01:03:38):
Well, I have a couple things that I say. Ultimately, we want to use multiple low level luminaires to create that feeling, that unison, that soft glow. We got to mix in shadowing with the light itself, but what you're referring to is the one light to rule them all, right? Yeah. The one that you pull all the way back and it hits all the spots. And-
Michelle Schwindler (01:04:02):
That's what I see when I go to a home and they attempt to kind of illuminate the home on their own.
Andy Schwindler (01:04:08):
They
Michelle Schwindler (01:04:08):
Use one bright light, pull it all the way back,
Andy Schwindler (01:04:11):
And
Michelle Schwindler (01:04:11):
Then they have light.
Andy Schwindler (01:04:13):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (01:04:13):
But what does that leave them with?
Andy Schwindler (01:04:15):
Well, it washes things out. It creates this source of light that your eyes drawn to. Those bright lights, draw your eye to them. And so it doesn't create a hierarchy of light. It doesn't create a feeling, a mood. We go to a lot of homes that say they have outdoor lighting, and it's kind of a mishmash of a floodlight here. We've got the coach light at the doorway, we've got a couple, and I think that they think that's enough, but it's my job to kind of say, "Hey, we've got to take a step back and we want to figure out how to frame a complete scene with light and then take it the next step." We want to be able to control it. And that's what I took away from Amy's conversation was the dimming of light, even if we just added a dimmer to every single outdoor light that exists today, I think we can improve the scenario exponentially.
(01:05:12):
Wouldn't you agree?
Michelle Schwindler (01:05:13):
Absolutely. Yeah. A little bit of control. Being able to dim some areas is huge. And I wanted to talk too about those can lights that we see an awful lot of. I know.
Andy Schwindler (01:05:23):
Not
Michelle Schwindler (01:05:24):
That there's anything wrong with them.
Andy Schwindler (01:05:25):
Explain the can light real quick.
Michelle Schwindler (01:05:26):
So the can light is a recessed light that you're going to find up in the soffit area.
(01:05:31):
And typically even in newer homes, you're going to see them every few feet all the way down all the way down the soffit. And that's kind of traditionally what builders do when it comes to illuminating the outside of the house. But the thing that I find so ironic and a little heartbreaking, and I know my clients do too, they've spent all this money building this house and they've been led down this road to believe that this is how you illuminate Zed House. By the time they've found us and we've shown them the way and we walk away from that final light and design, they're thrilled, but they never turn those can lights on again. And that's got to be rough having just invested in that. And so I think that maybe I'll take it all the way back to that's just another bonus to being involved early is that you're making better decisions when it comes down to the lighting and other things too.
Andy Schwindler (01:06:24):
I couldn't agree more and very well said. So that was a lot of fun. I'm glad that you had the opportunity to meet with Amy. I'm glad and appreciative that Amy had the opportunity to spend some time with us. Is there anything you'd like to leave everyone with before we go?
Michelle Schwindler (01:06:42):
I think my final thoughts are, Andy and I, we love what we do. We love doing lighting and it's mostly because of the fact that we get to make things beautiful. It's for the end product. And so if I can leave anything with anyone, it's get us involved early. If you're modeling, if you're building a home, introduce us to your builder. We should definitely be a part of the conversation so that when you are at your home on that first night, you're moving in and you look out the window and you've got the perfect focal point or you're driving up the driveway for the first time and it's just magnificent and perfection. And that's what I wish that we could provide to all of our clients. So I think that especially in our market, and our market tends to be all of Indiana, but what I am seeing is that if no one claims the lighting portion of the project early, someone will.
(01:07:44):
It might be the pool builder, it might be the landscaper, it might be the deck builder. And what you're going to end up with is a beautifully lit pool or a beautifully lit deck where the rest of the property is disconnected.
(01:07:59):
So it's very, very important that you bring in a lighting designer so they're considering the whole space, otherwise you're going to be left with pieces.
Andy Schwindler (01:08:07):
And when you say pieces, I know exactly what you mean. You're talking about mismatch color temperatures, mismatch controllers, you're talking about-
Michelle Schwindler (01:08:17):
Systems that don't live on the same ecosystem.
Andy Schwindler (01:08:20):
That's it. And so those are things that are not only important to consider, it should be priority.
Michelle Schwindler (01:08:28):
Right.
Andy Schwindler (01:08:28):
Yeah.
Michelle Schwindler (01:08:29):
And I really, truly feel like builders around us right now have a real opportunity to differentiate themselves in the market by bringing in that lighting designer because not everyone's doing it.
Andy Schwindler (01:08:43):
Yeah. And we also have another saying that we say, we're in it for the pictures, right? We want to come back at night. We want to take those photos. We want to share those with our clients because you'd be surprised our clients haven't even seen their homes in this light per se, and it's amazing, right? They've never seen it like that before. And I've seen people that have lived in homes for 20 years light their homes, and at the end of it, they're almost in tears because they're experiencing their home in a brand new way. It could be the limestone above the doorway that they'd never seen before, the scallops that are on the brick wall. There's so many little details that I'm going to find and call out that is just going to ... It's really going to blow people's minds. So I'm glad you brought that up.
Michelle Schwindler (01:09:37):
Yeah. And I'd also love to hear your opinion on this. We see a lot of really beautiful homes being built, they're finished, they're fully lit, right? And I truly believe that some light is better than no light, right? But what is the difference between good light output and not great light output? I hate to say bad because-
Andy Schwindler (01:10:04):
You're really trying to get me to geek out on this episode. I can do that, but I'll keep it simple. There's a couple things that you want to take into consideration. Obviously, the temperature of light. Is it warm? Is it on the yellow side? Is it on the white side? Is it somewhere in between? And most people think that you can pick one and it's universal. So picking the right color temperature for the house, the house color, the trees, the reflectivity of the material, White House is going to reflect different than a brick house. I'll take those things into consideration. The color rendering index or the CRI, a high CRI is going to make colors look the way they're supposed to look. Other professions that use high CRI are going to be jewelers. Your produce section at the grocery store is going to use a high CRI.
(01:11:01):
Y? They want the vegetables to look as beautiful and as vibrant as possible. So high color rendering index is a big deal. Controlling the light output, you think that you hear things like three watt, five watt, eight watt. What does that really mean? It means that's potentially the brightness of it and bright isn't always the goal, uniformity, evenness. So you want to have a fixture or a luminaire that is going to have the ability to dim down, right? Just when you think it's perfect, chances are you need to take it down just one more notch. So those are just a few examples of what makes a difference to me.
Michelle Schwindler (01:11:48):
I got you. Thanks. Well,
Andy Schwindler (01:11:50):
I couldn't have said it any better than that. It literally gave me all the feels. So again, great job, Michelle. Thank you, Amy, with Lafayette Custom Interiors. This has been the reveal. If you've enjoyed this, let us know. We sure do like talking about our adventures in lighting, and I'm sure you've got some great stories too, working with the builder or having great lighting. Or if you have any questions, drop them down below. But until next time, this has been the reveal.