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Podcast by a Panhandle Surf Angler for all anglers of any level. We will talk weekly to guests that are anglers and also industry professionals. I want you to walk away from this podcast with some knowledge either refreshed or new for you to become a better angler. Though it will start in the Panhandle of Florida, it will be around the entire United States so we can all learn something about fishing in different regions.
Speaker 1 (00:00:01):
This episode of Finding Demo Surf Fishing is being brought to you by the Kids Can Fish Foundation, kids Can Fish dot Net's the website to take a look at, see all the cool things that they actually do and their mission and some of the past experiences that they've had. Lots of great things that they do. They take these kids out wherever they are and they're wherever their camps are, I'm sorry. And they do cast CNET clinics, fishing clinics, uh, what else we got here? They've done live demonstrations. All these things come together for these kids to learn, but at the end of it too, they get to take these kids, get to take all that gear home for free. It is for them to use forever. That's huge. And they do that through all the donations from you. Whether you go right from the website@kidscanfish.net and do it, uh, direct link there. Or you buy the cast net from Promar Ahi proceeds to that go back. Or you go to one of the, uh, you buy merch. All that goes back into the camp. Don't forget to get to go to the old run of the Bulls tournament, St. Simon's Island, Georgia in October. An excellent tournament. I will be there. I'm very excited to go Again. That all comes together to help that thing all do these things for the kids. So kids can fish.net, go take a look at it, support them Great times right there.
Speaker 1 (00:01:44):
Hello, happy, wonderful people. Hope you're doing well wherever you are and things got me, uh, as I'm reading the chat. Ah, I got me all messed up there. Uh, I shouldn't have done that. Uh, , I hope you're doing well. Wherever you are, things are going well, very well for you. Fishing is definitely picked up. Spring was a good run from pretty much everywhere I've seen online. And we are moving into the summer fishing. And summer fishing in the surf is a different, uh, it's a different beast depending on where you live. Here in the panhandle of Florida, we start dealing with June grass and, uh, just nature's way of moving stuff around. Hot water, fish, start moving around. And this week we're going international. We're going to the other side of the world. And this is going to encompass, uh, the northern hemisphere and the southern we there. There's a lot of range in this whole thing. So it's a father and son team, Justin and Julian. And we're gonna bring them on the show and Julian's gonna tell us about all of his experience. And Justin has been learning from his dad the whole way and lots of cool pieces there. So it's gonna be a double tap. Lot of fun. So without further ado, gentlemen, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for coming on. Thanks
Speaker 2 (00:02:54):
Brian.
Speaker 3 (00:02:56):
Thank you Brian. Thanks for having us.
Speaker 1 (00:02:58):
So let's, let's get ourselves oriented here. Justin, where in the world are you right now?
Speaker 4 (00:03:04):
I am in Noosa on the eastern coast of Australia. So anyone doesn't know where Noosa is. It's in Queensland. Um, yeah, tropical, beautiful destination.
Speaker 1 (00:03:18):
Ah, down there. I had a great episode outta your neck of the woods there. Absolutely loved that. That was a lot of fun. Talking to them. Made me really want to get down there.
Speaker 4 (00:03:28):
There's a lot of good fishing over here. There's a lot. Uh, good fishing off the side, off the boats and the rivers. Um, yeah, definitely no shortage.
Speaker 1 (00:03:35):
Yeah, go fishing Australia really made me realize how unfamiliar I am with the territory. Uh, when he started talking about going up into the Northern Territory, he is like, yeah, that's where Crocs live. I was like, oh, the map makes it look really good. I don't want to go there now. Um, but y'all, y'all have some interesting, uh, interesting zones that that's pretty cool fishing there. Yeah,
Speaker 4 (00:03:54):
I think we're at the sweet spot. We're, um, maybe about three hours south of where the Crocs are. So we've got the warm water. We don't have the es the deadly jellyfish. Um, we don't have the Crocs, but we've got the warm water and the clean water. We've got a wide variety of different ics and um, domicile species. So yeah, there's, there's quite a lot, quite a lot of good in this part of the world. Uh, definitely really happy to be here.
Speaker 1 (00:04:22):
. Well, I I look forward to seeing some of your stuff later, especially some of the barramundi that I know you'll get your hands on. 'cause it's always fun seeing the different fish species y'all pull up. There's some, you have some big monsters. And Julian, where are you today?
Speaker 3 (00:04:37):
Well, Brian, today I'm, uh, I'm in SW in Switzerland. I actually immigrated from South Africa recently and now living in Switzerland in the, in the southeast, just on the border with Italy up in the Alps. And, um, we actually quite high up, we're sitting at 1,800 meters above sea level. And my main focus here during the summer is to fish for trout. Um, I'm mainly walking up around about a thousand meters in altitude up from where we are and fishing the very, very clean mountain lakes, uh, fly fishing ma mainly fly fishing, but a bit of bait fishing. And, um, but my original fishing, uh, experience really comes out of South Africa where I was living for most of my life. And, um, so today's, uh, talk will be mainly about my experiences in South Africa, which is my first love, which is surf, surf fishing in, in the South African surf. So yeah, and particularly with a reference to competition fishing, which I think is one of the more important facets of my fishing career over the years.
Speaker 1 (00:05:51):
Yeah, this is gonna be good everybody. I hope you're ready for it. And I, thankfully, it's kind of weird, I've had episodes out of Australia and I've had one eep or I've had one, two episodes out of Australia and one episode outta South Africa. So I'm not wonderfully familiar, but I've had a very small overview of both countries and I gotta say they are both on my list to definitely go fish sometime. So let's go ahead and start this. Let's wind it all the way back for you here. Julian, tell us your story and what got you into fishing.
Speaker 3 (00:06:21):
Um, Brian. Yeah, I, I really only started fishing competitively at quite a late age. Um, obviously as a child, I, I used to fish in the, in the dams and the lakes around, uh, you know, in South Africa, but mainly for very small fish like any young kid who's wanting to start up his fishing career. And then sort of dibbled and dabbled until I moved to a, a little village up in the north coast of South Africa, north of Durban. Um, a place called I tanzani. And there I met up with a very old friend of mine from school days who got me into competitive angling. So at that stage I was 30. Um, and that was when I really started getting involved in the, in the competitive side. And I've often said to people that the competitive side is what got me fishing as hard as what I do.
Speaker 3 (00:07:11):
Um, I think without the competition I might never have got to the levels that I would've, that I have got to. Um, and I just found the excitement of competing, uh, pushed me, you know, pushed my limits and pushed me to go further and further into working out what, why, how when, um, which I think is very important when it comes particularly to surf fishing. Um, without those questions being answered, um, there's just actually no hope for, for most people. They, they, they just double and dabble and they hope for the best and people depend too much on luck and yeah, competitive angling is what turns me on.
Speaker 1 (00:07:56):
So when you say competitive, could you break that down a little bit more? What what do you mean by competitive fishing?
Speaker 3 (00:08:02):
Well, South Africa and, and also Namibia are very big in, in rock and surf competitive angling and in my knowledge are the two, uh, countries that currently really get involved in, in our type of angling. So what we do is we, well, South Africa and Namibia are divided up into a whole lot of clubs, um, based through provinces. So we've got, in South Africa, we've got, we've got, uh, 12 different provinces. And those 12 different provinces have clubs. Uh, typically each province will have between eight and 12 clubs, and within those provinces they will fish competition club on club. From there, they'll select an interprovincial, uh, a provincial side, and they will then go and fish at an interprovincial where all the provinces compete against each other. And from there they select a, a national side, which is, which gives you your national colors. So in South Africa you would be getting protea colors for that.
Speaker 3 (00:09:07):
And then they would then go and compete against another country. At this stage that other country is basically Namibia, um, who, who would then there would be a, a tournament, which is either based in Namibia or in South Africa. We'd love to see more countries get involved. Um, but they're not organized at this stage. So countries like Australia, which have got some pretty decent anglers, they, they, they're not actually, uh, organized. They don't have a federation, they don't have a structure. And so consequently they can't actually compete against us on a country level. So it's, it's quite a different kind of setup. Um, not something that most people see, but certainly our type of angling is very, uh, specialized. It's very different and very physical. Um, and yeah, it's what's what I really love. It's what I enjoy.
Speaker 4 (00:10:07):
Hey dad, why don't, why don't you break down how the competitions work? And when you say it's physical, like maybe about like how people are walking along the beaches and like the decomp demarcation zones, like the length of the competitions, the fact that some of them start at like 2:00 AM it's pretty means it's pretty extreme and regardless of weather.
Speaker 3 (00:10:30):
Yeah, yeah, thanks Justin. You typically, um, a competition will be set within a boundary. So you'll, based, based on where you're fishing, they'll set up a boundary, boundary's normally around about eight kilometers, and you all get a start time. So each, all the clubs come to one, one destination. They have a roll call to ensure that everyone's there. And then they will decide. The start time is for, say for example, be six o'clock in the morning and you would fish an eight hour day. So that would be six until six, until uh, two. Yeah. And that's not my strongest subject. six until two. And we would all start at, at six. You'd walk onto the beach. Um, there's no driving permitted on South African beaches. So you literally have to walk that eight kilometer zone, uh, with all your tackle. So we have little trolleys that we pull behind us.
Speaker 3 (00:11:31):
Your bait is in there, your, your rods, your reels, your tackle. And we would walk down that beach, find a place to fish, and each as an individual would pick his own spot and then we proceed to fish it. Um, obviously there's a title difference in that eight hours. So you'll have a either a full outgoing or a full incoming tide. And depending on where you stop, you might find that in order to be able to get into the deeper water, you would have to wade. Um, so typically we would sometimes wade anything up to a hundred meters out to sea through the surf. Um, sometimes swimming, uh, sometimes yeah, sometimes getting washed out to sea. It happens . And then once you're out there, you'll stand outside on that, on the sandbank, uh, you know, which is maybe waist deep getting smashed by waves. And then throw a bait over the back stand, wait, wait for the pull and, uh, fight the fish out.
Speaker 3 (00:12:34):
Um, the fish that we target is, is based on weight. So your points are scored according to the amount of kilograms that you, you land, um, for fish that have got teeth like sharks and that you would get one point per kilogram and four fish that are edible fish. So your, your bony fish as we would know them, um, like your JW fish and, and what we would call cob would get two points per kilogram. And at the end of the day, you add your points up and the team with the most points wins the individual with the most points wins and so on. Um, the, the big thing of course is that because it's based on weight, sharks are obviously bigger, so there's a bigger emphasis on targeting sharks, particularly if conditions are correct. So yeah, the fish, the fish are big. We, we, we regularly landing fish in excess of 150 kilos, sometimes 200, 250 kilo fish off the side. Um, there are limitations on the, on, on the tackle that we use. So the, the line, the line cloth is not allowed to be more than 50 pound, which is about 22 kg. So we are landing fish over 200 kilos on, on 22 kilo line, um, standing on the beach. So yeah, it's, it's uh, it's very challenging. Very, very challenging. And a full day of fishing, um, you're pretty exhausted at the end of it.
Speaker 1 (00:14:09):
Yeah, I'd say so. I like the add in there, the, the requirement of the line, uh, , I mean you talk about separating the men from the boys in that kind of group there. Uh, 'cause can you land a big shark on 50 pound? Yes, you can. You have to be drag manipulating, you have to be planning, you have to do all these things the proper way. There's a lot that goes into that. So that's an interesting add to creating into the competition. I can kind of see where you probably run into some issues as the international one goes to playing that one out. And it's an eight k uh, as I'm laughing 'cause I'm like, yeah, I know how much, I know how far that is, unfortunately. Um, 'cause you know, we don't, we don't do K here in the US People are like, what are kilometers?
Speaker 1 (00:14:57):
Just remember everybody, you have five Ks, 3.1 miles. It's the easiest way to keep things out, you know? Mm-Hmm. . So there you go. Five miles, essentially a beach that you get to walk and then walking out 300, 300 yards. I mean a hundred meters or 300 feet. Uh, oh man, the math on that. Not it's way too early. I haven't had enough coffee . Um, but I mean, the idea of being that far out swimming it and pushing it, that, uh, that's pretty extreme. And then the winning, I, I guess we didn't get to that part. When you're talking about these competitions with the winning, what are the winnings, uh, that normally come from these competitions?
Speaker 3 (00:15:34):
We, we are very, we're very special. We don't win anything . We only win, uh, . We only win the, the bragging rights. Um, it's pretty much it. Um, we don't do any, any kind of, uh, money prizes or anything like that because what we found is that the moment you start giving out big prizes, people tend to cheat and
Speaker 1 (00:15:58):
Say it ain't so,
Speaker 3 (00:16:00):
So we stay away from it. Um, also, what, what I might add is what is interesting for us is we we're the first country in the world to start, um, doing our scoring based on measurement rather than on weighing fish. So we don't carry scales. Um, we have, we have tables which are being worked out by our oceanographic research institute in South Africa. And for example, if, if you catch a, a blackfin shark, you put it down on the beach, you measure it from the, from the nose to the, to the coral notch on the tail. And then you enter that measurement into an app and it pops out the weight. And, and we use that. So consequently we have very little trauma on our fish. Um, and we get them back into the water very quickly after, after catching. And the competitions are such that we actually do not permit any fish to be removed, you know, to be killed and taken out the water. So even if you catch something that you can eat, still has to go back during competition. And that way we sort of try and stay above the, you know, the critics that say we are killing everything. Um, but yeah, we, we very, we are very conscious of our, of our stocks.
Speaker 4 (00:17:18):
And then dad, the other thing is, um, there's no gaffs allowed in competition. Are there? You you, you lose points or you're not allowed to at all?
Speaker 3 (00:17:26):
No, no gaffs permitted at all. So those big fish have to be landed without a gaff.
Speaker 4 (00:17:31):
With hands,
Speaker 3 (00:17:32):
With hands. You literally grab it by the tail and pull it out.
Speaker 1 (00:17:36):
I i, I don't know, maybe I'm weird. We don't do gaffes here either. Uh, when it comes to the beach, you gotta bring it up on the sand. That's right. The idea of walking out in the water with a gaff and a big fish to me is you're, you're, you're asking you to get gaffed yourself. Um, there, there's certain things in life in the surf that I think are safety in that one. I mean, you, you get wave the wrong way. You get into the undertow and the rip the wrong way, you're going for a ride and it's the worst ride of your life that you're fighting for because the, the ocean, she's an unforgiving mistress. Um, she will remind you that, you know, she owns you. So yeah, she's a, I don't mess around when it comes to that. And I haven't met too many surf anglers that do.
Speaker 1 (00:18:21):
They're kind of, they get worried. So what, when you were talking about swimming out, I was like, wow, that's bold. That, I mean, 'cause that's a lot of fight right there with that much line and the gear and one arm outta the game. Is, uh, that, that's kind of a big piece. Um, let's add in another piece when it comes to these, 'cause I know you can stack it up when you're starting to talk about these tournaments. 'cause this will all probably match more than likely what you normally do with your fishing since you got into it, uh, the way you have. How do you plan your fishing trips?
Speaker 3 (00:18:55):
Well, there's a whole lot of things that one has to look at before you go fishing. And, and I'll, I keep saying this to people that I speak to and, and guys that are, are wanting to get into, into the sport. Probably the most important thing that you have to understand is, is that if you're not targeting a species, you are actually wasting your time. So when I say that there's a whole lot of things that one has to take into account in order to decide which fe species to target. So for example, if it's the middle of summer, right? And I'm talking now in South Africa, for example. So if you're in the middle of summer, let's say February, it's the hottest time of the year. And this generally the water is a little bit brown 'cause of the rivers, because we have our, our rainy season that time of the year.
Speaker 3 (00:19:49):
And I know that in my part of the world, we're going to start catching a lot of, um, what we would know, flat fish. So skates, uh, rays, big rays. Um, then you would, as a, as a person going into a competition, you would be looking at the weather and you'd be looking firstly at the weather, at the, at the wind direction. And if you're getting a northeasterly wind for a couple of days, then you know the water temperature's going to be down a bit, which is good for those particular species. Then you would then decide, well, I'm going to target those, those rays, then I need to know which beach do they normally come on. So I, uh, from experience, I know that I'd go to a certain beach, then I would know that at certain times of the day, they feed better than at others.
Speaker 3 (00:20:35):
And then based on the tide, can I fish that beach? Can I wait it, can I get into the deeper water? So there's a whole lot of questions that need to be answered before you can even decide what you're gonna do. Um, so to answer your question briefly, one looks at the weather, one looks at the time of the year, one looks at the type of species that you're gonna get in the area, and then you would make sure that you've got the right bait, that you've got the right tackle with you, that the traces are tied correctly. And then you would pick your water and you would go and fish it. And nine times out of 10 you catch what you target. So Justin might remember when I was in Australia now this, this last last month that we were there for a month. Mm-Hmm, . And, um, we went down to a beach south of, of Justin, and I wanted to catch a Jew fish. It's something I wanted to do while I was there. Um, I know that a Jew fish is very similar to what we would call a cob in South Africa. So I, I believe they eat very similar. So we went to the beach, picked the water, went out, threw into the water, and caught 2, 2, 2 fish, two nice fish and like three throws. So nice. Yeah. Yeah. That's how it works.
Speaker 4 (00:21:50):
Clinical.
Speaker 3 (00:21:52):
It's very clinical.
Speaker 1 (00:21:53):
I mean the, this is kind of an international thing. I think it's fishing in general, you know, you're either targeting or you're fishing. And phishing is more of a, I'm just sitting there after a long work, work week and I'm just throwing a line in the water and I'm kind of just, I'm, I'm unplugging from the world. But when you're comp, you're out there fishing, fishing like you're targeting, you are dialed in, you know what you want, you know how you're gonna do it, you know, the things are. So the homework plays a huge factor into getting into that. And you just, I mean, you slammed it there by going out. You know, you went to go visit Justin in Australia, all right, this is what I want. This is what we're doing. You knew what you needed, Justin. I'm sure you had the intel from that stuff of, Hey, I think we're gonna be in this position. And you went and crushed it. So, uh, yeah,
Speaker 4 (00:22:39):
You went and crushed it. And um, now I need to catch a Jew fish. 'cause I've not caught one since I moved to Australia five years ago.
Speaker 1 (00:22:45):
Oh no,
Speaker 4 (00:22:46):
That's, that's now my goal. So I've been, I've actually been targeting them the last few days. I haven't had any luck, but I'll, uh, my dad, uh, he pointed out a couple spots, so I'll keep working those. Eventually the conditions will transpire and one will jump on the end, .
Speaker 4 (00:23:02):
But it, it's a challenge though because like you say, um, you have those days where you, you you've got a, like a seek and strike mission. You really plan it. You go and you're gonna target a species. But then there's many other days where you just want to fish, just wanna escape the world. And yeah, I guess it's trying to understand how to make the most from those, um, yeah, those, those ad hoc, those random fishing trips that you, that you get to go on. How to target species on those ones when it's not as pre-planned.
Speaker 1 (00:23:31):
Mm-Hmm, definitely on that. Well, it's been 20 minutes here, so let's knock into a quick check. 'cause we've, we've only begun starting scratch on the surface here. We got some really interesting things to continue with.
Speaker 1 (00:23:49):
It's been 20 minutes, so hopefully that means you've caught a bunch of fish while you're listening to this episode. The heck. So that's what we do. If you haven't yet, check your bait. Make sure it's still good. It might be a time for a refresh. You guys know I love using crab knuckles. It's one of my favorites for the Pompano, that's for sure. This is the time when I probably pop it off, pop a new one on that meat's. Probably been chewed up by something. This paycheck is being brought to you. Guy , the guy that taught me how to use crab knuckles, the sinker guy. And then over to the sinker guy.com and take a look at everything that chip's got going on in the sinker guy garage. You need sinkers. He's got 'em in your name or got 'em in his name. It's all the sputniks, different weight ranges from different sizes.
Speaker 1 (00:24:24):
They work great. Absolutely loves Sputniks. Uh, I got plenty to talk about when it comes to that. I got a whole article on why I use Sputniks back on finding the moster fishing.com. And if you need rigs, he's got the Bruno rig, the Uno rig, great pieces of gear right there if you need supporting equipment, scissors, uh, beads, floats. Maybe you need a hooking tool. Yeah, that's pretty cool when it's coming to build rigs. He's got it in there. So go over to the sinker guide.com, take a look, get your order in today. So you'd mentioned this piece, and this is, I, I think the next great part of it. And you, Julian, you went down and you had a little research and you picked your spot and then boom, nailed it. So let's talk about spots. How do you select your spot for fishing?
Speaker 3 (00:25:08):
It's, uh, it's, it's quite a broad question that it's not, it's not that simple. And once again, you know, you, you pick your spot based on what you want to catch. Um, it's as simple as that. So it'll depend also on, on, on where you are in the world at the time. So, and what do you wanna catch? And yeah, it basically, it's what do you wanna catch? That's the first question. So I'll tell you a story while we are at it. It was a very good friend of mine, um, chap by the name of Nigel Simmons. That, that, uh, Justin knows. Mm-Hmm, . He's, he, him and I used to fish together a lot in tournaments and he was, he was walking up the beach at his local beach at a place called Zinc Quai a few years back. And there was a, an obviously an upcountry tourist that was coming down the beach on the other way.
Speaker 3 (00:26:03):
And as they passed each other, the tourists stopped Nigel and Austin and said, said to Nigel, are you local here? And Nigel answered, yes, no, we local here. So he said, do you fish? And Nigel said, yeah, I do. I fish, I fish a lot. So the guy said, well, where's the best places to fish? So Nigel turned around and said, well, what do you want to catch? And the guy said, well, anything. So Nigel said, said to him, well then just fish anywhere, and I, and I think that pretty much sums it up, um, because if you, if you don't know what you're targeting, then you can't pick your water. So, you know, your question is, is as simple as that to answer. Um, so if you were to say to me, uh, to catch a, a tailor or, or, or a shed as we would call it, in, in, in South Africa, where would you go? Yeah, I can tell you the kind of water that I would go into. You know, I, in, in South Africa, I would look for a, a north facing bay. I would look for a southwesterly wind, I'd look for a bit of chop on the water. Um, yeah, that, that kind of water, um, would be what I'd be searching for. And
Speaker 1 (00:27:13):
Decent size surf, that's
Speaker 3 (00:27:14):
Where I would target. Yep,
Speaker 1 (00:27:15):
Yep. The white water.
Speaker 3 (00:27:17):
And you would fish in white water. You know, I think that's also a fallacy that people, a lot of people, they think that, you know, the deep blue water is a place to go and fish. Not at all. You know, it, it can be if you wanna catch sharks, but if you wanna catch edible fish, you fish in the white water. And, you know, so, you know, just beginning to learn that is a, is a, is a big step forward in the right direction.
Speaker 1 (00:27:41):
Yeah, I think a lot of anglers forget that the first 50 yards or the first fi you know, the first piece is
Speaker 1 (00:27:51):
Overlooked. 'cause it's easy to get, you know, you grab that 12, 13 foot rod and you think, all right, I gotta heave it out there. And it's easy to want to cast out, you know, a hundred yards, a hundred meters and give it full power to do all that. Um, but in reality, a lot of it, they just hide right in front of us. And it's easy to just overlook It. Just, I I, I make that mistake all the time. I never thought I would, but I do constantly, and I get schooled up by my daughter 'cause she doesn't cast as far and, you know, her lines are going off like, what the hell am I doing here? I'm like, why am I even fishing? Um, . But yeah, the white water's an easy one to overlook. And thank you for adding in that other part too. It depends on the species because I think that it's easy to say, all right, I want to catch this. And then you're using the wrong bait, you're using the wrong lures, you're using the wrong setup. You know, you don't need to be in a rip current, you need to actually be in a deep pocket or something of that nature. It's easy to overlook that.
Speaker 3 (00:28:50):
Yeah, no, absolutely. And you know, we, we talk about white water, but what we also need to remember is that the white water is not only on the side. So there is white water out the back as well. So you'll get a, a shallow sandbank, which is pretty much isolated with gutters running left and right of it. And those are prime spots for catching fish. But a lot of times they're, they're quite far out. So that's where the casting is really important, you know, to be able to first of all wait as far as you possibly can to get the distance to be able to land your bait on those zones. And, um, the other, you know, the other thing that I often mention to people is that if you take into account the direction of the current and you've got a, a sandbank working on the back, so, you know, when I refer to a sandbank, it might be a patch of white water might be a hundred meters out from the side.
Speaker 3 (00:29:44):
And you've got a current running, for example, running from left to right across the, the sandbank. The first side, the first place you're gonna put your bait is gonna be on the right hand side of the, of the, the sandbank. Because the current is obviously feeding any organisms, beta organisms that are being crashed out of the, out of the sand by the breaking waves are gonna be washed off on the right hand side. And fish always feed into the current. So typically you would go and first throw would always be on the right hand side if you've got a current from left to right, if you're current ru running the other way, then you would fish on the other side of that bank. So it's, it's those small things that, that make the difference between catching and and standing . Yeah. And fishing.
Speaker 4 (00:30:32):
And that, that is, there was another one you wrote a good piece about sand banks and not only the left and right, but also the back versus the, uh, the the inshore side. So the inshore side where the waves wash the nutrients, um, yeah, off, off the inshore side of the bank and the fish feeding on that side as well. Is that ?
Speaker 3 (00:30:52):
Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, it's, the waves are, if you've got a pushing tide, for example, the waves are breaking, pushing, pushing that food stuff off the front of the bank rather than off the back of the bank. So the fish will be feeding in the gutter on the front of the bank. You'll also find that that early morning your fish will be inside those gutters because in the dark they're not, they're not scared to come in close. And the bait fish are often right inside those inside the gutters. So you wanna be closer rather than further. Um, so it's all about thinking like, how, how would a fish think, you know, you've gotta think about it. Say if I was a fish, where would I be looking? Where if I'm, if I'm a shark, what do I eat? If I'm a a a a Jew fish, where do I go to where, where do I find the mullet that I want to eat?
Speaker 3 (00:31:40):
And and then you, you, you plan your life around that. So it is a lot of thought that goes into it. Um, yeah, people, people tend to stereotype the fishermen is the guy, as you say, he just wants to sit on the beach with a lion in the water and a bear in his hand. But, but the true, a true angler, as I would call it, as an angler is, is none of that. He's, he's a, he's a person who thinks he's very fit. He puts in the effort, um, a technical and puts in a lot of hours, a lot of hours trying to work out all these things. 'cause there's no book that can tell you, there's no one, I can't tell people how it's going to be. It's, it's something that you learn through experience. And, um, I often say to people, I'll walk down the beach with someone.
Speaker 3 (00:32:28):
Let's say you and I walk down the beach and as I'm walking, I'll say, oh, I love that water. And then you turn to me and you say, what do you like about it? And then I have to sit and think of it because why do I like it? The reason I like it is because over the last 40 years of fishing, that pattern has become ingrained in my mind. And when I see it as I subconsciously, I, I realize that it's good water. But once I sit and think about it, then I can explain to you what I'm seeing. But it's, it's hours and hours and hours and hours of hardwick
Speaker 1 (00:33:04):
Considering Yeah, . Yeah. Isn't it weird how that happens, ? I can't, I cannot. Yeah, because I mean, I'm, I know, I mean, I know I'm guilty of it. I'll be at the beach. I'm like, there's a rip, there's the bar, there's the gut. I'm gonna throw a line right there. I'm gonna throw another one there and I'm gonna use my lure right there to target. The toothy got, all right, let's do this. You know, and then you realize you don't have any of your gear and you were just sitting there the entire time for a beach day with your wife. But I mean, you know, those things happen. Um, yeah, you, you mentioned this when it comes to different species. 'cause you're not, you know, like you said, yes, you target one, um, and you plan for it. So you know, if you're going after toothy critters, you have a certain setup. If you're going after, you know, the ones that eat crustaceans, you've got another one. So when it comes to rigging, that's a kind of a broad question here. So can you bring us down a little bit here of what your thoughts are of rigging for fishing, for the, you know, ic, predatory and just kind of everyday fishing for eaters?
Speaker 3 (00:34:14):
Yeah, for eaters, I mean, most of the eaters don't have teeth, so they do, some of them do. So Justin catches some of those funny things on his ski with, with lots of teeth on them. And obviously if you target, yeah, if you're targeting those species and you're throwing, and typically you'll be throwing spoons, lures for that kind of thing. So you'd be like shad, um, Taylor as they call them. Um, and, and barracuda, you generally you'd be throwing lures and you would have a little bit of steel, um, so that you don't get bitten off. So if you're throwing lures nine times outta 10, you're gonna have some steel if you're throwing baits. And we, we as competitive anglers are probably 95% bait throws. So if you're fishing for edible fish, um, most of them don't have teeth. So we would be throwing straight nylon, um, for a trace.
Speaker 3 (00:35:12):
So your trace would be, would be nylon. Um, I tend to fish lighter rather than heavier. Um, I find that the lighter I fish the more pools I get. And so typically my nylon trace would be about a 0.65, which is about 50 pound, would be about a 50 pound, uh, trace snoot, as they would call it. And I fish only with circle hooks. Um, it's something that we've started doing in South Africa now. You'll hardly see a, a j hook anymore in South Africa. Everyone fishes circles. Um, it's less damaging on the fish, catches them in the, in the, in the corner of the mouth and the scissors every time. Um, and we find that we're not, we're not missing fish at all. Your sinker setup is basically linked to the type of rod you're using. So we would be, I, I'd normally be fishing with a, like a five to seven if I'm fishing a five to seven ounce sinker, if I'm fishing for, for edible fish.
Speaker 3 (00:36:21):
And then depending on the, the how strong the water is, I might use a wire sinker with, you know, like, like an anchor sinker. We call it ol and otherwise, yeah, maybe a cone. But I very seldom fish with any other things besides a wire or a cone. Um, purely because I prefer to throw my bait in the right spot and have it stay there than to throw it and then have it wandering around and hoping for the best. Um, if I'm fishing in the reef, I also tend to fish with wire because it doesn't move and you don't get hooked up as much. Um, or my main line, I only fish with braid line, so it's all braided line. Um, the reason for that is obviously the diameter to breaking strength is much better. So you don't drift as much, you don't get messed around by the wind as much.
Speaker 3 (00:37:18):
It's a lot more sensitive. So you get a better feel. And the feel is not so much about getting the bite, but rather about knowing whether you've still got bait on the end. Um, because if you fish with nylon, many times a small fish take your bait off without you even knowing it. Whereas with, with uh, braid, you always know if you've got a bait and um, obviously you can throw further with braid. And the other thing is that nowadays with the, with with braid coming in, we find that the, the fixed pool reels come into their own again. Whereas in the past we never ever fished with a fixed pool reel. We only fished with, with a, with a revolving reel, with a spinning, you know, the, what they call a pen reel. Um, purely because a capacity, but now with a braid being much thinner, we can actually fish with a, with a normal fixable reel, which has got a whole lot of advantages with regard to casting and other such things.
Speaker 3 (00:38:18):
So yeah, so that, that would be my basic setup. So it would just be nylon trays, hook size dependent on the, on the bait size. So you know, if you're throwing a small bait, small hook, throwing a big bait, big hook, um, snu nylon normally six 5.7, so it's about 50 pound. And then, uh, I don't use a running sinker at all, so I don't use a sliding shrivel. Like a lot of people will use a sliding shrivel. My my theory is if a fish bites, it's only got a mouth, it doesn't have any arms and hands. So if it bites the hook's in its mouth, you're gonna hook it. You don't need to worry about it letting go. And yeah. And then the sinkers, I, I fish a lot with a gral sinker. Um, and the fish tend to hook themselves, particularly with a, with a circle hook, you get a bite, the fish is on already no striking required.
Speaker 1 (00:39:13):
Yeah, the grapple. So I think we're talking about the same thing. We're just two different words here. Your grapple is basically a lead piece with legs, essentially, right? I
Speaker 3 (00:39:22):
Exactly. Yeah. But the legs break, they break loose, so Yep. Once they pull, they break loose. Yeah. Yep.
Speaker 1 (00:39:28):
So that's the same thing we use here, the sputniks. Um, and I, like I said then that last paycheck, that's all I use. Um, it could be a non-current day and I'll still use a Sputnik. And the main thing I found was I did a casting day. I went out and took, uh, pyramid cannon ball sinker, arrowhead sinker, Sputnik sinker peer, uh, I, I took a, a myriad and just took 'em out and launched 'em just to see how much, what a difference made. And the sputniks made a huge difference when it came to distance, accuracy and hold. Because a four ounce sinker, a four ounce Sputnik can hold like an eight ounce pyramid. The legs keep it there and you, you know, you can adjust the, the width, you can go 90 degrees out and it's gonna hold even more. Um, the breakaway is gonna be a little bit funky 'cause it's a 90, but those are huge.
Speaker 1 (00:40:18):
So it's kind of cool to hear that you're using them over there. Um, and I like that you added in with the snoots. So when you're talking about your SNS there, I, uh, I see a certain rig in my head that we call the mortician, um, chip from the sinker guy showed me this one. So basically you've got a 50 pound main line with two knots in it, north and south. And then in between it you've got another external sn whether it's 15, 20, 15 pound in between, um, that you just put a knot, uh, a loop knot in the back, and then you just feed it through and go there. Are you talking something of that nature as your snoot or are you talking more as like a single drop or a double drop where it's all continuous on one line?
Speaker 3 (00:40:59):
There's so many different, there's so many different theories. Lots and lots and lots. So quite often, if I'm fishing for, uh, cob, um, a lot of the edibles I'll fish with two hooks. So what we would call it a, a Christmas tree trace. So essentially we, we work with a shrivel and then a shrivel down. You can either use knots or you can use a shrivel. And then you would tie one hook at say, um, it'd say about a meter above the sinker, right? So the sinker would be right at the bottom. So the one hook would be about a meter above, and the second hook would be about half a meter above. So they'd, they'd be separated by about half a meter. So your whole trace would be about one and a half meters. Um, with your, so-called Sputnik at the end and you, we would normally use a smaller hook on the top and a bigger hook on the bottom.
Speaker 3 (00:41:57):
And we would use say a squid bait on the top and a say a soine bait on the bottom and throw it like that into the white water. So you're covering two different baits. Um, also the soine puts out a lot of smell, so it attract, tends to attract smaller fish. And then the other fish come with it might grab the top of hook, top hook. Um, some of the fish like to feed a little bit higher up, so it's nice to have a second hook up top. Um, but generally for distance, I'll fish only one hook. Um, my snoot would be around about 700 millimeters. So what's that about? No, not even 7, 9, 500 be about one and a half foot, maybe two foot, the snoot hook snoot and a think a snoot would be a little bit longer. Um, I never fish with a snoot, a sink, a snoot shorter than the, than the hook snoot.
Speaker 3 (00:42:54):
A lot of people do. They seem to believe that it, it keeps the bait on the ground or what, I don't know. But my, my experience is that your bait needs to be off the ground in most cases. Um, if you've ever sat in a fish tank and taken a piece of bait on a, on a, on a, on a piece of string and put it into a fish tank, put it on the bottom, the fish will swim around and and ignore it. The moment you lift it, they'll go for it. So we sometimes actually even put foam inside our, our baits. We put, um, polystyrene inside the baits to lift them, to make them more visible. Um, but give them more action, they move it better in the water. And our baits are all tied to look like something. They're not just blobs. They, we, we actually spend a lot of time making sure the bait is, you know, is aerodynamic firstly for, for throwing and secondly for lying in the water that it doesn't twist and it doesn't tangle. Um, so the smaller things that, that we play around with. But yeah, so the snoots are obviously if you, if you're fishing for sharks, then the snoots are, you know, they can be anything up to two and a half meters. Um, what's that? Nearly eight foot long, um, with full steel, you know, a hundred, 150 pound, 200 pound steel and we'll fish for like, like that. So yeah, long traces.
Speaker 1 (00:44:21):
It's interesting when you talk about the foam though, um, you know, one of the big things that I hear plenty of anglers talk about is, you know, we use it here. Sorry, I was looking to see if I actually had a rig in here. Um, but I don't right now. Uh, you know, floats, uh, on the end of, you know, you get the, the SN float, then your hook and you know, you're hoping that brings you up. Um, and it's a, a big problem I see is people forget that buoyancy plays a different game. You can't put a certain, you, you can't put a certain piece of bait on a foam that's not designed to hold that much weight. It doesn't work, it's gonna sit on the bottom and it's just gonna be useless. Um, but I like that you were adding in there that adding the foam to your bait itself because I mean, you're using the sardines, you're using different pieces of fish, um, adding that in to create buoyancy to get it off the ground. And on a longer snoot, which is even more of a, oh, okay, I could see that one working, especially to get different columns. 'cause you're not playing the bottom column, you're playing bottom, middle up. Um, 'cause you've only got a certain amount of water to fish. The, the, the, the setup that you have with that. Uh, I guess my question really comes down to is when you talk about putting the foam with your bait, are you wrapping it with a string set or is it kind of an ingestion? How do you normally play that?
Speaker 3 (00:45:44):
Well, so what you would do, the easiest way to explain it would be on a J hook. Uh, because ba up circle hooks is another game altogether. So I'm not going to even go there because for someone who's never worked with circle hook hooks, they wouldn't understand what we're talking about. But on a J hook, we would typically, we would take a piece of foam, we would cut it to like a, an elongated egg, that sort of shape. Then we would tie that onto the, onto the shank of the hook on the back. So you've now got, alright. Right. So, so that would be tied on with elastic cotton. Um, and then once that's tied on, then we might take a piece of squid and then wrap it around that, that, uh, that piece of foam. And for, we might give it some tails so that by the time you've finished, you've got a, a hook, um, with some tails hanging below it and a body made out of, made of, uh, foam with, with squid wrapped around it.
Speaker 3 (00:46:47):
So at the end of the day you've got a little fish for want of a better description. And, and when you throw that, we would, we would typically would clip our sinker onto the hook itself. Um, it would have like a little hook on it and we would throw the whole lot together. So it throws you get an extra 20, 30 meters in distance out of that. Yeah. So that it's not swinging around in the air. And then once it lands, obviously breaks away and then the, the foam then floats that bait up and keeps it in the, in the mid column. Um, there are lots of different ways. I've got other ways where I can actually fish. I can fish nine meters off the bottom with different res. Um, but yeah, there's so many different ideas and things that yeah, you've just gotta try. You know, if you, you sit, you know what it's like you're sitting having a beer, talking, some talking nonsense with a friend and, and he says, oh, I wonder what would happen if we did this. And then you try it, you know, and sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. So
Speaker 1 (00:47:48):
, yeah, learning off the old, changing things up with, you know, solving all the world's problems over a beer at the beach. Who, who knew it would be so effective ?
Speaker 3 (00:47:57):
Well, you see, you see when you, when you compete, and this is why I, I'll bring it back to the competition side of things. When you compete, you're always seeking the competitive edge. So you've gotta come up with new ideas all the time to stay ahead of the mob. And um, yeah, that's what we do.
Speaker 1 (00:48:16):
Definitely. Lots
Speaker 3 (00:48:17):
Of tricks.
Speaker 1 (00:48:18):
I can, I can see that for sure. Um, it's been 40. Oh, we're almost about, yeah, we're overdue. I'm, I'm due for another paycheck here. But you, you we're going back into the competition here 'cause I got, you said something that really rung me and we're gonna play into that here right after this.
Speaker 1 (00:48:38):
It is the second paycheck of the episode. Hopefully everything's been so good for you. Just, you're just listen to this in the car on the way home. Yeah. 'cause that's what we want. This paycheck is being brought to you by ninja tackle. Ninja tackle va.com. Great place to go. If you're looking for my absolute favorite rods that I utilize, the Ninja Dagger series seven footers all the way up to 13 three. This thing, it's a great set of rods for all sorts of great fishing. You wanna do fresh water, salt water, they, if you're seven footer will do a lot of things. My favorite one of the greats eight, six throwing metal off the beach. Two ouncers all day, all day. It loves to eat it up. And it'll go even lower than that, that 12 footer. You know, I use those for fun and excitement.
Speaker 1 (00:49:16):
And the 13, I haven't thrown it yet, but everyone that's thrown one said it's great. Absolute great product. You need reels, rigs, he's got 'em all in there. Different pieces. And it's not just for Florida or Virginia or any of that. It's an international great use. And if you're into the firearms and firearm accessories, ninja Tactical. Yep. He's got you covered there for optics and other parts that's best. I can say it on here without getting a warning from the other matters of internet. So ninja tackle va.com. Go take a look today. Get your order in. Good stuff. Okay, so we're talking about competition here and you're talking about rigs and the setups and competitive edge. And I think one piece of the paint, the one piece that we didn't talk about, and it's easy to not say this is, uh, different world or different places, different beaches, different countries have different depths. You got high impact beaches here, low impact beaches, you got long beaches outta Texas is one of the ones I love talking about. 'cause guy's gotta walk 200 yards off the beach just to get an extra three feet of water. The depth wrench makes huge difference. And Justin, you can throw into this, I mean, with your beaches in Australia, Julian versus the South African beaches depth from the shore makes a hu I mean it is noticeable difference
Speaker 4 (00:50:33):
I think. Um, my experience of being like, like I said, I've been in Australia for five years now and the beaches are actually, I'd say quite similar, like remarkably, wonderfully similar to the ones in South Africa. Oh, nice. Um, yeah, it's actually really good. And we've got a lot of the same sorts of gutters and channel structures. Um, I'm yet to see as many really deep water points, like the ones that we've seen in South Africa, but off the beach. Yeah, it's not, it's not that hard. Sort of get to like three meters of water up to five meters of water. So yeah, it's, it's actually, it's pretty nice. Um, I, I can't say that I do as much waiting as my dad does. I'll get there. Um, it's, it's, it's still pretty early in my rock and surf fishing career I'd say. But, um, yeah, I, I, yeah. Dad, what about you? What was your, what did you think of Australia versus South Africa? Was it what I said correct or accurate?
Speaker 3 (00:51:28):
Yeah, I think, I mean, where we fished absolutely, uh, it was very similar. Um, but then bear in mind that the, you know, that the latitude that we were fishing at in Australia is very similar to the latitude where we used to live. Um, but Australia's a huge country, you know, and I think that once you start going north and you start getting into the, into the zone where, you know, where the barrier reefers and everything, it'll be a totally different kettle of fish. In fact, I, I would be surprised if you could do much more than do spinning up there. I don't think that you would become, it wouldn't be possible to, to bait fish that easily because, um, you'd be in very shallow water forever, my guess. Um, and I have been up to the Barrier Reef, so I've got a rough idea of what it looks like.
Speaker 3 (00:52:15):
Um, and I think as you go further south, obviously, you know, the waters gets more like Cape Town water, it gets a bit, a bit colder. Um, it might get flatter there. There's, it's so much, you know, so much that can change from just, you know, just over a, over a distance of 50 kilometers. Um, so I think it's, you know, it's very difficult to try and compare the two places. I think what you've gotta do is you've gotta look at the species again. And I come back to this every time, and you've gotta say what species in Australia are gonna be similar to the species in South Africa. And will they feed the same way? Yes, they probably will. And so, just as an example, we, we catch a, a very nice eating fish in South Africa called a stump nose. And while I was fishing for the, they, they also live in, in whitewater and churning white water.
Speaker 3 (00:53:08):
And while I was fishing for the, the Jew fish, um, I also caught a stump nose, which looked surprisingly like our stump notes and I don't even know what it was called. It's probably got some funny Australian name. But the point is, is that, you know, the fish all evolved in these different parts of the world and they genetically they're slightly different, but physically they're very similar and they, they eat similar things and they operate in similar water, which is why they've, they've evolved into those particular shapes. And, um, so I think where it doesn't really matter where you go in the world, I think that you're gonna find similar species in similar latitudes. And I, I use latitudes rather than water types because I think latitude is what determines water temperature in a lot of cases. Not only latitude, but also are you on the east coast or on the west coast? So in South Africa, our West coast is cold water. Our east coast is warm water in Australia. Your west coast is cold water. Your East coast is warm water in America. I think the same thing. Um, you can correct me if I'm wrong. I've never fished in America, so I I'm, I'm guessing
Speaker 1 (00:54:26):
You, you're, you're pretty good there. The west coast of the United States is definitely, the Pacific Ocean is definitely chillier. Um, in certain zones where there is the Atlantic, you're gonna play a little bit warmer. Especially like my area, the Gulf of Mexico. Um, it will routinely hit, I'm gonna say in Fahrenheit. 'cause I can't do centigrade. I suck at that . Uh, but the, our, our normal running in the summer, it, it is not uncommon to hit 87 to 90 degrees Fahrenheit. It's very weird. Yeah. Sounds warm . It's, it's bath water. Strange. It's like, why is, why is it this, I, you know, you go into the water to cool off and you're not cooling off. Um, , it's pretty depressing. Whereas when I was out in California, uh, when I was stationed out there, uh, you get into the water like, oh, oh, there's some shrinkage and it's not expected in June.
Speaker 1 (00:55:22):
You know, it's, it, it can be that way. Um, but I love that you brought up latitude. Um, I never really thought of latitudes of that nature because it, it, you know, for us it's, it can play a different game. But I mean, you on the same one for us, uh, you know, what I have in the Atlantic Ocean versus the, the Pacific Ocean on our side is you got different species. Some of 'em are kind of same. You got some similarities Sure. Perch and that sort of thing. You can run into different ones or, uh, close twos. But, you know, you're not catching a Pompano, uh, like a Florida Pompano off the coast of, you know, California. They just don't migrate that way. Mm. But what the differential being, like you said, Northern Australia versus Southern Australia, huge differential there in that distance alone. 'cause people, like, people look at a map, they're like, Australia's not that big. Australia's freaking huge . Yeah. People, yeah. A hundred percent . The map does not give that country enough, uh, credit for how big it is. The state that I live in is the size of South Africa.
Speaker 4 (00:56:23):
, just the state of Queensland is the size of South Africa. It's, uh, it's crazy.
Speaker 1 (00:56:28):
Yeah. And so your differential pieces with that makes difference. Uh, huge points there. The, what I didn't expect, and, uh, I think it's, I I'm glad you brought that up. Um, our beaches, mine, you'd be, you'd be hard pressed. Let's see here. How far out of that? Probably 200, 200, 300 meters you'd be lucky to hit was meter three feet, 3, 6, 9. You'd be lucky to hit four meters of depth within 200, uh, the 300 yards. You'd be lucky to get that far. The majority of the water as it runs, I am six, so that's 3 6 2 meters. One and a half meters of water is very common for us. So we don't have that big cut. But if I go up to Massachusetts, up to New England, up, up to the Cape, I could be end up hitting 20 meters of water if I, if I walked out a little bit further, you know, the, the quick drop off is a, a differential piece.
Speaker 1 (00:57:34):
And I think as an angler, you said it best with that is knowing what you're gonna target, what that makes a difference of how you can fish. I can't throw a single dropper with a piece of fish bites, uh, here or, you know, here with like that and be like, oh, I'm gonna catch this species the exact same way I would do it in Massachusetts. There's no way. I'm not gonna catch a striped bass that way. I have to do it a certain piece. So knowing your depth, knowing your fish, knowing what you're doing, like you said with different pieces, makes the huge difference. It's all the, it's all in the end there.
Speaker 3 (00:58:08):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (00:58:11):
We, uh,
Speaker 1 (00:58:12):
I wasn't supposed to Go ahead, .
Speaker 4 (00:58:14):
We, we fished a spot recently that, um, it, it dropped off from the edge right down to like 20 meters. And that was when my dad was over here in Australia. Um, and we watched how some of the local guys were doing it. They were fishing with balloons and live herring and just drifting their mouths. And we caught quite a lot of, um, long tail tuna up to like 30 kgs or something right off the side there. So we've got a bit of a mix of spots here where we've got these like big drop offs, but then also those long flat beaches.
Speaker 1 (00:58:43):
Hmm. Balloon fishing is a fun one to watch, isn't it? It's like, how did you just drift that bait? I mean, it's a long wait, but getting that bait out there like that, it's so smart. I mean, I would've loved to have been around the person that thought, oh, I'm gonna put a balloon on this line. I don't wanna take it out there freaking half a mile and I'm gonna make it work. . It's just genius.
Speaker 3 (00:59:01):
I think, I think the most, the most surprising thing about that was how str how fast the drop off was. So the drop off was literally like fishing on a cliff. The tuna actually bit, they took those baits within 20 meters of the side. Mm-Hmm.
Speaker 4 (00:59:17):
.
Speaker 3 (00:59:17):
So we weren't, you can't throw it far, you cannot throw it far. And the wind was, and the wind wasn't offshore, so it wasn't like it was blowing the balloon out. The balloon was merely there to, to keep the bait on the surface because the, because the tuna, they seemed to like it there. And, um, yeah, they, they, they came in so close, it was ridiculous. They obviously just liked that deep water. And obviously, you know, we were catching, we were catching the herring with little lures right. Where we were fishing. So they were coming in to feed on those, and all we had to do was throw on the outside of that little shoal and they would eat it. So yeah, it's amazing.
Speaker 1 (00:59:58):
That column makes a difference, man. I mean, just different water columns produce so many different things. It's, you know, like space age movies, cars are driving at different altitudes. Yes. They don't even get it. Same with the fish. They're all gonna travel at different speeds, different altitudes, you know, depths and all that. It's fun. I've,
Speaker 3 (01:00:15):
I've worked out a new plan for the next trip, so I I I think next time we're going to, we are gonna do even better. I said to Justin, I've got some good ideas. We said, we don't need balloons. Yeah. And then we're gonna catch a lot of fish.
Speaker 4 (01:00:30):
I'm looking forward to that. , we already had too, too many fish. Uh, , our freezers, our freezers were completely full with tuna.
Speaker 1 (01:00:39):
Oh, no. Not that anything but that. Yeah. ,
Speaker 4 (01:00:43):
Someone took it away from me.
Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
That's a good problem to have. Um, so with competition, you've nailed into a lot of pieces and I've really enjoyed it. And I love how you're, you tied it all together. Um, how competition has really changed your way of view of Phish. Uh, I can kind of hear through the story there. I know I'm using my words, not yours on that, but how you've connected the pieces for that to be successful. I mean, like you said, you went down to go see Justin in another country, different from where it is. Same latitude if you play into that. But you were still successful based on what you've learned from previous and you've put it all together to make it work. And that's, that, that says a lot about what you've learned and how to use it. So well done, sir. Very well done.
Speaker 3 (01:01:31):
Thank you. Yep.
Speaker 1 (01:01:34):
Um, we'll get into the closing pieces here actually. Uh, but one of the ones that I didn't ask you earlier was what are some top surfing mistakes to avoid that you've learned? And how can anglers continuously improve the skills and their knowledge to create, create success?
Speaker 3 (01:01:56):
Yeah, I think, I think one of the mistakes that, that the fishermen makes, and I'm gonna refer to 'em as the fisherman. I think it's the biggest mistake that I see is the fallacy that you have to fish in the deep blue. Um, you know, they, they look at the water and if it's deep and it's blue, then you throw bait in it and you hope for the best. That, and I think anyone who's been even slightly successful in, in fishing knows that it's, that's not what it's about. It's not about throwing in the deep blue, it's about fishing in the white water. So I think that if, if that's one message I can take across, that would be one of the things. The second one I think that, that a lot of people mess up quite badly on is, is their tackle, particularly their knots.
Speaker 3 (01:02:46):
Um, people don't take time to learn the correct knots. And often you'll, you'll see a guy fighting a fish for 10, 15 minutes and suddenly nothing. And when he reels out, his, his leader is gone because the leader not, didn't work. Um, the other third one is buying, buying cheap tackle. Um, particularly hooks that can break, number one, they can open number two or number three, they're not sharp, um, sharp hooks. If, if, if there's anything that I can tell someone is to make sure their hooks are sharp. If there's a slightest little bend in the tip of the hook because it bumped a rock or whatever, just discard that hook. Don't use it because you will lose fish. Um, when in the old days when we used to, before they, they started chemically hook, um, sharpening hooks. We all used to carry a file and we used to file our hooks to an absolute needle point. And, and it makes, it makes a difference. It makes 20 to 30% difference on your hookup rate. Um, so yeah, those are the three things I would look at would be nuts. Water selection, and your hooks. Make sure that they've got, they've got points on them.
Speaker 4 (01:04:04):
Dad, dad, you said something really good in Australia how people win competitions. It's by the fish that they lose, not by the fish that they catch.
Speaker 3 (01:04:14):
A hundred percent. Yeah. Something
Speaker 4 (01:04:15):
Like that. Yeah, because, because of those blunt hooks, the cheap tackle and Yeah. Well by blunt hooks and cheap tackle specifically.
Speaker 3 (01:04:24):
Yeah. I think, I think Justin, the one, the one thing that, that I recall, particularly with yourself now, you know, when you started, uh, your, your paddle ski fishing. Mm-Hmm. , you, you were complaining that you were getting a lot of pools, but you weren't hooking the fish. Yeah. And, and I, and I asked you how tight, how tight is your drag? Yeah. You said, oh no, I keep it very loose, you know, because then I don't want to spook the fish. I said, tighten your drag. Yeah. The moment you tighten your drag hookup changed. And the hookup changed because there's more resistance, number one, which helps to sink the hook. But also it works the same way with the sharpening of your hook. If your hook's not sharp, it doesn't penetrate and you just miss too many fish. Um, so it's worthwhile spending money on, on decent hooks.
Speaker 3 (01:05:09):
Um, and I, I, I tend to stick to hooks that I trust and I don't change. Whereas you'll find there's a lot of fashion in fishing, uh, people will look to the, the, the top guys or the, what should we call them? The, the fishing influences. And they always want to be fishing with what that guy fishes with. And so if you keep changing your tackle, you've gotta get used to it. Every time you change, you've gotta get used to it. You know that hook, you've gotta bait it up slightly differently. You, you know, it, it might not, it's got a different gap. It's got all sorts of things that are different. And so I tend to stick to one type of, of hook and that I stick with and I learn to use it. And that's what I use. And, and it works for me.
Speaker 1 (01:06:00):
Okay. Now I'm gonna ask what kinda look, is it
Speaker 3 (01:06:03):
? I use, I use a, a tuna mustard, uh, a mustard circle. Um, and it's uh, it's, uh, an off an offset. So it's, it's slightly offset. So they call it a mustard, tuna offset circle. That's what I use. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:06:20):
I wish I could use that. Florida, we get, we get slapped for using offsets . It's a, that's a big no-no for us offsets are,
Speaker 3 (01:06:28):
Well if you're using, if you are using j if you are using j hooks, offsets are a no-no, because they, they really bad give you a bad hookup. But on, on, uh, on a circle, no problem at all. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (01:06:40):
Yeah. There's, that was a very unfortunate learning experience for me. Uh, didn't realize the offset J hook was a no-no down here. And I was quickly educated, uh, . But they do, they make a huge difference. Um, we're gonna continue on that because I know we're already an hour in and we got a little bit more time. But I wanna do one more paycheck so we don't have to do another one. 'cause you brought up something fun.
Speaker 1 (01:07:11):
Uh, I'm like super excited to get back into the conversation, but here we go. This paycheck is being brought to you by DS custom tackle Ds custom tackles out of the Delaware area. And they make excellent gear for you to build your own rigs, or they have rigs readily available for you, whether you're fishing for Pompano, blue fish, squid, all those pieces, everything in between. They, if you want to get into making your own rigs and selling them online, DS custom actually has an available program for you to get your hands on all that gear. So you can do that and reach out to them and talk about it. If you want to build into fun things, making your own rigs with night fishing. One of the things, I love the skulls, they go in the dark. I have a whole thing about going dark fishing.
Speaker 1 (01:07:52):
I'm not gonna get into that right now, but I will say it makes a little bit of a difference. So ds custom tackle.com. Go take a look. You, you're gonna find something. I guarantee it. So, okay. So when you start talking about sharpness of hooks, um, my buddy Justin from Justin Reed fishing, I fished with him all the time. I still do. And I love the guy. He showed me one thing, he used to take his circle hooks and he put it above his thumbnail and he'd run it across. If it didn't grab, it was gone. I never thought about it. I was like, oh, okay. And then I figured after what, we did a tournament, we were in a big tournament and it was, it was crush mode. We were just killing it, hitting every fish we could. And then all of a sudden it started slowly dissipating and I figured it out.
Speaker 1 (01:08:31):
It was 'cause I had a dull hook. I think one of the things people forget about when it comes to sharpening of hooks, and this is why I'm asking, saying this for a question is bait. You hook up your bait, you penetrate that hook, you cause something to it. It's like a needle. Every time you poke a needle into something, it gets a little dull. When you're doing all those ones and you're constantly reating and all that, you're dulling the hook a little bit off the tip. What do you do now to keep yours sharp? 'cause like you said, they're chemically sharpened. Do you still do the filing? Do you do anything else?
Speaker 3 (01:09:05):
No, no, we don't carry a file anymore for, firstly, a a circle hook is virtually impossible to, to shop. And it's really just purely because of the shape. It's really difficult to, to sharpen it. Um, so if we were fishing a tournament, we would, we would carry several traces. You wouldn't just use one trace. Um, so you would just change your trace, um, before the tournament. You, you'll have a trace wallet in there. You'll have probably five or six of each type of trace that you, you might use on the day. And you just replace them, um, as and when required, because obviously, you know, even with a, with a, with an nylon trace, if it's, if you using it and you've caught four or five fish, you'll find that the, the nylons also tends to get all buckled and bent and it doesn't hang properly anymore. So just cut that trace. We put a new one on throw again. Um, so your hook, stay, stay sharp. It's not really a concern.
Speaker 1 (01:10:04):
That's smart though. I'm glad you brought up the hook thing because I think, I think tackle is, it's different than when like Justin and I were kids. Yeah. Tackle was kind of one of those things. Dad has his gear, don't mess with dad's gear, you know, it's, it's that constant use. But now, and you could buy 20 hooks for, you know, 10, 15 bucks and just run it from there. It's disposable it quick and easy changes.
Speaker 3 (01:10:33):
So
Speaker 1 (01:10:35):
I just think we've come a long way with technology on that. So I love that you adding in with the piece, especially with the nylons. You can just look, just switch it out. Doesn't hurt you. So let's move into, uh, some of the closing pieces here. You mentioned top phishing stop, top surf phishing mistakes. But let's talk about a brand new angler. They're just getting into this. They're, they're learning the hard way through the hard knock motion of, uh, trial and error. What are some know, what is some knowledge you would give to a brand new angler to get a, a head start
Speaker 3 (01:11:06):
In South Africa? I know what I would tell the guy, , uh, I, I can't speak for your country, but certainly in South Africa, what I would tell the guy is join a club. That would be the first thing. You, you can't, you, you, you, there's no ways that you can learn as quickly on your own as you can if you are under the wing of someone who can teach you. Um, so in South Africa, when, when I was still club fishing, which I, well, I I still do a little bit, but you know, I would, I would take those youngsters under my wing. So they would join a club and I would say, you're now going to fish with me for the next 10 competitions. You're gonna be my fishing partner and you teach 'em. Um, so that would be rule, that would be sort of like, yeah, that would be the best option.
Speaker 3 (01:11:59):
But certainly if you can find someone to who, who's got experience, who can actually teach you the, you can't beat that. Otherwise, what, what I used to do when I first started fishing, and I'm, I'm talking now, 40 years ago when I first started, and I, I really didn't know much about surf fishing at the time. What I did a lot of is I used to fish on my own a lot. And it sounds totally backwards now because I'm saying on the one side that you should get someone to teach you. But on the other side, you also need to develop your own skills through experience. And by spending time on your own on the beach and trying look different things without someone laughing at you makes a huge difference because you learn what works and what doesn't work. And I would go, for example, when I was really competitive, I would go down to the beach on the worst conditions that I could think of screaming Southwest, three and a half meter swell, you know, massive side wash and go and see if I can actually catch a fish in those conditions.
Speaker 3 (01:13:05):
And, and it's amazing what you can achieve if you, if you, if you go and work at it and you think about it, because sometimes you're gonna be thrown in those situations and you need to know how to do it. Um, so yeah, I I think fishing on your own is a big thing. I think also being prepared to walk and look at the beach, work your way through it. Um, too many people will walk onto the beach and fish straight in front of the access point. I think it's worthwhile taking a good stroll on the beach and trying places where no one else has fished. Uh, obviously if, if you in one spot and there's 10 people fishing there, then your chances of catching that one fish that's there is one in 10. If you walk down a beach and you one there and there's one fish, then your chance of catching it is a hundred percent. So yeah, I, I think you spend time on your own and try and find someone to, to teach you.
Speaker 1 (01:14:04):
Nice. Good one. Justin, what about you? What are your thoughts on that?
Speaker 4 (01:14:08):
I would say what, what I, what I've learned, my, my humble experience is, um, like learning to take control of the situation. And whether that's fishing off a kayak, whether that's spear fishing, whether that's fishing from the side. If you get to the beach and you throw a bait and after 20 minutes you're not getting any pulls, change something. Um, if you're getting pulls and you're not hooking up, then maybe go to a smaller hook, uh, change from squid to sardine, walk a bit, try and find another gutter, throw in closer, try to throw further. But, um, but, but by no means just, um, settle for failure. Um, work, put the work in, I would say. Yeah, I found, I found that that's really helped, like, like I said, across all of those disciplines, like just taking control of the situation.
Speaker 1 (01:15:01):
All right. I like it guys. All right, Julian, uh, I didn't ask this question earlier. I kind of held it off to the end and I'm kind of glad I did. Can you share a memorable fishing story or moment, including some unexpected catches and wins
Speaker 3 (01:15:14):
? Yeah, I actually looked at that. I've got a, I had a few that I thought about. I'm not quite sure which one is, is the better one.
Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
Go with 'em all. Give give us a couple here, man. I don't mean share the memories 'cause memories are some of the best stories.
Speaker 3 (01:15:27):
I think the funnier, one of the funnier ones. Um, I was fishing a tournament, uh, down in Jeffries Bay, which you might know from, from the surfing day. You know, it's, it's a very famous surfing spot. Um, and we were fishing there and we, myself and a, a good friend of mine who was fishing for one of the opposition pro provinces, um, we waited out onto this very, very difficult bank. Um, we got out there, the waves were pounding, pounding, pounding, um, and we were fishing for ragged tooth sharks. Um, he threw a bait with a, with a nel sinker. Um, I thought I'd take a chance and throw a, a cone sinker just to get a bit of movement in the bait because I wanted it to move. And there was quite a sort of a, not a strong current, but a slight current.
Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
So I thought, let me rather do it that way. Anyway, we threw in and after about 10, 15, 10 minutes, we decided that, that the sea was far too strong. It was far too difficult to stay out there. So we said, we, we decided that the two of us would then walk back, we'd swim back to the beach and we'd stand on the beach rather. And of course, because he had a grapnel sinker, he was able to hold. And because I was now further away from the water with a, with the cone sinker, I was starting to wash. And anyway, I was washing and washing and washing. I was walking behind the sinker to stay with straight with my line. And the next thing, Darien, my friend got a bite and he went tight and he started fighting the fish and he started coming down towards me.
Speaker 3 (01:17:07):
And then our lines were tangled. And, uh, it was a bit of a circus. Uh, i, I just had to just, just reel in slowly while he fought the fish so that I didn't burn him off. And eventually we landed the fish. It was a raggy of, I think it was just over 110 kilos. And I went down to go and look at the, you know, to take his, help him with the fish to unhook his fish. I got there and I found that my trace was right down this fish's throat. And his, his hook was actually, was hooked onto my sinker, so it was my fish . So I got the fish, he did all the work.
Speaker 4 (01:17:48):
That's amazing. And I
Speaker 3 (01:17:49):
Got the fish.
Speaker 4 (01:17:49):
That is amazing. I'd love, oh my God, I'd love to share a story afterwards that's similar. But Dad, didn't you once have a story about some dude who thought he, he fought and fought and fought and then eventually he realized he was fighting his single or something
Speaker 3 (01:18:04):
, lots of those. So yeah. So that was, that was the one story then.
Speaker 4 (01:18:08):
That's amazing. Oh my God.
Speaker 3 (01:18:11):
Then another one, um, I made a note of Oh yes. And you know, probably one of the most stressful things that ever happened to me fishing in, in our home ward is also in a, in a national chimps and not a lot of fish around. And I hooked a, a good fish. I mean, when I say a good fish, a proper fish. And I fought it for five and a half hours and eventually I, I got it, it was a very steep beach, and it was up the beach and it was down the beach and it was up the beach and it was down the beach seeing, you know, you could see it all the time, but not being able to gaff, the guys couldn't get all of it. 'cause the, the swell was so big and the sho dump was so big. And eventually I lost the fish.
Speaker 3 (01:18:55):
It was a, it was a spotted eagle ray of, of probably 120 kilos, beautiful fish. Um, an absolute epic fish, you know? Yeah. One of those things you dream about. And anyway, I lost it. And, and, and I, I still have nightmares about that fish, you know, what could I have done differently? I was so exhausted by the end of that, I must be honest, that I was cramping all over. And yeah, that was, that was a difficult species, a difficult fish to catch. And yeah, I still, I still have nightmares about it would've put me on top of the tournament, would've won the tournament, would've been fish of the tournament. It would've been everything, medals, the lots. So yeah. Anyway, that was one of them. And then the other one, I, I think back to just give you some idea of, of what's necessary sometimes, you know, to, when you're fishing, a comp fishing up at a place called Cape Vital.
Speaker 3 (01:19:49):
Um, very, very, very few fish around, very clean water, very flat. Um, which is very, you know, really not the kind of water you want to fish with. In, in Cape Vital. And I hooked a, a honeycomb ray, um, which was, was going to be a winning fish. There was no doubt. 'cause nothing was happening. So I fought it and I fought it, came, got it close, and I felt the line go around a rock. I thought, Hmm, here we go. It was still probably 50 meters from the side. And I pulled this way, pulled that way, gave it free spool, didn't do anything, stayed on the rock. So eventually I just said, too bad. I took my clothes off, leapt over the side of the, the, off the rock into the, into the water, swam up 50 meters, looked down, I could see the fish with my line around the rock, pushed my rod down to the tipped until I could get it off the rock. Got the fish off the rock, swam back, landed the fish, New York . But that, that was, that was my first, that was my first South African colors right there. So yeah, it's, it's the extras that you have to do, you know, it's just, yeah, sometimes you have to do these things. So yeah. So those are the three memories that I have that are one funny one and a couple of others. But yeah, sometimes you fail, sometimes you don't. It's, it's fishing.
Speaker 4 (01:21:14):
Yeah. Justin, what was that one? Go for it. Um, Maan was, um, so we grew up, we grew up in that small, that small village, um, tanni thousand people living there. We had an amazing esry that ran, um, down through the national park. And as kids, we, like, maybe like 10 year olds, we used to go down there. We used to like have like mud wars. We, we were just completely feral. And the one day, um, we had taken the cast net, we'd caught a bunch of prawns and we were catching these spotted gruer, which are like, you know, up to, up to 2, 3, 4 kilos. Good eating. Um, and so one of my mates, um, he, no, sorry, I put, I put a bait on my, my little bas rodd and I threw it out. And then as we were having these mud wars, I looked back at the jetty and I saw my rod just go into the water.
Speaker 4 (01:21:59):
I was like, oh, no. Like, just like swearing, like far too much for a 10-year-old at that point, just screaming, oh my God. Like, um, ended up going and jumping off the jetty and swimming after my rod. I grabbed my rod and I was fighting this fish, and I was just yelling profanities at it, like families are walking past, covering their children's ears. And, and, and in all my, my frantic fervor, I ended up snapping the line and I, I was distraught, like, oh man, I lost this gruer. I didn't know it was a gruer at the time, but then anyway, um, put the rod back on the, on the jetty and carried on with my mud war. Um, and my mate went and baited it up again. He just casted this bait type and he left it there on the jet. No, sorry, sorry, sorry. This, it was a long time ago. You'll have to just cut that bit out. Um, so I think my mate goes and he casts his line in and he gets, he gets a pull, he fights this fish, he pulls it in. It turns out the lion that I'd snapped off that was hanging out of the gru's mouth had tied a single knot around my mate's hook, and he managed to hook this and pull this gruer in, and we had gruer for dinner.
Speaker 1 (01:23:13):
Nice.
Speaker 4 (01:23:15):
Like, the chances are it, it, yeah, it's hard to remember the sequence of events and it's hard to believe the story, but it sounds like my dad's story was equally crazy . So these things happen.
Speaker 1 (01:23:28):
That's so good, guys. Yeah, that's so good. A little luck never hurts anybody ever. Oh yeah. That's what it's all about. Let's run into this kind of last one here. Before we wrap. Do you have any kind of final thoughts, uh, that you'd like to share with listeners who are interested in getting into surf fishing or into competitions?
Speaker 3 (01:23:51):
Yeah, again, I think that the competitions that we fish in in South Africa and Namibia are, are so unique that they're really not repeated in other parts of the world as far as I know. I know that in Europe and in America, not so much in America, south America, Brazil, they fish a, a competition circuit that they, they call it Phipps, which is also some kind of surf angling, but it's, it's fished very similar to fishing for cop, you know, with, with pegs peg fishing. Um, and it's not really the kind of fishing that we do. Um, so I don't know that competition fishing is really relevant to this conversation from, from that point of view, because I don't think that the opportunities are out there for people to really get involved in other countries besides Naira in South Africa. But I think that fishing in itself is always competitive.
Speaker 3 (01:24:50):
So if you go fishing with a mate, you stand next to him and you always going to brag about your fish being bigger than his fish, or you caught more fish than the other guy did. And so fishing in itself is competitive. Um, and I think that you don't need to necessarily belong to a club or, or whatever, but what you should be doing is you should be trying to improve your abilities and not just be going to the beach to drink beer, because I think that's where, you know, a lot of, a lot of fishing or has, has got a bad reputation. So if you look at the jokes and you look at the cartoons that are out there, it's always about the guy sitting there drinking his beer and throwing his cans on the side of the beach and what have you. So I, I would like to see people trying to improve their skills more, number one.
Speaker 3 (01:25:41):
Number two, to have more respect for the, for the fish themselves and to see more catch and release. Um, because it's, it is a finite part of things. We, we are very quick to, to blame the lack of fish on the trawlers and the long liners and the commercials, et cetera, et cetera. But we all play a part and there are certain species that only can only be caught from the beach. Um, so some of your reef species, they don't even go out very far. And yet we seem to think that we can just take them forever and we can just keep eating them and then complain about the, you know, everyone else. Um, so I'm a great supporter of te of, of catch and release. Uh, I actually, um, am an active tagger. Uh, I've tagged over 800 fish, um, in my career. And, and then thirdly, I think be aware of the environment, you know, littering.
Speaker 3 (01:26:35):
Um, it, it drives me absolutely crazy, particularly in, in some of these countries. I mean, South Africa is terrible. I mean, some people are just, they just drive you absolutely mad. You can't understand how a guy can go down to the beach and take a case of bears with him and leave all the bottles on the beach, but he can carry them to the beach, but he can't carry the empties back. It absolutely destroys me. You know, leaving nylon, you know, nylon on the beach, which is getting tangled up with the birds and killing birds, you know, leaving, uh, hooks on the beach with be on, which dogs come and pick up and they get them hooked in their, in their throats. Um, kids stand on those hooks they end up with, with even those sinkers, the, those same grappling sinkers that we spoke about. You know, they kids come and they stand on, they get a piece of wire through their foot. Guys, if I, if there's anything that, that I would like to sort of put in, just respect the, the environment, inspect the, you know, respect the fish and, and enjoy it, you know, go out and enjoy the environment, enjoy the, the whole experience, but don't mess it up for other people.
Speaker 4 (01:27:38):
A hundred percent on that. Hey, um, yeah, leave, leave the place as you found it, if not better. Because also often you go to the spots, even the deep water spots, even here in Australia, sometimes you'll go and you'll see like bits of nylon lying around and all like old bait and puddles and it's just, yeah, it's just not a good look
Speaker 1 (01:27:59):
And it doesn't make sense. I, I, I truly don't understand people like that because it's you, you're going out there to fish and you, which means you have some common sense, I would think, uh, about the resources that you have around you and what you're fishing, you know, you're protecting that area. You need to continue to make it good so we can continue to fish it. Why would you trash it? But people, uh, for lack of better terms, uh, some are just ignorant hatts that shouldn't be a part of that community. And unfortunately we have to deal with them. Um, and I say that happily a platform where there are people that listen. So if you're one of those people, stop, be a better person. Yeah, I'm gonna say that. Um, but thank you. Very well put. All right, last question for you and Julian, we'll go with you and then Justin will finish with you on that one. What's next for you?
Speaker 3 (01:28:49):
Sure. What's next for me? Well, um, this year I've got, I've got two tournaments. They'll probably be my last tournaments. Um, I haven't really broadcasted out much, but yeah, there's been a few changes, um, in that, particularly financially. I think it's not going to be worth my while to keep traveling back to South Africa to fish tournaments. So this year will probably be my last, um, it'll be my last tournament, national and international. And then I'm gonna concentrate more on the trout side of things here in, in Switzerland. And hopefully the money that I'm saving by not going to South Africa, I can use to go and visit Justin Australia
Speaker 4 (01:29:35):
And, uh,
Speaker 3 (01:29:37):
And teach him how to catch some, some Dow fish
Speaker 4 (01:29:39):
Please . And,
Speaker 3 (01:29:41):
Uh, and also I've, yeah, there's some, some destinations that I'd like to go to. I'd like to go to, uh, Cape Ver one day, um, and catch tuna off the side and Cape Ver Islands. So yeah, there's some ideas I've got, but yeah, that's it, I think pretty much. Sounds,
Speaker 1 (01:30:01):
Sounds wonderful.
Speaker 4 (01:30:04):
So for me, I think, um, this year I, I was doing some reflection cards at the end of the year, you get these reflection prompts, and one of the questions was, uh, what do you want to be a student of this year? So at the start of 2024, i i i, it, it just came to me immediately. I didn't even have to think. I was like, I wanna be a student of fishing. Um, so yeah, I, I've invested in, um, kayaks, like stealth fishing kayaks for fishing, um, offshore. So I've been doing quite a lot of that, catching a lot of Spanish macro or barracuda you might call them, and tuna. But, um, at the same time, I'm loving my rock and surf right now. Like for the last couple weeks I've been focusing a lot more on that, especially since Jillian's come to visit Australia.
Speaker 4 (01:30:52):
And I'm, at the moment, I am a hundred percent focusing on trying to catch two fish. But yeah, I'm, I'm really enjoying the rock and surf. Um, it's, while kayak fishing is amazing and intense and extreme and you catch big fish, um, it is, it is all of those things and the rock and surf, it's really relaxing as well. Um, really grounding and it's, yeah, and there's, there's so many species to catch. So yeah, we've got a lot of, I've got quite a lot of good fishing spots just down the road from me, like good deep water points as well. So yeah, I'm gonna be getting amongst those for the rest of the year, I think. Try, try not to work too much, trying to get as much sneaky fishing in as possible. .
Speaker 1 (01:31:33):
Very nice. Well, Justin, thank you for setting this up. This was all you, you, you created this. So thank you so much for coming on the show and bringing your dad and putting all this together. And for both of you, thank you for sharing your knowledge. Thank you for just taking the time out. I know, you know, Justin, it's 10 o'clock at night there, Julian. It's probably coming up on, uh, afternoon or it's what, probably one or two there now. Um, but thank you both. I, I sincerely appreciate it. I've enjoyed this conversation and, uh, I look forward to seeing more from you in the future when messages and all that and, and, uh, watching you continue on with this stuff. Thank you.
Speaker 4 (01:32:08):
Amazing. Thanks so much, Brian. Thanks for having us.
Speaker 3 (01:32:11):
Yeah, thanks for having us, Brian. It's been, it's been fun. Yeah,
Speaker 4 (01:32:14):
It's been awesome. Yeah, really cool. .
Speaker 1 (01:32:17):
All right, gentlemen, we'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 3 (01:32:19):
Good. Alright.
Speaker 1 (01:32:20):
Alright, all ladies and gentlemen, there you go. That has been . It's been a great trip. I mean, Australia, South Africa, a little bit of Switzerland. Hopefully it's, it's been kind of fun actually. Um, you can find this again, this website or this episode will be aired out on all podcast platforms. You can find it back on finding demo surf phishing.com and you'll find all the information on there. I'll have the links and tags back on through that. Thanks for sticking around. It's always good to have you here. Hopefully you pick something up for knowledge and it, uh, helps you out on your next fishing trip. Until then, take care of yourselves. Uh, you can listen to find Demo Surf. I'm out.