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What if your company culture wasn’t just an HR buzzword but the secret weapon to scaling your business?
Welcome to Kan Talk Kulture, the podcast that dives deep into how remarkable company cultures are intentionally built and how they can transform your team, your business, and your bottom line.
Hosted by Kylie Anne Neal, founder of Kan Kulture and a passionate expert in people, culture, and leadership, this show is designed for business owners, CEOs, HR professionals, and anyone who believes that empowered people are the key to long-term success.
Each episode features real conversations with inspiring CEOs, business leaders, and culture champions who share how they’ve shaped their team environments alongside case studies, practical tips, and bold questions that challenge the status quo.
Whether you're looking to boost employee engagement, create a high-performance team, or align your people with your vision, this podcast will help you connect the dots between culture and growth.
At Kan Kulture, we believe in Kindness, Understanding, Learning, Trust, Uniqueness, Respect, and Evolving, and this podcast brings those values to life.
If you're ready to turn your team into your biggest brand ambassadors and create a workplace people love, this is the podcast for you.
Find out more at www.kankulture.com
Hi, I'm Kylie Anne Neal, founder of Kan Culture and welcome to Kan Talk Culture. In this podcast, I sit down with some of Australia's most progressive founders and CEOs to explore the heart of their company, cultures, what drives them, what they value, and what it's. Really like to work for the companies they lead.
You'll also find occasional episodes packed with practical HR insights to help you. Build safer, stronger, and more trusted workplaces. So whether you're a new team member, getting to know your workplace, curious about creating remarkable company cultures, or just wanting to know more about implementing HR best practice, you are in the right place.
Let's dive in.
Hello and welcome to today's episode of Kan Talk Culture. Joining me today is Ben Grozier, who is the CEO and Founder of Class Cover. Class. Cover is an tech enabled platform transforming casual teaching staffing across schools in Australia, New Zealand, and Singapore. Ben launched class cover in 2011, and since then, it's grown to support over 2,300 schools and 80,000 teachers under his guidance.
The company has continued to innovate, including launching class, cover, learn. Ben is deeply committed to building culture and leading with empathy. He often speaks about learning through mistakes, creating space for curiosity and vulnerability, and ensuring tech enhances not replaces the human side of education.
Beyond class cover. Ben is a mentor, an investor and community advocate. He's well known on the northern beaches and even ran for local council to support education, the environment and small business, demonstrating that leadership starts with community. What stands out most is how grounded Ben is. I've had the pleasure of knowing, knowing Ben for.
About six years now, and he is very approachable, genuine, and he really does bring integrity to everything that he does, whether it's mentoring startups or organizing pickleball tournaments. I am really grateful, uh, for Ben's support. He's been a big supporter of can culture since the early days, um, and I'm really excited today to explore how his team is shaping the future of education, tech, and leadership.
Ben, welcome to Kan Talk Culture.
Thanks very much Kylie. Good to be here.
It's an absolute pleasure to have you here. Let's start by, can you just give us a, a little bit of an introduction of who you are mm-hmm. And what Class Cover is all about?
Yeah, no worries. So, um, I am the co-founder and CEO of class cover.
Um, have been since about, uh, 2012 when we launched the business. And, uh, my background was actually a professional tennis coach and, uh, a school teacher. And so I'm actually non-technical. I run a software business, but I, I'm, I'm not technical. I don't write code. Um, and so we, we have a great team behind us that, that takes care of all that.
I've learned a lot over the past 14 years about the technical aspects of the business. Um, I guess away from class cover. Um, I mean, I, I really, there was a, a glowing appraisal you gave there in your introduction. Um, and, uh, and, and again, paints a pretty good picture of sort of what, what my life looks like.
It's pretty diverse these days. I've got three young kids, um, one in primary school, two have just started high school. Um, I love, love my goal, love my surfing, love my photography, love being on burly heads. I love being at burly heads, um, which, uh, where, where we currently find ourselves. And, um, yeah, my, uh, my beautiful wife Ally, um, makes up our, our little family on the northern beach of Sydney.
And, uh, yeah, life is good.
Beautiful. Beautiful. And what about class cover? Give us a bit of a rundown of what class cover is. You're, you're from Sydney, but you, you're currently up in the Gold Coast doing some very exciting things with Department of Education Queensland. Yeah. So give us a bit of a rundown about where Class Cover has evolved to today.
Yeah, for sure. So, um, so class covers a software as a service that helps schools manage casual relief teachers. Um, and, um, you know, as I was explaining, when we're, uh. Off the mic before, it's a, what I describe as a, as a huge solution to a huge problem in a, in a bit of a niche market. Um, and, uh, it was all born out of lived experience.
Um, in 2011 I'd been back from five or six years in the UK hitting tennis balls for a living. Um, got sick of the winters over there and so came back to Sydney and, uh, I was actually in the surf and it was the middle of winter pouring rain, which, and it's important to note because the highest demand time for casual teachers.
And I got, um, got out of the surf and got a call from the school where my daughter actually went to primary school. And I was, can you come in and teach? And I said, yeah, no worries. See in 20 minutes. And then about 10 minutes later, I got a call from the same school, different teacher saying, can you come in and teach?
I said, no, I'm already already working for Tony. I'll see you in there. Then I got another call, same school, different teacher, can you come and teach? And I said, this is ridiculous. I've, I've said yes to Tony 25 minutes ago, and you guys are calling me again from the same school. How much time is being wasted here?
Chasing teachers that are already unavailable, whether it be because they're already booked, booked in another school, um, just generally unavailable. Surely there's something that can be done about this. Uh, then, uh, there was a bit of a serendipitous Facebook post back in the day where people were posting sort of Facebook statuses, like giving sort of a live stream into their emotional state, I guess.
And, uh, and it was a mate of mine, uh, who was a deputy principal, and he, and he put up on his Facebook status. Uh, 22 calls to find two casual teachers. Great way to spend a Sunday in sort of this sense of exasperation, this sort of tone of exasperation. And um, and, and then from there that was kind of the catalyst for the idea, I guess, um, sketched up some.
Some pretty rudimentary, uh, designs, frankly, frankly, ripped it off. Um, what a, a, a hotel booking platform called What if.com, um, used to use in relation to a, a matrix of availability with dates across the top and hotels down the, down the bottom. Um, and applied that to casual leaf teaching. Um, and so that was, yeah, that was 2011.
And then went set about building it and, um, as in, you know, outsourced that. Um, and then into the hustle, really? Mm. And it was, uh, and, and this is cutting obviously a extremely long story short, but, uh, a, a passage of time where we were just grinding. Yes. And, um, trying to get, trying to validate, trying to get early traction, early revenue, trying to pay ourselves a salary.
Um, and then, you know, skip forward to a couple of bigger wins in relation to enterprise contracts and what have you, uh, found our feet. I guess found break even. Um, and then skipping forward even more, and the reason why I'm in beautiful Burleigh today is that, uh, we signed, uh, the Queensland Department of Education, uh, on the 1st of July, which is a, a big win for our little business.
Um, for some context, we're about 3,300 schools that have been built up over a period of 14 years. And this is an extra 1300 all tied up in one contract. Fantastic. So it's a, it's a really big deal for us. Um. And, and we're just in the early days of, of execution and, and rolling that out, which is why I've been in Queensland for three the last four weeks, which is great.
Good to be here.
Amazing. Yeah. It's good to have you here. And you know, I think the work that you've been doing at, since, since I've known you, but the team. Is a very, very solid team. It's very eclectic team, if I could call it that. But the team is so solid. What is important to you from a team perspective and how do you, uh.
Really rally around the team and enable them to rally around each other.
Yep. Yeah, it's, um, it's incredibly important to me, but it also comes with selfish motivations in that, again, with, with three young kids and a and a, um, desire to have a enjoyable life as well as a, um, a successful life. You need to have a lot of good people around you.
Um. So it, it's not all altruistic. Um, it, it helps me having a great culture as much as it helps them Yes. But to the point, um, around what creates that. Um, and I, and I've, it's funny, I've, I've probably said this three times in the last 10 days. Just one of those moments in time where I'm doing a bit of speaking, bit of mentoring, doing this today with you.
Um, and that is if, if you show me a team that is very comfortable with saying, I'm wrong. I need help. I don't know. Um, and I've extended that lately to say I'm over budget, I'm late. If you are very comfortable with saying that to whether it be your manager. Your owner, your colleague, um, and getting that stuff out in the open early.
Yes. And then collaborating on solving those problems. I'll show you a team on Rocket Boosters every single time. Um, and I, I really do live by that, the vulnerability. I'm a big heart on my sleeve kind of guy. Mm-hmm. Um, I, I, I find communication fairly effortless. Um. And I try to encourage that with the team.
Yes. Um, and that is to, to be vulnerable, to understand that, um, no one's getting outta bed in the morning and thinking, how am I gonna screw up class cover today? Yes. Just like, uh, I've said it to my team of under elevens. Soccer kids in which my, my youngest son is, is a part of, um, yeah. When there's been a bit of, a bit of niggle between two boys, 'cause one's made a mistake.
I said, well, he didn't get outta bed this morning and, and say, how am I gonna stuff up under 11 apex today? You know? And so get around him, help him solve the problem. Yes. And solving the problem might just be restoring someone's confidence because they've made a mistake.
Yep.
And in a, in a football context, it might be putting an arm around him and saying, it's all right mate.
You know, up you yet. Let's keep going. In a business context, it might be Okay. Yeah. Mistakes being made. Thanks for bringing that to me so early. Let's, let's fix it up together. Yeah. Or let's get the resources in place to fix it together. Um, there is nothing worse than going to ground and, and shutting up from a communica communication point of view.
Yes. Um, when there's a problem to be solved.
Mm mm. Uh,
and, and so that's, uh, that's very much one of the pillars of, of what creates a, a great culture. Mm. Um, from my perspective.
Mm. And, uh, just, just to share a story with, with the listeners. I was involved in a meeting about ISO. Incr accreditation with class cover recently.
And, uh, the ISO consultant had asked questions about onboarding and we went through how we, uh, onboard staff at class cover. And then the ISO consultant asked about offboarding and, uh, prash that was on the call with me. We've both looked at each other and we were like, nobody leaves. Nobody leaves. And I think it is.
Real testament to, um. Yourself, Ben, but also the amazing humans that you have within the team. I, I think being able to embrace that stability and for them to rally around each other when. Some of the work that you do as a team, and particularly going through tender processes for 20 months, 20 months long, like that puts a lot of pressure on people.
And for them to, um, feel supported and energized in a high pressure environment is really remarkable. And I think the other, um. The other point would be from a retention perspective. Many, many businesses struggle with retention at the best of times, but you have a workplace where there the, the team are.
All over the place. It's not like you have a small office where they can, um, you know, come in and rally around each other, like all the team, um, work remotely. So being able to capture that essence where most businesses struggle with that remoteness of work, um, they struggle with retention, but it's things that because of the way that you.
Uh, lead the team and because of the way that they establish themselves within class cover, it just, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm sure it's not completely seamless, but it is a real testament to yourself and the team.
Yeah. Thanks. It's, it's interesting, you know, I, I think there's, there's one thing to, to kind of add or provide context to that, and especially, um.
Yeah, when we talk about the team being completely dispersed, um, and I, I guess for your, for your listeners, it was a, um, it wasn't always like that. We, we pretty much had a Sydney office, an office in Sabu and the Philippines, an office in Chennai. So we had sort of, we had three teams and then COVID hit, um.
And, uh, obviously that dispersed everyone. Mm. Whether you liked it or not. Mm. But we also went through a, a stage of growth.
Mm.
And so they needed to hire. And when we're, when we're all in a lockdown conditions, we ended up hiring from Melbourne to Townsville. So, um, when we had an opportunity to come back to an office, we were like, well, it's not really worth it because everyone's everywhere.
Yes. Anyway,
yes.
But I guess what I'll just say to that quickly is that I think it's important for, um, for teams and, and business owners. To understand the value of, it's sort of what I would refer to as almost a savings account of rapport and relationship, which we benefited greatly from. So yes, we, we haven't lost people, um, which again, I'm, and I'm happy to take an amount of credit for, for that.
Um, and that's multifaceted, right? People need to be paid well. They need to have good conditions, need to be energized, need to enjoy what they do. Um, and so I, I feel like we do tick those boxes really well. Um, however, if you are growing a team from scratch. And you are straight into a dispersed environment.
Mm-hmm. Um, it is a lot more difficult to do that because you don't have that, what I'd call that sort of savings account of rapport and relationship. Like going into that dispersion.
Yes.
We had a team who had spent time together. Mm-hmm. Who did get to know everyone's idiosyncrasies that did get to know, or when, when this person's talking like that they're stressed or when this person's talking like that, like they're, they're a little worried.
Or, uh, when this person's talking like they're excited. Yes. And, and they're sort of missing details 'cause they're just have sort of puppy like excitement, which is probably me, but, but uh, but um, taking that into a world where we were completely dispersed Yes. Gives you a big leg up.
Yes.
Because then when you go to a lot of Slack chat or teams chat, a lot of online, a lot of non face-to-face, um, you know, oh, yeah, yeah.
I, I can see that when, when that person's doing that they, they need this level of support. Mm-hmm. Or this is how they act. And I think it's important consideration because, um, it, it's a, it's a bit of an unfair advantage in many respects.
Yes.
Yeah.
But I do also think, Ben, that. I mean, that comes very naturally to you to, you know, and I think that's one of the strongest points of your leadership is that you do have that, call it emotional intelligence or emotional awareness to see the signs of what that looks like from a team perspective and understand, um, you know, when to lean in and when to lean out and let, let them get on with their job.
So, you know, I do really think that that is, um, you know, a really solid testament of your leadership style and the way that you. Um, the way that you support the team, which, you know, I know that the, you know, the team are, um, very valuable, but, you know, there's also a lot of gratitude within the team, which is, you know, those things that aren't spoken about a lot.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm, I'm happy to take that compliment and, and, um, again, I, I, I appreciate it. It, it does come from, um. Learned experiences of being in, in less than optimal environments, you know, in, in a previous life. Um, there is a, uh, yeah, there's a massive trust element. Um, there's also, there's also what I would say, look, I, I'd really, I don't really try to live my life.
I think it's just the way I was, I was born, frankly, um, on what I sort of call like a, a first principles basis. And then what is the actual problem here? I don't do anything just because. Dozens of other people have done it before me.
Yep.
Um, and it, that would extend to everything from the, you know, whether it be the parent I am to the suburb I choose to live in.
Um, I try to make decisions all the time on that first principles, what's the actual problem that needs to be solved? And, and I think like if you, if you take that around, say work flexibility. Um, I have no issue with my team doing side gigs at all. Um, as long as they're getting their job done, I encourage them to start.
I do it, you know. Yeah. I mentor startups. You know, I, I have, you know, have a, have a, have a hand in my family business still. Um, that keeps me massively fresh and energized. And it also gets me, uh, it allows me to, to, to educate myself from other areas of the world outside the class cover bubble.
Yes.
Um. But there are plenty of people who when they hear that, they go, what?
Yes,
yes. There's conflicts, there's conflict about you're, you letting a
design, a moonlight for someone else is like this. Yes. Like does she do an outstanding job? Absolutely. She does. Um, is, is she learning things that she'd never learn at at class cover because she's just working in a slightly different culture, solving a slightly different problem.
Yes, she is. Um, is she getting outta bed in the morning feeling more refreshed because she's just spent half a day talking about something totally opposite the class cover? Yes, she is. Um, but it, it, it never ceases to amaze me how much people just shut down yes, to those sorts of what they might think are unconventional concepts.
Uh, when I think the net result of an amazing team culture, energized team, zero churn. Um, in your team is is the outcome and we all want that.
Yes.
Because it is a massive pain in my ass if someone leaves. Yes. Um, it's expensive.
Yes.
And it's time consuming. Yes. And so I, I'd do anything to, anything to, uh, to keep good people.
Yeah. Yeah.
Fantastic. Fantastic. And it is quite unique to have that perspective, you know, as, as a founder. Um, so what's, what's coming up next for class cover?
So, um, for class cover, there's this, excuse me, there's this beast of a Queensland rollout, which is, which has kicked off really well. Um, and, uh, yeah, you talk about culture.
I, I've had to wrestle with some pretty serious imposter syndrome in the last, in the last month or so. Um, also talk about having a great team around me. I've spent such a incredibly small amount of time in a, in a formal corporate. Bureaucratic setting that it's actually quite intimidating to me. Um, you know, just the processes and the jargon and the acronyms and, um, and, and even just the dynamic.
Yes. Um, and, and, but I, but again, the team around me, it's not their first rodeo. Um, you know, my CTO is telling me. Um, just when, when we're up in Brisbane for the first time, telling me how he's based in Chenai in India and, and when he was with Amazon, he got seconded to Seattle to deploy a massive project for them.
You know, three months working over in Seattle, whatever he was call as a cucumber. Uh, uh, you know, with these, uh, with, with the Queensland DOE. So, so again, putting great people around me. Um, but yeah. What's next is, is, is we roll out to 1300 new schools within the next probably six to eight months. Super exciting.
Yeah. Um, and then, and then there's other things happening in parallel. Uh, we sort of have a vision for being kind of like a LinkedIn for education. Um, mainly, again, to keep it really short, but teachers frankly don't like LinkedIn. They don't find the content relevant. The, the, the culture on there is way too corporate.
Mm-hmm.
Funnily enough, they tell us that they're worried about seeing parents on there. Um, but they do crave a sort of digital professional network. Um, because class cover has a. There's a, there's a, um, there's an employment, there's the software platform aspect, the employment. We've got, um, a recruitment job board.
We've got, uh, teacher professional development. Um, we feel like if we add a few things to them, to that, to that in the way of services and then bring them all together, that we'll have something sort of akin to like a LinkedIn for education. So, uh, that might have to be on the back burner for a, a little while because of rolling out, uh, this large enterprise contract.
But yeah, it's always, always churning away in the background.
Amazing. Yeah. Amazing. Yeah. Very exciting to see where that goes. Uh, if you had, uh, someone listening to this that was starting with class cover and today was their first day, what, what message would you want to give to them?
So opposed to kind of that corporate jargon, that corporate cliche, like, you know, spitballing, touching base, like blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
That I, that I used to, I used to, I used to advocate for corporate swear jar. That, that, if that, if you said something like, uh, yeah, I'll synergies, I'll dump, I'll circle, I'll circle back to you, then you gotta, gotta put a dollar in the jar. So, um, but that being said, um, there is a, there is a, there is a phrase and, and it's an important phrase and it's an important thing, um, around.
Just psychological safety and safety and, and and being made to feel, um, extremely at ease. Yes. In and otherwise quite uncomfortable and intimidating environment, which is what you face whenever you start a new job. Yes. With a new organization. Yes. So I guess back to what I said earlier around the being comfortable around being wrong, asking for help just to lay that groundwork and, and.
Yeah. Again, human nature and, and people are different, but sometimes you need to reiterate that 3, 4, 5 times. Mm-hmm. They, you know, and it's okay if someone is reticent to ask a question because they don't know, and they're insecure because they think they should.
Mm-hmm.
They might be a weak into a new job and they, they might think, damn it, I, I should actually remember this.
I remember, I remember being told this, but I don't know. It's that reiteration that it's okay.
Yeah.
Like, you know, we can't retain everything. We're not listening all the time.
Yeah.
You know, we're it, it, it's fine. Yeah. Um, but what's not fine is not asking for help. Yes. Um, not letting people know what you need.
Yes. And, and that is so fundamental to that onboarding experience. Mm-hmm. And welcoming someone in. Mm-hmm. Um, and you know, I guess in addition to that, there, there is instilling that, that sort of mindset around. Um, not only autonomy, but the value of, of being a lateral thinker that everyone needs to be an entrepreneur.
Mm-hmm.
Um, again, go to first principles. Would you, would, would I take, would I take that clocking clock out? Um, and, and, and look, we, we have people who have to be. Online at a particular time and they clock off at a particular time. Yes. If they're five minutes late, it's not good enough. So it's not all ladi da sort of ultra flexibility turn up when you want to turn up.
Mm-hmm. If you're in a customer facing role, that's just a reality. Mm-hmm.
Yes.
Um, however, if you show the ability to be a good lateral thinker, be entrepreneurial, be flexible to own your mistakes. Yeah. Then of course, um, aside from being on time as a customer service representative mm-hmm. Uh, because customers won't be waiting to ask you questions, then there is a huge amount of flexibility available to you.
Yeah.
Um, yeah. Yeah, because that's, and, and, and once that's embedded and you know, we've had people who take a while to actually believe that. Yes. They can't believe this flexibility is being extended to them. Yes. But, but that's part of the trust. Yes. That's part of focus on, on outcomes and not input. Yes.
Which I'm massive on. Show me outcomes. Yes. I don't care about input.
Yep.
Been asked to do something. Just get it done. Mm. Um, let us know if it's not gonna be on time. Um, preferably weigh in advance. But it's all okay. And, uh, yeah, that, that sort of gets people off on the right foot. Yeah. Amazing. And again, then they feel that safety go back to that word, whether it be psychological safety, what, I dunno what you call it, workplace safety, whatever they feel that immediate safety.
Yes. And then with that vulnerability. Really very little. Very little can go wrong.
Yeah. Yeah. And you've used the word trust a couple of times. Yeah. Um, and I think, you know, trust, if we look at the five dysfunctions of a team mm-hmm. Trust is that basic foundation. And what you're, what I'm hearing you explain is that you have an environment of trust.
You trust the people that come into the organization and allowing that. Uh, permission for themselves to trust themselves, trust the choices, the decision making that they have within the business. Um, so it is, it would take a while for people because I'm sure coming from a different work environment where trust may not be at the pinnacle of that work environment, um, it would take a transition for someone to wholeheartedly trust, not just the people around them, not just you, but also to trust themselves.
For them to know that they were brought in because they have the, the level of capability and the skillset that you were, you were after when you brought them into the business. And also obviously the the cultural fit as well. Yes. To enable them to, to thrive in the class cover environment.
Yeah, absolutely.
And, and, and look that the cultural aspect is, is just massive. Yeah. We had a little get together in Sydney, um. Last Friday and it was maybe 30 people in the room. And it was a mix of, I, I sort of described it. Um, one of the other five times I've, I've had to, had to talk, um, in public in the last week or so.
I sort of described it as the room being divided into, into two. And that was people who, they were people in my life who had just checked in regularly about this Queensland deal. You know, how how's it going? Where's it at? You know, how you feeling? Um, and that's incredibly, that's incredibly considerate and it's incredibly, um, valuable to me to have that support network around me.
And then it was my team, um, or certainly part of my team. And, um, and the funny thing was is that across those people who are very considerate and those people who were, um, who are part of the class cover culture, which, which I think is a very healthy one. The entire night was just people just getting on.
I mean, Frank, frankly, a lot of 'em had met each other at, at past gatherings. Um, but whether it be that reconnection or that initial connection, just like-minded people,
yes.
Just having meaningful conversations. And it could've been about whatever, it could have been, a geopolitics, could have been about cricket.
Doesn't matter, but our authentic conversations and then the flurry of text messages comes through and has such a great night. Like that guy I met last night, or that person I spoke to last night, I never realized that this and that and um, and again, that that's such a cultural, um, well it's, it's such an important part of, of building that good culture is that shared values.
And, um, and again, just a willingness to, to to be open to, yeah. To, I guess. Meeting new people, doing new things. Yeah.
Yeah. Thank you so much for that insight. You really are very, I wouldn't even use the word innovative, but you are quite unique in the way that you see company culture and the way that you do, um, support and nourish your team, and you're so.
Genuine about the way that you show up for your team, and that's really, really evident. Um, I think if we look at the key takeaways that I think, uh, as, uh, some really good takeouts that I've seen from what you've said and what I've heard is the first one would be, uh, you mentioned about. The savings account in rapport and relationships and you know, the importance of understanding what that kind of unspoken credit system would seem like in building a really great culture and having really great people within your, within your team and within your system of class cover and within the class cover family.
Uh, the second one for me would be the comfort in being wrong and making mistakes and. What a significant impact and a return in investment that that has and being able to show vulnerability in the space of work where we're, we're kind of conditioned to try and have the answers or try and mm-hmm. Be right or, you know, be seen as, um, having the right outputs and making the right decisions.
But you know, from what you have said, it's being able to say. I absolutely stuffed this up. I screwed this up. Um, and being, being that as. A fabric in the class cover team and the way that you guys communicate with each other is really, really significant, I think. And the last takeout for me from what you've said is that trust that we touched on before, you know, that trust in enabling, not just trust between yourself and the team members, between the team members, but also that, um, that self trust that, you know, they really need to.
Dig deep because again, we're socialized to, uh, be in a lot of work environments where trust isn't always evident. Mm-hmm. Nevertheless celebrated. So I think those three things are really fundamental to how workplace culture shows up for you and your team at class cover.
Yeah.
So just before we finish off, I've just got one last question for you.
If class cover were a song. What would it be and why?
Uh, so it, it's funny, this, this came to me pretty quickly and, um, and I'm sure I'm not alone as a, as a founder of a startup business to say this, but probably the, the song Rollercoaster by the Red Hot Chili Peppers. And I think, I think, I think one of the, I think the lyric in the chorus is.
Your love is like a rollercoaster baby.
Are you gonna sing it for us? I'm not gonna sing it
for, I was actually on a fireside panel, a fireside chat two days ago, and the, uh, the guy hosting a bust out a guitar and asked for some impromptu lyrics, funnily enough about where we were and what we were doing.
And, uh, yeah, that, that was, that was seriously being put on the spot. But, um,
you play the guitar, don't you? I the guitar, yeah. Yes,
yes. But, um. Yeah. It's, it's a rollercoaster. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Um, and again, it it, you're gonna, you're gonna bring these people who have, um, in many, in many instances, sort of no skin in the game other than it's their, it's their nine to five.
Yes. Um, you, you have to empathize greatly. Um, if they're gonna be in that environment where there are lots of ups and downs, yes. Um, and of course a massive ups and downs, massive rollercoaster over course of 12, 13, 14 years, but even day to day. Um. Yeah. It's a, it, it's a rollercoaster.
Yeah.
Yeah.
As a small business owner myself, I absolutely appreciate Roller.
That's right. Rollercoaster. That's right, exactly right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So
it's, um, yeah, that, that would sum it up about best. Amazing.
Yeah. Amazing. Well, thank you very much for your time, Ben. Thank you for coming in, and I'm very excited to see what you and the team achieve in the next coming months, years.
Decades. Class cover will live on and we'll keep growing and evolving. Um, and I also personally thank you for the support that you've, um, given to Kan culture since, since I started Yeah. A couple of years ago. So you've been in my corner and I really, really appreciate you and I really appreciate the team.
That's really kind, Kylie. I really, yeah. It's been been an absolute pleasure. And we, we love having on our team too.
Yeah. Thank you. So thank you everyone for listening to Kan Talk Culture and we look forward to the next episode. Thanks for joining me on Kan Talk Culture. I'm Kylie Anne Neal. I hope today's episode gave you a clear review into the values driving your workplace.
All sparked new ideas about building a remarkable company culture. If you're a founder or CEO interested in sharing your culture story, or if you are looking to build a safer, stronger, and more trusted workplace, let's connect. Visit Kan culture.com. That's KA. K-U-L-T-U-R e.com to learn more. Please hit that subscribe button to hear more real conversations with founders and CEOs and hands-on episodes full of people.
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