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For over 25 years Proverbs 31 Ministries' mission has been to intersect God's Word in the real, hard places we all struggle with. That's why we started this podcast. Every episode will feature a variety of teachings from president Lysa TerKeurst, staff members or friends of the ministry who can teach you something valuable from their vantage point. We hope that regardless of your age, background or stage of life, it's something you look forward to listening to each month!
KALEY OLSON:
Hi friends, thanks for tuning in to the Proverbs 31 Ministries podcast, where we share biblical truth for any girl in any season. I'm your host, Kaley Olson, and I'm here today with my co-host, Cailah Garcia, and special guest, Lysa TerKeurst.
CAILAH GARCIA:
Hey, girls.
KALEY:
Hi, friends.
LYSA TERKEURST:
Hello.
CAILAH:
Hello, hello.
KALEY:
Oh, well, any day we get to have Lysa on the podcast is a special day, right, Cailah? But-
CAILAH:
So excited
KALEY:
... today is a very special day because-
CAILAH:
Drum roll, please. Duh-duh-dun!
KALEY:
... I'm not gonna do another drum roll, like, actually'cause it's an audio nightmare, but metaphorically I'm doing another one because Lysa, today, today on September 15th, your latest book, Making Peace With What I Can't Control is officially released to the world. Oh, my goodness. Like, how does, how does that feel?
CAILAH:
Yes.
LYSA:
Equally exciting and terrifying, to be honest.
KALEY:
I feel like, um, what's the analogy you give whenever you talk about-
LYSA:
It's, it's almost like-
KALEY:
... releasing a book
LYSA:
... putting a bathing suit on and standing-
CAILAH:
Right.
LYSA:
... in front of the whole world and saying, "Tell me what you think." Which I am in my mid-50s, and so, you know, I've reached the age and stage of life that, uh, I, I don't need to do anything of the sort. Um let's be honest. Never in my whole life have I ever wanted to put on a bathing suit and let other people judge me, so there's that. But it- the point is, it, it's- it's a vulnerable feeling. You know, you pour your heart and soul into a book, and you pray, pray, pray, pray- um, or at least I do, that these words will connect with people and not just be a book that they read, but a message that they're able to apply and live out in their in their own life, and that it does draw their heart in with, um, with good wisdom and draw them closer to being able to trust the Lord more. Um, surrender the outcomes that we're so very afraid of. And then also practical tools of how do we live this message in real time
CAILAH:
Right.
LYSA:
... right in the trenches day to day, moment by moment. And so it's not a bunch of theories. It is a lot of practical application woven together with spiritual inspiration and also personal revelations.
CAILAH:
Yes. A lot of -ations, guys. A lot of -ations. Um, but, uh-
KALEY:
Can't wait.
CAILAH:
Yes
LYSA:
... in this book especially, I wanted to be vulnerable and meet people exactly-
CAILAH:
I love that
LYSA:
… where they're at, and, um, hopefully I've done that.
CAILAH:
Well, we already know Making Peace With What I Can't Control is making an impact. And here is what one of our fellow staff members, Emily, said about how God has used this message in her life. She writes, "Lysa's new book pointed me straight to Jesus. God revealed that what I call responsibility in my life was really an idol of control, and he used this book to lead me into deeper surrender to his authority. Every believer who longs to walk in freedom and know the truth needs to read this.".
KALEY:
So good. Okay. I mean, I agree with Emily in how this book has impacted our life. I know so many of us on staff got to read it. We have testimonies from early readers too. And I guarantee you guys, you need to get this book 'cause this message is gonna help you. But friends, as much as the three of us could sit here and yap about all the things we can't control right now-
CAILAH:
Yep
KALEY:
it's time for today's episode. And so in the spirit of celebrating, we're gonna share exclusive access to the audiobook version of chapter one, which is titled Grasping for Guarantees, as a special treat to our Proverbs 31 listeners. And Lysa, you recorded the audiobook, so-
LYSA:
I did
KALEY:
... that, I feel like that's a big thing for an author to do because not everybody does that. Some people let other people read the book. But it's fun to get to hear your voice.
LYSA:
Well, thank you.
KALEY:
Yeah. Yeah. It was great.
LYSA:
It, it was hours and hours in the studio. But I feel like me reading it allows me to have the appropriate inflection of tenderness, grace, and teaching that, um, that this book needed.
KALEY:
Yeah. Well, I cannot wait to listen to it again. And so at the end of this episode, Cailah and I are gonna be back on to share a few thoughts-
CAILAH:
Yep
KALEY:
... and reactions to what Lysa shares in chapter one. But for now, friends, sit back, lean in, and get ready for a good word, and we'll see you on the other side.
CAILAH:
Can't wait.
LYSA:
Chapter one, Grasping for Guarantees. It was 2:00 AM when I sat straight up in bed feeling panic rattling down into my bones. Something was wrong. I don't know how to explain the knowing I had, but it was crystal clear I couldn't stay in my bed. I jumped up and grabbed my phone. I opened an app where my loved ones and I share our locations with each other.
LYSA:
Everyone was where they were supposed to be at 2:00 AM, at their house. Everyone except one person. I saw movement on my screen letting me know this person was driving away from where they lived. I panicked. There was no good reason for them to be driving around at 2:00 AM. This was bad. I knew this person's patterns, addictions, and struggles.
LYSA:
I loved this person, and I felt constantly compelled to make sure they were okay. I didn't want to control them. I just couldn't bear the thought of something terrible happening to them or to a fellow driver out at this time of night. I was in therapy, and I knew what the counselors were telling me was true. If a person doesn't want to change, there's nothing I can do to change them. I knew this with my head, but I couldn't get my heart to sign on to this reality. I jumped in my car and attempted to go find them at two AM, in the middle of the night. I was following the moving arrow on an app looking for this person.
LYSA:
There was nothing normal about that, but I felt compelled. I couldn't stop myself. It was like I was in a trance with only one option: help them, rescue them, save them. My fear response was driving my control response. Get this situation under control or else something terrible might happen. If I don't do this, no one will.
LYSA:
Based on the location app, it looked like they were going through an all-night drive-through, which might give me time to catch up to them, and I did. As soon as I saw their car, I reached into my glove compartment and grabbed the breathalyzer device. Sadly, I had plenty of experience using it with this person.
LYSA:
I pulled up next to their car and signaled for them to roll down their window. They just stared at me and then shook their head, signaling their answer was no. I pulled into a parking space, hoping they'd pull over beside me and at least talk to me, but I already knew they wouldn't. So, as they were sitting at the window waiting for their food, I got out and walked over to stand in front of their car.
LYSA:
What in the heavens was I thinking? I wasn't thinking. I was desperately reacting. In order to try to save someone else, I was willing to put myself at great risk. I remember my heart was racing. Every nerve ending felt completely activated, and my mind was a swirling mess of confusion. Surprisingly, they turned their car in the direction where mine was parked.
LYSA:
They agreed to breathe into the testing device, swearing they were sober and I was being dramatic. They were wrong, and after the test, though they resisted at first, they eventually got in my car and let me drive them to their house. After I dropped them off, all the stress and fear and anxiety crescendoed into an emotional breakdown.
LYSA:
I sobbed all the way home, and as I walked back up my sidewalk at almost three AM, I just kept repeating to myself over and over, "I can't keep doing this, and I can't not do this. If I don't help them, who will?" I got back into my bed infuriated by this whole deal. And you wanna know who I felt most angry with? God.
LYSA:
Why was this happening? How would it ever get better? And why was God allowing it to continue on and on for years? Maybe you're in a similar situation with someone. You care about them, and you want the best for them. You know you can't make them change, but there's something deep inside of you that keeps pulling you to try.
LYSA:
Try one more thing. Try having one more conversation. Try one more suggested solution. Nothing you've tried before has permanently worked with this person because they are incapable or unwilling to make lasting changes for themselves. You feel stuck and exhausted, and some days, quite hopeless. I get it. I wish I didn't understand this dysfunctional cycle as well as I do.
LYSA:
I have felt that same angst of not knowing how to still care about this person without trying to save them. It is a painful tug of war. The 2:00 AM panic rescue situation happened years ago, and nothing I ever did caused this person to change. I eventually had to let them have their journey. Maybe for you, it's not a person you wanna fix, but a circumstance you've cried over more times than you can count.
LYSA:
You want something to be different, and the different you want is a good thing. You can't figure out why this good thing can't be your reality. You've tried and tried and tried to make this situation better the way it should be, but it just isn't happening, and you fear that life won't ever be right unless this goes the way you desperately want it to.
LYSA:
Yep, I have some of those circumstances in my life, too. I don't want to control things. I just wanna make things better. Too often, I shake my head and wonder why life has to be so complicated and challenging and heartbreaking. Sometimes I still find myself wondering why God doesn't uncomplicate things and work in ways that hurt less.
LYSA:
And I still feel that pull to do whatever I can do to make things better, fix things quicker, and manage things so there's more of the peace I long for. But it's not working. I'm tired, and I'm worn out trying to carry all this on my own. I bet you are, too. Whatever you're facing that makes your heart race and leaves you staring at the ceiling during the dark hours of the night, I wanna give you permission to speak it out loud.
LYSA:
Say it with all the angst and frustrations tucked into the layers of unanswered questions and solutions that never seem to come Like me, you don't want to carry the weight of trying to manage another person's actions, reactions, emotions, choices, and lack of awareness about how severe the consequences might be if they don't change.
LYSA:
You see things they don't see or care to acknowledge. You feel a painful dread of what might happen in the future, not just to them, but to you because you care so much for them. It's a brutal burden trying to change someone who doesn't want to change. Or maybe for you, it's the brutal burden of trying to manage all the pieces and parts of a scenario you never asked for, but are now being forced to deal with.
LYSA:
It's a diagnosis, a financial hardship, a lost job, a move that left you without community around you, a false accusation against you, a child who is struggling, or something else that has left you wondering why God doesn't seem to care enough to make things better and ease the stress you're under. I've faced many of these situations too.
LYSA:
I don't know how to make peace with the uncertainty of what God allows. And it's not just what He allows. It's also how much He allows. His timing, His ways, His long patience for something I feel requires swift action. He seems to have great endurance for listening to me cry over what He surely could stop, change, rethink, redo, erase, or undo.
LYSA:
I don't get it. When His goodness doesn't feel good, seem good, or look good, it confuses me and sends me into this weird place of feeling betrayed by Him. If I had the chance to talk to God face-to-face today, this is what I would want to process with Him. How I feel in the face of His seeming silence, how confusing it is when He doesn't fix things, and how hard it can be to constantly be trying to accept His mysterious ways when nothing makes sense.
LYSA:
It's a very presumptive request, but a completely honest one. Sometimes I don't want God's mystery. I want His love, His power, and His assurance that it's all going to go like I've prayed. Too often, His mystery bumps into my need for reassurance, and my faith feels shockingly fragile. I love the Lord with all my heart, and I also need space to be a fragile human with questions.
LYSA:
I'm a girl who wants her heavenly Father to be a dad, who wants nothing more than to fix what's breaking my heart and seems so senseless. I don't want another life lesson. I don't want another thing added to my testimony. In my estimation, I've been through enough. I want peace. I want it so badly. I want less uncertainty, less unknowns, more guarantees, more assurance that if I do the right things, then the things I deem should happen as a result actually do happen.
LYSA:
If I do this, then that good outcome will be in my future. I like equations like this because I like being responsible, and I like knowing there will be a positive payoff for my prayers, my diligence, my responsibility, and my intentionality. I like setting up my future self for success by doing things today that will make tomorrow more manageable, more predictable, less stressful, less chaotic.
LYSA:
I guess you could say I'm trying to reduce the risk of the unexpected. But when I do all I can do to produce good outcomes and things still catch me off guard, get incredibly stressful, or take a turn for the worse, I fear it will make my life complicated to the point of being unbearable, and I can feel myself resenting the mystery of God.
LYSA:
I don't wanna have to trust God through the unknowns. I'd rather make things better myself. After all, I just can't bear the risk of not trying to turn things around and make them go the way I truly believe is best. Maybe some would say I'm being prideful, but I don't think it's simply a pride issue.
LYSA:
It's a panic issue. I'm scared to let things play out. I'd rather use my nervous energy to try to change things than kneel in surrender and trust God with things. None of this is fun to admit, but I must acknowledge this because I want to change this. I know I can't control things outside of my ability to control, and I know I can't change people who are incapable or unwilling to change.
LYSA:
I'm old enough now to finally see that. But I'm compelled by something deep down inside of me to keep trying. Because what if this time I actually can fix this, change them, convince them, redirect the outcome, and prevent what I fear will happen? I guess what feeds this delusion is the reality that sometimes my efforts seem to work, at least for a time.
LYSA:
There are days where I'm like, "Good thing I'm here, because if I wasn't, the wheels would all come off." I mean, my ideas work. Thank goodness I can mentally play things out and make wise decisions for the future because others around me just seem to be living in la-la land. I mean, where would they be without me?
LYSA:
Good thing I can count on myself because time and time again, others prove I can't really count on them. And of course, I trust God. But just in case He doesn't come through, I'll come up with a backup plan. I'll do more. I'll figure it out because I can do that, right? And maybe we can figure it all out for a while, maybe even a long while.
LYSA:
But at some point, we all hit the brick wall of reality that even our best efforts to keep it all together will fail We crave a guarantee, not realizing that the only thing we humans are truly capable of ensuring is our own failure. We fall short because without God, we are incomplete.
LYSA:
Think about how life started for the very first humans. The man was dust, fully incapable of life until the breath of God completed him and brought him to life, Genesis 2:7. The woman came from a broken-off side of the man with no heart or mind or soul until God formed her into a living being by His design, and life began. Genesis 2:21 through 22.
LYSA:
Apart from God, we aren't complete. Apart from God, we fall short in every way. Apart from God, we aren't the solution. We are actually the problem. Apart from God, we aren't holy. We are sinners. So apart from God, we aren't set up for complete control because apart from God, we only add to the chaos of this very broken world we live in. God reminds us that we are like branches that cannot do anything if we separate from Him, the life-giving vine.
LYSA:
"I am the vine, you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit. Apart from me, you can do nothing." John 15:5. We think we know best. But isn't it interesting that the very thing God instructed Adam and Eve not to partake in, the knowledge that they weren't capable of handling, Genesis 2:17, is what we are still reaching for today.
LYSA:
We aren't capable of knowing what's best. Only God has that knowledge. Therefore, only God is capable of steering us toward what is best. Only God is capable of seeing what is truly best. Only God knows what is truly best. Theologians refer to this concept as the omniscience of God, or simply that He is the God who knows all things.
LYSA:
The more we fight against letting God have control, the more we fight against the very thing we desperately want: what is truly best. And you know what's been the most startling revelation about all of this? My efforts to control do not prevent my fears from coming true. The only thing my controlling does is make me a less stable and more chaotic version of myself.
LYSA:
A girl standing in front of a vehicle at two AM risking her life to save someone who didn't want to be saved. Controlling never makes me a better person. It just makes me a self-deceived person, a person who is setting myself up for the eventual heartbreak of realizing just how very powerless I am on my own.
LYSA:
There have to be answers for living in the tension between the relentlessness of all that life throws our way each day and standing confident that God has it under control. But it's hard to see circumstances that make no sense while simultaneously believing that somehow even this is something we can trust God to handle.
LYSA:
It's confusing. There are several things that confuse me right now. It confuses me why a friend's child is facing an incredibly painful and potentially life-threatening medical situation. It confuses me why things like affairs, abuse, and betrayals often cause the ones who are hurt to pay a high cost for the sins of the ones inflicting the pain.
LYSA:
It confuses me why some kids grow up with parents who seem to care very little for their well-being, while other couples would offer great care and lots of love, but are struggling with infertility. And then there are the more daily uncertainties that we handle okay until too many things catch us off guard and knock us off kilter.
LYSA:
Just today, I got a zinger of a text message from a friend who was not shy about letting me know that I didn't meet an expectation she had. Then I got a request from someone else who I fear disappointing because then they might also get in their feels and misunderstand why I can't do what they're asking.
LYSA:
My heart is to love all my people well, so being misjudged is really hard. I wanna fix their narrative. I wanna change their perspective. Once again, I want to try to control things beyond my control. I could go on and on with examples like this, and if we were having coffee together, you could add all the many situations over which you've felt this kind of angst too.
LYSA:
We know we are to walk in faith, 2 Corinthians 5:7 and Romans 1:17. And we absolutely believe in God, but we also want someone to turn on the lights when we feel like we're being kept in the dark about how things will or will not turn out. Should I be bracing for impact? Should I stand firm, trusting God with every aspect of this?
LYSA:
Or should I be doing more to bend things in the direction I feel very certain is best? I don't know. But here's what I have to admit. I am way more comfortable living in the deception that I have the ability to control the uncontrollable than I am standing in the tension of uncertainty. I like the thought of guarantees.
LYSA:
I like the feeling of making choices today that will surely prevent bad things from happening tomorrow. But mostly, I like relying on myself, so I don't have to risk counting on others. And by others, I mean other people, yes, but I don't like acknowledging this part. I don't wanna have to count on God either.
LYSA:
Oh, sure, I'll count on God for some things, but there are other things I'd rather not have to factor faith into. I want certainty. I want a three-step plan to fix this. I wanna do something rather than trust God with something. The ironic thing is that the most uncertain part of every situation I face is me.
LYSA:
My thinking is limited. My ability to see into the future is nonexistent, and I have no ability to control the uncontrollable. The second most ironic thing is that the most certain part of every situation I face is God. His thinking is unlimited. He not only can see the future, but He stands in it right now, and there is nothing beyond His control.
LYSA:
In theory, I know this. But when I'm knee-deep in confusion, wanting something I very much care about to go the way I think it should go, I don't wanna consider a plan different from mine, not even God's plan, especially because experience tells me God's plan sometimes takes me to terrifying places I'd rather avoid.
LYSA:
No wonder I lie awake in bed at night, mulling things over ad nauseam. No wonder I get caught in thought spirals, trying to make sense of things that don't make sense. No wonder I feel panicked when things go differently than what I expect, and no wonder the undercurrent of my being looks a lot more like anxiety than a peace that surpasses all understanding.
LYSA:
Though I would tell you in conversation I don't struggle with control, I give you full permission to challenge me on that statement. And might I have permission to challenge you as well? It's an exhausting way to live, trying to keep everything predictable, to keep everyone in line with the plan you are convinced is best, and feeling the pressure that everything depends on you figuring it all out.
LYSA:
But maybe you're like me. I haven't seen another way to live. I've flirted with trying not to control the uncontrollable, and I might even dare say I've made progress, but then I slip right back into it the next time I feel afraid of the consequences of not keeping everything under control. It's so hard to turn it off.
LYSA:
I haven't been able to picture a world where I truly let some things go, things I really want, things I fear I won't be okay with if they don't turn out the way I hope. I haven't truly imagined a state of mind where I accept what is without striving to fix something or trying to make a deal with God that I'll finally be at peace as soon as blank happens.
LYSA:
But I had an epiphany recently. The epiphany happened not because anything in me changed. It happened because I finally realized my real issue isn't control, it's fear. And even more shocking to me was the realization that what I am most afraid of is God. I'm afraid that God will allow things I can't bear to live with.
LYSA:
I'm afraid of my own powerlessness. I'm afraid that I don't know the full plan, and that I'm given no chance to weigh in as to whether I agree with it or not. I fear not being able to comprehend what God does and does not allow. Like Solomon expressed in Ecclesiastes 8:16 through 17, "When I applied my mind to know wisdom and to observe the labor that is done on earth, people getting no sleep day or night, then I saw all that God has done.
LYSA:
No one can comprehend what goes on under the sun. Despite all their efforts to search it out, no one can discover its meaning. Even if the wise claim they know, they cannot really comprehend it." I especially resonate with Eugene Peterson's paraphrase of this passage in The Message. "When I determined to load up on wisdom and examine everything taking place on Earth, I realized that if you keep your eyes open day and night without even blinking, you'll still never figure out the meaning of what God is doing on this Earth.
LYSA:
Search as hard as you like, you're not going to make sense of it. No matter how smart you are, you won't get to the bottom of it." That's a low place to end a chapter. But sometimes it's good to sit with this kind of raw admission without hyper-spiritualizing it or brushing it away. Being able to admit this fear isn't a sign I'm pulling away from God.
LYSA:
Quite the opposite. It means I'm finally ready to be honest with Him, and honesty is what God wants. A heart that is seeking Him with questions is so much better than a heart that stays deceived.
KALEY:
Okay, Cailah
CAILAH:
Oh my goodness
KALEY:
... what a word. Ugh. Oh my goodness. And that was only chapter one. So just in the spirit of processing, because we process together, we're processing-
CAILAH:
Always
KALEY:
... people on the-
CAILAH:
We do
KALEY:
... P31 proc- podcast processors- ... processing together.
CAILAH:
We need a sticker that says that.
KALEY:
We do. That's an alliteration. That's quite a tongue twister. I couldn't even do it. Um, I would love for you to pick one concept from chapter one, and let's just chat about it.
CAILAH:
Yeah. Honestly, there's so many good things that we could talk about. But I think one of the things that stood out to me the most was this concept of my efforts, the things that I try to do, the energy that I put into trying to get through the day that really are my efforts to control do not prevent my fears from coming true. Like, let that sit in for a second. Because I can do everything that I can to move around the pieces on the board and hope that things will land exactly how I hope they will but oftentimes they, they don't.
CAILAH:
Oftentimes what I, I hope will happen just doesn't work out the way that I anticipated it to. And honestly I can do everything right, I can say everything right, I can show up and be responsible and be accountable and and move the pieces how I think they should be moved but sometimes things still happen that are outside of my control, that are hard that are difficult, that may be the result of someone else's decision that I had no say or sway in. And that's hard to reconcile. It's really hard to reconcile. And I think Lysa puts it so well. She goes on to say that really- That God will allow things that sometimes I can't, I think that I can't bear to live with.
CAILAH:
That I'm, I'm really afraid of that happening. I'm afraid of my own powerlessness. I'm afraid that I don't, that if I don't know the full plan, that I, and that I'm given no chance to weigh into whether I agree with it or not, that things will just not work out the way that I hope that they will. And that's the tension that we live in with, um, just learning to trust God with the outcome, and also learning to know our own limitations. And I think that's a struggle for me as someone who would raise their hand and say, "I'm a little controlling sometimes."Uh, my family will tell you, "Mom likes things a certain way."
CAILAH:
My kids know that in my pantry, everything has a place, and if it gets moved one inch, I know it. And I think when we come back to that space of God really knows what's best, He sees what's best in every scenario, and we don't have the full picture. We really don't.
KALEY:
Yeah, yeah.
CAILAH:
But even our best efforts can't- can't control us, can't control the outcome, can't control the good things from happening. That's God's, that's God's role in our life that we have-
KALEY:
Can you come do my pantry?
CAILAH:
Oh, man. Anytime. Anytime. I, if you ever catch me with my AirPods in organizing something-
KALEY:
You're in your happy place
CAILAH:
... then that's my happy place.
KALEY:
That's so fun. I, okay, but, like, I truly, I get where you're coming from with the efforts spent on control 'cause Cailah and I have commiserated over this. Fellow Enneagram ones.
CAILAH:
Yes.
LYSA:
Fellow ones there's, like, a right way to do things and a wrong way-
CAILAH:
For sure
KALEY:
... to do things. Even though I would consider myself a, a highly Type B person. But, you know, that's fine. Um, I feel like, though, Cailah, the more that I've thought about control and controlling life, I don't think that as controlling people we desire to be in control of literally everything. Like, for example, not everything is blowing up at the same time.
CAILAH:
That's true.
KALEY:
Rarely.
CAILAH:
That's really true.
KALEY:
Okay, but, like, for example, in my life, there might be three things that are a top concern. But if I look at the rest of the way that life is operating, there's some things that are going off fine.
CAILAH:
Right.
KALEY:
You know? So it's interesting to me how I notice so much of my effort, which I equate to, actually, it's not effort, it's energy.
CAILAH:
Right.
KALEY:
Mental energy spiritual energy, physical energy, going to- Even over-processing the things that I can do nothing about. Because I think there's this, this part of me that is so very aware. I know better than to take a next step.
CAILAH:
Right.
KALEY:
Because I have not yet received clarity from the Lord on that or whatever. But man, I love to process.
CAILAH:
Right.
KALEY:
I'm like,
CAILAH:
and spiral, and spiral, and spiral.
KALEY:
I love, I love to process. It makes me stay up late. I have the same conversation over and over again hoping for a different outcome which is the definition of insanity.
CAILAH:
Honestly.
KALEY:
And I can't do anything about it. And so I think where I have been challenged recently, and I have not always chosen obedience in this area, but it's not that I'm always trying to control the outcome, but I spend too much time stuck in the processing of thinking the same things over and over again, having the same conversations over and over again, hoping that it's gonna lead to somewhere else, because I'm just waiting, I'm hoping that maybe the next time I process this something's gonna happen.
CAILAH:
Unlock, yeah.
KALEY:
Or in prayer. And, and I think I've just been so challenged to just put it to rest. Like, don't even open that door because you know it's not gonna lead anywhere good right now. You know that, that effort equates to energy, and the energy use in processing leads to insanity. Like, your efforts to control do not prevent your fears from coming true.
CAILAH:
That's so good.
KALEY:
And even if it's fear in, is the Lord ever gonna answer and tell me what to do? So, such a good chapter one, such a good precursor to what the rest of the book-
CAILAH:
I know
KALEY:
is gonna be. I can't wait. But I feel like right now, there's so much good content going out, um, even on the-
CAILAH:
For sure
KALEY:
... Therapy and Theology podcast. If you guys don't listen to that podcast, you should absolutely do that.
CAILAH:
Please do.
KALEY:
They have just unpacked in a series, um, a little bit more about control from a biblical, um, and a therapeutic perspective. It is so good. Um, but I'm so grateful, guys, that you joined us today and just spent a little bit of time unpacking this. I really encourage you guys to just, like, chew on this chapter on your own as you finish your drive home or finish that load of laundry or whatever.
KALEY:
Um, but I do just, um, want to acknowledge really quickly, um, that this book is out to the world. Like, I mean, it's in stores now.
CAILAH:
It's available now.
KALEY:
Like, you can get it on Amazon now or all the things. But can you, Cailah, can you imagine someone walking around Target or the airport and grabbing this book, never really knowing Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior, and having gone something that hurts them and make them, makes them question God's goodness, and then this message meets them in a way that changes everything? I think that's just such a picture of how the Lord really works through-
CAILAH:
Yep
KALEY:
... Proverbs 31 and Lysa's messages. And so with that, friends, today, we do want you to go out and buy a copy.
CAILAH:
Yes.
KALEY:
But we do have a favor we'd like to ask of you, and this may seem a bit strange, but hang with us here. Since you listen to the Proverbs 31 Ministries podcast, we want you to buy from us at p31bookstore.com. Could you drive to Target and get the book right now?
CAILAH:
Sure.
KALEY:
100%. But we want you to leave those copies at Target for the women who are there who don't know Jesus and who need a little hope. And plus, whenever you buy from Proverbs 31, all your, that purchase goes directly to supporting the work we do every day.
CAILAH:
Yep.
KALEY:
And we do need you to do that.
CAILAH:
I could not agree more. All right, friends, well, we just wanna say thank you for tuning in. Thank you for hanging out with us today. At Proverbs 31 Ministries, we believe that when you know the truth and live the truth, it changes everything. We'll see you next time.
KALEY:
Bye.