Subscribe
Share
Share
Embed
A Marvel Rivals Podcast hosted by Coach Mills and CaptainCoach, two creator and educators for Marvel Rivals. We discuss all things Rivals including META, balance and the future of development. We will often debate controversial topics that surround the game and plan to bring on many exciting guests from pros to devs!!!
CaptainCoach (00:40)
Welcome to Captain Coaches and Coach Mills' podcast. Actually, let me do Coach Mills first. Coach Mills' name's first on the big scoreboard. We got a new Marvel Rivals podcast that we're starting here. And yeah, this is just going to be a place where we talk about the game, our thoughts on the meta.
Coach Mills (00:46)
Ha ha ha ha!
CaptainCoach (00:59)
balance changes that we could see, ⁓ what the game needs, and just stories we have about the game. We're gonna be bringing on guests in the future, and you can definitely be a part of that, deciding who you wanna see on this podcast as we talk about the game. Welcome to Clearcoms. We got Coach Mills and Captain Coach, and let's get right into it, man. Coach Mills, where we starting, dude?
Coach Mills (01:22)
Yeah,
Yeah, so this is our first podcast. I'm excited for y'all to be here. We are going to be talking mainly about season four. There was a lot of balance changes. There's new heroes. And we really want to talk about the state of the game. think there's a lot to dig into this season. And we've been playing a lot of this season, so we want to really break it down. And I think the first thing that we're going to start off with is primarily the balance changes, the balance of season four. Because there was a lot of team ups that were removed. There was a lot of team ups that were added.
Overall, what's your impression of Balance? Do you think that Season 4 Balance was a step up from Season 3.5 or was it a step down? What do you think?
CaptainCoach (01:57)
⁓ So, even though I'm not a huge fan of the meta, I do think it is a bit of a step up, despite the game being more imbalanced than it's ever been. Let me explain. So, the game has buffed a lot of the support characters, like Jeff is really good, they nerfed Aluna but she's still strong, and Viz now is getting played a lot more. ⁓ I think if you just make characters that ⁓ aren't played enough really OP,
Coach Mills (02:10)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (02:26)
That's a really good way to get people to play them, mainly healer. And that's kind of the case right now. I think healers in the game are really, really good. Maybe I'm just a little biased because I play a tank, but the meta is pretty much for season four, just have three healers on your team. And while I don't think that means the characters are necessarily the most balanced, I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on this actually. Do you think...
healers are a problem or that it's like good to attract more people to the role because i see jeffson every game every game
Coach Mills (03:01)
Yeah, yeah, and I
I was actually watching ignite last night and there was Jeff's in like most pro matches too like Jeff's are everywhere Yeah, that's all over the place. ⁓
CaptainCoach (03:08)
⁓ yeah. I put him on S tier.
I put him S tier on my tier list from D to S, generational run.
Coach Mills (03:15)
It's weird because I think that triple support can be boring, but some of these triple support comps aren't. Like think Jeff triple support is at least more interesting than like Loki, Luna, Invis, you sit there, nothing happens. Like that's not what Jeff's trying to do, right? He's trying to contribute a little bit more. And I think that Ultron, a little bit to the same extent, not quite the same as Jeff, but...
CaptainCoach (03:31)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (03:39)
⁓ But yeah, I think just generally like supports are really really busted and ⁓ And I don't know what people think do people think that triple support should be something that it stays in the game or triple support is something that gets removed ⁓ Because like you said every time every time a support is buffed. It doesn't make it so that That support is played in two supports It makes it so that support is played in triple support and a DPS is the one that gets rid of you get rid of that DPS
CaptainCoach (03:52)
Yeah. I mean, I-
Yeah. Well,
I will say Jeff is now viable in two healer comps, but you'd still much rather play him in a three healer comp. That being said, mean, I guess that is a step in the right direction, but not in terms of balance. And one thing that I thought really hurt Overwatch over its course, I never played the game too much to be fair, but I did watch it from the outside when they added Role-Q to that game.
I really think it is a direction you don't want to go in because then you start balancing around a role rather than the individual characters, right? So if every team is guaranteed to have the same amount of supports on their team to supports, then effectively you can make supports however strong you want them to relative to the other characters. Hopefully that makes sense. So then, ⁓ right, if you have it so you can have as many as you want, we could be moving towards a direction, I mean, probably not, but where you could see...
before support comes if they become that good to where they just want to promote casual play. I know people call me crazy. So I think with that you do have to be careful and while it is nice to encourage that kind of thing, people playing, like Jeff Mains are, Jeff Stoxx are up. They're happy right now. And everybody else's Stoxx are down because nobody likes having Jeff's on their team. But. ⁓
Coach Mills (04:57)
Yeah, just forget DPS. No, yeah.
Yeah. ⁓
I actually lived because I played Overwatch all the way through like the beginning through Role queue and something that happened towards the end is I want to make it clear that we should not have a role queue because when I played DPS in relatively high elo on DPS I was waiting like 20 minutes for a game like on average and as Tank, I queued up Tank I got a game instantly and I would be like a grand master player which would be the equivalent of like a celestial almost eternity and I was getting queued with like Platts basically
CaptainCoach (05:29)
I agree. I agree.
yeah.
Coach Mills (05:46)
Like, because there wasn't enough tanks. So they just let them go with whoever. otherwise, there's just gonna be these crazy long queue times. ⁓ that's, we don't wanna run down that road. I'm telling you, we do not wanna go down that road.
CaptainCoach (05:56)
You know what?
Yeah, you know why they're not gonna add roll cue? Because it's a nerf to healer players and tank players and they they're already they're already struggling as it is but I will say You know because you see a lot of complaints about just like it's miserable to play tank It's miserable play healer when it's triple healer It's not miserable to play tank and it's not miserable to play healer healing becomes a lot easier when you get though because you got three people could save you
Coach Mills (06:07)
it.
think it's just DPS
players that are mad, I think mostly. Like, I get it, you don't get to play, you don't get to play, you know, whatever Bucky or whatever you were gonna run instead, but.
CaptainCoach (06:25)
Yeah.
So what I was saying though was that when you ⁓ have a meta where it's beneficial to the... or sorry, not meta, what are we talking about? When it comes to role queue, ⁓ healers now... I think a big advantage of playing healer right now is that most teams won't have even two healers still. Because I don't think it's most popular role. And then with three-threed healer being meta, if you get an instant queue but it's guaranteed even teams with like a role queue,
Right, ⁓ DPS has to wait a long time, but then like all the wins that a healer player would have gotten just because the enemy team doesn't have any, now that goes away. So people will effectively want to play healer even less, causing the queues to get even longer when it comes to role queue. So that's something you could like consider when talking about that.
Coach Mills (07:15)
I could see that. I could see that.
Okay, so I saw there's a streamer named Kaji and he had this recommendation or suggestion, not Roku, but a way to fix the triple support problem. I want to hear what you think about it. So he had an idea where if you have more than two of the same role, there's some sort of global penalty. So like if you have three supports, let's just say it's like a 10 % healing reduction on your team. Or if you have three tanks, it's a 10 % HP reduction across the board for your tanks. Something like that where you can play it, but there's a cost to be had if you're gonna play it.
⁓ Of course that number would have to probably be balanced and fine-tuned but the whole idea is just to kind of decentrifies people from playing it unless they really really have no other option like they don't have a DPS player on their team and that you know, it's better than someone flexing to something they don't play.
CaptainCoach (08:01)
Yeah, yeah,
I, while I think that is a really good idea, I'm generally not a fan of adding passive buffs and nerfs to characters, heroes, classes, whatever you play in a game that aren't part of the characters original design. I used to play a game, I'm sure a lot of people have heard about World of Warcraft where
They had trouble balancing healers in what were called arena matches, which were just like player on player fights, kind of like Marvel rivals, right? And basically healing just became stronger and stronger to the point where they just had to nerf healing the longer the matches went. Just so the matches would eventually end, cause nothing would die. And what ended up dying was World of Warcraft. Okay, cause that made the arena combat, they eventually...
did exactly what I said, where they start balancing around the passive nerfs they put to the characters in the game, rather than the actual characters, and then they lose sight of the balance. ⁓ it, when you start adding those
Coach Mills (08:59)
makes sense actually yeah like
a band-aid fix so a balanced band-aid thing they're not actually addressing the problems at all
CaptainCoach (09:06)
Yeah,
yeah. And when you talk about like the team ups, not the actual abilities, but the passive bonuses, ⁓ those are, think, NetEase's way to combat that exact thing a little bit. Whereas like, okay, we want this character to be meta this month, and next month we will, you know, we're going to push Squirrel Girl. And now Squirrel Girl, everybody's gonna be playing Squirrel Girl, just like Jeff right now. And they do that by just quick, easy, 15 % bonus. Now it's gone, but we'll compensate in other ways, right? It's way they can kind of quickly flip-flop the meta.
And it's clearly, I think it's pretty obvious that's what they're trying to do. So we're always gonna have something to talk about, Coach Mills, because the meta is constantly gonna be changing in this game. ⁓ Riot Games does something similar with League of Legends, although that game has like 160 characters or something now. I think Marvel Rival's still in its infancy. I mean, podcasts and conversations like this are gonna be, I think, a good way for...
Coach Mills (09:43)
⁓ That's true. That's true.
CaptainCoach (10:02)
the community to talk about where we want to see the direction of the game going.
Coach Mills (10:05)
Right.
That actually reminded me a little bit of one of the talking points that I've been seeing online is the fact that poke has been like basically the only better. Like we don't really we haven't really seen like a brawl meta or a dive in quite some time. How do you feel about the difference? Like do you feel like that's fine? Do you feel like there should be more diversity? Because every time we've had like a dive meta, there's always been complaints for sure. We've had brawled metas very, very briefly around Groot. ⁓
But for the most part, it's just been poke, know, Magito, Strange, Hella, all that stuff.
CaptainCoach (10:36)
Yeah, well, first you
got to ask yourself, like, what is a meta? Well, a meta is people playing the characters to their highest potential, and then the best players who can play the characters to their highest potential get higher rank than other players. And then people see that and be like, ⁓ I want to do that thing. Well, are you good enough to do it? And then that's where you have an idea of what the meta is, because Marvel Rivals has to balance around a certain level of skill, in my opinion, or...
you're never going to have balance anywhere. I think with like hitscan, you say hitscan's been meta, ⁓ hitscan characters are kind of harder to play in my opinion than other characters. Would you agree with that or?
Coach Mills (11:15)
That's
That's fair. That's fair. It kind of, it depends on how much you quantify aim skill. think aim skill is weird because it technically, it definitely has an infinite ceiling, but it's also the most transferable skill from other games. Right? like that it is. Well, like one of the, one of the things I like to say ⁓ is like back. So,
CaptainCoach (11:23)
My aim is terrible. My aim is not good.
Yeah, yeah, I guess, yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, cause yeah, I don't come from shooters, so.
Coach Mills (11:41)
like characters like Genji and Tracer back in Overwatch, like these characters were always capable of dominating lobbies, but they were not nerfed as much at the start compared to like Black Panther and Spider-Man. These characters get nerfed a lot now. And it really has to do with the fact that the people, mechanically, the people today are so much better than they were back in 2015, 2016. you put, if Marvel Rebels came out in 2015, Black Panthers would be dashing like super slow. Like it would be crazy. Like go look at,
Go look 2015, 2016, look at a Dragon Blade from back then. And it literally looks like it's in slow motion. The average Plat Dragon Blade looks better than that. that's... Right, they're two crack. That's actually... Spider-Man, Black Panther, it's because players are two crack. That's why these characters are a problem. They would be perfectly fine back then. People were not moving Mach 10 and hitting like a yo-yo, pull off the... Like no one's doing that in 2015. Like get at all
CaptainCoach (12:18)
There's... It's the damn kids these days growing up on games. They're cracked!
Yeah.
Ha ha
Was Spider-Man ever picked in competitive? When you were watching? I haven't seen it too much.
Coach Mills (12:40)
So yeah. you're
saying for Ignite? No, no, no, Spider-Man, no. Black Panther, we'll see.
CaptainCoach (12:48)
But Spider-Man's good, like people
carry on Spider-Man, but I don't think he's the type of character you really want on your team too much. Even if they're good. Even if they're good.
Coach Mills (12:55)
The problem is when you have ⁓ like in pro play, well, hitscan
players are just gonna chew you out of the sky. That's the problem. If they don't miss, you're just like, when you do that backflip thing, when you're looking all cinematic, they hit you twice in the air. that's...
CaptainCoach (13:02)
Yeah.
So that's an
interesting conversation to have. Then how do you make a character like Spider-Man meta without him being OP? Because if, yeah, he's just, his kit, his ability moveset is just too over the top. But he feels like Spider-Man, which is awesome. That's why the game is so good is because the combat and movement and everything is so fluid and it's cinematic. The game is really cinematic. there's gonna be some characters that unfortunately, unless they're just,
Coach Mills (13:15)
I don't think you can make a metamon pro play. I really don't think you could do it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I
They don't.
CaptainCoach (13:37)
really
really really overpowered they're never going to be like a main meta character because this game has to be balanced around a certain level of skill to have accessibility to keep the game popular yeah so hitscan is by the way probably always going to be pretty good unless they just piss off every hitscan player that the other day they have to attract people who can shoot to one of like yeah i can get high rank in this game sure you know
Coach Mills (13:42)
And you don't want them to be about it. Yeah.
Right, right, right. ⁓
They, yeah.
And that's a really
easy way to kind of bounce a difference between low and high elo is because aim skill is always like, like mechanics are always a big difference. like, even though Hela is busted, like Jean is busted on console, low elo in low elo PC, they're never going to be busted. Right. But like, if you make squirrel girl meta all of a sudden, she's like, she dominates everything.
CaptainCoach (14:19)
Can
we talk about that? Where were the Jean nerfs and where were the torch nerfs? Like what are we doing man? Yeah, we're talking about Jeff a lot, like Jean, think she's the best character in the game. And I ban her every game.
Coach Mills (14:24)
⁓ god.
i agree i
i i i don't think it's even close she's so over kidded it's insane
CaptainCoach (14:36)
You know, you know
the moment I found out Jean is gigabusted, needs to be nerfed? I always like, unreleased, like, yeah, she's really good. For sure S tier, like day one, I'm like, yeah, she's an S tier character, but I never thought she was this like, a God tier of her own, was when I jumped in on a Jean with about 50 % health as Hulk with a full health bar, with my bubble up, with all my cooldowns, I start punching her, I start going in, and then she starts doing this.
Coach Mills (15:03)
Bye!
CaptainCoach (15:04)
30 times,
30 times on my face. Just doing her little, she's doing her melee combo. And then I'm just like, what the fuck? And she folded dead to me and I get popped and she literally stands in front of me, does that new Arwalk, which people can do, and just like fireballs me into the face. I got 1v1 in melee by a gene. Okay. As Hulk.
Coach Mills (15:23)
She's actually one
of the best brawlers in the game, which is actually stupid. It's actually so stupid.
CaptainCoach (15:27)
She has everything.
She has, she has, I just found out, you know she has life steal in her kit? I didn't even know that.
Coach Mills (15:34)
Yeah, yeah, yeah,
with the yeah, yeah, when she triggers her her fire. Yeah, it's actually I don't understand. I don't get how they could let her pass. Maybe. OK, maybe it's because she's new. Maybe they're like, OK, new DPS. We're to let her stay meta for a little while.
CaptainCoach (15:47)
Well, Angel
is new and she's one of the most balanced characters they've released. So, I mean, I don't know.
Coach Mills (15:54)
I
just, really don't understand Torch, like at all. Like that one I really don't get, cause that guy's still with Permaban. It was a Permaban last season. And he, and it like, I just don't understand why would you not want to get rid of him? Like, nerf him. I really don't understand it at all. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna.
CaptainCoach (16:07)
⁓ I hear
I
don't either because they buffed Ultron in the same patch. me, what this... The only thing I can say is someone who's like, I mean, we gotta give our opinions, right? Like, we gotta take a guess, maybe. I mean, who knows if right, but like, they're just trying to force certain like, metas around a rank that most people just don't agree with. Like, they're kinda balancing more around the lower ranks. That's probably the best...
Best way could get net ease the benefit of the doubt when it comes to balancing their game is they're bouncing around players who can't basically because they want to attract a casual audience ⁓ I don't know if that's the case and that would be definitely someone I would love to talk to is is ⁓ Z is developer z young I would love to have him on that that's like podcast goals man because I'd be curious to like my number one question be like what rank do you balance around and if they can't give you an exact number
Coach Mills (16:55)
A developer,
CaptainCoach (17:08)
or like something finite that usually means that they don't know and then they're just doing whatever, just whatever we feel like and that's not a good sign.
Coach Mills (17:15)
Sometimes they try to please, like in the past I've seen devs try to please everybody and it's kind of not gonna work. When you're trying to balance for the pros and like high elo and low elo all at the same time, it's like, really can't. You're dragging things in like a whole bunch of different directions. It's really hard.
CaptainCoach (17:32)
Here's
another thought too. ⁓ Jean is a pretty you would say pretty straightforward character, right? She's pretty simple She has a instant dash You see that on the ton of characters in games. She has like a mobility spell that makes her move faster she's just you aim and shoot and Did I miss anything? Yeah, and she has like she has a stun which I'm not a big fan of all the micro CC getting at it to the game But we can talk about in a second. So she's a pretty straightforward character
Coach Mills (17:37)
Yeah, yeah.
Stone just as she has a right look stone. Yeah
CaptainCoach (17:59)
Did you notice that most of the straightforward characters in this game, like Emma for instance, simple anchor tank, kind of just don't get near her or else she'll do a lot of damage and block your heals, right? ⁓ But then characters that are more over the top like Spider-Man, they generally tend to be weaker. So to me, I don't really think it's much of like, ⁓ whatever, Phoenix is gonna sell us a lot of skins, so we're gonna make her OP. Maybe it's a little bit of that, because... ⁓
I think like three out of the top five most played characters in MRC were like the ones that got bikini swimsuit skins. It was just like all the, I saw a list at the top of those played. It was was like Psylocke, Emma, Luna. ⁓ They were all just like hot, hot young girls. But yeah, I don't think it's like anything like that. Maybe a little bit like they're trying to.
Coach Mills (18:34)
⁓
God.
I mean,
hey, Torch just got a swimsuit skin, so they had to keep them good, you know? I'm just kidding, I'm kidding.
CaptainCoach (18:58)
They gotta
attract their Gooner audience to the game or else they're gonna, no I don't think that's what it is, maybe, I mean maybe that affects balance. That'd be another really good question to ask is like, ⁓ is balance affected by like marketing? Like does the marketing department ever come in and be like, yo we're trying to sell this Angela skin here, so make her busted.
Coach Mills (19:22)
I mean, even if they don't say it, it's like they definitely are not going to make Luna like F tier. Like they might not, they might nerf her. You know, yeah, they're they're just. Well, I mean, like that's like one of the most popular characters. Like they, it's like, it's like part of the brand. Like you can't, you know, but, but, on the, on the same side, like Spider-Man, Spider-Man should be like the most popular.
CaptainCoach (19:27)
Never. Not with the skin like that. What a wasted opportunity. ⁓
Yeah.
That is a good point. So
you do think then that Luna is OP because she attracts like a lot of people to the game, really?
Coach Mills (19:50)
I don't
think they will, not necessarily OP, but they're gonna never let her be terrible. Like I don't think so. I don't really think so. And I think that that could be, I don't think that there's anything wrong with that, to be honest with you. I think it's fine. Like it's actually, ⁓ now you gotta make things within reason, but it's like, you gotta think of it like, people talk about like, ⁓ that's the main character plot armor, you know? That's kind of like what Luda has. She has the plot armor, she has plot armor, yeah.
CaptainCoach (19:54)
Yeah.
Luna's the main character of Marvel
Rivals, not Jeff.
Coach Mills (20:19)
Oh yeah, yeah, she has
the plot armor. And I think that that's, you know, I don't think that's the worst thing in the world, but, know, yeah.
CaptainCoach (20:29)
I like having a Luna
on my team more than Jeff, that's for sure.
Coach Mills (20:32)
I feel like every Jeff I play against I can't beat and then every time I get a Jeff I can't win. So maybe it's just me. I don't know.
CaptainCoach (20:38)
I
play with the rank one Jeff if you didn't know. Yeah, actually yeah, so Jeff sleeper OP, but what about Angela? So I mean have you played her a little bit right? But that's probably
Coach Mills (20:42)
Oh, oh yeah, oh yeah, nice, there you go.
Uh, yeah, no, I did play her a little bit. I played her in the play tests. Um, I did actually make a rant video on YouTube about her and my, my general takeaway of her is that she's, she's not bad, but she's very linear. Like the strength of the character is comp reliance. So who you're up against, uh, map reliance. So like where you're playing, if there's pits or places you could take people off, all of a sudden the character becomes like tears better, like not even slightly better, but like tears better.
Certain characters you can bully, characters like Magneto you can just kind of boop around. Characters with mobility, like ⁓ you're hardly ever taking a Thor off the map or a Hulk off the map, it's gonna be hard. So certain characters you can bully, certain characters you can't really do anything, you don't interact well.
CaptainCoach (21:34)
Angela is a character that I, in a weird way, kind of compare to Spider-Man, where she's just such an insane character with a ton of just, like, cool, she's so fun to play. She's one of my favorite releases. I love playing her, she's so fun. But ⁓ if you give her abilities that are as crazy and over the top as hers are, like, she can fly wherever she wants to on the map, she can not have insane crowd control, she's the best displacer in the game, right? ⁓
She's pretty tanky. Like she has a lot of really, like she's really good. You can't really make a character like that also have the damage of something like someone who has to aim. It just wouldn't be fair. So I think she's going to be a character that's like always really good in the right spots on the right maps.
Coach Mills (22:12)
Right, right.
.
I think that's the way to make a flying tank, honestly. I'm afraid when they make a flying tank that can shoot a gun while in air. I don't even think you can do that. A flying tank that's just sitting there, just shooting like a war machine, just shooting at you.
CaptainCoach (22:29)
yeah
No, I think Nettys,
honestly, their hero design is one of the best in any games I've ever played. And I do think it's why the balance is pretty tough for this game. ⁓ Yeah, I have a lot of, like, I think they know what they're doing most of the time. And to me, I just kind of try to figure out the reasoning behind it and give them like goodwill when it comes to having really broken stuff in their game. Because I just enjoy the combat so much.
To me, having stuff being broken, that's a fair trade off. And Angela, they did a great job with. I just unfortunately don't think you're really gonna be able to... Like I said, she's like Spider-Man where you pick Spider-Man with maps where you can pull people off ledge. And in the higher ELOs meta, there are a lot of people who...
Will one trick Spider-Man, but then there's the ones who will just play him for like one checkpoint. It's like, okay, there's no ledge here now, so we'll swap to something else and be more useful to my team. Those are the good Spider-Mans, by the way. ⁓ Most of the Spider-Mans, ⁓ in my games at least, are not good Spider-Mans. I mean good as in like a good teammate.
Coach Mills (23:30)
Hey.
One of the, I was actually watching his stream, a team captain stream, shout out team captain. It'd be cool to get him on here at some point so we can get the team captain, coach Mills combo. But I was watching him duo. was playing with Jeremy, which is like a really good Thor. And they were running like Angela Thor, oftentimes in triple tank. And they were like just stomping teams. Like was like Angela Thor venom. And they were just like.
CaptainCoach (23:47)
Hell yeah. Yeah.
Coach Mills (24:06)
Like perpetually diving the support backline like like over and over and over again and the support back like couldn't do it And they won like so many games they were like they ended like top 30 I was watching it and I was like, okay, I can see where you know Just because people might have figured out some stuff around Angela But I don't think people have figured out like how like how to build the comp with her like and I actually love the idea of putting her in a triple triple tank comp because she just plays She doesn't she just plays so much different than a tank. She doesn't hold space. So she's not really a tank
CaptainCoach (24:16)
Yeah.
That's exactly it.
Hmm.
Coach Mills (24:35)
She doesn't play like a tank.
CaptainCoach (24:36)
Yeah,
she's like ⁓ low, what's word? Like she doesn't need much attention from support. She's self-sufficient. She's not like Hulk, where Hulk, you have to heal him. No, she can kind of do her own thing. So she's like a ⁓ safe DPS to play almost, with just like kind of lower damage, I would say. But like the trade off is she can be wherever she wants. So she's going to get damage on you. She chooses her targets. It's just like, can she kill you fast enough?
Coach Mills (24:43)
Yeah, no, yeah. Right.
CaptainCoach (25:01)
⁓ I think she's awesome. like, yeah, you hit the nail on the head, in the hands of good players, like team captain and who else you said? Jeremy? Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Angela Thor combo. Then they're going to know where to be and how to coordinate and abuse the broken parts about them. So again, it's just like why you can't ever have a character like Angela being hard meta. And if she ever is, it's probably the, probably the developers know what they're doing.
Coach Mills (25:02)
Yeah, I'm here.
It was Jeremy, Jeremy, yeah, the more authority, yeah.
People
are gonna hate that more than like Spider-Man Black Panther because it's like you're being constantly dove by characters that you just can't actually chase away
CaptainCoach (25:30)
⁓ Well, it's the worst... Yeah, it's the worst
feeling in the game. People will complain about, like, assassins, like, dive characters, but they'll live with it, but if a tank can ever just run at you with, you know, three or four times your health bar and just beat you to death, no one is going to play your game. No one is. Like, that's just not gonna happen.
Coach Mills (25:47)
Yeah.
Yeah. Luckily there
are... Yeah. Yeah. And it's also scary because she's actually reasonably good against Flyers, which is like, Flyers are one of the best ways to counter like triple tank, like giant tank comps. Thor also has like a grounding ability for Flyers and he's like pretty good against Flyers. So all of sudden you make like a triple tank comp that's like, it's like pretty good against Flyers, like doesn't fold to it. then...
CaptainCoach (25:54)
So her damage has to be low. It has to be low.
Coach Mills (26:16)
It just doesn't have a counter anymore. That's like the slippery slope that you can run along. So it's interesting how it develops. I'm curious what pros are going to do with Angela if they're going to do something with
CaptainCoach (26:26)
Angela's
my new mate. My number one is Hulk, which Hulk's pretty good right now. Hulk's in a good spot. I like Hulk right now because Triple Healer meta is good for him.
Coach Mills (26:29)
yeah.
You
just, you get a lot of resources. He just gets to do a lot with that level of resources for sure.
CaptainCoach (26:44)
Yeah, then other
teams have Triple Healer too, which means generally there's less damage being dealt, which is like even makes it easier. I can just do whatever I want every game on Triple Healer. I, ⁓ yeah.
Coach Mills (26:53)
No,
I love watching when you bait out a support ult, pop your ult, and then juggle someone out of the ult and still kill them. That's such an insane trade. Because you're trading one for one plus a kill, and then you just win the fight. It's actually insane.
CaptainCoach (27:03)
yeah.
Well,
a lot of stuff too is like I was, so I think you were there. I was playing with Eremori last night and she's like the best healer player in the world. And supports are so good right now with Hulk that I can just bait out supports with my ult. And instead of trying to do like the insane play that you're talking about, I'll just, I just literally jump back to my team, stand out in like an open choke and just stand there in mega Hulk form. And I'll just let them spam heals on me. I'll just take damage because I can sometimes get a support ult up.
Coach Mills (27:32)
Yeah.
CaptainCoach (27:37)
like 30, 40 % just doing like just and like you're going to just win games off of support out still that's still kind of how it goes. I think a lot of it's just kind of playing around that. And like with Angela, like getting kills in between those big alts or like during, like you said, using her displacement to knock her out is really how the people are going to make her OP for sure. It can't be damage, right? But like, yeah, you, what, what have you been enjoying? You've been playing Thor with the new buffs.
Coach Mills (27:49)
Right.
No, I've been losing on Thor. After I deranked really hard, I climbed back up to Grandmaster with just mainly Mag. Mag is still busted. Mag is still really good. If you can just hit your Mag golds, you're just going to carry games. Yeah, just Mag. But I actually learned to really enjoy it. feel like even though Mag kind of feels sometimes boring, ⁓ it's really hard to play a perfect game on Mag. And if you play a perfect game on Mag, you feel like you can't lose.
CaptainCoach (28:15)
Yeah.
Bros in Mag Jail.
Blink once if you're being had a gun to your...
Coach Mills (28:35)
Like that's what, and so like, I like that. What it's like, if I lost the game, I'm like, man, if I would have just been a little bit more accurate, hit more maggots, I would have won this game. I like that feeling rather than some characters are like, you feel like there's literally nothing you could have done.
CaptainCoach (28:35)
That's a good point.
Yeah.
Well,
that's funny that you say that. It's kind of like why... I actually like Mag. Like, I like playing him, but it's... He's just too hard. you have to land... You're just shooting. Boop, boop. Like, all game. Like, I don't want to be doing that all game. I kind of want to be able to just like, okay, get my punches and jump out. Okay, what do we do? Okay, I'm going back in. know? Like, I got to... Mag is like, you got to be locked in. The whole...
Coach Mills (28:55)
it.
Yeah, you know.
Yeah. ⁓
He
CaptainCoach (29:12)
Like, so, and then, like, if you miss your ult, God forbid you miss your ult in front of, like, a Twitch audience or YouTube audience on stream, because you're going to hear about it. Like, he's hard to play. He's hard. So, Mag being meta again is like, he's a higher skill ceiling character. So, like, Mag maybe in lower ranks, probably not worth the play as much, you know? So.
Coach Mills (29:18)
Yeah.
Right.
Well, one of the things I was kind of talking about before with my chat, my chat was asking me about it is like, why has his Magdito still so strong and so meta? And I said, it's like actually a lot of the same reasons why triple support is meta. And it's because Mag is like the most defensive tank. He has the most defensive tools, shield that can block infinite damage, an ultimate that can deny a bubble that can deny. And that's, that's what triple support is, is you're sacrificing offensive capability in a DPS for defensive.
CaptainCoach (29:50)
Yeah.
Coach Mills (29:56)
cool downs, like that's really what you're doing. And so like defensive stuff is so, it's at such a premium. If you can deny, you just get so much value. ⁓
CaptainCoach (30:01)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, the defensive, there's not a ton of character. There's more offensive stuff in the game for sure. And that's like why support ults are so good. But like mag, you know, like all the best mags, they'll just use their defense to do whatever they want. And that's why he's so good. Like, okay, you have this insane shield. Okay, I'm just gonna run right at you and kill your support and you can't do anything about it. Good luck. And that's what the best mags do is use their, ⁓ no one to use their like defensive utility to push for kills, right?
Coach Mills (30:16)
Right, right, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah,
⁓ Defensive utility is just so flexible. I feel like offensive utility, it's very litigate. It's like you do one thing. Yeah, like you got you have one thing you can do. You can't use it. When you're on the back foot, it's hard to use offensive capability like utility to win, but defensive ones can keep you alive. It's pretty interesting that that is kind of like the reasons that Mag is good and like Emma's good is like now kind of the whole meta is like triple support, defensive capabilities, play Ultron instead of
CaptainCoach (30:36)
Yeah. Well, yeah, that's a good point.
Coach Mills (30:58)
the hella or whatever and now you're just like not as lethal but way more defensive.
CaptainCoach (31:01)
Right.
Yeah, I mean, that's definitely an argument for support characters being the best characters in the game, right? It's like, okay, you would rather just have, like if you're gonna pick Ultron into Hello, which is like, you'd think that's a counter, which people are doing, you know. I mean, Ultron's, I'm pretty, most people would agree, he's probably easier to play and gives your team more utility and more consistency. It's like, why wouldn't you go for that? I mean, that's like competitive play in a nutshell. You just pick the most consistently reliable things. And then like, you know, the best teams are the ones that can like consistently.
carry on characters like Star-Lord or something. yeah, it's definitely an interesting conversation. And it's like, I'm curious to see like what direction they go with it moving on. ⁓
Coach Mills (31:43)
Yeah,
think 4.5 is going to be really interesting, what they decide to do. Or if they do like a mini bounce patch. I don't actually hate the meta right now though. I think it's actually not bad. I say that as a mag player, I'm having a good time, but...
CaptainCoach (31:54)
What
changes do you think they need to do to the game in the future? I mean, we talked about Phoenix. Is there anything else that you potentially think they could do to... Maybe, I don't know. I definitely think this patch is attracting people to the game. I'm probably curious to hear your thoughts on that. But the queue times have been instant for me. Like at any time, it's been great.
Coach Mills (32:14)
Yeah.
No, I really think that it's not even the balance that's kind of holding the game back right now. It's just the fact that there's just not enough, mainly supports and tanks as well. Like we are super limited on the amount of supports that we can build two support comps with. Like Jeff, you can do it. It's kind of rough. Mantis, can do it. It's kind of rough. Ultron and Adam, you really can't do it. And so like we have Luna, Cloak.
CaptainCoach (32:25)
Hmm.
Yeah.
Coach Mills (32:42)
Invis, isn't that it? Lunokluk Invis? Yeah, I mean, guess, oh no, I'm talking about just building two support compositions. like main supports, like the bulk healing supports, right?
CaptainCoach (32:46)
Man, it's a support alt. What's about support alt?
right. Well, I see
a lot of like mantis duo in like offense, but on defense, it's just too risky to have that low amount of healing.
Coach Mills (33:02)
And the mantis needs to be like constantly capable of like keeping getting more flowers hitting dinks like like mantis do a support in like a low elo like your tanks are already taking more damage than then like it like just crazy amounts of damage and then you're not hitting your headshots like you're just trying to like scoop out water in a boat with a giant hole you're just never gonna do it's gonna be like terrible
CaptainCoach (33:08)
Yeah, yeah, like you have to hit dinks and if you don't you're just gonna slowly lose
Coach Mills (33:27)
I just think that there just needs to be more supports and I know that Daredevil is probably going to be a DPS but I feel like we need like three more supports. Like I feel like more supports is better ⁓ and then of course tanks too. But like we don't need any more DPS for like a while. Like like like a while. We have a the I actually think that season three releasing two DPS was like a really really bad idea. ⁓ I think that they should never do that again. Like ever. Like like ever.
CaptainCoach (33:54)
Yeah,
because I think what people tend to forget is new characters, people will want to play and try them out. And that's a lot of time how you convert people to other roles. It's like, wow, I end up really liking Angela. I think I'm going to try tanking. I'm to give that a try. Then all of a sudden it's like, oh, I actually like this. It encourages people to try different play styles and it creates like a more diverse.
Player base that can play tank when they need to play so you have to have these characters that are popular to attract people to certain roles Or else it's it's you're gonna I mean it was really bad for a bit But I do think we're kind of going in the right direction now with Angela being added I mean I people want to play tank and you know I there are a lot of people there are a lot of Angela throwers though There are there are a ton of Angela throwers They're so bad. I Got about 50 games on her
Coach Mills (34:39)
They're getting less. I think they're getting less, but it's yeah. The floor on
that character is really low. It's really low.
CaptainCoach (34:49)
I
got about 50 games on her. So I know what I'm talking about when I say that there are some people who have no idea what they're doing on Angela. Because you could do whatever you want on her. So I had a guy just constantly diving their backline alone. He would just 1v3 and he wouldn't kill anything because she does no damage. Never went for any pulls and we just lost because it's like, okay, this guy doesn't know how to play her clearly.
Coach Mills (35:15)
I just had ⁓ this match where I was playing up against Angela and we had a rocket beacon and as Mag I went and grabbed the jump pack and I would walk back to the pit, she'd pull me off and I would just jump back up, I'd walk back to the jump pack, grab another one and I did that like four times throughout a game. The Angela just kept on pulling me off, I kept on jumping up and then just like over and over again.
CaptainCoach (35:25)
yeah.
Yeah, that's nuts.
That happened to me when
I was playing Angelic. I hit an Emma off the ledge on the map in Araco. then she just, it was like a movie moment. Like when Obi-Wan comes up from the pit where it's like, oh, he's dead. He fell down there and then she comes up like, rise. It's like, oh, damn it. She has a jump pack. Yeah, it's a...
Coach Mills (35:43)
Yeah.
No,
I'm not gonna lie. Okay, this is a hot take. I think that jump pack thing should get removed. I think that that's a terrible mechanic. I'm not gonna lie. Here's why. It's value that you can swap to still have. It's like the optimal way to play is always to have a rocket, give everyone a jump pack, give everyone armor, swap off of rocket, and then you get that utility for free. And I think that that has created like a lot of problematic gimmicks like
CaptainCoach (36:01)
Really?
Coach Mills (36:19)
with Wolverine grabbing you, taking you, like it's fun. I get it. I feel like it's a gimmick that's like, I don't know.
CaptainCoach (36:21)
I disagree with you. I disagree with you. It is a gimmick, but at
the end of the day, your game has to be fun. And you have to have these like TikTok clip moments or else your game's not going to be around long enough for the balance you're talking about to matter.
Coach Mills (36:39)
Okay, I see. We can, no, I agree. think it should, let's make it something more fun and less like actually strong.
CaptainCoach (36:41)
Do you do agree with that or do you?
Okay, yeah, well, okay, what would you- what
would you put in instead of, like, a jump pack if you don't like it? I- I love the jump pack. I think it's hilarious. I- it's- it's pretty stupid.
Coach Mills (36:53)
Like, what if it's
just like a dash, like just one dash in like one direction, like a short dash. Maybe that's even stronger. I don't know, but like just like a short dash or something. ⁓
CaptainCoach (37:01)
I I I love having
broken stuff in games if it's not Yeah, like it sucks when you get hit by it, but it's also like I don't know I you're probably right like I honestly I'm you're probably right like it can be it can
Coach Mills (37:07)
You like it? like it?
Because I thought it was really cool at the start,
but then like every Wolverine just gets that and always uses it like You're just gonna get taken across the map on the first engagement every time by the Wolverine. ⁓ But I guess maybe that's like the layers to it It's like okay, you gotta force out the jetpack jump and then I like I don't know it. Yeah
CaptainCoach (37:26)
Yeah, it is a little annoying it is a little annoying. Yeah. Yeah, I guess they're
The meta is just a
bunch of these gimmicks and jokes. I could definitely see it going in that direction too, where it could be not even about skill anymore. You gotta be careful with that stuff.
Coach Mills (37:46)
Yeah, it's I think they could probably put something fun in there, but I know this is like a small minor complaint It probably doesn't even matter but yeah ⁓ Jump back up get rid of jump back ⁓ Because it's also like super busted if you give it to a punisher and because he can jump mid-alt you just dodge a magneto ult ⁓ Very strong ⁓ Give it to an invisible when she can jump like vertical mid like magneto ult. She'll never die
CaptainCoach (37:54)
Yeah. Hot take. Jump pack OP.
Yeah.
It's
terrible in Hulk.
Coach Mills (38:14)
Like
if it's used, if it used super optimally, I think it could be like absolutely insane, but like no one uses it super opti-
CaptainCoach (38:21)
Yeah, jump pack is something I don't want on Hulk because it messes up with my jump charge flow. if I press it even a second early, I'm coming down, great for my another jump, whoop, nope, okay. I'm just like, it's basically you stun yourself as Hulk for three seconds. It's basically a three second stun because you can't do anything when you're in the air, you're a melee character. So it's just like, don't give me the jump pack, I do not want it. But there is actually some crazy Hulk tech with it, which I'm eventually gonna try to do where you can actually make your air.
Coach Mills (38:24)
Hell yeah.
Yeah.
yeah, because he just outed it. He just outed the problem.
CaptainCoach (38:49)
This is breaking Hulk news, guys. I haven't revealed this to anyone where you can use the jump pack to actually do a combo where you can stun lock them for like 30 seconds in your ult. Because what you do is when you do the air stun with your ult, then you just use the jump pack and then fly even higher in the air. So your jump's like six seconds. And then when you finally land, they still have the ground slam animation. And then you can continue doing your juggle out of that.
Coach Mills (39:08)
⁓ shit.
Yeah, and I need to see that on the YouTube video ASAP. ⁓
CaptainCoach (39:16)
Yeah, I probably shouldn't have leaked it here on the podcast. You only get
the best insider information. All the secrets to Marvel rivals here on Clearcoms.
Coach Mills (39:23)
Yeah
So, what do you think Rivals needs? Like if you were to balance the game, if you had full control, balance the game, what would you do like tomorrow if you could just change some things up?
CaptainCoach (39:37)
⁓ I would-
I would nerf a couple of the strongest characters. I would tone them down a little bit. I would probably tone, I just would tone everything down a little bit just so things don't feel so oppressive to play against in like the worst situations. I just think like damage in the game is too high and it has been continually getting higher with like the addition of Phoenix and Emma, which ⁓ like Emma's wasn't nerfed enough. She's still really good. So there's some characters that I just feel are really unfun to play against. ⁓
But this is coming from a Hulk player. Like I get countered by a lot of stuff. I think maybe if you were on, I mean, I think most people play Angela, or not Angela, Phoenix know that she's completely busted. Like I think most people know that now. But so I would, and Torch too, think Torch, like I can land an air stun on Torch's Hulk and it won't even do anything. He'll just get healed.
Coach Mills (40:22)
Yeah, yeah, it's definitely busted.
How do feel about
their techs? Because they both have... ⁓ Gene has the melee tech and the spinny top tech, and then Torch has this movement tech. Both of these techs are really hard to execute on console, and they kind of both make these characters go even over the top.
CaptainCoach (40:44)
⁓ I've
seen Mike's Above You do the Torch Tech, I don't exactly under, is it with his melee attack or am I thinking of something else where it like propels him forward, like as he's moving?
Coach Mills (40:55)
So
well, yeah, so you have to kind of rebind all your stuff, but yeah, basically you are meleeing in between of Every every right click so you're like you're just your body is moving like like this. It's like not it's not Yeah, I mean it just makes it basically so hard to hit the character and it's one of the reasons why the character so busted and then like with the gene one it just gives her this brawl capability and it's like
CaptainCoach (41:08)
Oh. Right. You know, yeah, I have seen it. Yeah.
Coach Mills (41:22)
I get that those texts are kind of cool because it adds skill to the character, but it also makes it so it's really hard to balance the character because if you look at the data, like all these console players that are not using these texts are probably losing a lot more, you know? So it's like really hard. And if you don't know the tech, your win rate is probably abysmal on the character, comparatively to people that know the tech. Like if you learned the tech, like if you got paddle controllers so the tech's easier, like the movement tech on Torch, and you learn the tech,
CaptainCoach (41:35)
yeah.
Yeah.
Coach Mills (41:51)
You could probably climb all the way to diamond just with the tech alone on console. Like no one's going to hit you. Like they're not going to hit you at all.
CaptainCoach (41:54)
That's crazy
actually, yeah. Yeah, console meta and PC meta, I've been told is more similar than I thought. I thought it'd be like a lot different, but yeah, cause I mean, I think you can do most of the, I mean, we're both PC players. So like my knowledge on it isn't the best, but.
Coach Mills (42:04)
Especially when it gets to the high ELOs, it's a lot more similar, yeah.
Because
last season I climbed a Celestial on console. I bought a PS5. Yeah, which you should do too. You should do as well. Oh, you should do it. I want to see it. I want to see it. It's so slick. I feel like you would farm. See, that's what I thought. But I did play magic only, so it was a little easier, but you don't need to aim.
CaptainCoach (42:15)
Oh really? I didn't know that. No, no, no, no, no, I, I can't, I can't play console games. Me on, you do not want to see me on console, bro. I'm going to get stuck in, I'm going to get stuck in gold. I cannot play console games.
I, well, another thing too, ⁓
I play Smash Bros a lot, or used to at least, but ⁓ I actually get like carpal tunnel from those games. I'm old guys. So I actually, I'm not trying to make excuses, but I genuinely shy away from those types of games because, PC games are a lot easier on my hands and take care of your hands, kids. ⁓ Dude, like people playing games now more than like I ever did bet. Well, that's not true. played.
Coach Mills (42:39)
nice, hell yeah.
⁓ yeah.
Yeah, no, my hands fucking hurt. I'm not gonna lie. I'm not used to like, I'm not used to that.
CaptainCoach (43:02)
way too much back in the day, but like, yeah, dude, you gotta worry about that stuff. Like your health is important, like do stretches and like stay hydrated and stuff, because that stuff will get you as you get older. And if you wanna be playing games your whole life like I do, you gotta take care of that. And also like with diet and being healthy, which I don't do that either, but ⁓ those things are really important to like muscle health and things of that nature, I feel like. So just a warning to everybody, Papa Coach, you know?
Coach Mills (43:30)
If you want to still be competing like Unks like us, you know, gotta take care of yourself a little bit. A very loose term, but you We like to we like to think. Just let us have this. ⁓ Okay, so how do you feel about the state of Rivals? do you feel like Rivals, I know we've been losing some players, but it feels like
CaptainCoach (43:32)
Yeah, competing's very, we are very, bit much. We're trying.
Coach Mills (43:56)
the loss is kind of stabilized. How do you feel about the future of the game? Do you feel like the game's in a good spot? What would you feel about all this?
CaptainCoach (44:02)
Yeah, I think it's
good I think I mean I definitely have noticed like a downtick overall in its popularity with like you know like the views of like you could look around like tick-tock whatever videos But I do think it's probably bottomed out I don't think it's gonna go down many more than it has and which which is exciting to me because if that's like what I view the game as and I am in my opinion the game is only gonna grow and because I mean there's tons of characters they haven't added that people it's gonna bring people to the game I
For everybody saying the game is dying, I just don't see it really happening. It's just got too much going for it. ⁓ Which is like, mean, let's be honest, would we start a podcast if we thought this game was going to die?
Coach Mills (44:41)
Yeah, yeah for sure. I mean the game is getting updated at such a fast rate I don't feel like I feel like people are spoiled because they don't really understand like that's It's so insane. I've never seen anything like this in any game Most games come out with two characters a year, maybe three like like that's just
CaptainCoach (44:48)
⁓ their update schedule is impressive. I have a lot of faith in Nettys, I really do. I have a lot of faith in them.
Yeah. Well, the question though,
you got to ask yourself, is it because they just have a ton of like manpower or had they scheduled the release of this game with like one, two, three years of content already ready to go? Cause that's again why I would love to talk to Xeon. Like can they keep it up?
Coach Mills (45:15)
That's, I mean, I saw the numbers. was like,
wasn't it like hundreds of millions of dollars this game made in like the first like month or something like that? billions. Yeah. Like when they see those numbers, I feel like they just like green lit, like, all right, let's hire a million people. Let's turn this up to 11. Let's just keep going. And we know that the summer skins have printed money too. So like keep it going.
CaptainCoach (45:24)
⁓ it made billions. Well, it has made billions. Yeah.
Yeah. Well, that's,
Listen though,
there's not an unlimited supply of talent though. And I think when you upscale like that, it's really hard to find people who are able to balance and design characters in the same skillful way that they've done with, I think most of their characters. I think they're really smart. I really respect their design team and their philosophy on balance, even though I don't actually agree with some of the changes they make. ⁓
Coach Mills (45:46)
That is true. That is true.
CaptainCoach (46:08)
But I think they hit it out of the park on most of the heroes. Like Mr. Fantastic was awesome, Thing was awesome. Blade's a little weird, but I could see what they were going for. Blade's definitely one that I think they should probably try to rework. I'm curious to hear your thoughts on that.
Coach Mills (46:22)
I actually like Blade. I actually like Blade. think, I mean, from the design, the music, I think that's cool. I think his ultimate is cool. I will say that the brawl dash mechanic is interesting. Because basically what they did with Blade is they made a character that doesn't really have a lot of proactive playmaking. He doesn't do that much damage and it ramps up slowly, but he's through.
CaptainCoach (46:29)
music, yeah.
I don't think he's very cinematic
either or cool. Like I feel like they could have done the whole vampire aesthetic a little cooler, but maybe that's kind of like what they were going for is more like, like you can't have him have like a, like a dash to someone like I, you know, I thought he'd be like more nimble maybe or, you know.
Coach Mills (46:55)
Like a little bit of an assassin maybe.
CaptainCoach (46:58)
But then,
you're gonna have characters like Nightcrawler coming up who are just poof, poof, poof, like teleporting all over the map. mean, the game, the sky's the limit with this game. There are so many cool heroes that are gonna be out there that just gonna attract people for years to come, because they're gonna see that and like, I wanna be that thing in the game.
Coach Mills (47:02)
yeah, yeah. I, I, I, I, ⁓ I...
I'm really curious about how they're gonna do Daredevil. to me that is... They could go a million ways with Daredevil to make him, you know... Assuming he's a DPS, like... He's gonna be able to see through walls, he's gonna be able to... Like dodge and brawl, like they could give him rolls and like... I want a counter. I want a legit counter. Where it's like you press it and within like a one second window if they hit you, he does something back to them. Like I want a legit counter.
CaptainCoach (47:23)
yeah. Well, that's...
Coach Mills (47:42)
Like a full counter would be insane.
CaptainCoach (47:43)
yo, yeah, yeah, that'd be really cool actually. Interesting.
Coach Mills (47:48)
It's almost kind of like timing Iron Fist, but it's like a small window and if you time it perfectly it like...
CaptainCoach (47:53)
Well, isn't-
isn't Daredevil, like, the actual character, just, like, a guy? Like, he doesn't have superpowers, right? So, like, how do you make him- Right, his senses, but he's just, like, some guy fighting literal fucking gods. I mean-
Coach Mills (47:58)
Yeah, he's kind of...
I mean he has- he has super hearing and I mean he- Right. But- I mean- In the trailer
it looks like he's like- he's like all off-tone. Yeah, yeah. Never underestimate a blind guy, okay? But no, no, he's ⁓ I think they- I don't know if they're gonna do like- powered up Daredevil. Cause that's- in the trailer it looked like-
CaptainCoach (48:12)
You see, a guy who's blind actually, sorry, let me get that part. A blind guy fighting a literal god.
Yeah, I didn't know what that was. I didn't know what that was. Yeah, I like how they take a bit of creative liberty though to be like, okay, how can Daredevil do this? Like how is there, you know, whatever character you play, how is like, like how is Phoenix not just one-shotting the entire map or whatever? Yeah, cause she's like comic, she is kind of comic book accurate right now with how OP she is, but. ⁓
Coach Mills (48:29)
He's like powered up by something, something.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Where she right now she definitely is yeah
Yeah, by the way if you were to add a character I'm sure you heard you heard this question a million times, but I'm curious the one character. What would it be? Like what's what's the care? What's the number one character you want to see?
CaptainCoach (49:03)
it changes from day to day. So maybe a question you could probably ask me again in the future. I'd say something different. ⁓ probably I want to see what they could do like juggernaut. No, no, actually no Thanos, Thanos. I want Thanos. I think Thanos could be really actually fun to play. I like with this combat make, make him like a, ⁓ an anchor tank that's a full melee. That's what I want to see.
Coach Mills (49:14)
that is? With the glove?
Okay. Okay.
CaptainCoach (49:28)
An anchor tank that's full
melee. So the idea with Thanos would be that spinny blade thing he does. That's just, anytime he wants he can block projectiles and that would immediately make him balance if he could just do that whenever he wanted and then be a melee character maybe with small movement abilities. Something like that would be really fun to play. I just love tanky, fight in your face kind of characters. like, know, Thing, Hulk. ⁓ So yeah, an anchor tank that could.
Coach Mills (49:46)
Right, right, yeah, yeah.
CaptainCoach (49:52)
Yeah, mean, all the anchor tanks are the most tanky tanks. That's why they're anchor tanks. The tankiest tanks, they do a lot of damage. So I feel like Thanos could be something like that.
Coach Mills (50:00)
can see that. I can see that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And something big that would get a lot of people to try the game for sure. Yeah. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (50:01)
And he's cool character.
for sure yes. And they
could, the meme potential through the roof. the roof. That's what I'm saying, like I'm just not worried about the state of the game. It's gonna be around. They'd have to really mess up and you can tell they're listening to the community a lot.
Coach Mills (50:11)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
I agree,
I really do think like people are so spoiled. Like I've been making content and working with devs on games like as a creator for a long time and like so many devs just don't even listen. Like they don't care about what anyone says, like the public says. They kind of just do their own thing. They don't really take any feedback or criticism or anything like that. So, you know, as much as I criticize some of the balance things, I actually am very impressed with like the...
the cadence that they're posting content and the like how much they're being receptive to people's complaints. I think that's like, I think that's all good. I think it's actually all really good.
CaptainCoach (51:00)
Yeah, no, I'm definitely looking forward to the future. Did I miss anything?
Coach Mills (51:08)
No, no, I think we're good. I think that's most of it.
CaptainCoach (51:14)
Yeah, I mean, I'm just trying to think if there's anything else we could add in. I feel like, ⁓
Yeah, we could do like a cold open with like just some of us like, I had a couple of clip where the like one liners in there like come to the clear comms podcast for like the cutting edge, the insider information. Then you just, you know, that's the hook, right?
Coach Mills (51:32)
Yeah
Right, right, right, right, right. No, I think... Wait, what were you doing?
CaptainCoach (51:41)
but I did want
to say one thing before we ended. ⁓ So I'm sure a lot of people maybe here clicking on the video have probably seen it. A video recently has surfaced about me ⁓ on another content creator's channel, a smaller content creator named Akromix. And I said some things, some true things and some things I was joking about, ⁓ joking's never really excused that I wish I didn't.
And I'm just saying, I'm sorry to Acromix for talking about his channel the way I did. was definitely, sometimes in the heat of the moment you can kind of just say things you don't really mean. So I wanted to apologize to him and his channel, because I checked out some of his videos. He makes really cool videos. And I think he's a really good content creator. And it's definitely a learning experience for me moving forward, that the things I say, whether I'm joking or not, you know.
Our actions have weight and I think you know even like the best jokes are rooted in like a little bit of truth right that like that's kind of where like a lot of this the funny stuff lies, so it's ⁓ It's it's something where it's like ⁓ Making fun of people at their expense or whatever is just it's just not good content. It's just not being a good person and I can be better so ⁓ I will be in the future and ⁓ shout out to chromix. I talked to him personally and
⁓ He accepted my apology, I apologize to him. So I appreciate him for being so understanding about this and looking forward to trying to improve my attitude in the future. So thanks everybody for hearing me out on that. Yeah.
Coach Mills (53:21)
yeah. yeah. Now if you're a Jeff player though, I'm still roasting you. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. yeah, no, I think we, think, yeah, I think this podcast is, I'm really excited to have this place for us to just be able to talk and talk about how everything's going and yeah. Yeah.
CaptainCoach (53:37)
Yeah, dude.
I love talking about games, man. I would
really, in the future, if maybe people in the comments section, other games you want to talk about, really into that kind of stuff, really talk about game design, game balance. ⁓
Coach Mills (53:53)
Yeah,
would love to get a dev. Getting a dev would be insane. It'd be so cool. ⁓
CaptainCoach (53:59)
Yeah, it's cool because it is like a mix of, because I have like a bit of a background in like marketing and stuff. And it's cool to ⁓ see how a game is designed, not just from like, what is the ideal way to design it versus like, what is the ideal way to attract players to it to make money to keep the game around it? There has to be a balance there. And think that that area is like really interesting to me. Like I would be curious to see the connection with that sort of thing.
Coach Mills (54:25)
Yeah, for sure.
CaptainCoach (54:28)
Which by the way, what's
Coach Mills (54:28)
But, ⁓
CaptainCoach (54:29)
your background? I thought we could like talk about ourselves a little bit each podcast at the end, just like a little personal stuff.
Coach Mills (54:34)
yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I mean, I basically have been doing content for like almost eight years, seven, eight years. ⁓ I got recruited by like a gaming YouTube education company and I worked for them for three years called Game Leap. so like I kind of like the content I make now, I did for a company for like years and I worked on Overwatch and Valorant and Halo Infinite and Apex.
CaptainCoach (54:48)
⁓ okay.
You've
never, have you ever had like a job before that?
Coach Mills (55:01)
I was a cook. was a cook. Yeah, so I was like actually a cook. Terrible job, by the way. I was a cook and I was in college and doing college stuff and like the CEO of Game Leap was like, like I worked with them for like six months and he was like, hey, you're really good at this. I'll give you more money, but you got to quit school. And I was like, I'm down. So yeah, I quit school. Yeah. Like he legitimately gave me an ultimatum of like quit school and you get a raise and full time position and like all this stuff.
CaptainCoach (55:02)
you're a cook.
⁓ wow!
crazy.
Damn, young talent.
Coach Mills (55:31)
And I was like,
I was like, why the fuck am I gonna finish my general studies degree when I could just go try to do what I actually want to do? And then, yeah, yeah, yeah.
CaptainCoach (55:39)
That's, yeah, that's crazy. What
did you want to do before all that happened? Were you always set on like trying to make videos?
Coach Mills (55:45)
I actually wanted to be a lawyer. I'm not gonna lie like
CaptainCoach (55:48)
No way. You know, it's so funny. was
about to make funny, ⁓ like lying. I know a few lying cooks, man. Like that is one of the most common professions that you will see like, hard drug use, like on the job. Not saying anything about you, Mr. Mills. ⁓ Jesus Christ. You're about to have to lawyer up and keep this up, defend yourself, but like lawyers.
Coach Mills (56:01)
Oh, oh, yeah.
Hey, you caught me. You caught me. No, just kidding. One of
my mods is actually doing his LSAT right now. I don't know if he could be a creator mod. I'll get him all the connections because we're all ending up somewhere. We're going to need some legal representation. So.
CaptainCoach (56:16)
⁓ jeez. Lawyers?
Jesus
Christ, legal representation with the Akromics. ⁓ I'll just play it. ⁓ Yeah, no, the lawyers are miserable. ⁓
Coach Mills (56:32)
god.
Yeah, I'm glad that that didn't.
CaptainCoach (56:39)
You have,
like lawyers have, sorry, I don't mean to offend you, lawyers have like the highest depression rates ⁓ out of any profession. Yeah, I think that's right. might have to fact check me.
Coach Mills (56:45)
I'm not surprised. I'm actually not surprised.
Yeah, yeah, turns out lawyers
is not like suits. Like everyone thinks that being a lawyer is just like the show suits where you're just like. I'm sure I'm sure. No, it's actually because I like I grew up watching like Philip DeFranco and like other YouTubers and like I thought like, me being a YouTube would be so cool. But then somewhere along the way, I was like, ⁓ that's not that's not reasonable. That's not that's not like a reasonable goal. And then backdoored into it for no reason.
CaptainCoach (56:54)
But I'm sure there's some happy lawyers out there, you Love defending the people.
Yeah. Yeah, I want to.
Coach
Mills wanted to be a lawyer because he watched Better Call Saul. I want to be that guy. Yeah, no, nobody wants to be that guy.
Coach Mills (57:18)
Ha ha ha ha ha!
But a little bit about you, I know you have a degree. You actually finished college unlike me.
CaptainCoach (57:33)
Yeah, biggest waste of time of my life. ⁓ I wanted to play sports growing up and I was kind of like always set on that. And then when I kind of kind of saw it not really happening, I kind of that's when I started to get more into games a lot. So I really like playing competitive stuff and that's kind of what led me to streaming before that. Yeah, I I worked at a gym just to stay fit, you know.
Coach Mills (57:36)
Hahaha
CaptainCoach (58:03)
Always in my mind, like, yeah, I'm to do videos. I'm going to make content and stuff. And yeah, I've just been just been grinding at it ever since. And just trying to be my best self every day, you just trying to get better at it. It's a lot of fun, man. Like, it's fun meeting you, too. Like ⁓ you get to meet a lot of really cool people. ⁓ I joke with my chat a lot when I talk to him. I say like, yeah, you're just numbers, letters on a screen to me. You're not real people. But yeah, no, I've I've genuinely I've made like a lot of my best friends through streaming.
Like I'm about them literally about to go play a world of Warcraft with them like as soon as I leave here a guy that I met through he was watching one of my like I did like an IRL stream and he was DMing me on discord because he was like laughing at what I was doing and I was like on my phone like watch this was like a long time ago by the way, I was just out in public and I was like just talking to people at like like bars and stuff and hanging out with my friends. It was just like a super chill time and
He, one of the girls I was talking to, he's like, yo, ask that girl if she can, you can give her my Snapchat. I'm like, okay. And I just gave it to her. He ended up like dating her for a little bit. And then he told me about it. And then like, I've been friends with the guy ever since. He's like, he's a super, super cool guy. We just play games together and stuff. So yeah, man, I just love streaming, love content creation. It's something I hope I can do for as long as I can, really.
Coach Mills (59:14)
You
Yeah, yeah, no, it's...
CaptainCoach (59:32)
But yeah, used to just
be like ⁓ high school, just couldn't play sports good enough. really got into, yeah, just got into games and just got obsessed, really.
Coach Mills (59:45)
⁓ yeah.
CaptainCoach (59:46)
But I've always been a gamer,
like ever since I was young. Like I've always played games. Like... ⁓
Coach Mills (59:51)
What's your favorite old school game?
CaptainCoach (59:53)
Ooh, ooh. Ooh, that's so tough. Probably Pokemon. The Pokemon games. ⁓ Yeah, just the originals, dude, I grew up on that. ⁓ also, original, I do, I'm gonna sound like such a boomer, but the original Call of Duty, like my generation made that game. Like that, my generation, or our generation, I guess. You're 28, right? Yeah, so I got, I'm like, you're probably, are you more of a zoomer or a millennial?
Coach Mills (59:54)
I know that's like a deep question, ⁓
Pokemon, okay. Anyone in particular?
Yup, 28, yeah.
CaptainCoach (1:00:22)
Or does Gen Y is in between? I don't know the Gen, I'm a millennial for sure.
Coach Mills (1:00:23)
I
I know that like my wife is nine months older than me and her and I are technically in separate generations because it's like the cutoff is in between us. I don't exactly know. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I don't actually know. But I feel like I'm I guess I feel like I'm
CaptainCoach (1:00:35)
crazy.
By the time you were probably getting into online games, which is like when parents like kids, like which there's a lot of kids who play Marvel Rivals. The age is getting younger and younger, but like ⁓ the shooters you would have played like are what? Like with Call of Duty, did you play Call of Duty?
Coach Mills (1:00:59)
Yeah, yeah, I played Medal of Honor first, ⁓ back in the old school. ⁓ And then, yeah, then of course, Modern Warfare, College of Modern Warfare. But I was mainly like a Halo. We were like a Halo family. We played all the Halos. That was mainly what we did.
CaptainCoach (1:01:02)
Okay, yeah, I played that game. Medal of Honor, the D-Day one, so good.
Yeah.
Okay, yeah, see I was
never a Halo kid. I was never a Halo kid, but I had a lot of friends. I had a friend who played, okay, that was my Xbox friend, go to his house and play Xbox. That's my PlayStation friend. I was the Nintendo kid, you know, so.
Coach Mills (1:01:19)
as I was.
Yeah, there we go. ⁓ And then before
that is PlayStation 2, Jack and Dexter, Sly Cooper, Ratchet and Clank. That was my shit. Those were my... Yeah. But...
CaptainCoach (1:01:33)
Yes, yeah, yeah, good games. But
then, yeah, that was like before, yeah, before, before like I got into online games, maybe like middle school with, you know, like Call of Duty and Guild Wars. I love MMOs, big MMO fan. But like before that, yeah, I was like a Nintendo kid. So the GameCube, ⁓ peak, peak, bro. ⁓ my God, that's like my childhood,
Coach Mills (1:01:52)
I never had a GameCube, but I
played... I always played GameCube though for Smash, for Melee. Yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah. Yeah, like in college, that's pretty much all I did. It's just like play Melee or Smash Bros.
CaptainCoach (1:02:01)
yeah, yeah. You gotta have a friend who plays Smash.
Yeah. It's crazy how much people
still just like, most people you talk to who are like at all interested in games play Super Smash Bros or at least like know about it. It's like a cultural thing.
Coach Mills (1:02:17)
Yeah. Which is... Speaking of... of...
We just talked about devs that actually support the games. Like, the Nintendo devs for Smash are completely the opposite. They destroy tournaments at every turn. don't know if you... They basically actively don't want their game to be an eSport. And they will do everything they can to make it so that it's not an eSport. It's insane.
CaptainCoach (1:02:36)
Nintendo... They have such a stranglehold on their own brand that like they don't want anyone else to enjoy it. They- they define how
you enjoy Nintendo. They-
Coach Mills (1:02:49)
But
they make so good games that it's like... Fuck you, fine. Fuck. Adult Nintendo! You heard it here first, Adult Nintendo! But... ⁓ Nintendo Gooner content, no. No, okay, we take it all back. But, It's already over.
CaptainCoach (1:02:51)
I want adult Nintendo content, man. Not that kind, ⁓ games for adults. Peach cosplay. Just kidding. Jesus Christ. We're canceled on episode one. Nah, dude,
I want Nintendo to...
To do good, I think they still make good games, but yeah, they're just not like a really, a brand for me anymore. Like they don't really make games for their base, which is, they make kids' games still. The Mario games are just, so, like a Mario game will never get old. You know, they're just such great games. They just, platformers I feel like will always be around, because the idea of just movement.
Coach Mills (1:03:25)
I think competitive, which is...
Right.
CaptainCoach (1:03:40)
It's just like so, people just love the idea being able to move better than they can in real life. that's always gonna be a fantasy people have from, as long as we still have legs. maybe once we get absorbed into the collective AI, we'll all just, ⁓ the game's all just be made up in our heads.
Coach Mills (1:03:56)
yeah, yeah, of course. ⁓ It's gonna happen before we know it. is the last... People are gonna look back on this as the golden age of gaming before it all got taken over.
CaptainCoach (1:04:01)
I'm gonna...
dude, it's definitely
exciting. I can just imagine myself doing my Super Smash Brothers combos in my head, just ⁓ psychically making my, psychically Falcon kicking. That's my main by the way, is Captain Falcon. That's all I, I only play Captain Falcon.
Coach Mills (1:04:16)
Yeah, yeah, I was, I know this is way off.
Well,
I saw that NeuroLink, like the Elon Musk whatever NeuroLink where it's like it's tied into his brain and he can control the cursor with his brain. ⁓ Is that like aimbot? Like, is that going to be a thing? Like, ⁓ if you could control a cursor with your brain, like, I feel like that's just cheating, I don't know. But I know what goes away.
CaptainCoach (1:04:40)
I mean, technically a computer
still has the potential to be better, right? Or maybe not, I don't know.
Coach Mills (1:04:47)
It
depends, if it gets too fast, like, I mean I just-
CaptainCoach (1:04:50)
Yeah,
soon the people are gonna accuse cyborgs being the real cheaters. Like literally, it's gonna be pay to win, stuff like that's gonna cost money. So you're be a cybernetically enhanced gamer, and then eventually it's just gonna be robots playing imaginary games against other robots. Think about it.
Coach Mills (1:04:54)
Sorry.
Yelp.
Yeah, this is the last golden age. got like 20 good years and that's about it.
CaptainCoach (1:05:12)
Yeah, dude. That's why people ask me like, why do you play so
much? I'm like, dude, it's you. This might not be around, bro. This is this is a dying art. It's it's moving in a scary direction, man, with like VR and stuff. And it's just like, I like the idea of being detached from everything. Like, it's like a lifestyle, bro. Get up and like, go and just take a break. know, ⁓ it's something that, you know, could I mean, maybe it'll get better, though. Maybe it become like more convenient.
Coach Mills (1:05:18)
It's not gonna be a re- yeah, it's gonna be a re-
CaptainCoach (1:05:41)
like gaming, maybe it's something that like, you can do more because it's so accessible. I think that's kind of the direction it's moving, right? With like the Nintendo switch and like all these like psychically, you know, people are trying to like control stuff in their head is just to make everything more convenient. Like if you can control a game in your head, you have a car that drives your, can drive yourself. I mean, you just do that while you're on your way to work, you know, during your commute.
Coach Mills (1:06:03)
All I'm saying is things
always get better before they get worse. ⁓ I'm super skeptical. I'm a doomer. I'm a doomer. When they try to get rid of my mouse and keyboard, then I know it's gone. Like it's over. Well, I feel like they're gonna come up with some reason to use a new device, like a new input, like you said, like at some point. I know this is like way off base, but yeah.
CaptainCoach (1:06:07)
Damn, so you're a gaming doomer? What do you think it's going then?
Is that happening to you?
Yeah, well, I mean,
it's up to us. know, like, would you think people will accept that? People probably will, but I
Coach Mills (1:06:31)
Like, do
you think in a hundred years we're still going to be using mouse and keyboard to play FPS games? That's like...
CaptainCoach (1:06:35)
⁓
I have no idea. That's so far in the future. Like there's so much new technology that could come out. It really just depends on what people are willing to buy, right? What people are going to be interested in. That's like really hard to know.
Coach Mills (1:06:39)
That's the...
We're
all trekking towards Sword Art Online. I don't know if you're familiar, but... No, Sword Art Online is like... You upload your mind into the game.
CaptainCoach (1:06:57)
Is that like solo leveling?
Oh, no, yeah, no, yeah, my brother tells me I need to watch that.
Coach Mills (1:07:09)
I don't know if I would recommend it, but that's just like what people crave. want to go into the games, but... ⁓
CaptainCoach (1:07:15)
Yeah, there's like a lot of, ⁓ what are they called? the anime, no, the type of animes where it's like they get put in a, like a video game and then they got to like power up.
Coach Mills (1:07:19)
like Ready Player One.
⁓ yeah, yeah. virtual VMO, maybe VMO. It might be that.
CaptainCoach (1:07:28)
There's some word for it. ⁓
It's like, ⁓ no,
it's a Japanese word, I think. It's gonna drive me crazy. It's like the type of anime where the character progresses. It's like, ⁓ hold up. This is gonna drive me crazy. I'm sure people are like screaming at the screen right now, because they know exactly what I'm saying. So many comments say what it's called. It's a type of anime, ⁓ yeah, that's, I know there's like a lot of those. I saw one where it was, ⁓
Coach Mills (1:07:38)
I have no idea.
CaptainCoach (1:08:04)
God, it was a girl who went into a... She like died? And then went into a world where she... was just... She got to like the highest level? And then... Oh, you know what? I don't even know what... I watched it as a joke. It was like how to become a level 1000 slime farmer some...
Coach Mills (1:08:21)
⁓
CaptainCoach (1:08:28)
Yeah, like the anime power up. I do, I'm sorry. It's a type... But that
was the name of the anime. It was like so, like it wasn't serious at all. was, it's just like a power fantasy that like weebs like to live through and that there's like a ton of them. That's what it is. That's what I was trying to, the point I was trying to get to go. But no, I like anime. Anime is cool.
Coach Mills (1:08:39)
I mean, there's a lot of names like that. Right.
Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Yeah, if those games come out by the time I'm like 70 so I can like still do something when I'm like in a retirement home, that'd be cool.
CaptainCoach (1:08:59)
Yeah dude, Psychic Games, I don't know if I would want to do that. I mean get motion sickness playing, doing VR. So I usually, I gotta take a Dramamine pill or something before I do that. But yeah, I'm excited though, I am excited. No point in just being a doomer too much. Then you're just not gonna want to play any games at all. It's like okay, I'm gonna have to go outside? Nah, screw that.
Coach Mills (1:09:12)
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Hahaha!
Yeah, that's
CaptainCoach (1:09:29)
Nah, it was fun talking man, do you wanna?
Coach Mills (1:09:32)
Yeah,
yeah, yeah, no, is awesome. I'm really excited. We'll probably do our next podcast in a week or two, whenever you feel like there's more to talk about. Yeah. There's a lot of people. I have a lot of contacts. We have a lot of contacts. can... I'm down for a pro. I'm down for a streamer. I'm down for... I'll reach out to the devs. Probably better to get a couple episodes out before we even get a chance at that, but...
CaptainCoach (1:09:42)
Yeah, we gotta get somebody on. Who do you want to get on? That'd be good.
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah,
well yeah, we could ask around. Maybe again, leave it in the comments, dude. Because if we could probably make it happen, feel like you know a lot of people.
Coach Mills (1:10:05)
Yeah, yeah, whoever y'all wanna see on the podcast, let us know.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I can set out some feelers, yeah.
CaptainCoach (1:10:15)
Cool, hell yeah man. All do wanna do the outro? Or do we just say bye? Bye! the end. Get outta here, go, shoo.
Coach Mills (1:10:17)
All
Yeah, Yeah,
CaptainCoach (1:10:32)
Classic YouTuber outro. The classic outro. Thanks for watching everybody.
Bye!