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Julia Fox guest stars as Raquel Debrowski, a “grief influencer” whose widow brand is shaken when her firefighter husband Johnny suddenly reappears—alive. What should be a joyful reunion quickly turns deadly as Raquel’s online empire, reality show “The Black Veil,” and shady motives collide. Meanwhile, Elsbeth reconnects with undercover officer Kaia Blanc (now “Denise Jackson”), who’s secretly working a dock corruption case. Their friendship sparks again, but danger looms when Elsbeth’s burner call to Kaia goes unanswered. With cameos, chaos, and commentary on influencer culture, this episode dives deep into love, lies, and the price of going viral.
Timestamps:
00:08 – Julia Fox enters as grief influencer Raquel Debrowski
00:17 – “The Black Veil” reality show and the return of Johnny
00:27 – Elsbeth discovers Johnny’s death isn’t what it seems
00:44 – Undercover Kaia (aka Denise Jackson) reappears
01:00 – A killer reveal and a cliffhanger that puts Kaia in danger
Love the episode? Don’t forget to like, subscribe, and leave a review to help more Good Wife fans find the pod! You can also support the show at https://buymeacoffee.com/goodpod.
Love the episode? Don’t forget to like, subscribe, and leave a review to help more Good Wife fans find the pod! You can also support the show at https://buymeacoffee.com/goodpod.
Creators and Guests
Host
What is The Good Pod?
Calling all fans of courtroom intrigue and complex characters! Join us each week as we dive deep into the gripping world of "The Good Wife," "The Good Fight", "Elsbeth," and the entire legal drama universe created by Robert and Michelle King. Jason Reed and Marissa Garza, break down each episode, unpack intricate plot lines, and analyze the moral dilemmas faced by Alicia Florrick, Diane Lockheart, Elsbeth Tascioni, and their colleagues. Whether you're a longtime fan or new to these addictive shows, you'll gain fresh insights and catch details you might have missed.
Elsbeth S3E3
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[00:00:00]
[00:00:05] Welcome to the Good Pod. We're today we're talking to Elizabeth, season three, episode three. Good grief. I'm one your host Tracy Reed. With me as always the number one Penn influencer. Marissa Garza. Marissa, you good? I'm great. What a, what an intro, Jason, today? Yeah. I gave you a good today, an intro. That was great.
[00:00:23] I gave you a one. I loved it. Like, let's like just frame it, put it in the, the Good Pod museum. I will cherish it forever. Uh, Jason, I'm great. How are you? I'm doing good. Are you also great? Good? I'm good. Good. Great. I'm good. Okay. I'm good. All right. Yeah, we're here is, that's about season three. That was with season three, the return you, could you, you sum this one, sum this one up.
[00:00:44] The return return, yes. Um, let's, uh, sort collective scenes. Yeah, sort of, kind of. Um, before we dive into that and all the other things that happened in this case, uh, we want to remind you of some free and easy ways [00:01:00] you can help this podcast. You can do that by reviewing rating and subscribing wherever it is you are watching or listening to this podcast.
[00:01:08] There's a way to subscribe, like, or review us. If you could do that, it would be greatly appreciated. Gets us into the eyes and ears of more listeners that like would like content like this. Uh, if you want to just chat with us about the episode or chat with us about any and everything, you can email us at the good pod feedback@gmail.com.
[00:01:23] If you so choose, you can also help us monetarily. You can do that by going to buy me a coffee.com/good pod and donating to our coffers. We would greatly, greatly appreciate that, uh, as it helps keep this show running. Uh, Rissa. Yeah. Let's, uh, let's get into the case. Alrighty. Uh, to sum this one up, just give a little brief summary here.
[00:01:45] In this episode, we're introduced to Raquel Debrowski, AKA Julia Fox, I guess Julia Fox, who, you know, uh, Julia Fox is one of those people that's like, she hasn't done much in quote unquote [00:02:00] Hollywood. Okay. Yeah. But she has in pop culture, she's, yeah, very much so. Pop culture. She's very well known in pop culture.
[00:02:06] She's just, I guess, kind of known for being hot. So like, that's, that's basically where I knew her from. Like, I've heard the name Julia Fox and is basically just from people being like, oh my God, how hot is Julia Fox? And so, like, I, I was like, I've heard the name before. I did not recognize her just from her face, like on like the show.
[00:02:25] I was like, okay, who is this? And so I had to like, do more research than normal. 'cause usually I look at our guest murderer and I'm like, oh, it's that person. And this one, I was like, who's that person? And I was like, oh, she, okay. Is famous for the meme, the audio meme, the Tic-Tac sound, uncut Jams, or however she said it.
[00:02:46] She said it in a weird way that everybody like took like uncut jams or something. Something like, look it up. Okay, I'll, it's a thing. I'll, I'll, that's the only reason. That's how I know her. Yeah. Like that's it is that everyone was using the sound on TikTok and [00:03:00] I was like, oh, she was talking about UNT Jams and that's it.
[00:03:04] UNT Jams and, yes. Did, did she say that while big in the movie UNT Jams? Is that where that comes from? I think it was like in her press tour. She was like talking about like the, she's something about like the impact of Unka Jam. I mean, 'cause she is in uncut jobs. Yes. Yeah. She is in uncut job. And I was unsure if it was one of those moments where it's like, you know, the name of the movie gets, gets said in the movie.
[00:03:27] She's like, it me, she was in the movie. She's like, look at all these uncut jams. No, it was like her, it was like a Julia Fox creation. Okay. It was not a scripted moment. Cool. Uh, so yeah, she was in uncut, Jim, she was also most recently in the movie him, which is a, uh, Jordan Peele joint. Mm-hmm. Um, so apparently that those are her biggest, I think, baf days that, uh, she has coming into this, uh, other than just being attractive, which is what, like, I think I know her to as, as being or just hearing people say, Hey, [00:04:00] she's hot.
[00:04:00] So Julia, I don't know how Julia Fox ended up on Elsbeth. I don't think it's our usual, uh, guest murderer assist. I think usually our guest murderers are a little more seasoned, a little more. It's famous, you know, I was thinking about this and mm-hmm. Seeing as we had that like budget conversation very explicitly put into our, our storyline at the beginning of the season, uh, you know, uh, the budget for the show probably did go a lot to the co-stars and the having people come in and out.
[00:04:32] And so I just think like maybe the caliber, no offense to Julia Fox, her, her star may be rising her, she may be on the way. Um, but you know, Nathan Lane, Julia Fox. Yeah. Gonna be a different paycheck, you know, maybe May, may. Honestly, I don't know. Honestly, I don't know. I feel like Julia Fox might, her price might be like high, right?
[00:04:56] I feel like, I feel like right now where we are in the [00:05:00] world, Julia Fox might cost more than, than a, um, I from David Cross. I don't know. I don't know. I just feel like Julia Fox is on the rise. Maybe her paycheck is, I, I don't know. I would love to know what, I don't know what the, uh, you know, reasoning or how this came to be.
[00:05:17] We need to see your p and l Elizabeth. I would like to see the profit and loss of every episode, so I know exactly where your decisions are coming from. I actually at piano, I was like, the piano was last episode. I think that was, but I think, you know, I, I don't know if this theory is true, we'll just have to see like who else continues to show up.
[00:05:34] But it's just the theory I have at this time. But anyway. Okay. So Julia Fox is playing Raquel Debrowski, a grief influencer whose brand is built upon being the widow of a firefighter fighter. Johnny Debrowski presumed dead in a helicopter crash in Puerto Rico eight months ago. She's leveraged her widow status to a lucrative social media persona and a reality spinoff show.
[00:05:54] Was on a reality show called The Black Veil, which Jason side note I really thought was going to [00:06:00] be an all black cast, like a reality show. Like I was like, oh my gosh. It's like, oh, okay. But then no, it is show where and get matched up and, and hence it's called The Black Veil. The Black Veil, hosted by, uh, Tony Gonzalez.
[00:06:19] Who, you know, MEA Did, do you know who Tony Gonzalez was? No. You have no idea clue. Tony Gonzalez is a famous ti uh, ex tight end who, uh, does do some, uh, you know, does some, I think pre-game show work for like Fox every Sunday. So he was a famous tight end back in, back in the day, used to, used to really win me some fantasy football matchups back in the day.
[00:06:40] Mm-hmm. So I was like, oh, Tony Gonzalez here. Which is very, makes a lot of sense because that's a lane that a lot of like retired NFL people are going down now, being like game show hosts. Yes. Uh, I think of like Nate Burleson who was like really blown up, uh, to be like a prominent host in very, a lot of different things.
[00:06:57] So I think I was like, oh, that makes so much sense [00:07:00] into what today's world is like, where a lot of, for whatever reason ex uh, ex NFL athletes mostly become these, like these game show hosts. I think, you know, Michael Strahan, uh, Nate Burleson come to mind. So I was like, that makes a whole lot of sense.
[00:07:13] James, James Palmer, even from, uh, the Bachelor I think was even an ex uh. Uh, NFL guy, but not as, not as prominent as like a Naper Center mock str, but yeah, they're, they're out. There's like, that makes a lot of sense. And on the other side of things, Gabby from the Bachelor, bachelorette and Traders Nation was a Broncos cheerleader.
[00:07:32] So, you know, that's all I got to offer. There you go. On wing, the l part of it. But anyway, versus like, I have something to contribute. I, I do, I do. And that is, I know, I know things about the sports ball. Yeah. You know, sports and so I actually do know a lot. I just don't support it at this moment in time, uh, for my own personal reasons, which yes.
[00:07:52] Any who? Um, but I'm not gonna yuck anyone's yum. You just, you watch you cheer, you'd be a fan. That's [00:08:00] important. Especially in 2025. Okay, so we had, she's on the Black Veil, which is not the show that I thought it was. It's about widows, widow, widows and widowers in a bachelor style, bachelorette style type of show.
[00:08:13] Um, and at on the show, she decides to choose herself and basically like, lets these other two guys down. And this is kind of, ro taken her profile up. And that's exactly the point. When, um, Johnny decides to unexpectedly turn back up and he's alive, he shows up at Raquel's apartment, claiming to have survived, had amnesia rescued by locals, et cetera.
[00:08:34] That moment was the moment there should be a happy reunion, but the story goes sideways quickly. Raquel immediately. Calculating. If Johnny is really alive, I don't really have this whole like widow brand thing going on. Meanwhile, the team at the NYPD, including Elba, begin investigating a mysterious voicemail that to Johnny's mom, Marie Debrowski, Johnny's mom, for those of you who are fans [00:09:00] of old movies, may have recognized as Ka Mor, Kathy Moriarty, not the Shakespeare Moriarty, but the Kathy Moriarty from Raging Bull.
[00:09:11] Yeah. I became famous like, uh, back in the day. She's, she's worked a bunch since, but I don't think anything like super out there noticeable. No. It's just like. In and out of some things. Mm-hmm. Um, but yeah, so Johnny called and left a voicemail for his mom, which contradicts Johnny's presumed death. She reports receiving a call from him, which starts to unravel the presumed death story.
[00:09:33] Forensic evidence starts piling in a shucker, picks up a hi, a hitchhiker who is known as Dawn instead of John in Delaware. DNA was left on some beer cans in that truck. Johnny's body was later found in the Hudson with a old FYND harness in carabiner. So. We've got some evidence going on there. It turns out that Johnny was never on wrecked on the [00:10:00] wrecked helicopter.
[00:10:00] He skipped it and went off the grid, living a double life and like living with a bunch of people, being a bartender, all of this stuff. And he resurfaced. When the whole black veil thing was kind of happening, the motive becomes clear to the team. Raquel fears losing her brand, her identity, and her livelihood.
[00:10:17] Facing Johnny's reappearance. She arranges to kill him, staging his death for real this time by pushing him off the sta satin statin island ferry. And then continuing on with her live streaming of grief. And so we do see, at the beginning of the episode, we see the murder happen, but then the case is like presented as a missing person's case, which is the first time we had that presented to us on sba.
[00:10:42] But in the end, the team figures that out per usual, and we had some special help along the way. Mm-hmm. Uh, with our good friend. Kaya Blanc. Yeah. This, uh, who, who is now Denise Jackson for her undercover Sting [00:11:00] reasons. Uh, so yeah. And she's apparently like on a task force and Elsbeth is like, I see you, but I don't see you.
[00:11:07] And then they meet up for some extra, like, evidence swapping, but it's kind of putting Kaia in a dangerous spot. And the cliffhanger of this episode is we are left when Elizabeth is trying to reach Kaia on a burner phone that Wagner so generously gives her and it doesn't answer. So therefore we don't know where Kaia is.
[00:11:29] Okay. So I, yeah, I really love the conceit of the black veil because. It made so much sense for today's reality. TV love competition shows because, like you said, at the very end she choose, 'cause the, the ca casino is like whoever you choose will lift your veil and you'll, you'll live off healthy upper after.
[00:11:52] So she decides to lift her own veil, which is, which has happened in recent seasons of these type of reality shows. People go, well, people have two [00:12:00] options. And they go, you know what? This just doesn't feel right. I'm choosing myself for whatever, whatever reasons. I mean, yeah, for no reason. You might wanna watch, love is Blaine Denver.
[00:12:12] Uh, listen, that is, that is everyone was choosing themselves. That love was blind Denver at the end. Okay. But yeah, so this, this makes a whole lot of sense, uh, and kind of send up of today's, uh, love reality, reality shows. So I thought it was very fun and very funny. Made a lot of sense. I enjoyed Tony Gonzalez being here, made, again, made so much sense for an ex NF NFLer to be the host of this show.
[00:12:37] Uh, and you know, because when you find out, like it's, it is like this is not only like this wasn't, this wasn't real, real, right? Because, uh. Uh, what, what, I'm sorry, what is her name? Um, Julia Fox. Uh, Raquel Drows. Ra Raquel is, is, this is calculated 'cause Raquel's like, listen, I'm I, the grief influencer [00:13:00] thing Ha.
[00:13:00] Is really bringing in the bucks. So why would I stop that by getting a new love? I can just, yeah, keep, just keep this grief train running, which let's have a broader conversation about grief influencers, because that is a thing. Like, it's like, it might sound like a silly El Smith invention, but it's a thing.
[00:13:20] It's a real thing out there and you ha you can have your different thoughts about it, whether people doing it for the right reasons or people are being genuine in how they're feeling. But it, it's a, it's a real thing out there in, in, you know, social media land. Not to always bring up capitalism. However, um, I would say that this is not, I, I'm not judging any of the people who are.
[00:13:44] In grief influencing land because we have a system that allows for grief influencing to happen. Like it's just a natural byproduct of capitalism that of course now we have influencers that are talking about the skincare products they use to hide their tears when [00:14:00] they're crying and grieving. And I also will say that like people are so like detached from their own emotions that like seeing someone else go through emotions could be captivating for someone in like a parasocial relationship type of thing.
[00:14:13] Um, so yeah, this is a, this is a real, a real thing. And, um. You know, and the character, Raquel, she, like you said, she chooses herself on the Black veil, but then she, she, she noticed, like she also has a manager who's in her ear this whole time saying like, oh, now you can get a spinoff show. You can have your own show.
[00:14:34] You can do all this. So she's not doing this alone. Like, there's a whole business built around her grief, influence, influencing, excuse me. Yeah. And it's like, she, she's in this lane. She's like, I nothing can mess up this lane. This, this is the lane I wanna stay in. So much so that like, you know, as, as you said in the summary, Johnny comes back, Johnny like reappears to her apartment.
[00:14:55] She's like, oh crap. Like, you're going to, you're gonna really [00:15:00] mess up my, my gig here. You're gonna mess up my brand. Which, you know, she's, she's so. She's so into her brand and she, she'll obviously do anything to keep that brand. Did you think it was Johnny for real? Like I was very confused because what I saw was their, like the, the manager and, and Raquel had like a conversation.
[00:15:19] She was like, if only, the only thing that could stop this is if Johnny came back or whatever. And then he had a look on his face, like, did he know that Johnny was alive? Or whatever. And then someone shows up at the door and I was like, is that Johnny? I don't know. 'cause we didn't see like any pictures of Johnny before that, you know what I mean?
[00:15:36] So I didn't know what to expect, but I was questioning for a while. I think she would know if it was Johnny or not. Like Yeah, they found a, he found, they found a, uh, a guy that looked just like Johnny maybe with some, uh, cosmetic, like this could have been, because the guy, the agent guy is actually not, not a nobody.
[00:15:54] He is, he's been on Ozark, he's on Ray Donovan rabbit hole, like in actual, like [00:16:00] roles, not just like, yeah, yeah. West Star roles. He's been, he has his own like 20 episodes of Ozark, which didn't have that many episodes. He's in mostly episodes of Ozark. So. I, I, I definitely could have seen a, like, twist in there where, like you say, the agent could have been like, I found this guy looks just like Johnny, right?
[00:16:15] And he thought maybe he's gonna like, spring him on Raquel and maybe steal her money or something that maybe the agent had some other scheme that Raquel didn't know about or something. But that may have been like, uh, an early draft of the episode. They cast it. I was like, let's not do that. Let's move away from that.
[00:16:31] Um, or if I like put on my Dateline hat, this was all like Johnny's plan to disappear and then have, have, uh, Raquel earn a lot of money and then the agent person was funneling money to Johnny while he was living on the island. Yep. Maybe, maybe. So they, you don't really get a good motive on why. Johnny is really back because we find out later in the episode that, because Johnny, well, Johnny says to Raquel is like, oh yeah, I've, I flew out the helicopter when it crashed and I got amnesia and I was walking by [00:17:00] a TV and saw you on the tv, and all the memories came funny back to me.
[00:17:03] But we found out later that will lie, that it was not real. So I did wonder, like, did, did Johnny's number one, we heard that Johnny had had sex with a lot of married women on the island. Oh yeah. The ladies were turning up with stories when Johnny came back to life. So he, he had to get out of there, I guess, to escape from all the husbands that, that he, you know, that he upset.
[00:17:27] And he also sees now like, oh, Raquel is doing really well, uh, making money off of me and off of my name. So he is like, maybe let me go cash in on that. Like, because it, it felt like maybe he left, he was like, he was in Puerto Rico. He found a, he found a convenient excuse to like say he was the fakest death and he was like.
[00:17:44] Why not? Like, I don't like my life back home. Uh, obviously, I guess he didn't love Raquel that much. So we, he, we kind of heard later in the episode, they didn't have the best, uh, relationship. So he is like, Hey, I'll just fake my death live down here in Puerto Rico and live, live the life. And that [00:18:00] life became harder.
[00:18:01] So he decided to cash in on Raquel, but we don't really get that said out loud to us of like Right. Why he chose to to come back. Right. Which is why, I mean, I really thought it was a setup until, and then I was like, oh, okay, yeah, we're here. But you know, I, Raquel I think Raquel's just lazy, right? Raquel's lazy.
[00:18:19] Because Raquel, if she had worked hard enough, she could have spun this, she could have spun the whole thing to like, to just go into a different influencer lane to be like, oh, 'cause you don't think people, the skills a skill be interested. Yeah. Well that's the interesting to see Johnny come back and like what their life would be.
[00:18:36] You don't think she could have spun that into a different, like, uh, influencer bracket? I think she could, they could have had like their own show together of like, yeah. How to get reacquainted with your husband when he lied and said he was dead for, you know, 18 months. Yeah. You know, who's not buying that reality, who's not buying that reality show, right?
[00:18:55] Yeah. Like there are many, many worse real reality shows that are out there right now, but Raquel, Raquel, this [00:19:00] whole time's like, nah, I'm a, I, I think I'm doing well, this grief thing, I'm gonna keep, keep up with that. And like a grief, like how like, she's so dumb because this, this could have like re revitalized her influencer career because how long, like the, the influencer space is very like, what have you done for me lately?
[00:19:19] So, well. You would, this death was, this death was only gonna run her for so long until it, the, the grief, the, the compassion and grief for her ran out. This could have restarted her whole influencer career. Yeah. I mean, we're already at 18 months after the event where she started influencing using the grief.
[00:19:36] Right. So that's pretty long. That's pretty long's. She's working on borrowed time here because she, uh, you know, 18 months. She's lucky. She's got this reality show, the back veil right now. Uh, you know, she coulda, she could have done this. She and Johnny both could have been on Dancing With the Stars the next season.
[00:19:52] Oh yeah, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Man, she messed us up. She really messed us up. But she was, she was, she was dumb. She was, she was terrible because Jason, sometimes, [00:20:00] at least in New York specifically, the only solution is to kill someone without a gun. Yeah, I guess so. That there's no other way, there's no other way to make it better for yourself.
[00:20:09] Yes. There's no other solutions. That's, that's it's just someone needs to be killed. She's taking the easy way out documenting murder here, I guess, but I mean, that wasn't, so let's talk about the murder. Okay. So she brings, first of all, they're going on the stand island ferry, and she has luggage. I don't know why she has luggage.
[00:20:27] Johnny, Johnny, they didn't, didn't ring a bell to you, Johnny, to be like, why are you bringing luggage? I guess she could have told him, well, if we spend the night over at your mother's house, we have clothes. Like, or she's bringing her influencer gear, like her tripods and her ring light and all that stuff.
[00:20:42] Um, but she's got this, this suitcase. And then she knew on this, the ferry that there were like sandbags to put it in and then also grabbed the, um, the harness that was on her altar originally for Johnny and kind of just like tied it to him and then pushed him over the edge. And Johnny [00:21:00] like didn't really fight back.
[00:21:01] It was very interesting. No, Johnny, my friend. I mean, listen, Johnny didn't seem like the brightest bulb in the socket. Okay. Let's just say that. But sir, she tied it to your belt or to your like pants loop, I guess. And maybe instead of drowning immediately just take your pants off. I, I don't know. Like, or like, and honestly I was very confused at the, like, if, if I were Raquel mm-hmm.
[00:21:28] Why wouldn't you throw the suitcase over first and just have him like go with it? Yeah. Yeah. To taken by surprise. But she like, I guess then we wouldn't have the dramatic like holding onto the railing day of going down type of scene. Yeah. But I was like, wouldn't use physics to your advantage here. Like Yeah, but it's to help you.
[00:21:51] No one, no one here, no one here did the best job of being a, uh, a, a murderer or a victim. Okay. They both, they both had their [00:22:00] problems. Agreed. Agreed. Yeah. And I mean, this is a TV show. This is what we're supposed to do. I'm not really, I'm not really into figuring out why people decided to murder people in the mechanics in which they did.
[00:22:12] I'm sure the kings hate us. The kings are like, y'all thinking too much about this. Like, it's, yeah. They're like, we're just, we're just having fun guys. This is Ella's Beth. Okay. It's ELs. Yeah. Yeah. So we had that. And then what, what did you think about how the case was presented in the station? So we, we saw that we still had officer, I forget her name, but she was a merrily, we go along, um, officer Hackett, which I was like, officer Hackett.
[00:22:38] Yeah. So Officer Hackett is going to be like, I guess we, we are in a rotation again of cops. We have a rotation of cops. You have rotation of detectives. It's like two different dials that are getting spun around every episode. They're gonna get a different combination. Maybe. Maybe we'll see Somerville again.
[00:22:54] Um, well, but this combination specifically seems the stick. Yeah. Uh, because we had Detective [00:23:00] Fleming and there's the vibes happening. Your vibes, there's some compliments on the crafts. There's some compliments on work life balance. Yeah. There's some things going on and I think by the end of the episode, we are to assume that they are at least having drinks with each other or doing something after work together.
[00:23:18] Well, I wasn't sure like, because. Okay, grace. Grace is probably what, late twenties, early thirties. Uh, detective Fleming is sixties. Like, I mean, I think she could be in her thirties, forties, maybe thirties, maybe. So yes, at the beginning, like at, at first I was thinking like, are there like romantic vibes happening?
[00:23:43] But then I kind of got the vibes at the end that Fleming was going to become a mentor to Grace. And I was like, okay, maybe that's where they're going with it. Um, because what? And hey, I'm all for it. More people, we get Quentin at five, the better off for society. [00:24:00] Hey, uh, you know, keep your peace. Keep your peace.
[00:24:02] That's what I say. Um. But yeah, so in the way, the way this case was presented, because there's no homicide at first, Ellsworth has to be brought in some other way. So it's kind of like the case was kind of brought to Ellsworth. She didn't have to go anywhere for the case because Marie comes through the precinct because she got a voicemail from Johnny, which Johnny did not tell Raquel that she, that he, he had left the voicemail because he told Raquel that he hadn't told anyone yet.
[00:24:27] 'cause she asked, so she had this, she had this plot almost as soon as she saw Johnny walk in the door. She's like, so baby, baby, baby, you didn't tell anyone else that you're back, did you? He says, no, we're gonna go visit my mom later. And so I guess he didn't tell her mom a voicemail. I You're the only one.
[00:24:42] You're the only one. I told, you're the most important, blah, blah, blah. But, uh, we do have to go to Moz, like right now, like we gotta go. Hey, listen, we find out Johnny's a world class liar anyway, so it does not surprise he just left that part out that he, he left a voicemail from mom. So mom comes to the precinct and says, Hey, my presumed [00:25:00] dead son left me a voicemail.
[00:25:01] What are you gonna do about it? Let's go. So El Elvis is kind of like in the background and she hears what's going on and gets involved. So it's like, oh yeah. 'cause So it's kind of different. Like, we don't get Ellsworth going to a crime scene and, uh Right, right. Dosing her way in and doing all this. The crime kind of comes to Ellsworth in this, in this case.
[00:25:19] And at the same time, while Marie is in the station, we have Raquel coming and saying like, you have to accept that Johnny is gone. Mm-hmm. It's just part of thing. So Ellizabeth is like introduced to the two people? She, I, I was surprised she was, again, I know, I'm thinking too hard about this, but like.
[00:25:39] She's in homicide and this is a missing person's case. Uh, and well, we didn't, like, this is like kind of a trend, I guess, for this season, because last episode is Yeah, exactly. To start with her investigating a homicide, she Oh, did, no, it did. No, it did. Yeah. I just, it did the, the, the murder victim was so.
[00:25:58] Felt like a relevant last episode [00:26:00] that I forgot that it was like they were investigating this homicide and it felt like she had just like, kind of stumbled across David Cross, uh, last episode. So yeah, she, they, they were investigating. She, there was a crime scene, so I'm, I'm wrong about that. But this was a little different because the crime like, came to her.
[00:26:15] Yeah. It, it came to her more ways than once. So she's intro, like it came in through the station. She was like, both Detective Fleming and her were assigned to it, which again, homicide district, missing persons, I don't know. But anyway, it happens. It felt more like Ell Smith was doing her ELLs Smith thing and maybe she didn't have a current homicide.
[00:26:33] She's just like, what is everybody else doing? What can I help with? What can I, what can I do mean? She just kind of found her like, she, like Marie was in the precinct at the time. She was like, oh, let me, lemme get on this. Lemme see what's going on here. So she just bringing her expertise to any, any and every cry.
[00:26:46] She's a helper. She's a helper, helper. And she ends up going to the dock and that's where, well, first of all, she goes to the dock because they found Johnny. Mm-hmm. Strangely, they found Johnny in the ocean because [00:27:00] people are now using the ocean to store wine. Like they store that wine in caves and barrels apparently.
[00:27:09] So they, someone was checking in on their wine and found Johnny at, at the bottom of the, or floating in the ocean. 'cause he hadn't reached the bottom yet. And we see Cameron there letting us know yet, like, no, this dude was murdered. Like it's officially a murder case now. Good to see. They're keeping old Cameron around, even though his love interest has, uh, has left this officially left the series regular scene.
[00:27:33] At least we're still getting cams from work here. Yeah. Yeah, it was, I mean, I wish he would bring some baked goods in every once in a while, but mm-hmm. Um, yeah, he's there and, uh, then Ellizabeth asks like, do they have cameras? He's like, I don't know. You're gonna have to ask. And who do we see when she asks?
[00:27:51] No, they're like, Kyle, this was a good, a really good surprise because I, I said last episode I thought was gonna be the [00:28:00] Marissa Gold episode. And I thought that because reading the description for this episode last week, it said there was gonna be like a reunion does, it does something, something, something about a reunion.
[00:28:10] So I was like, oh, okay. It's Ellsworth and Marissa. I didn't even. Think about Kaia in that regard. So I was like, oh my God, it's Kaia. Like when, when Sheik, when Elvis was looking down while talking to the person and I saw that the person she was talking to was black. I was like, Uhuh, that ain't, that ain't Kaia.
[00:28:27] And I was like, oh, I got it. It's Kaia. Ah, I was, I was so happy. Yeah, it's Kaia and. I loved how this played out because Ellizabeth did do a good job not freaking out. She did do a good job playing along. Uh, we learned that Kaya's new identity is Denise Jackson. Apparently she's there, you know, working on some doc corruption case.
[00:28:52] Um, but they ended up like using a tiki bar as a place to exchange information and kind of like see each other and talk to each other. And we got a little bit of [00:29:00] the dynamic back that, yeah, we've been looking for this whole season. The magic was, it was, the magic was sparking. It was like some sparks were happening.
[00:29:07] I was like, okay, the chem, we can still see the chemistry is still, is still here. We also kind of used this as like a, we use this as exposition. We use it as like a way to find out some things about lsp. I was like, oh, no, no. Yeah, because we find out they meet up the bar, obviously, and the girls are gonna have girl talk and um, we find out that what happened in Scotland with Agnes?
[00:29:29] Oh, Agnes Angus. It's Angus. Agnes, not Agnes. It's Angus. Okay. Angas Angus. Oh. Um, uh, yeah, so the, the, the justification for this was interesting because basically it was neither one of them wanna leave their home. So can't really be a relationship if they don't wanna do a long distance relationship, I guess.
[00:29:53] And no one wants to move to New York. She doesn't wanna move to Scotland because she says, she says, she says it's [00:30:00] too quiet there for her. And it, it got me thinking about like, who Elsbeth is and what like, like how she operates. It feels like ELs. Elle's both needs the noise outside her mind to match the noise inside her mind, because we know that Ellsworth mind runs like a mile a minute and there's so many things going on in that mind of hers.
[00:30:19] She needs something outside of it to, to keep, to help her keep track of it. Because I could imagine she has to balance, she has to be on the same frequency as the place around her, otherwise she's gonna feel out of control. Right. Not that I speak from experience or anything like that. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
[00:30:34] As I always say, you are the most eligible person I know, uh, in, in my life. Um, but yeah, like I can imagine what she's talking about because like her, her, her mind runs a mile a minute and if she's in someplace quiet, like where Angus lives in Scotland, she's going round of things to keep her mind occupied and that's gonna drive her crazy if she, if, if that continuously running motor of her mind runs out of, runs out of fuel basically, because it [00:31:00] feels like New York.
[00:31:00] And its surroundings are like the fuel for her. There's so many things going on. It helps her occupy her mind. Well, she Chicagos that way too, you know? Yeah. Like Chicago is a busy city, had things going on. She had other people, she had like things to respond to. And I'm not saying that like a peaceful scene in Scotland isn't something to respond to.
[00:31:18] It's just it. Like a influencer's journey. It's only gonna last as long as it lasts before something else, you know, has to take over. And so if she knew she wasn't gonna be happy there in the long term, and he knew he wouldn't be happy there in the long term, um, unfortunately that means no more Angus.
[00:31:38] Yeah, I'm, I'm happy that she saved this revelation for Kaia, right. Because, yeah, Teddy asked about it in the first episode and she decided not to tell Teddy about it. And the only person she could tell about it was Kaia because Kaia is her, you know, her BFF, and she, she's the person that she can share the most information with.
[00:31:56] And it just, again, just made me sad that she doesn't always have that person with [00:32:00] her. It's only gonna be every once in a while she's gonna be able to see Kaia and, and have this type of, of friendship. And I also loved the, uh. The callback to Ka loving reality TV because they talk about the Black Veil.
[00:32:12] And of course Kaya knows all about it because Kai are watching The Black Veil. I was like, oh, poor Miss Kayan. I know. And even like at the end of the episode, Wagner's like, you know, who would want to hear about Yeah. His like, he is just like trying his best to be, you know, dad for both of them. Um, but also we learn what's going on with Kaia a little bit more.
[00:32:33] You know, she's, she's undercover as Denise Jackson, she's on this task force, but in the like changing of exchange of information, what she gives Elsbeth Elsbeth can't use because it would endanger her. And while they're at the bar and one of the last scenes that they're together in, someone comes up and talks to Denise.
[00:32:54] So I'm walking away from this thinking that Kai is in, in danger [00:33:00] a little Yeah. Here. And I wonder if, I wonder if, if this is like. A scale down season for Elsbeth, and if it can prove and hold its ratings, then uh, is this like I, is there going to be a Kaya rescue at the end because it even mm-hmm. If the, if the show doesn't get renewed, it would be a nice, like ending.
[00:33:21] But if it does get renewed, then she can get slipped back into the, into the ecosphere. Uh, because I, I just, the way that this episode ended, I can tell SBAs already, like scheming how to figure out what's going on with Kayah and how to help her and. That's gonna get in the way of some stuff, but I think that's where we're headed ultimately.
[00:33:43] Yeah. And like this cliffhanger we're presented with where, you know, Wagner gives, gives ELLs Smith a a phone That is a what? A, a single use phone only to call Kyle, which I'm not sure how or why that works, but it's, it's the rules for this phone. It can only be used to call Kyle one time. Like, what's gonna happen?
[00:33:59] Is it [00:34:00] gonna explode? Is gonna self-destruct after I used the phone call. What's gonna happen? Well then I guy hit redial again. Is it not gonna call her number again? It's like, I know, you know this reference, but remember on Inspector Gadget when he'd get the thing and then it would self-destruct? Yeah. I mean it was kind of like that.
[00:34:16] And then also I was like, why are you using your one call on this? You know what I mean? Like, what, what do you mean? Because it was, he was like, is this is what, you can only use it one time to call Kayah, uh, which is like, okay. Um, I guess, but. Yeah, I, first of all, I got my message board back here, says, sorry Ms.
[00:34:36] Jackson, because I don't know what's going on with Kaa. AKA, Denise Jackson. But lemme lemme tell you something. Kings, look at me. Look at me. I know you're watching. You better not touch a hair on Kaa Blanc's head. Okay. Kayah. Better be okay. Don't even do this to me, Jason. Like, do I have Ellizabeth have to solve the [00:35:00] murder of Kaia?
[00:35:00] No. Yeah. Don't even Marissa, you now you're speaking things into universe. I wasn't trying to speak things in the universe. Okay. I'm just saying Kayah better be okay. Kings. She better be Don't make, don't make me come over there. Okay. I don't care. To where? To wherever. Wherever the kings are at. Okay. Making their little law shows, uh, you know, featuring my coulter.
[00:35:24] Um, yeah. But listen, she better be all right. I'm not playing with y'all. Okay? She better be okay. I did not want to hear that Kai's been hurt. Kai's been, uh, deaded. I know. Like whatever's going on with Car Paterson, y'all, whatever. I don't, I don't even need her. I don't need Kai to be on my screens no more.
[00:35:44] I just don't want Kai to be dead. Don't do that to us. Yeah, don't do that. Don't do that. Don't do it, Don. Don't, don't don't. True enough. Don't do it True enough. Uh, also 2025 already been enough. Read the room. Read the room. Yeah. Yeah. 2025 has already been enough. Don't make, don't add this onto it. Okay? But I, I do think you're right in the fact that this, the, [00:36:00] the, the season long arc might be about.
[00:36:04] Where's Kaya? How can we help Kaia? What's going with Kaia? Um, but you know, we, we, we thought things were gonna be season long arcs before and they ended up being half season arcs, so Yep. Agreed. Maybe that might be the case as well, but what, however long it takes to figure out where Kaia is and how we can save Kaia, because I like, we got the distinct feeling that Kaya's in trouble because when Ellsworth tried to call that number, it was outta service.
[00:36:27] So Kai's in trouble. Ellsworth had to save her. Yes. She better be okay. You hear that? You hear that Kings? She better be okay. Yeah, she better be okay. Yeah, she better be, she's gonna be a problem if she's not look at you. Um, I mean, I'll send Jason, but yeah, we're, yeah, it's gonna be a problem and gonna send me what I'm gonna do.
[00:36:51] Is write a strongly worded letter because Yeah, with a good pen Pen. With a good pen, I would me Marissa's gonna provide me the pen. Yes, the pen. [00:37:00] The pen is minor than the sword. Okay. Yeah. And I'm going to write a rather disappointing letter to you guys and figure the revolution Yeah. Will be on stationary.
[00:37:12] That's right. That's all. I'll figure out who to mail it to and how to mail it, because that's so much more impactful than a DM that you'll probably never read. Okay. I make sure it gets into your hands. You, well, hey, if you know people in Congress can write strongly worded letters, we can too. Yes, sure.
[00:37:29] Because that's how change is made. So, yeah. I don't know. Jason, where else can we go with this one? We, we talked a little bit about like what happened and how Raquel, well did the murder, let's and everything. But what's missing from our conversation? Let's talk, look, let's talk about how dumb Raquel slipped up because Raquel is so dumb.
[00:37:47] First of all, because, oh, you have said a number. Raquel's so dumb. Raquel's dumb because the way Raquel decided to commit this murder was to take the carabiner and [00:38:00] harness from the little, uh, altar or the shrine that she made mm-hmm. To Johnny, and decided to use that, which came from his old F-N-D-N-Y, uh, uniform.
[00:38:11] She used that to attach the sandbags to his belt and pull him overboard. And then what she did, which I get, I think she thought she was being smart by being like, you know what? People are gonna notice the harness and cer are gone in my future videos. Yeah. So I'm gonna, so I'm gonna buy a new one to replace it so that no one knows the wiser, which Raquel, if anyone's gonna know the wiser, it's Elsbeth because we, it's eth.
[00:38:37] Listen ELLs, Beth knows and sees everything. And what you should have done, Raquel, dumb Raquel, is buy the new. Carabiner harness if you had, if you had the access. She didn't have time. She didn't have time. I guess she didn't have because she had to get on the thing and go see the mom and do all that stuff.
[00:38:53] I'm, and not let Johnny know that she was plotting to kill her. But listen, you could Uber eats anything. Now you could Uber eats [00:39:00] like fricking uh, I don't know. I'm sure you can Uber Eats, uh, Caribbean or her harness from Home Depot where she just went to the store and bought the date, the time after she committed the murder.
[00:39:09] But do do something more than use a prop that you know is gonna be in all your videos. Like, well, yeah, this also highlights like the, the whole how she solved it moment, right? Mm-hmm. So like, um, throughout the conversation, Raquel's like, I couldn't have done it because I was on a live stream. See, look at the live stream.
[00:39:27] Well look at that little time code that tells you that I was here. 'cause it is a live stream. Who knew that? Officer Hackett, also streamer. Yeah. Things like that. We'll see. Using, using, uh, an app called, I forget what it was called, but it basically like you could prerecord something and then it would broadcast it as if it was live, live talk or something.
[00:39:49] Yeah. Yeah. And she also picked up the fact that like, um. Raquel said hi to two people that weren't actually in the chat at the time. And so that was the first thing. But then [00:40:00] Elsbeth using her like Highlights magazine, what's different between these two images? Yeah. Superpower. That's when she noticed the carabiner was different.
[00:40:08] And then we do get the payoff of a traditional Elsbeth reveal, um, on the set of Black Veil, which I thought was very fun. Um, seeing as we hadn't seen one in a while. Yeah. It, it was a very, it harkened back to the first season where we, we make a whole big production out of, uh, arresting the Murderer, uh, because I, I guess we were doing a extra special, uh, version of the Black ve Behind the Black Veil, where she just talks more about the Black Veil.
[00:40:35] Well, J Nne come back. Right. So she had, she, she had, like the show is gonna jump on that and have a, like, she's exclusive interview with her and also she's also, she's Littleover. Yeah. And then also like, um, the. Manager man was like, talk about her upcoming new show. You know what I mean? So it was probably like good for both enterprises.
[00:40:58] Yeah. I loved, I loved [00:41:00] Elsbeth like coming, 'cause that's the big, like climax is Elsbeth, uh, revealing how Raquel did this. And I love the way they did it. 'cause she's like, ellizabeth is like playing to the cameras. It almost felt like she was in court presenting her case. Yes, yes. Like she has like the evidence bag.
[00:41:16] She's like, and she used this right here, Johnny's old carabiner and harness to attach to his belt and to pull him down into the briny sea. So I, I love like that part of it, uh, because it was so, it was so performative and Ellizabeth loves to be performative, so that was a lot of fun. Uh, Tony Gonzalez was there to, I guess watch on and not do well and he like.
[00:41:39] Served up a question or two. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, uh, that was a lot of fun. Uh, I loved, like I, I was wishing Marie was more of a, like version, like more of a player in this than she was. 'cause she was, she was really good in a limited amount of time that we got to see her because there was this moment where when they found [00:42:00] out that yes, this man that, that, uh, that was in the ocean is indeed your son slash husband.
[00:42:06] They ca they came to Marie's house where Raquel also was Raquel's like this, I hate this lady. This lady and my son were fighting all the time. They never had a great relationship. She was never happy enough with Johnny's, uh, FDNY benefits. So that, that kind of told our crew, like, okay, it wasn't, uh, it wasn't all the paradise that Raquel was, you know.
[00:42:29] Talking about her relationship with Johnny. It was not a perfect relationship. It was like a relationship fraught with, uh, with problems. So I was like, okay, she's not Raquel's. Definitely not all she's cracked up to be. And then when Raquel, when, uh, when Marie confronts Raquel at the very end is like, you, you dirty like m effort, like yeah.
[00:42:46] And then we find out that Marie is going to get a golden version of the black male because Marie's husband back in the day died from Electrocution. I was like, I, that made me think like, should we get like a sequel to this episode where you [00:43:00] find out Marie, Marie also killed her husband? I, well, I hope they do what they did.
[00:43:05] I think it was in season one, there was like a housewives. Thing. Yeah. And then we saw like a billboard for it later. Yes. In the season, like I hope we hear like some sort of report from like, did you watch the Golden Black Veil? Yeah. Maria, I love, like married now or something. And we had another great callback like in this, in this episode too, where like they talked to the age of person.
[00:43:27] They're like, Hey, were you the agent for, you know, the agent for the, um, it was the, the Christmas influencer couple. Uh, you remember that with Vanessa Bear? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, uh, and someone else, there was an agent there. It's like, yeah. Did you know that agent as well? So it was, I lo I keep, I love how Elba Keith's doing the callbacks to the previous episodes.
[00:43:45] Ellsworth mentioned she can't, she can't eat frozen yogurt anymore, which I didn't even remember. Like where, like, I think, no, I think that was just a reference to her and Kaia both. Yeah. Because they would have frozen froyo nights and watch television. Yeah. I, I loved the, I like. [00:44:00] You can tell Ellsworth is just like, just yearns for ki like to be with the beef, be able to talk to Kai all the time because like, she brings the, 'cause she referenced the Plushie in the first episode.
[00:44:10] She brought the Plushie that she got from Scotland for Kaia here. It's just like, and her just in her really cute Ellsworth way, she's like, I'm just gonna leave this right here and, uh, pretend that I forgot it at the bar when I leave. Which honestly, also, uh, if you are undercover, like why are you going to a public bar where anyone can see you?
[00:44:31] Which was, is exactly what happened here. Because when ELs would think, and Kay are talking, some other person is like, Hey, Denise Jackson, is that you? What are you doing here? Talking to a person that is, I'm sure famous because I, I gotta imagine Elvis is, and, and Elvis is fa it has to be famous, right? She has to be, if Elvis was a real person, we would be having so many like profiles and interviews.
[00:44:54] I, while Elba, I mean. At the very least, she stands out. You know, like, I mean, [00:45:00] she's, she's single handedly helping the crime rate in, uh, in New York. I would imagine there's gotta be some special, like, there would be a 60 Minutes interview at some point with her. Like, you're, you're really helping the cops by, uh, come with all this circumstantial evidence that will probably be, be thrown out in course later.
[00:45:18] Um, but yeah, I, I, I can imagine somebody be like, why is Snee Jackson talking to ELLs? Butoni the famous, uh, detective, not detective that's been helping, that's been helping the, the cops. 'cause you know, if you're, if you're a criminal, you got you. If you're a criminal, you also have to have Ellsworth on your radar.
[00:45:35] That that lady is trouble. I mean, yes, I would. I think by this time she may be a little bit known around town, as they would say, but I would also love to see, like, if they have to beat up again, I would love to see Elsbeth go into undercover and not be like in bright. Ooh. Because I think like that's what kind of like gives it away.
[00:45:55] Like it, and obviously her red hair, I did live also the mention too, [00:46:00] firemen, and she's like, you know how firemen could be? Mm-hmm. And I was like, yes, I do. But um, I think that would be kind of fun to see her like, okay, I don't wanna put you in in danger. I'm going to de l's bey myself so that I can get you something that you need.
[00:46:14] And maybe she is like in jeans and a t-shirt. Yeah. Like what, what if, what if they were like. Hey, who's that? Who's that chick who was talking to, and they like take her captive until they, she and they and uh, Kaya tells 'em something off the wall who Elsworth is, and then Elsworth has to pretend to be that person and go undercover and like you said, not be her ellizabeth self, uh, ditch the tote bags and ditch the bright colors and be like some street smart, tough person.
[00:46:39] I don't know. I think that would be a fun thing for, uh, for Carrie Preston to, to have to do Yeah. Like a character within a character type of mm-hmm. Situation. And also with like, Wagner in her ear or, yeah, like trying to get her attention like he did with a teddy bear in the last episode, like in some sort of way trying to still communicate with her because he, [00:47:00] she does need him to, I think she is going to need him to help Kaia.
[00:47:04] I just hope that when it does come to the point where Kaya needs to be saved, it is a like group effort with Wagner, Ellsworth, and Kaya all having to work together and to figure this to f to get her out of trouble. I would also love it if it was some past criminals. Like I would love it if, if Elizabeth had to, and Wagner had to lean on some of the rich people.
[00:47:27] They helped call it Vanessa Williams. Do you have any apples? You know, like, like all of this stuff. Um, PS by the way, on dropout. There's a show called Crowd Control. And this girl was like, one time I ate 60 apples in two days. And I was like, oh my God. And she's like, and it ended up in the hospital. And I was like, yeah, you did.
[00:47:48] Yeah, yeah, you did. I, and why, why did she eat 60 apples in two days? And she like, because someone dared her that she couldn't, and she wanted to prove she could. And she was, she was the kid. [00:48:00] That's crazy. But I was just like, oh my God. I know why sh I know why you went to the hospital because of Elle's.
[00:48:05] Yeah. I mean like, if they could lean on some of these, these other people and bring some, especially, especially, I mean, I do want the show to be renewed, but I am also watching this in case it, in case it doesn't, you know, like it, if it is gonna be a serious finale, it would be nice to bring in. Yeah, because I, I want to get, like, I want to see a a because I feel like a lot of ellizabeth solves involve a lot of circumstantial evidence that can be thrown out in court later.
[00:48:32] So I would love to see some of these criminals that she caught. Are still like running around, out, out free. Like I would love for one of them to come back and do something either to help or to maybe, maybe it, maybe we can get a former criminal involved in this docs, uh, stuff that Kaya is investigating, right?
[00:48:53] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That'd be fun. That'd be really great. Because I do feel like a good lawyer could throw out all this evidence that Elizabeth, uh, [00:49:00] finds on them because a lot of it is just like, that could be explained away, but also a good lawyer. Interesting. Oh my God, bro. Interesting bro. Bro, you blow my mind, bro.
[00:49:11] I know, I know. I am. What if Diane or Cargos or Marissa Gold comes through? That's it. Yes. Okay. I, I, I, I, I legit forgot what Marissa ended the good fight doing. 'cause I feel like I. Spoilers. Spoilers. Spoilers was good. Fight spoiler for good fight. I, she started wanting to be a investigator. Right? She was an invest, okay.
[00:49:36] First of all, she was, where is she a receptionist? And then she ended up being, 'cause I think she was Diane's receptionist. And then she ended up being an investigator. Right. And then she ended up applying to law school. Being in law school. There you go. And then she was in that weird law thing, or that weird court with me Beacon.
[00:49:52] Yeah. And then, yeah, that was fun. Became like an actual lawyer. Yes. Okay. I, I got the order of operations. Like was [00:50:00] she, did she wanna be a lawyer first and then she wanted be an investigator or was the other way around? It was the other way around. Okay. Uh, so yeah. Great. Like point, I would love to see, like if Marissa like got one of, uh, ELs Smith's.
[00:50:12] Murder is like off, you know, off, off of whatever. And how that dynamic would work after that. Because like I said, I feel like, I feel like Elsworth like solves or like they're true. They're right. We know that Elvis is right. The way she used, the way she finds out she's right is like a good lawyer could probably get, get that evidence thrown out.
[00:50:32] Well, yeah. Yeah. I mean, yes. So we'll have to see. I am interested to see what happens when Marissa's on board. I know we had the name drop of, of, um, Diane. Diane, uh, last episode. I would like to see either a lawyer say, Hey, this isn't enough. You gotta find more. Or like, what else can we do? Like helping, well the trial is going on, type of thing.
[00:50:53] Mm-hmm. Yeah. Or, um, them working together in tandem to get [00:51:00] to a, towards a common goal. And I also think it would be interesting if Ellsworth has to wrestle with the fact like, 'cause we've seen ELLs Smith be a little regretful about some of the things that she had to do as a lawyer and. Coming face to face with the fact that people that she's close with, like I'm Marissa Gold, might still be doing those things that she finds objectionable.
[00:51:19] Yeah. And to be like, you know, why are you doing these things? And Marissa would be like, 'cause I'm a defense lawyer, that's what I do. Uh, yeah, also like what? Like, yeah, you are, we are the same. Like having someone from her past see her without like the Elsbeth with her new values and um, moral morale. But, but I don't know if that's gonna, because it feel like, I don't know if Marissa, when we see Marissa, if she's still gonna be a lawyer, because listen, Marissa Gold was a very like, oh wait, dunno.
[00:51:48] Very go with the flow person. She, she switched careers like five times throughout the, throughout the journey of good wife and good fight. So who knows what she's gonna be when we see her in Ellsworth, but I'm super excited for [00:52:00] whenever we see her and what she's gonna be doing. And I'm very excited to see where this Kaya thing's gonna go.
[00:52:05] Now we, we definitely heard that Kaya's not gonna be in a lot of episodes. She's gonna be in like, probably single digit episodes, probably like two or three. So, but now we have reference for what she's doing. We know where she is and we know that she's missing. So if she's not in those episodes directly as like a person, I am confident that her character will be discussed or a message will come through or she'll get an email or a phone call or something, um, that will come through, that will move her story forward.
[00:52:37] As much as I would love to see Kaia in every episode because they still, that friendship is still one of the best things of the show, um, at least they laid the groundwork for her to not have just like disappeared. Yeah. For some reason, and I don't want this to happen, but I've seen so many shows like this where like we get.
[00:52:54] A one off like little scene where like someone is handcuffed to a chair and they're getting [00:53:00] like tortured for information. I hope that's not what's happening to Kaia, but I can see it happening where we don't need Carra Patterson. We just see it from like behind her perspective, where we see the Oh yeah.
[00:53:11] Kayah. Yeah. That way we don't have to pay Patterson, but we can have someone stand in for Car Patterson, which listen, we know, we know the Kings like to do that type of stuff. Okay. Um, from the good wife. Um, so I, I wouldn't be surprised when we got that. I hope Kai's not being tortured somewhere for information about who she really is and what she's really doing.
[00:53:29] But, uh, we'll see. We'll see. I'm excited. Well, and if she is, I don't think it's happening now. I think this is just like planting the seed that danger could be coming. You know what I mean? I know she's not available by phone, but she could have been using a burner phone like that, that whole thing. Well, don't, I think it's, I think that is to suggest that Kaia is in danger.
[00:53:47] That's what I think. Well, I think she's in danger, danger, danger. But, but it doesn't mean that she's like tied up in a dungeon somewhere. Mm. I don't know. I think that means she's in a current dangerous situation or, [00:54:00] or she was watching TV and her ringer was off. I know it's more danger, but like, I, it's not, but it's not in service.
[00:54:07] It's not just like voicemail. If it's, if she's being tortured right now, they're not gonna let her be tortured for multiple episodes. Do you know what I mean? Like, and so, no, you know, I don't know. Cruel and unusual. Cruel and unusual. I mean, it would show that she's, it would, it would show that Kaia has made of strong stuff because she's refusing to give up who she is and what she's doing.
[00:54:29] Sure, sure. Fine, fine. But that would require like kind of seeing. Kara Patterson in that situation. Like, and, and I know I'm thinking too much of like real world logistics, but why is the phone out of service? Like, does, did someone call and get the, and get the, and get the phone canceled maybe, or she knew that, or she knew that Elizabeth was gonna call and she cut off her phone?
[00:54:54] I don't know. You would think if the phone is destroyed, if the phone was destroyed, if the phone was off, it would just go to voicemail. It wouldn't be like [00:55:00] outta service. Right? Oh yeah, no, that's someone actually calling and saying like, Hey, cut off the phone. We don't need this number anymore. Yeah, yeah.
[00:55:08] Yeah. So that is episode three. It was, you know, chasing overall takes. I mean, it wasn't Elizabeth episode, right? It was, it was back to kind of doing what we do as Elizabeth last week was kind of a. Diverted path of what we usually do. This was more of the typical Ellsworth episode with a, with a little like sprinkling of some interesting KAA stuff in there.
[00:55:31] Um, I I, I, I liked the Grace Fleming dynamic. I thought that was really fun. Like, it was like, you could see Fleming was like really like, excited about Grace because she does stuff old school because we know that Fleming is an old school guy. And so she liked, he liked that she started a, like a whiteboard of evidence.
[00:55:50] And so I, I think that will be more of definitely a mentor mentee relationship. We'll see further down the line. I think it also cemented we're, we're Ellsworth is like, oh, like these [00:56:00] two are partners buddy, buddy and I got nobody. Like, I think, oh yeah, well, and especially 'cause Fleming wasn't Fleming in a mentor.
[00:56:08] Kayah Kaya. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that went nowhere. Um, K Kaya, like Kaia had so many mentors that never mentored her. Like Wagner supposed to be a mentor. Flynn was supposed to be a mentor like Smolin, when she was supposed to follow Smolin to be a mentor, like nobody ever actually mentored. Kaia, Kaia did everything herself.
[00:56:23] Um, she did. But yeah, I thought it was interesting to see that relationship, you know, form with Fleming and, and Grace and I, I hope to see it go even further. I'm, I, I, grace is an asset for sure, but I feel like, are we just gonna keep getting these, these police officers that can do more and like, are we, is Grace gonna be the, like, is Grace the next Kaya to be like a detective?
[00:56:45] She's like this smart cop that turns into a detective because they're like, that's the same trajectory that you had Kaya on. Like, oh, no, no, no. I feel like she, she respect, she's gonna turn off. She's gonna get off the clock at five. Like she's in the Fleming School [00:57:00] of Detectives and she's gonna be pursue her career in comedy.
[00:57:03] So if anything with this character, I, I feel like her out will be, I gotta set on the Tonight Show or something. Like, I don't think it's gonna be, we're gonna repeat it there. I gotta, I gotta bring it up again. And I hope you got, I hope you guys out there listening and watching aren't like, annoyed at me, like, keep talking about this, but I feel like a detective and a cop that you keep rotating.
[00:57:27] I feel like we could've just, we could've just done away with all that and put Kayah here with Ellizabeth as a permanent duo. Yes. Partners. And just let them be like, I like, I'm like the, the rotating detective and cops. They're, they're, they're cool. They're like, it can be funny, but if it went away and you place that with a Kayah and Ellizabeth permanent partnership.
[00:57:51] I don't be mad at it. I would, I'd be, I'd be grateful. Um, but that's, well, and especially that we don't really know, like Yeah. And [00:58:00] like that, I think those two characters can stand on their own and also have established relationships with the other people in the group. So it's like Kaya has her relationship with Wagner.
[00:58:10] Wagner has a relationship with Elizabeth. They ha, you know what I mean? Like there's more history there. I think when we keep switching it up, it kind of breaks that investment. It breaks the momentum in those characters. Yeah. Yeah. Because like breaks to chemistry. Yeah. Who are we, where, what pieces are we playing with today?
[00:58:26] Which I know is very like indicative of like everyday life. You don't know what you're gonna get, but it would just be in 2025. It would be very nice to have a predictable little slice of my life where these two people are always on tv. Yes. And they're always trying to solve murders together and watching TV just like we do.
[00:58:49] Yeah. Uh, when, um, when ELLs Smith was talking to Kaia and Kaia saw Cam, she was like, Ooh. Do you think there's trouble there or is it just the fact that like, she doesn't want Cam to come over and like blow her cover? [00:59:00] Okay. Yep. I just wanted make sure And she didn't wanna him, uh, maybe he didn't see her.
[00:59:04] Yeah. I don't think he know. And he doesn't like, she doesn't want, he doesn't know because I don't think he knows where she is. No, either. I don't think he does. I don't think so. It's like, oh, what do you mean you were in the backyard the whole time? You know, like, um, but yeah, that was, uh, I think that's, I think we've, uh, talked about the, the episode in a good enough fashion.
[00:59:21] I think we got it top to bottom. Uh, we'd love to hear, like if we miss something, feel free. Yeah. Let us know if there's another part of the episode that you wanted to explore or have something to say about our opinions about it. We always love to hear from you. You can email at us, email us, email at us.
[00:59:36] You can email at us. Yeah, you can do that. There is the at and there for a reason. You're emailing at us. Um. Yes. So I think next episode, from what I see, we is going to be a Halloween themed episode. Mm-hmm. So that should be fun. Uh, we know that, uh, is a, you know, if nothing else but a costume queen. So we'll see what that brings next week.
[00:59:54] Uh, Marissa, can you tell the people out there where they can find you? We can find the, tell the good folk where they can find you. [01:00:00] Hey, good folks. You can find me at it's meer.com where I have links to all of the podcasts that I'm on, including the Good Pod here, talking with Jason about Ellsworth and the Good Wife over on WHI one podcast.
[01:00:11] I'm talking about Pretty Little Liars when previously on a at a time. And then my sister and I are going through Star Trek, the Next Generation for a First Watch podcast over on us s Sisterhood. Again, all of those links are, its me at, its me, marissa g.com. Jason, I know you've got a lot going on this month, so I know she told the people what's going on.
[01:00:35] So, uh, yeah, love is Blind is wrapping up, and me, Aja Welch and Mary Kowski are talking about it. We just, uh, released the, uh, wedding episode recap a couple days ago. Uh, next week will be the reunion, and then LO's and I will be in the rear view. But, uh, that's not all the love mess you're gonna get from me because Murder for sight.
[01:00:56] Just came back this week, this past Thursday it came out. Me and Asia [01:01:00] Welch on the Perfect Match Podcast are talking about it. Uh, we dropped our first episode about the first four episode drop. Uh, it was a long one. We had a lot to talk about. We had a lot of fun over there. Uh, I got into talking about influencers.
[01:01:14] I am sorry to I, I've started to be like, get in the life of Influencer Peacock, who is a stream of service that is the new home er for Sight. Sent me and Asia some swag so that we could, uh, we could promote it on the show. Got a nice, a nice, uh, robe. I got a seat mask, got a weekender bag. It was a whole thing.
[01:01:32] So we talked about that on the podcast. Did a whole bunch of stuff on the podcast. So come over there, join us. We are also having bonus content from Radio First Sight Season 19. We also have some other previous season, Maria first sight content on our Patreon over at patreon.com/at Perfect Match podcast.
[01:01:46] So any of that, float your boat, come on over. We'd love to have you. And until next week, stay good.
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