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The Measuring Post is a podcast about growth, not perfection.
It’s a place to pause, reflect, and measure what actually matters in your life, your work, and your personal development. Not by comparing yourself to others, but by comparing who you are today to who you were yesterday.
I'm Joe Massa, and I created this show because I believe growth isn't a solo journey. Each week, you’ll hear thoughtful interviews with incredible guests: entrepreneurs, leaders, creatives, and everyday people doing meaningful work, sharing real experiences, lessons learned, and practical insights you can apply right away. These conversations are designed to help you think differently, grow intentionally, and move forward with clarity.
Alongside the interviews, you’ll also find The Daily Measure, short, bite-sized solo episodes focused on simple words of wisdom and actionable ideas you can use in your daily life. Think of these as quick check-ins to help you stay grounded, focused, and consistent.
This isn’t about hype or shortcuts. It’s about honest conversations, small improvements, and growing together over time.
If you’re someone who values progress, reflection, and becoming a better version of yourself, you’re in the right place.
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Joe Massa (00:00.332)
why Riverside does that. It's stupid. Let me get that out of the
okay. So I'll do a quick intro, I'll kick it over to you and then we're just gonna have a nice organic conversation.
Hey everyone, welcome to another edition of the Measuring Post where we truly measure what matters. And today I've got a really unique guest, and we're covering a topic we haven't covered here on the Measuring Post so far. he is actually a musician who sang his first opera at about seven years old. He eventually traded the stage for the airborne infantry and he jumped into Iraq before even turning 21 years old. He became home and he was a combat infantryman.
Hang on, let's start that all over. Stumbled a little bit.
Hello everyone, welcome to another edition of The Measuring Post where we truly measure what matters. And today I've got a very unique guest, a musician. We're covering something we don't talk about too often, the power of music. Now, this man sang his first opera around seven years old. He then traded the stage for the airborne infantry and jumped into Iraq before turning 21. He came home with a combat infantry's men's badge, a PTSD diagnosis that the army barely recognized, and then eventually picked up a guitar.
Joe Massa (01:17.562)
This is Sean Martin. He is the voice behind the grunge band The Quarantined, whose last album pulled over a million streams without a label behind it. Today we're going to talk about mental health, how the power of music can help heal the mind and spirit and lift you from a dark place. So this is going to be a bit of a heavier conversation with a wonderful overtone of music and how that can really make you find who you are and deal with things that maybe you've been putting off. So, with that in mind, Sean, welcome to the Measuring Post. How are you today, sir?
Sean Martin (01:47.017)
Good, good. Thank you so much for having me. It's great to be here.
Joe Massa (01:50.252)
Yeah, absolutely. Really excited for this conversation because we're we're gonna get in some some deep dark holes. I I know you had a really painful past and experience in the military. You lost people very close to you, you came back with some mental health struggles, and really you kinda had to navigate this without the help of who you would expect to be there.
the veterans, you know, associated, the VA, the military didn't really give you the help you needed. But before we dive into that and sort of what launched the quarantined and your music therapy, tell me a little bit about being a young guy. You actually were an opera singer, which is I don't I've never met an o a true opera singer. And and a young one at that, seven years old. So yeah, tell me a little bit about, you know, before your military career, your drive and passion in music.
Sean Martin (02:30.941)
Yeah.
Sean Martin (02:36.135)
Yeah, so I I actually started singing when when I was four years old in community choirs. so in this this particular community choir was led by a a a very a very conscious of the community kind of choir director.
So she knew that if she mixed popular songs and had the kids sing and make some changes to to make it a little bit more positive and uplifting to you know, to the to the audience, that it would have a very, very good positive effect on the community at large. And I'm pretty sure Medicino Com Children's Choir is still going.
If it's not, it it's it's been very, very recently. so I hope it is. I I hope it's still going. but yes, at seven years old, I was given the opportunity to go and be part of an opera, the opera tasca, for the Mendocino Music Festival, which is which is held in like a five thousand seat tent. So it's not like your normal venue that has normal reverberations. You have to press
your voice to make sure that it goes the distance and that it not just that it travels, but that it sticks around too. So that was something that I learned at a very young age. And then at twelve years old I let me fix my camera.
Sean Martin (04:17.865)
Deep it deep. Then at twelve years old, I started playing guitar. And started writing songs and at about fifteen or sixteen or so I went into a local studio around in my hometown and recorded eight or ten of those songs with a friend of mine, playing guitar. and, you know, it was like we we would
We would use like drum tracks and you know, in in at this time in two thousand and two or so, you know, like this was very very much demo work, but it was done in a studio with like a full SSL board and I started to learn from there like the real value of being in the studio and everything that you could do.
So that art form itself was was expressed to me from a very young young age because I was always kind of thinking, I want to nail this part. I want to get this part perfect, you know? And the best way to make sure that you've got the part perfect is to record it and listen back to yourself. And then when you do that over and over and over again, you're constantly exponentially improving yourself.
And so that was something that I learned the value of from a very young age. It wasn't the stage that taught me that. The stage taught me about expression.
But the s but the recording studio taught me about discipline and the way to and the different forms of expression, song form, how all of that affects the listening experience. And as many di as as many different fingers as you can have into affecting the listener experience, that's when you become an artist that has that uses more than just one medium inside music.
Joe Massa (06:10.497)
No, I love that and that you're very accurate on that, you know, w even put it in the perspective of like an athlete.
the the perfection or of the craft comes during the practice. It's not the game. The game is when you get to let let it unleash everything. Much like being on the stage. When when you're in the recording studio, that's when you have the ability to reflect back on the quality of what you're doing and see if it's actually up to the standard that you set for yourself. The on stage performance is when you get to really connect with the audience and share all the hard work that you've been doing. So that's a really cool way to think about that. But honestly that's really the the biggest part about it.
you you perfect your craft in the practice of it, not in the the actual live version of it. So obviously that's something that you you grew up with built into your bones and your spirit, the music lifestyle and and practicing and having these big stages or big tents, for lack of a better word, to be performing in. Obviously that set up
a level of expectation that you have within yourself. And and obviously you you have the by the bar set very high for yourself. So w at what point did you decide that going into the military would be the next logical step in your journey in life?
Sean Martin (07:25.277)
well, it's it came because the the I the avenues that were available to to me were not that great. I could go and you know, do music, but I'd probably be homeless for a good long time. or I just wouldn't go anywhere and sink into the depression of
You know, I have all of these things to say, I have all of these things to do, and I don't have anywhere to do them or any any any voice to use them. and
looking at c at community college, you know, was really the option that I have. It wasn't like, you know, a four year thing and even when you go to community college they say, take two years and you know, you'll have to do general studies anyway, even if you go to a four year school. so you don't need to know what you need to do or or need w need to know what you wanna do. and at that point I was like, that's just seems like a waste of time. Like I I already know what I wanna do. I wanna have
An effect on this world. I want to do something of consequence. I want to be involved in things that are of consequence. I want to have an effect on this world and learn how the world works instead of the world always beating me down and me reacting to it. You know? And once the military recruiters came to me with that in mind and saying, look,
You had been playing, you know, you're an athlete. You've been playing soccer and basketball and baseball all throughout high school. And they were saying it was, you know, maybe four or so months after graduation. They're like, I bet that if we took you out on a two mile course and see how fast you can run it, you'd probably run it at at military standard or better. And they did, and I did. So they started to put together
Sean Martin (09:30.497)
that you have the smarts, the intelligence, the comprehension, the the the physical ability. you don't need to just go after regular infantry. You can step up to something greater, something bigger, which is what we have going on right now, which is the eighteen X contract. And the eighteen X contract is the fast track into special forces. So you start off in the infantry in in basic training, infantry school, then you go to airborne school
Then you can decide whether you want to go to a unit and deploy to Iraq, or go right into special forces training and probably hit that 90% drop rate. And then you'll just end up back into another infantry, probably in another airborne infantry unit, like the 82nd or the 101st, or in my case, I was sent to the third, the 509th in Alaska.
Joe Massa (10:24.438)
So, you know, really the military just kind of fed who you were at the time. It was really just a great opportunity for you to sort of fast track some of the traditional s you know, going to community college, really without a purpose. So when you got into the military, you you did your basic training, you went into the infantry. The airborne, was that did you decide you only wanted to do that? Special forces wasn't really on your radar at that time?
Sean Martin (10:52.153)
at that point, look, I I we w we were sat down. How I made this decision was actually kind of a fun story. So we had just done our last and final jump in airborne school, and they gathered everybody who had gone through essentially we had dudes from the day one of basic training who had gone through with us the whole group. One of my good friends was there, Jeff Bisson. another one, Raina. and we had you know, a whole bunch of different other people from
my basic training unit who had gone up with us into airborne school and they were all given the decision, you can either go into the the special forces training and probably deal with that ninety percent drop rate or to the to the unit. and fifty percent chose to go to the unit. and fifty percent chose to go to special forces in about
Forty percent of them came back eventually to the third of the five ninth and met up with us and deployed to Iraq.
Joe Massa (11:56.183)
Yeah, so I can imagine that's a bit daunting going into special forces from that. But I know that just because you're not in special forces doesn't mean you didn't see active duty and and go through loss, including your good friend Jeff. So you went into Iraq, you you're, you know, late teens, early twenties. What was the culture shock of going into a country that was war torn and really you're, you know, got a big target on your back?
And and then you end up coming home not only with the pain on your heart and the PTSD that goes with it, you did come back with an infantryman's badge. So can you tell us a little bit about how that transpired and what that meant to you coming back from Iraq?
Sean Martin (12:39.793)
Yeah. so the C I B is something that you that you aspire to get, but it's not guaranteed. I mean there's many people who've been into the infantry and don't have a CIB. especially if they didn't have the availability as say they were in from, you know, the late seventies to mid eighties or so, there like was no conflicts then. No major conflicts. The the amount of people who would get the C I B very small.
But in this in this case, my CIB came from well over three hundred missions outside the wire. getting blown up multiple times, taking hundreds of detainees, pulling the trigger on on in in short range, close range, hand to hand. I had multiple different instances,
getting blown up, the truck getting blown up and and you know, having to deal with all of that. one that was at the very beginning, around November, at the end of November, which I lost my squad leader and my team leader and the other team leader, Saw Gunner. so my entire squad had to be entirely restructured after the second month that we were there. so everything that we'd been planning.
All of the different, you know, the ways that we got used to working with all of those people, now the core of it, my team leader and my squad leader are gone. And so now I have to to readjust everything to whatever it is they tell me that I need to do. and in with that mentality, you have to have a a a soldier's mentality. If you're sitting there saying, Well, what about all that planning, guys?
It was literally a a two second conversation where it's like you're gonna get over it and we're gonna do this, right? You know, but the emotionality of it was massive. Massive. I didn't know if I was ever gonna see those guys again. When we medevac them out after that, I had no idea if they were alive or dead for months. Because nobody nobody could tell me or would tell me or would share the information with the unit.
Sean Martin (14:57.029)
So they were in Germany and s and sending the information back to a combat zone in Iraq is not so simple. There's a lot of operational security that goes along with that. You have to protect the identities and you have to do it in in ways that protect the people who you're sending the message to.
So it's not just like sending a WhatsApp message or be like on Facebook, No, they're they're fine, no worries. Send an email. No, that's not how it works. There's many, many different levels of operational security that goes into s something simple like
a s a a five sentence message that says they're fine, they're doing this, they're you know, here and you know, this is their diagnosis and they're, you know, they're wishing they could be back there and they miss you guys. That's out of the question. That's completely out of the question. so you that's not something that you really deal with until after the fact, you know? And it wasn't until I saw my team leader come back.
to to the combat zone and he opened up the can door and was like, What's up, Martin? I was like, You know, I've lost my mind because I didn't think that I was ever gonna see him again. and and the same thing when when I didn't see the the other two guys until I got back to the States. You know? and that was that was the second month.
We have still nine more months of my d my deployment to go. And I thought it was gonna be until, you know, another thirteen more months, but it turned out to be shorter.
Joe Massa (16:31.935)
Yeah, and I I can imagine that uncertainty of not knowing definitely plays in your mind and in your thought process. And and you're right, you've been you've been prepping with this core group of guys the whole time. And then to lose them and have to bring in new people, you you sort of lose that level of trust.
and confidence in them, even though the you know, nothing against the new guys, but those aren't the people that you sort of relied on for your whole training. And I would imagine that, you know, substituting in different individuals kind of messes with your head.
Sean Martin (17:04.007)
Yeah. in the end, what it taught to me was a reliance on the fundamentals. There's a phrase that goes in the military. It says, Rely on your equipment, rely on your training. And what that means is that if we teach you how to do something with these particular things to get this particular end, follow the process. There's a process to everything. Just go through the process, use the equipment, trust your training. Well.
The people who I was with are gone. So what do I have to rely on? The equipment? Is the equipment gonna is that what's solely keeping me sink? No, it's my mind. It's my ability. It's my ability to use my mind and my ability to see this the situation and make a decision. But if I can't make a decision, then the whole thing's for moot. So that means trusting on the fundamentals of what we're doing.
And every different aspect of being a soldier and having that for myself instead of relying on somebody else to tell me what that was supposed to be became the number one thing that I needed to do. So I needed to become the best fucking soldier that I possibly could. And I needed to become the best, you know, in in at least from what I knew and constantly be learning so that I didn't need to have people tell me to do shit. I could just see it needed to be done and then just do it.
get confirmation if I have to and then make sure that the decision process is going. So it was part of relaying information really quickly and deciding in the moment if we need to do anything and waiting for confirmation, which was always hard, you know, because it's like it it's a very simil a very similar effect of it is, you know, in the in the scene Braveheart when when they're charging at him and he's saying, Hold you know, like there's waiting until they're right there. As it was very much
the feeling of that, not like that, but very much the feeling of waiting until the very last minute to to go and and do the shit. And you have to wait for the last minute and you have to be cool with waiting for the last minute. It's it's a very, very weird mentality that you have to have. You have to very flexible.
Sean Martin (19:17.605)
In your y in neuroplasticity is a I I didn't know this at the time, but later on, neuroplasticity is one of the number one things that a soldier can use and when they are fully capable in their mind, they are fully capable everywhere else.
Joe Massa (19:36.874)
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And and it's really tough for I think most people to not
have like a really clear vision or roadmap of what's ahead of them. So to have to, you know, the the old saying, hurry up and wait, where you're just waiting for that last second before you get the okay, go, go, go, go, that would be very daunting in itself, just even on like a local civilian level, let alone where people's lives and and safety are at stake and including your own. So, you know, my hat's off to you and and again, thank you for your service and all the men and women that serve in our military and different branches.
Wouldn't be what it is without the people out there risking their necks and doing the the work that you guys do. But but I know that that doesn't come without consequence and without loss. And and I know that you've talked previously ab about your good friend Jeff Bisson. and and and he lost his life in Iraq. Can you tell us how that sort of changed your mentality and and sort of how you had to cope with that or lack of coping with that until you got back to the States? Sort of
Walk us down that story.
Sean Martin (20:43.507)
Yeah. so I'll I'll tell you the the story of of the last time that I saw him. And the last time that that I saw him was he was coming out of the comms tent where I was going in.
And he was super jazzed because he just got done talking to his wife. He and telling his wife about the future that he that his unit had just given him. And that was his entire goal for going into for doing the eighteen X contract, going to the third of the five ninth, the entire thing was all just cursory to his actual goal of becoming a golden knight. He wanted to join the Golden Knights, which if don't know who the Golden Knights are.
They're the performer parachute unit. So anybody who's jumping into the stadiums, that's an army golden knight. So they are very well paid and they are non combat deployable. So very cush job. And you get to jump out of planes all day. Well, the Jeff had been a skydiver before in in the civilian world. And
So he was very much looking forward and had spent so much time while we were in in Alaska getting extra jumps to meet the requirements to go and begin the school and the tryouts for the Golden Knights. And the unit had finally given him, said, You we've put all the paperwork together, we submitted your info to the Golden Knights, they accepted you as soon as you get back.
you're gonna go to the and start the training of the Golden Knights. We'll we'll PCS you out of out of Alaska and then you'll go right in. And he had finally gotten that and everything that he that had been coming right that he'd been working so hard for had finally come to fruition. And he was just telling his wife about it. And I'd never seen him so excited. And that was the last time I fucking saw him because a day and a half after that he gets hit by a sniper on the way to Fallujah.
Sean Martin (22:44.037)
It's it's just it even s even still today. It's still
Joe Massa (22:44.554)
Yeah.
Sean Martin (22:51.401)
puts that tingle on my spine and you know I I just can't believe that the world is seriously that cruel but it is. And this is and this is obviously just a you know a a massive point of privilege. There are things way the fuck worse than this. However, man, to get him so fucking high and then kill him
Joe Massa (23:03.167)
Yeah.
Joe Massa (23:25.532)
An and I I think it's something that most most people take for granted, you know, especially
comfortable countries like the US where we don't have war-torn areas on our our land. It's really easy to get caught up in the TikTok, Instagram, social media world. Everything's fluffy rainbows and and unicorns. But the reality is there's places and parts of the world that are dark, they're evil, they're dangerous, and and you had to firsthand experience that. So there there's no amount of words that can can sort of
alleviate that that reality. And you've seen it all too well. So let's talk about transitioning back to the states after Iraq. After going through that, you clearly have some internal PTSD, things that aren't being recognized by the army.
How's your how's your mentality coming home and and sort of fighting a war of a different kind, the war of returning back to a civilian lifestyle with all of this baggage weighing heavy on your heart?
Sean Martin (24:33.105)
Yeah, at the time I I didn't have any idea what was affecting me. I had no idea. But at the same time I could live out its symptoms. For example, my memory was shit. Just ter I would walk into rooms and instantly forget why the hell I was even there. Thousand yard stairs all the time. While making sandwiches, like doing anything. I tried to have jobs. Nope.
Forget that. Because talk about efficiency. If you're standing there and you don't even know how long you've been fucking standing there in the service industry, guess what? You just messed up your entire tips because you got taken back to Iraq and couldn't fucking help it. That happened all the time. I got fired so many damn times in Minneapolis all the time. Because my memory was shit. And I didn't realize that that was a part of it. Because think of it like this.
You have apps that are running on your phone in the background, right? Unless you've specifically told it to not send out any information, it's gonna constantly be sending out information all the time, right? That's what they do. Well, your brain has constant shit that's running on back all the time. It's running all of your organs, every all of your internal processes. But when your mind has running internal processes, you're thinking about all of the different things that have gone before and trying to
organize them or or put them into some form of context or or emotional understanding it of any kind whatsoever. It takes a lot of work. And trying to do other shit while you're doing that is impossible. You're just gonna end up suffering on both ends. You're not gonna get one done. You're gonna get none done if you try to do all. So that meant I had to start going to
VA appointments for memory where they would literally just play the card them the card game memory for with me because I couldn't get through one game in thirty minutes. That's how much it was really affecting me. And I'm twenty one years old. There's no reason why that should be happening to me at all.
Sean Martin (26:46.941)
the the sleeplessness and when that sleeplessness hits the you know, your hunger starts to go. You start you you stop feeling hungry at all. And you just start thinking of all the things you want to do because the soldier mentality kicks back in. That seventh gear that we that we call it where we can take it up to another level that most people are not even prepared or understand how to take themselves to. The infantry teaches you how to tap into that consistently and then turn it back off.
And go back down into the regular gears. They teach you how to do that, but they don't always tell you the best ways to turn it back off because they want you to be on. They need that seventh gear. So sometimes they'll teach you about how to turn it off, other times they won't. And I know lots and lots of people who who who just never do. For me, the best example of this is the Marines. I've never seen a Marine be able to turn right back off, no problem.
go from to like, yeah, no, I'm cool, dude. They ne no, that's not they're once they're there, they're there, man. They're they're just up at that energy. but in the business that that that we were doing in the deployments that we were doing, it was very much a thing where you had to go to a hundred and then back down to zero, no problem.
And that's just not normal. That's that's not, I mean, that builds a psychopath. So I had to fight against the the training that was given to me and the situations that were given to me that trained me to become a psychopath. To that taught me that this is how the world is, and this is how you need to protect yourself from the world, is by being a psychopath. That's the only way you're gonna be safe.
Joe Massa (28:11.508)
Yeah.
Sean Martin (28:33.521)
So those were the things that were going on in my mind. And I didn't know it at the time. So I'm fighting against the need to feel part of society. And at the same time, I see the massive fucked upness that is this society. And I think, well, what do I know how to fix any of it? Well, I know the infantry way to fix it, but that's illegal. You can't, these skills don't just transfer to the regular civilian world.
Joe Massa (28:57.374)
Yeah. No
Joe Massa (29:02.036)
No, absolutely not. And it's it would be crazy to think that you could just turn it on like a light switch on and off. And and the expectation to be able to do that is something that clearly you're right. It it's sort of like the internal workings of of a psycho. But but really it's it's
You're America's psycho. You're out there to do the bidding of what we need to be done. But again, the the the all too sad part about this is talking to other veterans as well that have come back from active duty and and seeing actual action in the field, it's coming home and not having a way to have a support system.
Sean Martin (29:22.846)
Yeah.
Joe Massa (29:37.982)
Especially if you don't have a a big family or a network, to be able to help you sort of readjust back to a different lifestyle where that isn't the seventh gear doesn't need to be on all the time. So you've talked about like coming home with this PTSD, which maybe you didn't even know that that's what it was at the time, or you weren't calling it that. But really the only two choices you had were like you're gonna go and be homeless because you can't cope with this, or
like truly reaching out and asking for help. So what led you to that that actual asking for help and and was there like sort of a a moment where you're like, I absolutely can't do this on my own? And what did that look like when you started to ask for the help and and sort of receive some treatment?
Sean Martin (30:22.471)
Yeah, I I well, I would say that I I wanted to to get the help because I knew that something was wrong from the second that I got out of the military. You know? but I didn't know how or what to even ask for. I didn't know what was wrong with me, so I didn't know what to ask for. But it wasn't until two thousand and twelve in which I had a temporary psychotic breakdown.
in which I was put into a VA psych ward and I was then given a team of doctors to look at everything that was going on and talk with me and see everything that had happened and then recommend something to do about it.
And so I was able to drop everything on him, every single different combat experience, and explain it in full detail. I stood in this in this panel of doctors around a table where I'm just the center person and I'm speaking to it as and I had no idea who they were, never met them before. And they're just like, tell us what's wrong with you. No, really. No, this is a safe space. You can tell us everything. And it for the first time.
I've been given a the platform to actually talk about the combat situation that I had to have operational operational security about the entire time about. The first time to ever talk about combat experiences, man, they're gonna come out raw. They're gonna come out harsh. They're gonna come out with not clear at at all. It's chaos you're trying to describe here. And so how is that supposed to be normal?
How are you supposed use normal language to describe something that is so absolutely insane? And so it wasn't until that that time in the VA psych ward that I was given the the option where they said, Look, we've got an inpatient clinic that is just for veterans, for combat veterans specifically, to work on PTSD, and it's for people with PTSD specifically.
Sean Martin (32:21.769)
So that means you're gonna be surrounded by people who are just like you, but from but the details are different. And this is the chance that we think that that you need to take in order to have an ability to live a normal life again. If you're gonna have any chance of it at all, you've got to be able to confront all of this stuff and deal with not just the symptoms, but deal with the underlying root causes that come from.
That's gonna take psychology. It's gonna take time. It's gonna it's not gonna be a flip a switch and it's done. It's not gonna be take a pill and it's over. It's not gonna be, just that, now I know that thing and now it's done. Now it's therapy, no more therapy for me because I learned that thing. Don't be stupid. Think of the long-term effect. Think of the long-term plan for yourself.
For really in for me was for the first time. Because to me, I joined the infantry and after I realized exactly what it was, it's like, man, the way that you deal with your mortality is you say, fuck it. About your own life. It's not healthy. However, that's what you gotta do in order to not lose your damn mind when your mortality is threatened every single day. So when
So dealing with all of that in the inpatient clinic in on Sunset Boulevard in Los Angeles was very much a a a clashing of of the two worlds where I was dealing with the past and right still in the middle of the entertainment industry at the same time.
Joe Massa (34:04.263)
Yeah, and I can imagine that first experience where you're in the circle and and you got the team of doctors around you unloading that for the first time, where you truly had a safe light, a green light to do that, probably was probably a bit of a relief, you know, to get some of that off of your chest, but also probably
Sean Martin (34:14.899)
Yeah.
Joe Massa (34:22.099)
terrifying all at the exact same time. But but I love what came out of that because I know that then the the GI Bill and the vocational rehab were able to put you through the musicians institute. And even though you already had this great background in music and clearly very talented, you decided that you weren't going to be an artist who only focused on yourself, but you used your music as sort of a vehicle to share mental health. And that's really what this conversation
is about. It's about how you took those terrible things you had to experience and how did you push that forward into the quarantine. So tell us a little bit about the Musicians Institute and then the birth of this idea of singing for the the greater good of mankind for lack of a better way of s you know putting it.
Sean Martin (35:10.729)
Well, that's the I I I I appreciate that that way of putting it very much. I I I hope that that I can live up to that. It so I started in in Musicians Institute in two thousand and nine. So the breakdown didn't come until after I'd already graduated. And I decided to go back in two thousand and sixteen, to go do the audio engineering program. So in from two thousand and nine to two thousand twelve
I was doing the the I got an A in the guitar program, the guitar performance, which was extremely awesome. Like we got to learn from some of the best teachers, who really knew their shit and had been doing and been taught from some of the original
teachers at Musicians Institute. So they knew you know, Howard Roberts. They they knew all of the the people who had who had brought the school up from its very beginning. Some of them had had been taught by them. And some of them had taught next to them. It was crazy. You know, we had this this very nice mix of people who had been
you know, making this musicians institute baby for all of us to enjoy and for all of us to experience. And it was real to me, like it didn't start to be afterwards it it started to become a little bit more reliant on multiple choice questions and t you know, this kind of testing thing because they had to have some kind of, you know, true measurement that made sense to somebody who was outside of it.
And usually they could just reserve the measurements for the people who are inside of it. Because we if we say, you know, you were playing a a you know, a a flat three instead of a major three, the entire solo, and so that kind of ruined it, but you had it you had the idea, but you just didn't kn you didn't know the scale well enough. So I'm gonna mark you at a B because you missed
Sean Martin (37:19.859)
you know, a a very important part of the feeling. And if you did that in a gig, you'd probably get fired. So a B is is better than an F, right? Well, that's not how the academic world views that. That entire process of thought is not how it it operates in the normal academic world. So there still needs to be some work in adapting how you measure music and its understanding and its comprehension.
into the educational system that we have as a whole. If we're going to have an educational system, that is. Hopefully we do. But however, the
I went through the Independent Artist Program and the Independent Artist Program got me to start recording some of my own music. U up until this time I had been using everything that I had learned to go be side men, to go play for people in their bands. And every almost every single one of got blown up in some form or another. You know, somebody in the band made a terrible decision and just screwed the entire thing over. And none of us really of the other band members really had a choice, so we just kinda need to go
well. and that sucked. Like that that that's just a horrible way to be a musician because you spend f months making this and then all of a sudden it's just gone. So four months of work just you never got paid, you never got you know, it was all working up to it. It was all done on faith and trust. And
of course, life abuses those things. It's not just the people who would abuse those things. Life abuses those things. Life doesn't respect those things. it doesn't change based because I had I had plans. You know, the world doesn't give a shit about your plans. so I at that point started to think I needed to become my own music generator. And
Sean Martin (39:30.939)
I sat down and started to reconnect to all of the stuff that I had done before I went into the military. And that included singing. Because at this point I was just playing guitar. I didn't even tell people that I was a singer. I would sing to myself and like that was about it. And honestly, I I thought that I had lost it. I thought that for some reason I like I didn't have a voice anymore.
And, you know, I blamed the military. So it was another thing that that I felt like I had to take revenge about and I couldn't do anything about. And that was the entirely wrong answer. I eventually found out that all I really needed to do was go to a good vocal coach to have to have them bring it out of me, to teach me the ways to maintain your voice over time, not just use it, but to maintain it, to understand how to fix it when things go wrong.
How do you do vocal exercises to make your voice expand consistently instead of contract? Because entropy makes it contract. So now you have to think of the long term of the way to take care of your voice. And thankfully, I had a really, really great teacher named Gisa Vatke who taught me the way to maintain your vocals.
And I have had to to restart to start my vocals from the very beginning about five times already. To start from like that kind of shit. Like that's the only sound that you can make and you have to try to sing from there. I've had to do that five times already. And it's only because of the things that I learned from her specifically.
Who was a teacher at Musicians Institute that taught me how to overcome that at all. And that would have been game over if I didn't learn that.
Joe Massa (41:22.972)
No, that's great. And and again, you're right. It it was because you had the the knowledge that was passed down to you that now you can redo that without having to go back to a Volku coach, although you might check in with them. It's nice to have somebody out there that can unlock sometimes those hidden talents that we all have individually that sometimes get suppressed due to age, time, circumstance, experience. All of a sudden you lose that inner ability that really was a passion of yours early on, and it's not due to any fault of your own other than
and the fact that life kicked your ass for a while, and now you are trying to say, I want to go back to find this. So I commend that you were able to revisit that part of your your life. Tell us real quick before I want to talk about your your latest album, Aversion of Normalcy, when did you actually form The Quarantined?
Sean Martin (42:10.565)
so I I started the quarantine in two thousand and ten, two thousand eleven. is when I started doing the the Independent Artist Program. We did our first show in two thousand and twelve. and two thousand twelve to fourteen we were playing all over Los Angeles and recording. and to me that's when the band really started.
Joe Massa (42:31.026)
So do have you had the same lineup the whole time or have you had people come and go?
Sean Martin (42:35.047)
No, it's been a it's been a different lineup. We had the same we had the same guys with us all the way up until about twenty seventeen or so. and then life kicked my ass. We had an album that we had been working on for the last five years and it got stolen at distribution from a scrupulous manager. and that ruined
just about everything. And at the same time I was going through a divorce. and so I lost my ability to live in Los Angeles. and so I just decided, you know, I I'm just gonna go. And I got in my car and drove to Florida. And just
you know, went as far as I possibly could. Some very, very interesting stories of driving the entire length of the United States in thirty-eight hours. I will say. It was very, very No, no. Red Bull and Monster were my friends. And they they were definitely not my friends after I was done with it. Let me tell you that much. but while we were there, it was very very much necessary. so
Joe Massa (43:32.392)
I can imagine. Yeah, not a whole lot of sleep, I I would say.
Yeah.
Sean Martin (43:50.981)
Later on, while I was in Florida, I decided that, you know, I wanted to try and develop my ability to record my own music. I had gone through the audio engineering thing and and I knew that I could do it. I just needed to get better at it. So I tried to record a version to normalcy, all five songs, myself, and then send out to do the other parts from, you know, other people. And
We would we got set up, but I didn't have the skills to mix them the way that it should be. And so from there I had to let it take a back seat for a while. and then I went on an open mic tour, played across the United States at open mics, met all different kinds of people, did a crowdfunding campaign with a a a label in Boston, called Plaid Dog Records. And then after that
I was working in the East Coast for a little bit and I decided to go to the Nash to Nashville and record at the best studio that I could find. and so I found Blackbird Studios and Sound Emporium Studios in Nashville. and if you don't know, Blackbird is one of the world is a world class studio. There's v very much not another studio like it in the world.
And specifically they have a room which I call the Massenberg Room because George Massenberg designed it. and it's a room, you'll see it on some of the social media stuff that we've done. It's a room that has a hund over a hundred thousand one by one pieces of wood. And that wood is specifically and scientifically placed inside the room to make the the tuning of the room perfect.
It's immaculately designed and it looks really, really cool. but its operation is out of sight. Just absolutely out of sight.
Joe Massa (45:47.132)
I've seen pictures of it, but I've never been there. I've been in Nashville once, but never in the Blackbird studio. But it is it is amazing to it's a sight to behold for sure. So you you recorded there in twenty twenty five for the album, a version of normalcy, which you talk about is like when tyranny becomes the norm.
You have to have an aversion to normalcy because that's sort of the whole point of the album. But you've been writing this for a long time. This is going back to like your 2012 time when you're having this psychosis breakdown. Was this always something that that's what it meant to you? Did you change any of the songs on the album? And and then again, a bigger, a bigger piece of the puzzle. How did you get it to over 40 million views? You got no label, you're doing this independently. That's quite a feat on its own. So kind of walk.
Sean Martin (46:11.901)
Yeah.
Joe Massa (46:36.133)
us through how the album came to be from its infancy to the actual recording in last year.
Sean Martin (46:43.783)
Yeah, so let's see. yeah, the the some of the songs, Shadow, Nemesis, Trendsetter, I wrote in two thousand twelve. And they were very much songs that you know, represented a a
a sp specific aspect of my existence. It was me trying to describe my world, emotionally speaking. And Nemesis was very much a conglomeration of all the different bullies who I had ever met throughout my entire life. They conglomerated into that character who was all of these things at once. And in a way, I could very much see myself in that.
Because it was all part of shared experiences. And so that's why I wanted to have the song ride the line of you don't know whether you're actually talking about somebody else or yourself. Because in those moments of conflict, truly it is if you stare into the abyss long enough, it will stare back into you. You can very much become the monster that you are trying to fight if you're not careful.
And when it comes to the aspects of the mind, well, this applies more so than just about any other time. So I wanted to represent that feeling, that battle, that conflict in a song. Cause to me, that's what I'd been fighting with on in the back of my mind the the entire time. How do you deal with the things that are completely untenable?
How do you deal with the people that are completely unreasonable? How do you deal with the people that are really acting like they're your friends? And they're really not. They really just don't give a fuck about you. They're just using you to an end. How do you deal with that? You know? And that's what this that's what these these songs are confronting.
Sean Martin (49:03.931)
in the lyrics and in the and in the music. And it's not just about my experiences to be like, what happened to me? No, I'm trying to put you in the driver's seat. Trying to listen when you listen to these lyrics, the tonality is in the person of you. It's in the second person. Because trying to to have you think of it and feel it as if you're the one going through it. And that way it makes it personal.
Joe Massa (49:29.083)
And that's what I love about that's what I love about your music and and and really the power of music in general is it is so personal of an experience when you're listening to a song. Obviously the the writer, the singer, the musician, they have their own heart and soul poured into it. But when you really connect with a song
It it's it's amazing how much it internalizes with your own experiences. And that's what separates good music from great music. It's when you can feel it and I I can put my shoes into the song and walk it and feel it with my lived experiences versus yours. So that's a really powerful way to write music and
It's even more powerful when it's perceived by the listener and they can feel it that way. So definitely check out the quarantine. and one thing I know you always talk about is, you know, the importance of maintaining your peace. So I I love that you share that with your music. Where can we find you on social media, online? How can people support your music that the quarantine does?
Sean Martin (50:30.941)
Yeah, so we've got the quarantine dot com. we've got Bandcamp, the quarantine dot bandcamp dot com. that and Bandcamp has all of our discography and what's up on the streaming services right now is just the version to normalcy. So, I high r highly recommend
people go to the band camp site to go and listen to all of the the work that we have done because we have had some serious kneecapping done in the industry to us. And we we i we persist in spite of it. And we continue on because of it. And we will not
be held back by stupid fuckheads who try to get in the way and kicking and stomping on our dreams. This is why I did this the cover of of That's Life. Because that line of it, some people get their kicks stomping on a dream, truly is a very real thing. I've lived it. I've experienced it. So
I w also want to share that this is not just a an easy thing and everyone's just gonna be all happy that you're going about and doing this. No, man. No. That's not been my experience. you have to fight for attention, you have to fight for, you know, where your audience is, you have to fight for all of these different things. It's it's not just it just happens because it I'm it's so great. Nah, man. I constantly feel like shit all the time.
PTSD exists despite all of this. So going after it and being separated from it and reminding myself that the true success is the fact that the album exists. That's the success. Just the fact that we've had a million people listen to it is just cherry on top. But it took a hell it took a hell of a lot of work and understanding and trying to pay the right people to make it happen.
Sean Martin (52:30.329)
And it's there there is an aspect of this industry that is cut off from people who don't have money. And it's very, very important to realize that that's a gatekeeper. And if you're feeling like, well man, why do these people have all of these things and and I don't, because it's probably because you don't have the money for it.
And that's the way the industry is. It's not a reflection on you. It's not a reflection on how good your art is. It's not a reflection on how good of a a a guitarist or vocalist or musician or any of that is. It's a reflection on how the music industry constantly wants to try to rip off as many artists as possible so that they can have a profit instead of you.
They're not trying to go after your ri you yeah, they're not trying to go after your revenue streams. They're trying to go after your products that you need to buy and then they rip you off.
Joe Massa (53:19.631)
And unfortunately
Joe Massa (53:29.552)
Yeah. And that's so unfortunate, but it's so true. But I I love that you experienced a lot of that, even getting ripped off and losing some of your catalog. But what you've proven through your actual effort and and what you put out is that resiliency beats all of that. Your your willingness to go through the trenches, you know, for figuratively and literally
That's what separates you and the ability that you've had to make your music be known and be seen and be heard. It's because you were resilient. You didn't lose your catalog. You didn't lose, have a bad experience and then throw in the towel and say, well, this just isn't for me. You know, I'll go back to stock and shelves. No, you said, you know what, that sucked. I I lost a lot. But instead of sitting around bitching and moaning about it, I gotta get back up on the horse and go back to work and get this out there the right way. So you're truly a working example of
of hard work, resiliency.
And just the ability to to not lay down and die. So I I really commend you on your efforts and and sharing this really heavy part of your life that turned into this very inspirational piece of work that you can share with others. Because I think there's a lot of people out there, whether it's military or domestic trauma, other things that carry a lot of baggage in their heart, and they don't always know how to get that out there. So that that leads me to one question I'd like to end with. Because you've walked a mile or more in the
shoes. If there is someone out there that's going through PTSD, whether it's a veteran or not, and they're in this dark place, what's sort of the one thing you would tell them if you could just give them one piece of advice to to keep them moving forward?
Sean Martin (55:15.353)
well first I would make sure how what their stability is in their lives. Cause that's gonna that's gonna determine what kind of advice I'm gonna give them. But I will say that on a on a generalized level, usually if someone is down at their absolute lowest, feeling suicidal, feeling like there is no future, like the
Like all that the world gives them is shit, and the only thing that that you ever put out is shit, and nothing is ever gonna get better. There's two things that you're missing. One, perspective. You're missing the bigger picture. Maybe it's not just that the world is giving you shit. Maybe it's that you've placed yourself in a shitty position.
Maybe you've been forced into that shitty position. Maybe it's not having to do any of your fault. However, you are still in the hole. And the best way to get out of a hole, well, you have to slowly dig out the sides so that you can just walk up. But that takes work. That takes knowledge and understanding. Knowledge is power. This is why perspective helps you to start to realize to orientate yourself towards the solution, not just focusing on the problem.
And the second is gratitude. Man, we miss it so damn easy. Because when you are down at your lowest, what the fuck are you supposed to be grateful for? People have been doing all this shit to me. This thing has been happening. These all these it's so easy to blame everything and everyone else, and there are lots of things to blame. And usually it takes two to tango. It's not just your fault, it's not just their fault.
It's the entire thing. It's the entire situation. However, when you understand that gratitude doesn't necessarily need to be spread out to the people around you. It should be spread out to the people who are around you who deserve it, who deserve your gratitude. But it's important to remember to keep some for yourself. To have some gratitude for yourself because that's what you're missing. That's why you feel so sad.
Sean Martin (57:32.231)
Is because the gratitude that you that you need to keep going to understand to have a a slightly better mentality instead of this is total shit, be like, that was shit. But I'm walking forward. That's how gratitude will get you. So when you orientate with perspective, gratitude motivates you. Man, you have a chance then to get out of it.
Joe Massa (57:54.83)
And I love I love what you said on on your first part of that of focusing your attention on a solution and not always on the problem because we are really good at looking at the problems. And and you know, it's it's
Funny sometimes you talk to somebody that has the same problem over and over again and you give them a solution over and over again. And then the next time they bring it up and go, Well, did you try the last solution? No. It's like, well, okay. So you're just focused on the bad part of it, right? So I love your perspective, is it's breath of fresh air. You you've certainly seen a lot of things that would wreck the average human, and you've been able to bring this positive piece of work out there for others to enjoy and learn from and feel and and share. So I I truly commend you.
Sean Martin (58:17.853)
Right.
Joe Massa (58:37.773)
On that. Remember, check out the quarantine.com. I'll put links to that in the bandcamp site when we release this video. Sean, I I love what you're doing. It's been an honor hearing your story, and I truly appreciate everything that you've shared and been through, not only for this country, but for the other individuals out there that that really need a voice. And I think you've sort of championed that with the work that you do with the quarantine. And I'm truly honored that you decided to come on the measuring post today, sir. So truly thank you so much. Check out the quarantine.
Quarantine.com. We'll put links up there. Make sure to like and subscribe to them on Spotify or Apple, wherever you find your music. And support local music. These guys and girls are out there. They're they're sharing their heart and souls with us so that we can benefit from it. So thank you so much, Sean, the lead singer and founder of the quarantine, for joining me on the measuring post.
Sean Martin (59:27.369)
Thank you so much for having me. And and search for us on social media too, at thequarantine. We're on all of them. So go and support us on there. and also one thing I almost forgot. No! Those are new t-shirts, baby. We have a new merch store. Yes, that's a new merch store called wrongway traffic.myshopify.com. And the link should all.
Joe Massa (59:32.857)
Yep, I'll definitely link you w
Joe Massa (59:41.829)
got some merch.
Joe Massa (59:49.423)
That's a tough one to remember. I'll have to copy and paste that one in. Yeah.
Sean Martin (59:51.867)
Yes, yes, there's I'll send it to you. But it's LinkedIn, all the social medias. go on there, buy a t-shirt. They're all we we do the designs ourselves. and they're all really f awesome. So go and check them out.
Joe Massa (01:00:08.067)
You heard Go over there and get yourself a t shirt. Appreciate you, Sean. We'll talk soon, my friend.
Sean Martin (01:00:12.723)
Thank you so much, Joe. I really appreciate your having me.
Joe Massa (01:00:15.514)
Yes, sir.