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I Love Your Stories is a soulful conversation series hosted by artist and creative guide Hava Gurevich, where art meets authenticity. Each episode invites you into an intimate dialogue with artists, makers, and visionaries who are courageously crafting lives rooted in creativity, purpose, and self-expression.
From painters and poets to healers and community builders, these are the stories behind the work—the moments of doubt, discovery, grief, joy, and transformation. Through honest, heart-centred conversations, Hava explores how creativity can be both a healing force and a path to personal truth.
If you’re an artist, a dreamer, or someone drawn to a more intuitive and intentional way of living, this podcast will remind you that your story matters—and that the act of creating is a sacred, revolutionary act.
[MUSIC]
He's taught generations of photographers,
published over 40 books, and
still says the best
advice is shoot what you love.
Welcome to this episode
of All of Your Stories.
I'm your host, Hava Gurvic, and today I'm
joined by my good friend,
the legendary photographer, author, and
educator, Henry Hornstein.
For five decades, Henry has documented
the world with wit, honesty, and
deep curiosity.
A self-described historian with a camera,
his work captures the soul of
disappearing cultures,
eccentric characters, and
the quiet poetry of everyday life.
In our conversation, Henry reflects on
his early calling to photography,
what it was like to study with giants
like Minor White, Harry Callahan, and
Aaron Siskind, and how the 70s became a
turning point for photography,
as both an art form and a career path.
He shares stories behind his newest book,
Miles and Miles of Texas,
which is out now, why he's turned to
self-publishing, and
offers his
down-to-earth definition of success,
doing what you love
for as long as you can.
Welcome to the podcast, Henry.
Now, quick word from our sponsor, and
then we'll get right back to the show.
When I started selling my art, I had
absolutely no idea how to actually turn
it into a business, a
professional business.
And then I came across art storefronts,
and that was a game changer.
I've been a customer now for years, and
they've been instrumental every step of
the way of helping me succeed.
I have a gorgeous,
powerful commerce website.
I have marketing tools and a membership
to a community that is very supportive,
and teaches me how to
succeed as an artist.
Check them out, artstorefronts.com, and
tell them how I sent you.
Henry, welcome to the podcast.
And-
Just see you, Abba.
It's been a long time
since I've seen you, but yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
I think the last time we saw each other
in person was in Manhattan,
when you came into the city for that
documentary demo that we did.
You remember that?
And I was-
I've been, you know, yeah.
And I was interviewing you and trying to
get you, trying very hard to get you to
say that you do portraiture, which you
just absolutely would not have it.
I wouldn't have it, sorry about that.
No, that was great.
It was really great.
Anyway, Henry, you've been an educator
for a big part of
your life and an author.
So why don't you just tell us a little
bit about your journey, like
who you are, what you've done?
Well, it's been a long
journey, but it's been a great one.
I got to say that.
Not every moment was great.
There are always, for all of us,
difficult times, but
overall, I'd say pretty good.
I grew up in New Bedford, Massachusetts,
which is probably
best known for Moby Dick.
It's where Herman Melville started Moby
Dick, and it's the longest
story than that, of course.
But I moved to Chicago to go to college,
got thrown out of college my senior year.
You knew that, didn't you?
I did not know that.
It's a little about me that you don't
know, but that's one thing, I guess.
But I was getting into
photography at the time.
I was studying history and kind of
getting bored with it.
And so I went to Rhode Island School of
Design, which is where I teach now.
And I got two degrees there and started
my journey, trying to be a photographer.
But in those days, it was the 70s, and
people, it's so different than it is now.
The idea that you could be a photographer
on your own, kind of a freelance,
and have one foot in photojournalism, one
foot in fine art, whatever that is,
one foot in documentary, and somehow make
a living or let it...
It's hard now, God knows.
But then it was just like, we didn't
really know what that
career could even look like,
even if it was successful, because there
were so few mentors, so few people for us
who led the way.
And for me, I was really lucky because I
met up with, well, at
least three, maybe four of
those people who had led the way.
My two teachers at RISD, Harry Callahan
and Aaron Siskin, soon
after I met Ansel Adams.
And my first teacher was Minor White.
So all of these people were people who
set up the idea that you
could be an artist as a
photographer.
And when I say artist, I don't mean it is
pejorative or positive or anything, just
that's your career.
They're a good artist
and bad artist, God knows.
But you could just do that and maybe
teach to make a
living, as all of them did.
And so I didn't know that at the time,
that that's what I was
doing, but I was really
following in those footsteps as a lot of
people in the 70s were.
And I started teaching in 1970.
I was 23 years old.
I didn't have a degree.
And how did I get a teaching job then?
Well, today would be impossible.
But in those days, there just weren't
that many people
interested in teaching or able
to teach.
And I don't know if I was
able to, but I was interested.
And suddenly there was a great deal, a
swell of interest from people to have
photographer classes.
And universities and colleges did not
have many classes, very
few did in those days.
That happened very soon after.
But 1970, and I taught for, you know,
there were little ship
places, basically, little
storefront art spaces.
And then I went to school and then I got
some adjunct jobs
teaching and I did freelance
work and I wrote a couple of textbooks
and I painted houses, you
know, and I moved people
and I, you know, went to hear music,
drank a lot of beer
and been on the horses.
I like horse racing.
And so I actually like gambling, I guess
I should say, but I
like gambling on horses.
But anyway, so that's
what I did through my 70s.
I had, you know,
adventures and, you know, fun.
And I was not making much money, but my
rent was $40 a month.
And I had a 10 year old Ford Fairlane and
my dog was my biggest expense other than
photographer. And she was, she ate a lot,
you know, but so that was that.
And then the whole time I wanted to
basically make books, that
was my, you know, my goal.
And it's, I want to
make books of my work.
And the problem was I
didn't really have any work.
It's certainly not that was book worthy.
And so I made these books, instructional
books on photography,
which were very successful.
Still even sell a little bit.
But at one time that was, that was my
income royalties from the books.
And then occasionally this and that.
And then I had to spend some money to buy
a camera or film or whatever I had to do.
And that went on for a long time.
And then about 1979, actually exactly
1979, I was offered a job at
Polaroid to work at Polaroid.
You didn't know this part of me.
You get big out for it.
This is so fascinating.
I'm sure there's a lot about you.
I don't know too.
That's right.
I worked for, I had a job.
It was my only, I'd say
normal job that I ever had.
My teaching wasn't the same.
I mean, I have taught
a lot in their jobs.
Like Amy.
What did you do for Polaroid?
Ah, well, that's a good question.
Because in those days
they had a lot of money.
They were really writing it.
And so I could almost
do what I wanted to do.
I mean, weirdly, I
worked in communications,
PR, that kind of thing.
And a lot of people know that you see
Polaroid, you see that.
Make a picture of the film comes out of
the camera and you
get a print or an image.
But they had, at that time, 5% of their
business was actually business,
industrial, professional
applications.
Like medical
applications, IDs for license plates.
But also studio
photographers use Polaroids as proof.
Before you made your
picture, you took the Polaroid.
That's what you used to say.
Let's do a Polaroid of that.
So they needed someone on staff in PR
communications who was a photographer.
And that was me.
So I wrote press releases.
I did shows.
I edited a magazine.
I assisted Elliot Erwitt, Gary Winogrand,
some of the great
photographers of the era.
Ansel Adams, that's
how I met Ansel Adams.
It's just their
assistance for a Polaroid thing.
Because they all wanted to work for
Polaroid because there's good money.
Where galleries barely existed.
There was no money there.
So the money was in
teaching and commercial work.
And Polaroid was commercial.
So I did that for two years as a job.
And freelance there for
probably the rest of the 80s.
People I knew who were doing that were
starting communication
companies and PR companies and this
and that.
I don't want to do that.
So I just let the work dribble away.
And I got a job at RISD, Rhode Island
School of Design, for
those who don't know.
Teaching photography
where I started, really.
As a photographer.
And it was part-time for a
while and then it was full-time.
And now it's full-time.
But teaching jobs are not
full-time jobs in the way.
My partner works with kids.
Preschool and early
education and all that.
She comes home and she is wasted.
And I come home and I
have a beer and I watch TV.
I don't actually do that.
But my work life is less strenuous.
I have this whole part of me where I do
individual projects.
I won't go through all of them.
I'm an Infinigones interested.
I've got a website obviously.
So you can look that over.
Or my Instagram.
I do not have dogs and cats on my
Instagram or babies.
It's a professional work.
So if you want to check that out.
And anybody can email me, by the way.
I like email, actually.
I know it's old school,
but you can attach things.
And it's one place you can look.
And it's just my name,
Henry of Harnstein.com.
So feel free to put it.
Yeah, we will have all
that info linked in summary,
whatever it's called,
the notes for the show.
Wow.
So, okay.
So I thought I had some questions to ask.
But before I do, I guess maybe I knew.
But hearing this again all at once, it
just occurred to me that you...
Your mentors were the
giants of photography.
Where photography
really came into its own.
And then in the 70s, as far as...
That's my understanding.
Before then, photography really wasn't
accepted into the art world.
It wasn't...
No.
No.
There are some places.
Yeah.
So not only did you study with and work
with giants of photography,
you also lived through that transition
where photography came into its own.
And suddenly there were photo galleries
and photography started to be
purchased and elevated as an art form.
Yeah.
And through all of that, you had a
connection with Polaroid,
which was just pivotal in all of that.
And Risty, which continues
to be pivotal in all of that.
So you're like a living legend.
No, I'm living so far.
Anyway, but I actually wrote a book,
which I think it's so like eight copies,
which a memoir...
It was about five years ago.
It was called Shoot What You Love.
I know that book.
You sent me that book.
I love it.
Sure, I sent it.
Yeah.
But it's a history of that time.
It's exactly what you just described,
because I was a history student.
By the way, I still read history and
history podcasts and the whole shebang.
And I speak to like in March, I'm
speaking to the Texas Historical Society.
I think that's what it's called,
Association, whatever.
I'm speaking to them.
In Amsterdam, I spoke to the University
of Amsterdam to an
American studies program there.
So I see myself as kind
of a wanna-be historian.
And my work is much
about history and history.
So, but obviously I really am not a
historian and don't know what I'm talking
about half the time.
But I did live through that time.
You described it really well.
It changed a lot and
it continues to change.
And I can only guess at
what the next stage might be.
But photography came out of the Bauhaus,
the school in Germany in
the 20s and into the 30s.
I think that was a school of design and
photography creeped into the Bauhaus.
I mean, a lot of people there, I think,
didn't pay much attention.
Inside is only a way to document their
architecture, their
industrial design, their real art.
But there were creative photographers who
worked in the Bauhaus.
They came to America fleeing the Nazis
and they landed in Chicago in Boston, in
Cambridge rather, at Harvard and all.
And I think, Lesanne, I'm not a historian
of this stuff, but I
do know that the biggest
Bauhaus intrusion was in Chicago where
Tallahansists can talk.
And that's where photography came in, I
believe, to academia,
to higher education,
to being accepted at least by schools.
Minor White taught photography at MIT,
but he taught it in
the architecture school.
MIT had a very distinguished, as you can
imagine, architecture school.
And he was a small part of that.
But because the Bauhaus did it, I guess,
I don't know how he ended
up there, but I can imagine.
And Callahan and Siskin, but keeping in
mind that none of those
people I mentioned had a
degree in photography of any sort.
There was no degree in
photography at the time.
No degrees.
In fact, I don't think
Callahan ever went to college.
I could be Ron Slarry, Howard Sirmly, if
I've misspoke, but he
was a factory worker.
And it was discovered in Detroit by Ansel
Adams, really, and brought
to Museum of Modern Art and
eventually to his job
in Chicago and greatness.
But today, of course,
there are PhDs in photography.
God knows what they're talking about.
You know, Henry, what in all of that from
the beginning, so you
started school like when you
were in college, you were in history, but
you started doing photography.
What got you interested in
photography in the first place?
Well, truthfully, or should I give?
I know.
Well, I was getting a little bored with
my life in the libraries,
which is what, you know,
being a historian meant.
Though I still like the subject, I didn't
like the what we would
call today lifestyle.
And I liked getting out and working and
having little adventures.
And honestly, if you were photographer,
you're a lot cooler than if you were
historian, which meant
I got a lot more dates.
You asked.
Tell you why I'm laughing.
When I started college, I was premed
because that's, you know,
I had to choose something
like real like my parents wouldn't let me
just, you know, do what I wanted.
But I took a figure drawing class and
they were like large,
you know, we drew on these
large sheets of newsprint.
And so I had to get one of those large
portfolios, those like zip black
portfolios with a handle
that was large, like
24 by 36 size portfolio.
And so I'd walk around campus with a
portfolio and I loved
carrying that portfolio around
because that told
everybody that I was an artist.
And I would I'd have to say that my
decision to apply to like to
to switch to the art school
and become an artist had a lot to do with
wanting to look like an artist.
Understandably, I mean, I, you know, I
couldn't wear a tweed sports coat.
Was required dressed story of the day.
But, you know, I mean, the thing is, this
is this is my brain thinking about it.
Now we look back and we come up with
these like silly, silly,
like true, but kind of like
ridiculous reasons that that pushed us
into the field that became our passion.
But the reality is that maybe something
else was pushing you
there, but that something else
wasn't something that you could
articulate even then to yourself.
Like your passion, like something that
you're passionate
about is going to pull you.
But if you don't have the language to
describe that it's pulling
you, you are going to look at
at the sort of the circumstances or like
the side effects of that pool.
So feeling like when when one says or
like when I say like, I
liked that when I walked
through campus, people knew that I was an
artist, or you're saying
like it was cooler to be a
photographer, you liked that image of
yourself. What that was
really saying on the deep down is
that that felt authentic. That felt like
your path. And to like an
18 year old shit who was like
concerned with outward appearances and
how people see them, you
know, that's what registered.
But the reality is that, you know, you
were that was always your
passion and it was great that it
felt good. Yeah, totally. And I think,
you know, as an 18 year
old or 20 year old, you know,
you do tend to be maybe a little more
idealistic before life
really smacks you across the face.
Gives you some reality checks. But, you
know, so you're drawn to
the things that you really
care about, you know, a lot of people end
up doing what they're
doing, because they need
and I did too, you know, because they
needed a job or they
needed this side. And, you know,
what we do is what you do, what I do,
what artists do is a job
and in its own way, you know,
this idea of like work life balance is a
real thing for
everyone. And but as an artist,
that for a long time in my life, I had
like the career, like the
day job. And then there was my
life. And then there was also the art
that I wanted to do and
trying to balance all of them.
And then when you become a full time
artist, and suddenly have to like
reconfigure and realize
that like everything I do is my job. You
know, like that
separation becomes a bit hard to
distinguish. I wanted to go back in time
a little bit. So because this
is this is so fun for me. So
you and I met 20 years ago, I was living
in Manhattan, and I was
working at Tom Gittemann's
gallery. And you were an artist, you were
friends, you're good
friends with Tom. And I heard your
name. And I thought, like, why does that
name sound so familiar?
Like, I've never met you,
but I that the name sounded so familiar
to me. And then I found out that, you
know, you've written
all these books. And I was like, Oh,
shit, back when I was in
college, and was taking photography,
we had your book as our textbook for
black and white photography.
And that I just thought that
was incredible. But that didn't end
there. When I was in grad
school, in the 90s, I was teaching
photo 101. And that was the textbook that
I had my students get.
I owe you some royalties.
You know, it's, it's just kind of
amazing, then we meet and became friends.
And, and we ended up
working together like after I left Tom's
gallery and started the art to art
business. And you became
artist that I represented. And I actually
we toured three of your
exhibitions, the animals
on Emalia, and looking at animals, I
think that's how we called it, right?
Looking at animals. And
then there was the honky tonk show. And
on committee was just those two. Now I
feel like there was a
third but anyway, but those two I know
traveled. And I know that like when the
the animal show went
to this art academy slash museum, I
forgot what the venue was in
Philadelphia. They actually
invited me to give a talk, a curator talk
about you, which was,
which was really, really fun.
And then in another chapter of my life,
where I was working on a
demo for a documentary film on
portraiture, and we invited you to come
to Manhattan to be
interviewed for that. So like our
past have crossed several times. And they
continue and here we are again. So
that's, that's really,
really fun. And so and I have I have
quite a few of your books.
And you'll be getting getting a new one
soon. Yeah. So I yes,
okay. So that's something that
I definitely want to talk to you about
you have a new book. How
many books have you published?
You know, it's funny because I a lot.
I've done different kinds of books, you
know, the textbooks,
I even did some children's books. Did you
really? Yeah, yeah. Only
two I liked, but whatever.
And I've done, you know, the monographs
of what you really I'm in it for
everyone's in it for
photographs are your own work. And so
I've gone through different gyrations
with all of this and
I have bodies of work. I could do another
five books, six books with
what I've got in the basement,
my studio basement. But because I just
would shoot subjects I was interested in.
And one subject I've
been interested in for a long time is
Texas. And for a lot of
reasons. But the main reason,
honestly, is music. I love Texas music.
So that's what really got me involved.
And I went down there
several times for different things and
photographed a bit as I usually do. And
then I thought, well,
COVID had come in 19, 19, 20, 20 or so.
And I wanted a project I
could do that's felt safe and
contained. And while I photographed a lot
in Texas, I didn't have
an idea in mind. I just
was shooting. So I started shooting with
the intent of doing a book
on Texas. And I didn't have a
controversial subject. You know, a lot of
people have opinions about
the politics and so forth and
so on. I do too. But I decided not to
make that a part of the
book. I'm really not a political
scientist, expert in history or anything.
I'm a photographer, you
know, and a big time music
lover of that kind of music. And I'd like
to drink beer. It was
barbecue, really barbecue. So,
you know, I was there. So for about three
years I went to Texas
quite often and photographed
and came out with this book. It's called
Miles and Miles of Texas. And I
self-published it for a
number of reasons. Number one, I doubted
that I could find a
traditional publisher for it.
It's not a big market kind of thing
except maybe Texas maybe. And also, I
don't mean this to sound
horrible in any way, but I am old. So
getting a book published through a
traditional means takes
a long time usually. By the time they
turn you down eight times
and you finally find someone.
But even more important to me was I
wanted the book to look
like I wanted it to look.
And the last two books I did, although
I'm proud of them with publishers, I
didn't like the way they
were. I wouldn't have done it that way, I
should say. They did it
their way and it's good, but it
wasn't my way. So I hired a designer, I
know. Anyway, we went
through quite a bit, raised some
money, but it still ended up I wrote a
big check just yesterday. And
I'm headed on the road to try
to sell some books and make that money
back. So that's my plan.
It's at the racetrack, the
gamblers say, "I hope I pray to even I
can use the money." And
that's kind of the way artists,
I think, whether they say it, but that
you don't make money
on what you do, you make
heart, I guess. So there was a practical
sign, and I'm a
practical person, even though
I'm basically throwing away my money on
these projects. But
generally, I'm a practical person
and I want to, but I know at a certain
point I can't, I won't be
able to do this anymore.
Drive around, I'd go to different places,
even the airport becomes a little
difficult these days,
especially. But I'm still doing it, and
I'm going to do it as
long as I can. So that's
a big reason for wanting to self-publish.
The problem with
self-publishing, you have to find
a place to put the books. You have to get
them out there if anyone
wants them, you have to get
them to them. And all of that, I'm not
really that good at any
of that, but I'm trying.
But what I've done is, because I do like
music, I've kind of taken the model of
trying to take the model of musicians
these days, which is they don't have
copyright protection the
way they did, Spotify, etc., which is
basically not paying them for
their work. So what happens?
You go out on the road, you tour more,
and you try to get a little
more money for your shows.
But you know, you sell vinyl or
merchandise, whatever it is.
And you just take it on the
road, and that's what I've decided to do
with this. And I'm having
a good time with it. It's
a challenge, and I don't know how it's
going to work out, but in
fact, I think I even emailed.
I emailed all my friends, and I said,
"You know any place I can
go in an arbor or whatever?"
Come to an arbor. There
are some good brickstores.
Well, I actually think
one's out to you, but...
[laughter]
But you have to take it yourself. You
have to do it
yourself. And it's a challenge,
but it's also the
ability to control what you do.
I didn't expect to have a conversation
about book
publishing, but that's actually,
you know, now it occurred to me. Like you
are as much of an
expert on publishing books,
specifically monographs of your own work,
you know, art books.
You've done many of them,
and that's the scientific number you've
given me, many of
them. And you've done them
with publishers and now self-publishing.
And I'm wondering if just
for those who are listening,
who are also artists and have been
thinking about it, like,
what advice would you give
an artist that is dreaming about
publishing a book, which, you know, I'm
one of those artists.
And it seems, I mean, it feels like
self-publishing is the
way to go. And you've just,
you know, said some of those reasons. But
also, are books to you, are
they still relevant? Like the
actual physical books? What place do they
have? Like, can you talk about all that?
Well, I mean, you're a visual artist, as
am I. I do write. I'm not a real writer.
Not a writer.
But I do write because I like to, and I
think what I do helps
explain, is helped by the
explanations and the captions and all of
that. But yeah, I mean, my
advice to all you artists
out there, you know, if you want a book,
don't do it. Well, how to
work. No, it isn't my advice.
You know, but music is the same thing. I
mean, at time, you know, you were a
musician, you were a
band, you wanted to get signed to a
label. That was what, you
know, signed to a label. That's
what everyone wants to do. There are
labels out there, and some
people still have that goal.
It's part of what they do. But the
reality is there are no
labels out there. Very few. Same
book publishing. Random House does not
publish photo books, and
they don't do it because they
don't make money. And so that's a, you
know, that's a challenge.
But it's also a positive thing,
because you then are able to put a lot of
energy and a lot of
control, take a lot of control over
your project. Johnny Cash was being
interviewed in this, what's it been,
YouTube, which I wasted
a lot of time on. So if you're on YouTube
now, got a friend, but
Johnny Cash is saying,
they were talking about song swaps, that
a lot of musicians write
together, or they share
and help each other. We don't do that
enough as artists, I don't
think, but, you know, there's
a lot of co-writing and this kind of
thing. He said one time
early on in his living room,
there was Bob Dylan, Chris
Christofferson, Willie Nelson, Wayling
Jen. There were like five or six
people became huge stars and was starting
to be stars at that time.
And they played each other
their newest songs to try to get some
feedback or convince the
other one to record it maybe or
something. And incredible, you know, all
these people are in one
room and they're all in, you
know, basically controlling their work.
You know, controlling their
work. They were the people who
did it. Wayling Jennings nearly got
kicked out of Nashville, kind
of did for a while, because he
insisted on his own producer. His early
record sought. And when he
got a chance, and he had,
you know, A-list producers and, you know,
they were good, but they
weren't him. And I think if,
you know, if there's a message I have
for, you know, students, I
try to make this a part of it
without sounding too sanctimonious. But,
you know, you can read, you
can look at work, you can talk,
and you can, you know, you can do that
all day and that's fine. But it's the
heart of it. You've got
to be you, you know, it's the most
obvious lesson in the world. But it's one
that I think a lot of
students have trouble. I had a lot of
trouble, you know, for years. I didn't
get that. But that's
what you got that's different than what
all the rest have. Now, you
might bring you great fame
and fortune or might get you, you know,
get your buy and a half-time
job in your art. But you can't
worry about that. Right. You have to live
your truth. Yeah, you can.
I mean, if it comes great,
if it doesn't come great, it's not
following your own, you know, following
your own. That's right.
I think that leads very neatly into a
question that I like to ask
all my guests is how would
you define success for yourself now and
how has it changed over
time? Yeah, it's a really good
question. It has changed. And but also it
depends a little on who you
are. I had a back and forth,
I won't mention names here, but and they
said, you know, you're
just trying to propagate your
legacy. And I looked at this person and I
said, you know, and I
knew this person pretty well.
We dated once. But anyway, and I said,
you know, you grew up in Manhattan and
all your friends and
your friends family were doctors and
lawyers and professors and
politicians and, you know, and,
you know, if they were a lawyer, they
wanted to be on the Supreme
Court. If they were a doctor,
they wanted to invent a vaccine of some
kind. Sorry, RFTA Junior
will cancel that out. But
anyway, so they all were very, very
ambitious as well. I'm saying, and that's
where you came from.
You came from that background of great
ambition, not to mention wealth. And I
grew up in New Bedford,
Massachusetts. We weren't broke. I mean,
my father was did very well for us,
actually. And I got to
go to good schools and, you know, I
didn't miss a meal and blah, blah. But
that kind of, but he was
a salesman. That kind of ambition was
not, I didn't know anybody
who had that kind of ambition
going up. I do now a lot of people. But
in, you know, growing up,
that wasn't my background. So
for me, for me, success is just getting
to do it, you know,
getting to do it and doing okay.
I mean, I do okay. But I had this Aunt
Marcia, and she was my
father's sister. She was married
for long enough to have her to get
pregnant and then was
unmarried. And her whole life, she was
single mom. And she worked in a factory.
She was a bookteacher in a
factory that made rubber things.
I don't know what exactly we get. But,
and so she didn't have any
money. She was okay. It wasn't
expensive to live back then. But, and she
certainly didn't have any
ambition except for her son to do
well. That was her only ambition. Anyway,
so when Aunt Marcia got very
sick at the end and went to
the nursing home, I went to visit her one
time. And she said to me,
she said, "Look at you, Henry.
You're a photographer." And I still don't
know whether she meant
I'm doing really well or I'm
a failure. Because I didn't know what
that meant to her, you
know, because we didn't know.
It's kind of, you know, those kinds of
ambitions growing up. But
once I started to see, you know,
people who did, even the graduate school,
I didn't really have a lot
of ambition, I wouldn't say a
little bit. I mean, ambition for my work,
but it shows for success
and so forth and so on.
Not many people had that in those days.
But I kind of, you know, kind of got
interested in it as I
went along and tried to get more shows
and tried to get, you know, more
connected. But I think now
I'm back to successes that I, I mean, I
look at friends of mine who
have real jobs and, you know,
and I look and I don't see any of them
who's, and some of them
done very well. I look at them,
I don't envy them for a minute, you know,
having getting to do what you
do, getting to do what I do.
That's amazing. Chuck Close gave the
graduating speech, commencement speech,
Ed Rizzi many years ago. And I remember
this so well, you know, he
didn't speak to the graduating
class, to the students. He spoke to the
parents and he said, I
know a lot of you are worried
children becoming an artist and how they
make a living and all of that. He said,
you've given your children the chance to
have the greatest life
imaginable, their own life.
And he's very, very happy for that. I
think there's this full circle here. And
we talk about us as,
you know, 18 year old kids who gravitate
towards a form of art. And
because, like, it's a passion
and you feel cool, you look cool doing it
and all that. And then, you
know, getting to this point
now and saying that your definition of
success is to just be able to
keep doing that thing that you
gravitated towards all those years ago.
And I can't imagine a
better way to say that's a life
or well lived. That's absolutely. And,
you know, a lot of I said it jokingly
before, but I mean it,
a lot of people in our field who are able
to do their own work,
they have they have something
behind them. A partner with a lot of
money, a family with a lot
of money. So I don't know.
Sadly, that's but you have something. I
mean, being able to live the life that
you have always wanted
and happy with what you're doing, like be
excited about waking up
every day and getting to do what
you want to do. That's that's that's more
than all the Teslas in the
world. So I could keep talking
to you forever. You know, I was I was
hoping to touch on a whole
bunch of other subjects with so
maybe we'll do a second part at some
point. But one final time, you have a
book that's coming out.
The book is called Miles and Miles of
Texas. Right. It's self
published. How can people find it?
Where can they find it
and how can they find it?
It's out. It's out by the time this comes
out, I'm sure. And I
it's on my website, which
we'll link to that.com. And we're trying
to get onto Amazon. They're
giving us a lot of trouble.
I don't know why, but eventually it'll be
on Amazon. And I'm touring
for the book. I really am.
I'll be in a lot of places and you can
check my website's got the tour updated,
try to update it frequently, but I'll be
in Texas a lot. I'll be at the Texas Book
Festival in November, which is actually
quite a large festival.
People come from all over.
And so, you know, in various bookstores,
but I'm not doing a lot of
that because it's too much work.
But also, if you have New York people
listening, I'm sure you
do. There's going to be a
book signing November 4th that resolutely
bookstore, which is, you know,
the bookstore. Rizzoli.
Rizzoli. Rizzoli. Yeah.
Which is, I don't even know where they
are. Fifth Avenue, something. But,
and along the way, they have these in
conversation things you probably know
about, but they'll put
somebody else with you. Can't have a
talk. And so we're going to have a woman
named Laura Cantrell,
who's a country singer from New York and
a DJ and all of that. So
that's going to be fun.
Kind of a fun event, I think. And come to
Rizzoli bookstore. Follow
me. Do all the, you know,
I meant it if you have anything to say or
want to email is best for me.
So I'm taking it on the road. That's the
other way. If you want me to sign it,
get it directly from me. If you don't
care, then, you know, go
to Amazon or, you know,
bookstore or whatever. Thank you for that
plug. Yes. Thank you so, so
much, Henry. This has been
so fun. Oh, and yeah, definitely. Let's,
let's schedule to have
a chat. Off, off life.