Podcasts for Profit with Morgan Franklin | Podcasting Strategy for Podcasters

Is your podcast ranking on the charts? Does it matter?

In this episode we’ll talk about what rankings are and how they impact your podcast growth, how to strategize for your own show and of course, how to actually start showing up on the charts and ranking to find the audience you want listening to your podcast.

In this episode:
How podcast rankings work across different platforms like Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
Understanding the importance of choosing the right category for your podcast and how to decide. 
Tracking your podcast's performance using free tools like Listen Notes and Refonic.
How to improve you podcast's visibility and find new listeners using podcast ranking strategies.

🗣️ Find out more about rankings on Listen Notes and Rephonic:
https://www.listennotes.com/
https://rephonic.com/

📌 Book Your 1:1 Podcast Strategy Call:
https://morganfranklin.media/contact-morgan-franklin

👩🏻‍💻 Shop My Podcast Template Store:
https://podcastsforprofit.com

📥 Download 4 FREE ChatGPT prompts for podcasters and listen to the episode on how to use them here:
https://morganfranklin.media/podschool-steal-my-4-favorite-chatgpt-prompts-for-podcasting

👋🏽 Let's connect! You can find me on LinkedIn, Pinterest, Instagram, Threads, and TikTok.

🙋🏻‍♀️ Questions? Comments? Ideas? Message Me:
morgan@morganfranklin.media

Creators and Guests

Host
Morgan Franklin
Morgan Franklin is a podcast producer, strategist and educator. Since 2020 Morgan has founded and produced multiple top ranking podcasts from the health industry to beauty. Featured everywhere from Good Morning America to Martha Stewart Living Morgan's passion and knowledge for branding and podcasting have helped countless business owners and brands grow their impact and bottom line podcasting. Morgan is the Founder of Podcasts for Profit and Morgan Franklin Media, in addition to host of Podcasts for Profit with Morgan Franklin.

What is Podcasts for Profit with Morgan Franklin | Podcasting Strategy for Podcasters?

If you’re ready to create a podcast that will align you with experts in your industry, position yourself as a trusted leader and create another source of revenue for your business you’re in the right place. Podcasts for Profit will help you create and grow a podcast that cuts through the noise of social media and speak directly to your target audience. Stop letting the algorithm determine your social marketing strategy. Stop letting trends dictate the kind of content you’re able to create. Hosted by expert podcast strategist, producer and educator: Morgan Franklin, Podcasts for Profit is your step-by-step guide to creating a podcast that will transform your business, opportunities and life.

Morgan Franklin: If you've
listened to this podcast before,

you might know that my first
corporate job was in the

magical, glamorous and awe
inspiring world of search engine

optimization. That's right, SEO.
I was worried about rankings

before. Worrying about rankings
was cool. And let me tell you,

in 2013 it was so much easier
than it is today. But not to

worry my friend, I have spent
the past decade clawing my way

up the charts on Google, across
social media, Apple, podcasts

and Spotify, and I am here to
tell the tale. In this episode,

we'll be talking about what
rankings are, how they impact

your podcast growth, how to
strategize for your own show,

and, of course, how to actually
start showing up on the charts

and ranking to find the audience
you want to listen to your

podcast. Hello and welcome to
podcast for profit. My name is

Morgan Franklin. I'm a Podcast
Producer, strategist and

educator. This podcast will help
you create and grow a podcast

that cuts through the noise of
social media and speaks directly

to your target audience. If
you're ready to create a podcast

that will align you with the
experts in your industry,

position yourself as a trusted
leader and create another source

of revenue for your business,
you're in the right place. So

what is a podcast chart? Let's
start there, and this might be

old news to you, but let's
buckle in for everybody else.

Apple podcast creator says our
podcast charts reflect the most

popular shows and episodes
available in a given market, and

are designed to help people
discover what to listen to next.

Okay, great. We love a vague
explanation. Basically, the

chart is exactly as you'd think
of any other chart. So let's say

Billboard top 100 we're all
pretty familiar with that. Those

are the top 100 songs played or
streamed in any given period of

time. So a podcast chart is
exactly like that, but as you're

gonna see throughout this
episode, not as straightforward

when we're talking about podcast
rankings, that can mean so many

different things, and I think
that's part of what makes it so

confusing for podcasters,
because when I say ranking, that

can mean ranking in a category,
it can mean ranking all shows

ever. It can mean ranking for a
specific platform, like, let's

say Apple podcasts or Spotify.
It can mean ranking globally

using all different points of
data from all different hosts

and platforms. It can mean so
many different things. So when

you're trying to figure out what
your own podcast rankings are,

or the goals that you want to
achieve around your rankings,

it's important for you to know
what podcast ranking that you're

actually looking at, and so for
this reason, I'm going to be

specifically pointing out each
part of this episode, what we're

talking about and how it
actually works. Let's start with

Apple podcasts and Spotify
charts and how to rank on these

platforms. The first thing is
going all the way back, way, way

back when you set up your RSS
feed and started this podcast

that you have, what did you put
as the categories for your

podcast? And does that actually
reflect what your podcast is

about? This always has to be
step one, and it's very

important, no matter what, you
need to do some serious

reflection on your podcast and
what kind of content that you

are making, and did you pick the
best categories that will speak

to the content you're putting
out on your podcast? Here are

two of the biggest problems.
First, you're like me, and your

podcast doesn't really have a
category. So for example, this

podcast that you're listening to
right now about podcasting? Yes,

we know that, but that's not a
category. There is no category

about podcasting or content
creation or anything like that.

So I had to put it under
marketing and business. And even

though it does encompass those
things, right? It's really just

the best that I can do, and that
most of us are going to have to

figure that out along the way.
What is the second best option

that I have for my category,
since my category doesn't exist?

The second problem is, you're
thinking, Morgan, my podcast is

about everything. How could I
possibly pick a category. So for

me, this is one of the biggest
problems across the board that

podcasters face. If you can't
even narrow down what your

podcast is, how can you put it
into a general category? How

will you ever be able to find
your target audience with that

strategy? So if you're thinking
either of these two things, I

have one on one coaching where
you can work with me that can

help you figure this out. This
is exactly the kind of thing

that I work with podcasters on
every day, my information will

be in the episode description.
Okay, so after you pick the most

relevant category to your
podcast and the content that

you're putting out with your
podcast, this is when the real

work is going. To happen because
rankings are determined by a few

different things, one of the
most prominent being listener

engagement. Now what's listener
engagement? It's someone that is

coming to your podcast, maybe
for the first time, listening to

80% of an episode, subscribing,
leaving a review. When people

are consistently interacting
with your podcast, it is telling

the algorithm. This is a good
podcast, this is a relevant

podcast. That's how they're
determining the ranking of the

category that you picked. Now
Apple podcasts and Spotify are

never going to tell you what the
secret sauce is and how you can

rank number one. That's how they
get people to buy ads and spend

money and keep working on their
podcast forever, but I will tell

you the two biggest factors
playing into these rankings are

new subscribers or followers,
however you want to define that,

and five star rankings. And I
know that there's a lot more

that goes into it than that, but
that will make a huge impact on

where you're ranking currently
and where you show up on the

chart. But that's not all. I
mean, don't you wish that it was

that easy, that you could just
keep getting an influx of new

followers, and you would always
be ranking and I mean, that is

part of it, but here's where SEO
manager Morgan is coming in to

talk about keywords. So what are
keywords? Keywords are words and

phrases that your future
listener will type into a

platform search to find your
show or episode. So stay with

me. So let's say, for example,
this podcast that you're

listening to right now, podcast
for profit. Someone might be

searching for how to start a
podcast, or generally something

about podcasting, or how do I
rank on Apple podcasts, and if

my episode shows up first and
they click on it and listen to

it and then maybe hopefully
subscribe and rank it five

stars, that is perfect. That's
amazing. That's what the ranking

algorithm wants to see. So how
do we make sure that this

happens for you, and that when
your future listener is

searching for the words that you
were trying to rank for the you

are showing up. Personally, I
think that you should focus on

these three things. First, the
episode title. If the episode

title isn't hooking people in,
you are never gonna get past

that. You need relevant keyword,
rich, interesting titles. That

last part, interesting titles,
don't just ask chat GPT to do

this. I hear so many podcasting
gurus telling their clients to

just, oh, just chat GPT. Tell it
to SEO Optima, no, do not do

that. I always tell my clients,
if there is one thing we are not

going to do it is use chat GPT
for our titles. And why is that?

It's because you are telling
your future listener that you

can't even be bothered to write
a five to 10 word title without

AI. And how are you expecting
them to trust you with their

most valuable resource of all,
their time, their time to listen

to this podcast. So take a
little bit of effort and think

about what interesting titles
would actually bring someone in

to listen to your podcast, and
what they would actually be

searching for. Put effort into
your titles. Work backwards from

your titles, if you have to. So
basically, if you need to write

all your titles and then record
the episodes after that. That is

totally okay. That's what I do
every month. So I'll work

through what my four episodes of
the month are gonna be based on

what people are asking me,
what's trending, what keywords

are ranking, and then from
there, I record the episode

based on the research of the
titles. Good content takes time

and effort, I think, in the era
of short form media, that that

can be lost on a lot of
creators, but it really does

matter, and your audience can
tell the difference. The next

thing is just focusing on your
general search engine

optimization that is going to be
making sure that your episode

descriptions and transcriptions
are aligned with this episode,

and again, what that person that
you want to listen to your

podcast might be searching for.
I see so many podcasters just

leaving everything on the table
by not doing their episode

description correctly, and I
personally think that this is

where you can use AI and chat
GPT and any AI assistant like

that. I mean, think about how
many people are really going to

read an episode description,
other than just to find a link

or something like that. Not very
many. I'd be doing everything

possible to get those keywords
in there and make sure that when

someone is searching for
something, either my podcast is

ranking first and popping up, or
it is that specific episode that

is ranking first. So why do
podcast rankings really matter?

I should have probably started
the episode with this, but I

think it's important to talk
about why we're doing all of

this in the first place, and why
it matters if your podcast is

ranking on the charts the. First
of all, it makes it much more

likely that new listeners will
find you. So anyone that's

looking for a new podcast to
listen to at any given genre,

this gives them the opportunity
to find you, if they're just

scrolling through the charts
again, like we talked about a

minute ago, when someone is
searching for something specific

you want to be that podcast
episode or podcast that pops up

and is being the most compelling
to the listener. New listeners

for podcasts usually come to us
one of two ways, and that's

either a personal recommendation
or from searching natively. So

that means in Spotify or Apple
podcasts, or wherever you listen

to podcasts, looking for
something to listen to, looking

for something specific. So if
you are ignoring the rankings

and thinking, Oh, that's just
vanity, that's just a vanity

accomplishment, you're not
putting into perspective how

much showing up on these
platforms actually matters to

finding new listeners. I mean,
that's half of the listeners

that you would be getting. There
is one vanity ranking that I

want you to know for your own
information and being able to

keep track of the progress that
your podcast is having. So

that's your global rank for all
podcasts. You can find this on

Listen notes.com I'll have that
in the episode description.

You'll go to that website and
just search for your podcast. It

should give you a listener score
out of 100 and your global

ranking. So that'll be a
percentage if you don't yet have

a ranking, is because you are
not yet in the top 10% of

podcasts globally. So I'd start
by making that my first goal. If

you don't see your global
ranking or what your listener

score is, start there. Start by
saying, Okay, I want to be in

the top 10% of podcasts, so I
can keep track of this, and so I

can work towards getting in the
top 1% or the top point 5%

whatever that might look like
for your goals in your podcast.

But make sure that you are
keeping track of that, so you

can see how many people are
listening to your podcast in

comparison to everyone else.
Like I said earlier, I'll leave

the websites where you can look
at your different rankings in

the episode description. The
second website that I want you

to look at is called refonic.
That is where you can look at

your rankings for Apple podcasts
and Spotify for the categories.

So that is where you will just
go to the website you will type

in your podcast, and it will
tell you all about where you are

ranking in these different
categories and across the globe.

So you might, for example, be
ranking in China, but not in

America. So go ahead and go and
check that out. And there are

several different podcast
platforms like, I'm thinking of

good pods specifically, where
they have their own ranking

system, and you can just go on
there, make a profile and see

where you are ranking. I'd
encourage you to do that and

make some kind of note where you
are tracking this information,

especially if you ever plan to
monetize your podcast, which I

hope that you are planning to
do, that you can have that

information and say, Okay, I
rank in the top 200 for business

podcast on Apple podcast in the
United States, I'm ranking in

the top for the word podcasting.
So let's talk about that really

fast. You need to go into an
incognito browser and search

these different terms that are
associated with your podcast and

see if your podcast is ranking
for any of those words. And if

they are, I probably do this
once a month and just see where

you are. I've not found a
website that will give you these

rankings or this information, so
you'll need to do it for

yourself. But have at least
three keywords at any given time

that you are trying to rank for.
Make sure that you're checking

to see where are you, and then
write that down and keep going

until you are the number one
person ranking for that word or

phrase. If you've just launched
a podcast, or you're about to

launch a new podcast, make sure
that you keep an eye on your

rankings, because you're gonna
have a big boost that first few

days or weeks because you just
launched this podcast, you're

getting all these new
subscribers and ratings. So make

sure to keep an eye on that and
start making your notes from

there. I remember when Kylie
Kelsey launched her podcast, and

everyone was in a total frenzy
because she was ranking above

Joe Rogan. And the whole time I
was just thinking, well, this,

this isn't really, I mean, this
is not a good representation of

how she will be ranking. And
then I think it was like, less

than two weeks later, she wasn't
even the top 50 podcast at all.

It's because that huge influx of
followers and listeners and

ratings and listener engagement
that then subsided and

everything kind of leveled out,
and then she was no longer that

number one position. So make
sure that you're keeping an eye

and keeping perspective on what
is happening with your podcast.

Oh, and by the way, I meant to
mention this up front, but do

not pay for websites like listen
note or refonic. Don't waste

your money on stuff like this.
Podcasting is expensive enough.

Just check in and make sure that
you have a Google spreadsheet or

something like that, where you
are writing down the date you're

writing down what your rankings
are. And remember, this changes

every day. It's very. Volatile.
One day you are going to be

ranking 10th in your category,
and the next day you're not

going to be ranking at all. So
take it one day at a time, keep

measuring where you are and make
your goals from there. Remember,

knowledge is power. If you need
help creating a strategy for how

your podcast will rank on the
charts, I would love to help you

out the information for my one
on one coaching is in the

episode description. If you have
a question, please feel free to

send me a message. My email is
Morgan at Morgan Franklin dot

media that will also be in the
episode description. I'd love to

help you. If I can, please
subscribe to this podcast if you

haven't already, and as always,
I can't wait to listen to your

podcast. Hey, thank you so much
for joining me on this episode.

If you enjoyed the podcast and
you'd like to hear more episodes

like this one, go ahead and
subscribe to the show. New

episodes air every Monday
morning. And if you found this

episode valuable and you want to
help other business owners and

podcasters, will you leave me a
five star review. It helps the

show rank higher in the charts
and brings more entrepreneurs

the information they need to
start making money on their

podcast.