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Art of Spousing is for marriages that what to move from being mundane to becoming masterpiece relationships. Hosts James and Lisa Duvall share truths and lessons learned from their 30 years of marriage and over a decade of teaching, coaching, and speaking on marriage.
James: [00:00:00] Hey friends. Welcome back to the Art Espousing. I'm James.
Lisa: And I'm Lisa. And we're here today talking about commitment and marriage.
Now, before you, check out and think I already said I do. What more is there? Just hang in with us because commitment is way more than just staying in the house and not signing divorce
James: That's right. Commitment is one of those things we think we understand when we say I do, but as the years go by, we realize it's less about the big wedding moment and more about the daily decision to stay in love, stay engaged, and stay in the fight together.
Lisa: Some days are easier than other days. That's true. but here's the thing, we don't want to just stay married. We wanna build a marriage that lasts, that thrives, and that actually inspires the next generation. 'cause we have people ahead of us, James, that have inspired
James: That's true. You know, we walked alongside a lot of couples through premarital crisis seasons.
We've done a lot of marriage reboots and, [00:01:00] legacy building. And what we've learned is that commitment is a process with depth and dimension, right? So today we're looking at the key elements or underpinnings of commitment and the journey of commitment over time, what it looks like in different seasons, how they keep love alive, and some practical ways to make sure your I do keeps turning into what we still do.
Lisa: I love that. So before we dive in, here's a fun fact. Studies show that couples who intentionally choose commitment, who work at it, even when it's hard, are significantly happier over time than those who just rely on feelings.
Makes complete sense, right? Yeah. It's because commitment isn't just about how we feel in the moment. It's about the choices we make every single day. Feelings come and go, But commitment is the soil where real love is grown.
James: Mm. That's beautiful. And that's where a lot of couples get stuck.
They think love should always feel effortless, but real love the kind that last goes beyond feelings. Commitment isn't just something that happens to us, but something we actively choose day in and day out. [00:02:00] It's actually a decision, not just a one-time vow, but a daily practice. Truth
Lisa: is some days you wake up and your spouse is your most very favorite thing in the whole world, and then some days.
James: They're not,
Lisa: They're just, I never
James: feel that way about
Lisa: Lisa. I know you never feel that way about me, but I feel that way about you.
James: Gosh, okay.
Lisa: I'm just kidding. Not really kidding. But seriously, commitment means that even when butterflies settle and the newness fades, you're still choosing to be in this together.
James: You know, the Bible reveals a lot about the nature of love. We see this modeled in God's covenant love. It's not based on mood swings or convenience. It's actually steady, it's faithful, and enduring. In the Ephesians chapter five, it talks about marriage being a picture of Christ's love for the church.
And if you think about that for a second, you know Christ's love is sacrificial. It's unwavering and full of grace.
Lisa: actually very thankful for that.
He doesn't give up on us [00:03:00] when we're a mess, and that's the kind of love we're called to model in our marriages. It's not about giving our spouse love only when they deserve it, but choosing to love as an act of obedience and devotion,
just like Christ does with us?
Oh,
James: huge.
that's why we say commitment isn't about feeling in love. It's actually about choosing love.
Lisa: That is fantastic. Okay, so here's a practical question for you. What's one way you can show your spouse today that you choose them? Whether you feel like it or not. one of the core habits we encourage is practicing your promise daily.
Mm-hmm. Making small, intentional choices that reinforce your commitment, whether it's through words, actions, or even a mindset shift.
James: Yeah. So with that in mind, let's talk about some key elements of commitment.
Lisa: If you're listening to this and thinking, wow, we could really use a reset in our marriage.
Well, we've got something just for you.
James: It's called a marriage reboot. It's a three month coaching process with Lisa and I designed to help couples move from just surviving to thriving. It starts with a private two day [00:04:00] intensive where we help you gain clarity on where you are and where you want to go together, and we build a purpose-driven roadmap to help you get there,
Lisa: but the transformation doesn't just stop there. Over the next three months, we walk you through intentional coaching sessions to help you implement what you've learned. Navigate challenges, build lasting habits that strengthen your marriage.
James: Whether your marriage is in crisis, feeling stuck or simply in need of fresh vision, a marriage reboot is designed to bring clarity, connection, and renewal.
If you're ready to stop living by default and start living by design, visit our espousing back slash marriage coaching to learn more. You can also schedule a 30 minute call with a link in the show notes with Lisa and I to learn more about the marriage reboot. So when couples tell us we're committed, but we're struggling, we usually say, okay, let's talk about what kind of commitment you're leaning on.
Lisa: Because we've learned that commitment isn't just one thing. It's actually made up of different layers. And if you're [00:05:00] only relying on one, especially emotions, your marriage is going to feel really wobbly when life gets real.
James: Yeah. It's like building a house on just one pillar. It might hold for a while, but storms are definitely gonna come and when they do, you're gonna need more support to stay standing.
Lisa: so we wanna walk you through what we believe are four core types of commitment that we've seen make marriages strong and sustainable, especially when life throws curve balls.
James: And if you're a visual person, you might picture it like a table with four sturdy legs. you, you're gonna want each of these commitments in place because they all support the weight of a lifelong marriage.
Lisa: The first commitment is personal commitment.
this is each spouse saying, I want to, this is the, I enjoy you. I love being with you. I wanna do life with you. I wanna wake up with you. I can't wait to be with you. Kind of commitment, honestly, it's where most couples start.
James: It's emotional, it's affectionate.
It's that spark that makes you want to send sweet texts and pick up your [00:06:00] favorite snacks at the store without being asked. Lisa. When we first started getting to know each other, and I professed that I was gonna marry you. Yeah.
Lisa: it was a little early
James: getting to know each other too
Lisa: time getting to know each other too soon.
James: soon.
Second time meeting each other, right? Mm-hmm. I had all these fields. I remember I wrote you poetry, I brought you flowers. I was on the constant high of oxytocin, the love drug. But it would be crazy to think that anyone could sustain that kind of emotional energy for a long time.
Lisa: Well, you definitely needed it when we first got married because I was a little bit of drama, so I'm glad it was there.
Right. Um, but that's why personal commitment is the most fragile because feelings fluctuate. And when conflict hits or you're just exhausted, I want to can turn into, do I have to? Mm-hmm. That's why this layer of commitment is beautiful, but it can't hold up the whole weight of a marriage on its own.
James: Yeah. The second type of commitment is moral commitment. This is all about, I ought to, this one's about integrity. It says I gave my word, [00:07:00] and even when emotions fade, character shows up.
Lisa: Yeah. We've seen couples who hit a wall emotionally, but their deep sense of responsibility to each other kept them moving forward.
Not outta guilt, but just out of honor.
James: It's the quiet strength of we don't quit just because it's hard. This is where the covenant part of the marriage shines. And biblically we see this in verses like, let your yes be yes, your no be no.
And Matthew 5 37, it's about being people of integrity, people of our word.
Lisa: there's a couple we've been coaching, we'll call them Steve and Karen. They've been married 10 years, and for the last five, it's been rough, Not in an explosive, everything is on fire kind of way, but a slow, quiet unraveling. They're not screaming at each other, but they're totally not connecting with each other Either they sleep in the same house, but they feel more like distant roommates. Conversations become transactional.
It's about the bills, schedules, the kids. There's just no warmth, no laughter, just existing. Right? and what's wild is nothing big happened. There was no [00:08:00] infidelity, there's no betrayal. Just years of missed moments, unspoken disappointments and an emotional drift.
But they stayed. Why? Because they took their vows seriously. And that deep sense of, we said we would. That's moral commitment. They believe their marriage was a covenant, not something you walk away from when it gets hard. And when we met them, Karen said, we're not leaving, but we don't know how to stay and still feel connected.
And Steve added, we are faithful, but we're tired of being committed and miserable. It's really very sad and it hit us hard, James. That's exactly where a lot of couples land. Faithful and frustrated showing up physically but checked out emotionally. but here's where the beautiful thing we witness with that sweet couple there.
I ought to. Wasn't wasted, right? That commitment became the framework. God used to rebuild something so much sweeter. They started having honest conversations. They invited mentors in, they asked for help. And over [00:09:00] time, that dry season gave way to growth. That same commitment, that once felt like a duty, it became a doorway to delight again.
They started laughing, praying and dreaming together, and honestly, we had a front seat to seeing their lives shift it. It was
James: really beautiful. Yeah. Their story reminds us that feelings may fade, but faithfulness creates a space for love to be reborn. Commitment wasn't their enemy. It was actually the anchor that held while healing began to take
Lisa: root. Yeah.
James: Okay. The third element in commitment is spiritual commitment, which says, I'm bound to you.
Lisa: This is the deepest layer. It says, God brought us together. Our covenant is before him. This goes beyond contracts or convenience.
it's a holy spiritual bond that says. What God has joined together. Let no one separate.
James: Yeah. This is important to note that spiritual commitment holds space for grace.
It reminds you that you're not alone in the fight. You got the Holy Spirit in you and for you. and when we've seen couples lean into this, especially in our reboot experiences, they find a new [00:10:00] way to flourish and build or rebuild on rock instead of sand.
Lisa: You know, this is where pro um, we talk a lot about our pro-marriage community and it's so critical for us.
Our pro-marriage community is built with people who share the same value of what God's put together, let no man separate, right? And so, actually. Our conversations, our activities, and even our conversations when life is hard, still supports this, this covenant that we have together and I love that.
Yeah. Okay. The fourth element of commitment we wanna talk about is structural commitment. This is all about, I choose to,
James: yeah. This one often gets overlooked, but it's what holds the rest up structure means intentional rhythms that support our, yes, it's the weekly check-in, the non-negotiable date night, the calendar sync, or the commitment to counseling when needed.
It's saying, we'll build scaffolding to hold this up while we grow.
Lisa: Structural commitment also speaks to the guardrails that you set up to protect your marriage. James [00:11:00] and I, we've agreed upon self proposed guardrails that create trust and accountability in our relationship.
These include things that like what we will and will not say to our friends about each other. Right. places we will go, places that we won't go. We both have complete access to each other's cell phones and social media accounts. And I'm not DMing any guy, and hiding anything like that.
It is
James: full disclosure, right?
Dis Yeah. Yeah. It may not seem like a big deal, but very rarely. I mean, very rarely. Mm-hmm. Will we go to bed at different times? We almost, I,
Lisa: you're snoring and I will go, then I'll leave the room and come back. Yeah.
James: We almost always go to the bed, to the bedroom together to sleep, and I also will not ride in the car with a person of the opposite sex by myself.
I just don't want there to be any chance that anything could cause a crack or separation in our commitment to one another.
Lisa: Yeah. Some people may hear this and think, well, that sounds really strict. Well. It actually is, but our relationship is the most important thing to us, and we want it to last.
The truth is, structure doesn't [00:12:00] restrict, it creates margin for intimacy, safety, and growth, and actually gives us a lot of freedom.
James: That's true. So those are the four elements of commitment. I want to, I ought to, I'm bound to and I choose to.
Lisa: love those
James: And each one matters, right? Each one holds weight.
And if you're listening thinking, well, we've got one or two of those, but maybe not all four, you're not alone. Most couples aren't strong in every area right away. This is something you grow into.
Lisa: Yeah, and I would say in seasons some of those way, and you have to actually evaluate and, um, look to grow and be intentional.
The key word is grow because commitment isn't just something you declare at the altar. Then forget about it. It evolves, it matures. It changes shape over time, which is why it helps to recognize the season of commitment you're in, what your marriage needs in year two is different than what it needs in year 10.
And it's certainly different than what you need in year 30 ish. How many years? That's 30. 32. Okay. That's
James: have to remind you. Working on 33. Yeah. We've seen this [00:13:00] play out in our own story in the lives of so many couples we've worked with and. When you can name your season, it gives you language, perspective, and grace.
So let's turn the corner now and shift gears and walk through some of the phases of commitment.
Because it's not static, It matures kind of like we do hopefully, right? Yeah,
Lisa: that's right. So the first phase of commitment is the honeymoon phase. We are made for each other's stage. Everything feels effortless. You finish each other's sentences.
This stage is filled with butterflies, the spontaneous road trips. It's a camp. Keep your hands off each other face. That's right. It's full of dopamine and long stairs. And this is where you wrote a lot of poetry to me. That's right. And it's glorious, but this is not designed to last forever and that's okay.
James: Yeah. Couples who expect a honeymoon to last and definitely are often shocked when real life actually shows up.
But in this space, commitment is high because energy's high. Everything feels fun, but don't confuse excitement [00:14:00] with depth that comes later.
Lisa: Yeah. That's why it's so important to enjoy it, but we don't idolize it.
Right. It's a such a great key, but even after 32 years of marriage, we still enjoy flashes of a babe. And I even say, Hey, sometimes we still feel like honeymooners because we actually have invested in that.
James: Right. We do. For sure. Especially that part where you can't keep your hands off of me.
Lisa: Yeah, that's that.
Yep. Well, you know. Okay, let's move on. Okay, so the second is the growth phase. This is where most couples start to feel the rub, the diapers, the dishes, the disagreements, and so things start to get a little tense here.
James: You start to realize, I married a whole person with flaws and opinions and a totally different way of loading the dishwasher
Lisa: I will talk about in a different episode, because you did have to learn how to load the dishwasher.
this is where the work begins, where your differences become more obvious, deeper issues arise to the surface. This is where a lot of my, origin story came up for us. It's during [00:15:00] this season that really leaning into your self-awareness helps. We need to grow as individuals and as a couple.
James: It's also the phase when couples have to really determine the why for their marriage. it's in this season, if they have not already. That they need to determine the purpose that's gonna be stronger than the problems they
Lisa: Yeah.
Growth requires intentionality, like learning how to communicate, how to apologize, how to fight for each other, not against each other.
It's during this phase, the healthy and growing marriages learn that conflict isn't the enemy. Apathy is, and that growth happens in that tension. It's a opportunity to grow and learn and understand each other better.
James: we've watched couples hit this season and feel like something's wrong with them, but it's actually a sign of growth.
You know, I recently read this article, Lisa saw from The New York Times by Ada Calhoun and TA to Stay married, embrace Change, and she emphasized that spouses naturally evolve and change through a long-term relationship, potentially [00:16:00] becoming actually different people than they were at the time of their marriage.
And this can show up in various ways such as shifts in interests, priorities, and even personality traits. but here's the thing to remember. Just like your spouse is maturing and evolving, so are you right?
Lisa: That's right. This is why we often talk about the work we do with couples through the marriage reboot experience.
As you grow, it's important to constantly build on common ground and the commitment that you have. To grow together. So if this is resonating with you, you may be in a growth phase of your marriage and you may need some help navigating through it. And we're here for you.
James: Okay. The third stage we wanna talk about is the legacy stage.
Now, this is the sweet spot of marriage where commitment has matured, where trust is deep and the consistent work you've done and the growth stage pays off. You've been through some fires together and you've built trust and a life worth passing on.
Lisa: Yeah. You're not just building life anymore, you're building legacy.
You start mentoring others. Your kids feel safe. Your marriage becomes a model for others. It doesn't mean it's perfect, but it is [00:17:00] rich, it's strong, and it's witnessing to the world around you, the way God works. You know, James, we've had ALS come up and say when they're seeing us in a hard time, maybe in parenting, people are watching you.
Mm-hmm. It matters, which is real. It's not, that's not, it's kind of scary, but it actually brings a commitment to us, um, that we are modeling and mentoring people as we navigate through things.
James: I think part of that too is the world is looking for health. They're looking for wisdom, especially a younger generation.
So if you can fight through that growth stage and come to maturity and still health, not perfect, right? But you're gonna be a model to other people. That's doable. And they're going to, they're gonna look to you for advice and guidance. I
Lisa: I love it. We talk about our heroes all the time. Donna and Joy Bray. Yeah.
They're in their eighties. Their marriage is rich. It is growing. To this day. Mm-hmm. Don just signed up for a boxing class, right? he got a diagnosis of Parkinson's and he is like, I'm gonna do something that will combat this. These people are growth minded and they literally [00:18:00] are just bundles of joy and silly in love, possibly the only honeymooners I've ever known in their eighties.
Seriously. So we love. That they've left a legacy, they're living and leaving a legacy. Yeah. For their family and for those around them.
James: we've had them on the show a few times, and I'll put one of the interviews with him in the show notes. You might wanna go back and just hear from the, you, they truly are legacy builders,
Lisa: We actually say, what would Don Joy do? That's right after, what would Jesus do? we need a model of marriage. They're our models. I love that.
James: Okay, so let's get practical. based on what we've seen over and over again. Here's some steps that you can take this week to work on your commitment. First of all, do a commitment check in. which type are you strongest in? Personal, moral, spiritual, or structural, and which needs attention?
Secondly, talk about the season you're in and name the season. Are you in the honeymoon, growth or legacy season? What does that season need from you right now? Third, strengthen your structure. [00:19:00] Talk about some guardrails. Maybe create one new rhythm this week. Maybe it's a weekly check-in, or a date night or a shared calendar.
It's always important to pray together. It doesn't have to be fancy, but invite God into your mess. Your momentum. I
Lisa: love that.
James: good, right? Yeah. And then finally, stay curious. Ask what's it like to be married to me right now?
Lisa: Yeah, those are all fantastic. We've seen it again and again. Commitment that's rooted, nourish intended, will grow into something unshakeable.
And if you're struggling, don't give up. There's hope. We've seen couples come back from the edge and build something beautiful. So take one step today, talk, pray, choose each other again and again.
James: You know, Lisa, one of the things that we probably should put in here before we close is that, commitment is a, two person game. Like both of you need to be committed to your marriage.
And I know that you've sat with spouses and we've talked with spouses where one spouse doesn't have that personal commitment, right? Maybe they, they don't have the moral commitment and they're, [00:20:00] outside the marriage and so forth doesn't mean that, It can't be fixed and God can't do a redeeming work, but in no way are we saying that you should just suck it up and get tough if there's, if the commitment has been broken.
Lisa: Yeah. Yeah. We've seen where a spouse doesn't want to quit. And it's hard to actually move into a different season that they never anticipated. Right. So we wouldn't want that person who may be hearing this to think that, they weren't there to fight for it. but this has been a great conversation in and around commitment.
If you want more support, check out our marriage reboot or DM us at Art espousing for more tools and encouragement.
James: Yeah, if you found this content helpful, you can help us by sharing this episode with your friends and family. You may even be so inclined to leave us a review, which we would love.
And don't forget to follow us on Instagram at Artist espousing. And if you haven't signed up for our weekly practice, you can text the word AOS to 6 6 8 6 6.
Lisa: At the end of the day, lasting commitment isn't about never facing hard season. It's about continuing to choose each [00:21:00] other through them.
When we stay, grow, and show up with grace and grit, our marriages become stronger, more resilient, and more life giving. So keep leaning in, keep learning, and keep building a love that lasts. Until next time, bye bye.